TBH, I am not overly shocked to see a few of my senior cats without perfect kidneys. One vet said that given their age, it is not too surprising to have some kidney issues in my house.
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My Old kitties issues, chronic pancreatitis?
- Thread starter cprcheetah
- Start Date
I wouldn't get worked up about her crea values of 1.7 or 1.8, especially if they are still within the normal range. First of all, every lab is different. If this is normal for your lab, that is good. And I was told that it's really the BUN/Crea Ratio that is more important anyway.
My Vet told me that there really isn't much pain with kidney disease itself. Mainly the kidney (s) just shrivel up and don't function. I've had a couple of cats with kidney disease...have one right now. She doesn't appear to be in ANY pain, thankfully. Just doesn't have much of an appetites, which is all too common.
My Vet told me that there really isn't much pain with kidney disease itself. Mainly the kidney (s) just shrivel up and don't function. I've had a couple of cats with kidney disease...have one right now. She doesn't appear to be in ANY pain, thankfully. Just doesn't have much of an appetites, which is all too common.
I wanted to add that cats in these early stages of CRF can very often live for many years, especially if things are detected early by owner and things like high phosphorus are managed. Read Tanya's web site about this topic.
I don't have much experience in CRF (yet), but I really hope this is not something you have to worry too much about with DeeJay right now.
You've got so much on your plate already.
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- #205
So.....long day at work waiting to talk to my dad 
So it is confirmed my 14 & 1/2 year old DeeJay has Stage 2 Renal Disease (not failure yet). When I asked him what could be done he asked me what I was feeding her, I told him I am switching her to prey model raw, he said that was the best thing for her. Of course the vet at work suggested k/d (Blech). No other suggestions yet other than monitoring her hydration and keeping tabs on her blood levels every 4-6 months which we were already planning on doing. His cat Cooney lived 3 years with stage 3/4 kidney failure on just fancy feast and friskies canned food. SO I am very hopeful about this. I have only had one other CRF kitty and hers didn't last very long before she crossed the bridge. I am doing a ton of research on what to do with the diet etc to make it proper for her so we shall see. But I am not as upset about it as I thought I would be. He wants me to do some research on a supplement/drug he has been getting faxes for called Renavast to see if it would be worth adding to her regimen of things she gets. This is what I have found out about it so far: RenAvast contains Avastamine, a proprietary blend of L-Aspartic acid, L-Carnosine, L-Glutamic acid, L-Glutamine, Glycine, L-Arginine, and L-Histidine. RenAvast helps decrease renal blood pressure, enhances expression of BMP-7, a hormone that causes re-generation and repair of kidney tissue, and increases renal vasodilation. This is Tany'as sites view of it: http://www.felinecrf.or/holistic_treatments.htm#renavast May not hurt to try maybe? I dunno though.
So it is confirmed my 14 & 1/2 year old DeeJay has Stage 2 Renal Disease (not failure yet). When I asked him what could be done he asked me what I was feeding her, I told him I am switching her to prey model raw, he said that was the best thing for her. Of course the vet at work suggested k/d (Blech). No other suggestions yet other than monitoring her hydration and keeping tabs on her blood levels every 4-6 months which we were already planning on doing. His cat Cooney lived 3 years with stage 3/4 kidney failure on just fancy feast and friskies canned food. SO I am very hopeful about this. I have only had one other CRF kitty and hers didn't last very long before she crossed the bridge. I am doing a ton of research on what to do with the diet etc to make it proper for her so we shall see. But I am not as upset about it as I thought I would be. He wants me to do some research on a supplement/drug he has been getting faxes for called Renavast to see if it would be worth adding to her regimen of things she gets. This is what I have found out about it so far: RenAvast contains Avastamine, a proprietary blend of L-Aspartic acid, L-Carnosine, L-Glutamic acid, L-Glutamine, Glycine, L-Arginine, and L-Histidine. RenAvast helps decrease renal blood pressure, enhances expression of BMP-7, a hormone that causes re-generation and repair of kidney tissue, and increases renal vasodilation. This is Tany'as sites view of it: http://www.felinecrf.or/holistic_treatments.htm#renavast May not hurt to try maybe? I dunno though.
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Did you look up the phosphorus values on her bloodwork. From what Tanya's web site says, keeping those in check is one of the most important things to do at every stage, including early stage. I'd be curious to hear where her values for phosphorus are at. My kitties are definitely higher than ideal based on the web site (but in normal range for idexx lab). The accepted notion now is that k/d is a bad diet for early stage kidney disease - while the lower phosphorus is a good thing about it, the very low protein that it has is not considered necessary and not even good for early stage kidney disease - it is now known that cats in early stage need their protein to be healthy, and only in very late stages would you restrict protein. If the phosphorus is too high and you don't want to change her diet to a low phosphorus diet, you could look into phosphorus binders.
