It's happening again....

[renny]

Originally Posted by CatsAreBetter

on the note that you haven't changed anything... you might not have had to. It may simply be that there is something he's getting into periodically that hasn't changed at all... and at this point I'm just using the air freshener as an example.. but.. if you have the same one, same scent, etc., he might just decide that he wants it once every two months or something.. maybe he had a craving for something or what have you.. and it might just be he's not interested in whatever is causing it the rest of the time.

I don't know

I've got it stuck in my head that it's something that's caused by exposure to something periodically, and it probably isn't. That's just what's making sense in my brain right now.

No it makes sense...and that's what I went through originally. I thought for sure I had it figured out when the outbreaks coincided with me being just about ready to start with all new litter - i.e. the feline pine had broken down to a certain point. Once I switched him over (and i tried a bunch) to World's Best (clay litter makes him cough too) I thought it was figured out. I just talked to the vet and I have his dose of benadryl to try and some cream to hide it in....so fingers crossed that that will help tonight. I'm also going to empty the litterbox, clean and sterilize it and then put in fresh world's best and see what happens.

 

[sicycat]

It's so frustrating when even the vets cant figure it out.. I've been there

 

[catsallover]

Has your vet ruled out eosinophilic granuloma? My sister's cats have this, and when I was reading, in some odd cases, cats have reportedly had these ulcers in their sinuses, roof of the mouth (though this one isn't so rare) and I read about one or two who were suspected of having them in the lungs (not to scare you- just pointing out that what I've read said they can show up in atypical spots

). Mosquito bites can cause this, as well as fleas and allergies (one person also reported eye drainage). Just a thought- I hope you can get to the bottom of this and he's better soon!

I read this too- it's just one vet's opinion, but who knows?

Eye problems still not diagnosed

Question: Dear Mike,
Thanks for your reply regarding my Dylan's eye problems. I wish I could
have replied sooner -- my computer is down for the near future, I'm
writing this from the library. It gives me some perspective to know that
you also send your putative herpes infections to an
opthalmologist. Dylan's herpes test was negative, thank goodness, but
that still leaves us in the dark as to what it IS.
Now I have a second cat with the same syndrome: she had a fever and didn't
eat for 3 days, then one eye swells up, the conjunciva and upper lid
swollen shut and out about half an inch -- almost as if she'd been stung
there, by a bee. Today it's looking slightly better. I think it will now
become a chronic situation, where it flares up and oozes a yellowy mucous
substance, then clears up for a month or two. I don't see anything like
this in my vet handbook, does it ring any bells with you? Thanks as always.
Laura

Answer: Laura-

Eosinophilic granuloma complex will sometimes produce symptoms like you are
seeing. It can even sometimes occur on the cornea itself and it looks a lot
like herpes virus infection when this happens. Often, cats who have this
problem affecting their eyelids or corneas also have eosinophilic lesions
elsewhere on their skin or in their oral cavity. It might be worth checking
carefully for other signs of skin disease.

Allergic conjunctivitis is supposed to be pretty rare in cats, but it is a
conceivable problem.

I have read recently that the false positive rate for PCR herpes tests is
thought to be higher than initially reported (about 10% false negative in
initial studies), but I haven't been able to find a recent report that
gives sensitivity and specificity information for PCR testing. I hope to be
able to find this information because I have been relying on these test
results, too.

Mike Richards, DVM
8/10/2000

 

[renny]

Wow...i've never heard of that...but something I will definitely ask the vet about next time I'm in there. For now the swelling is still there, but maybe slightly less. I wasn't able to get the benadryl into Rambo, and he's getting upset and hiding so I'm leaving him alone for now. I did sterilize and change the litter box to see if that makes a difference...he's in there right now.

I'm definitely going to do more research on Eosinophilic granuloma complex. Thank you guys so much....hopefully I'll have good news to update

Thank you guys so much

 

[vanillasugar]

Oh NO! Poor mister Rambo

I thought all this was behind him! I'm so sorry you're both going through this again! I hope this time SOMEONE will be able to figure out what it is! Give hugs to the little guy for me!

 

[catsallover]

Originally Posted by Renny

Wow...i've never heard of that...but something I will definitely ask the vet about next time I'm in there. For now the swelling is still there, but maybe slightly less. I wasn't able to get the benadryl into Rambo, and he's getting upset and hiding so I'm leaving him alone for now. I did sterilize and change the litter box to see if that makes a difference...he's in there right now.

I'm definitely going to do more research on Eosinophilic granuloma complex. Thank you guys so much....hopefully I'll have good news to update

Thank you guys so much

These are the unusual symptoms

. The most commom one is a swollen lip (also called "rat lip" sometimes). My sister's cats get it in their lips and toes, which is slightly less common. You can google it by putting in "eosinophilic granuloma in cats" or "eosinophilic granuloma cats" etc. Be prepared- the pics are kinda shocking! Hope it helps

.

Okay, I finally found the one link I looked at that had it in the mouth.