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- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #207
Her phosphorus levels on 11/20 were 4.9 and then on 12/4 were 5.0 so they are still low according to the labs levels as well as Tanya's (6.0 is her low end to get things under control). I read this:
If your cat's level is between 4.5 and 6 mg/dl, but multiplying it by your cat's calcium level gives you a reading of 60-70 or over, take action now. and DeeJay's came out to be 52 so she's still okay I am guessing? My mind is spinning trying to make heads or tails out of everything.
She does say that your target for Stage 2 in USA units should be < 4.5 so while not "critical" (as in take action now), she would probably advise to try to lower them. The thing is that higher phosphorus apparently increases the rate of kidney destruction, so in an ideal world you want to get it lower.
A couple of the phosphorus values for my cats are about 1.65 or so and according to the web site my target should be < 1.45. So I have got them on reduced phosphorus diet now. Rexy's phosphorus is much too high (closer to 2) so I am really trying to reduce her phosphorus and will recheck in a month - if a diet change does not help then I will look at phosphorus binders. The internal medicine vet never even mentioned her high phosphorus and what I could do about it which I find surprising.
Quote from her web site:
"Even if your cat's phosphorus level is normal, it is wise to feed a CKD cat a food as low in phosphorus as you can, because the less phosphorus your cat eats, the less work there is for the kidneys to do trying to process it; plus phosphorus levels tend to rise as the CKD progresses, and usually it is easier to keep them low rather than have to reduce them."
"Even if your cat's phosphorus level is normal, it is wise to feed a CKD cat a food as low in phosphorus as you can, because the less phosphorus your cat eats, the less work there is for the kidneys to do trying to process it; plus phosphorus levels tend to rise as the CKD progresses, and usually it is easier to keep them low rather than have to reduce them."
Just a side note...
I know you are into supplements and what not and I'm sure you already know this, but just be careful with what supplements you use and how they interact with one another. Look at the body as a whole. DeeJay has a lot going on (bless her little heart). A supplement for one of her issues may irritate another.
I know you are into supplements and what not and I'm sure you already know this, but just be careful with what supplements you use and how they interact with one another. Look at the body as a whole. DeeJay has a lot going on (bless her little heart). A supplement for one of her issues may irritate another.
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- #211
Thank-you. I am going to consult my holistic vet to see what her recommendations would be as far as supplementing DeeJay goes and what her recommendations for the best course of action. Also dealing with her making a thickened spot on her belly from chewing/licking.
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- #212
Talked to my holistic vet, poor girl was with me for almost 2 hours with my 3 kitties and dogs issues. We have tweaked supplements a little and have started some homeopathic remedies for each one of my animals. DeeJay is also going to start on a Phosphorus Binder as soon as I get it (it's ordered). She is doing great on the raw diet, eating every meal with gusto, and she also isn't chewing on herself as much as she was. Her 'thickened' spot on her abdomen is healing and we are using some chinese medicine for her chewing as well. I think I have all 3 of her vets in sync as far as her treatment goes. I know she is on a crap load of supplements and homeopathic things but each one has a reason behind it and we are introducing them slowly to watch for any signs of reactions or anything. My holistic vet checked on each item to make sure none had any contraindications with another. She truly is amazing, moreso that she doesn't charge me an arm and a leg Anyways that is DeeJay's update. She is getting really silky and is a lot more spunky in her attitude lately.
Anyways that is DeeJay's update. She is getting really silky and is a lot more spunky in her attitude lately.
Glad to hear your holistic vet is being so helpful!
Glad to hear your holistic vet is being so helpful!
Haven't heard anything in awhile! How is DeeJay?
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- #217
Sorry we have been absolutely swamped at work and I come home exhausted. DeeJay is doing amazing, no recent issues except Ms. Grumpy when it comes to taking pills. She is getting more difficult about it which means she is feeling better She is still eating raw and her energy levels are awesome, she is so much more active, runs around like a kitten, will play like a kitten when she thinks no one is watching her. All in all she is doing really good.
She is still eating raw and her energy levels are awesome, she is so much more active, runs around like a kitten, will play like a kitten when she thinks no one is watching her. All in all she is doing really good.
So you haven't figured out a way to hide her pills in something...maybe inside a freeze dried, slightly rehydrated treat or something? Or even a piece of raw meat? Is she still taking that boat load of pills 2 - 3 times a day? I guess you really need to put them all in a gelcap and pop them down her throat, unless you could take a strip of chicken breast or something and cut little slits (like when you add garlic gloves into a roast
) and stuff a pill into each little slit
.
Well, anyway, the good news is that she feels better
Well, anyway, the good news is that she feels better
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- #219
Pill Pockets worked for about 2 weeks then I was discovered She found a pill in one and now she won't touch them. She is only on Tramadol twice a day and then Zyrtec at night. Everything else is a supplement that I mix sneakily into her food. Little does she know.........
She found a pill in one and now she won't touch them. She is only on Tramadol twice a day and then Zyrtec at night. Everything else is a supplement that I mix sneakily into her food. Little does she know.........
So great to hear she continues to do well!