Warning! Pics are graphic!

http://www.vet.uga.edu/vpp/clerk/Starnes/

 

[jean44]

Poor Rambo. He must be so uncomfortable with all this going on. I also know how it feels to have a sick kitty and no obvious solution to the problem. Hugs to both of you and get well vibes to Rambo.

 

[anakat]

Just some

for you and Rambo.

 

[renny]

I took this picture this morning.

The only benefit I see him getting from the antihistamine is that it puts him to sleep. But it showed no reduction in his eye. I'm definitely going to do more reading on eosinophilic granuloma and definitely mention it when i talk to the vet. I'm going away all next week and I'm worried that something will happen with him when i'm gone.

Thank you all for your on-going support

 

[catsarebetter]

Aww, poor little guy.

I wish there was something I could do to help.

 

[tia2]

I have a cat now that had eosinophilic granuloma but it started at the side of his eye and he lost his hair all the way down to the side of his neck.

Rather than the prednisone that the vet wanted to put him on (and once they go off it it seems to come back--some have to stay on it for a long time) I did NOT want that for my cat...I was advised online to boost his immune system and quickly. You said that his immune values were boringly normal. That to me doesn't mean strong. He needs a strong immune system.

For Piddle:
I ordered a product called Immunostim'r which is the same as essiac tea used by people fighting cancer...there are miraculous claims on this tea, so I thought I'd give it a shot. It boosts the immune system in a big way to fight ANYTHING that's going on negatively inside the body.
He recieved nothing from the vet and I went home, ordered this and started giving it to him.. he healed up over about 2 weeks and it's never come back. I will never be without this stuff onhand.

Something to try while you try to figure it out? Hope this helps...it did for us. good luck!

http://www.naturalpetfoodandsupply.com/immunostimr.htm

 

[renny]

Well Rambo's have always been his eyes swelling like this (sometimes switching) and 25-50% of the time the blisters in his mouth/throat. He has none of the other symptoms. We were trying to balance out whether it was an allergy (in which case boosting his immune system would just boost the reaction), or if it was something else, in which case boosting his immune system would work. Since it always seems to disappear we've played a waiting...try something and wait again game.

I'm going to mention eosinophilic granuloma to my vet when i talk to her today and see if we can screen him for that. I think a diagnosis...any diagnosis at this point would be a relief to me. If I know what it is...I can figure out how to fight it.

 

[jcat]

Poor Rambo! I'm sending for you, and get well vibes for him.

 

[tia2]

Originally Posted by Renny

Well Rambo's have always been his eyes swelling like this (sometimes switching) and 25-50% of the time the blisters in his mouth/throat. He has none of the other symptoms. We were trying to balance out whether it was an allergy (in which case boosting his immune system would just boost the reaction), or if it was something else, in which case boosting his immune system would work. Since it always seems to disappear we've played a waiting...try something and wait again game.

I'm going to mention eosinophilic granuloma to my vet when i talk to her today and see if we can screen him for that. I think a diagnosis...any diagnosis at this point would be a relief to me. If I know what it is...I can figure out how to fight it.

"(in which case boosting his immune system would just boost the reaction),"
Wow, I've never heard that before!
I'd have to look that one up

.. remember if it does end up being EGC which is an autoimmune diesease, boosting the immune system (however you can) will only help.
That's what my vet told me..
Good Luck!

 

[rapunzel47]

Originally Posted by Tia2

"(in which case boosting his immune system would just boost the reaction),"
Wow, I've never heard that before!
I'd have to look that one up

.. remember if it does end up being EGC which is an autoimmune diesease, boosting the immune system (however you can) will only help.
That's what my vet told me..
Good Luck!

That's what an allergy is: the immune system over-reacting to something, hence the statement that boosting the immune system would only make matters worse.

Poor, sweet Rambo.

I hope you can get a diagnosis, and find him some relief soon.

 

[renny]

Well...I put in a call to the vet and she's going to call my back when she gets back from lunch. I'm going to mention the ECG and see what she thinks. If this can be tested for, I would at the least like to rule it out (or in).

I didn't mention...and kind of forgot about a few other symptoms that Rambo had this week: he was coughing (like he had a hairball), but he did this before when he started getting the blisters in his mouth and he also spit up saliva several times. Now reading some of the stuff on ECG it can cause difficulty in swallowing. I don't want to try and diagnose him myself...but it's beginning to look like:

a) herpes viral outbreaks - with atypical symptoms but which would benefit from immune boosting

b) EGC - autoimmune reaction which would benefit from steroids and immunosuppression

c) other periodic allergy - which also would benefit from some immunsuppression.

of course if it a - then immunosuppression would not be helpful, and could be deterimental. I don't really want to experiment with my kitty....I just want to make him better.

my ongoing thanks to everyone....i'm hopeful that this chat with my vet might help.

 

[white cat lover]

I hope the talk with the vet clears some things up!

Poor Rambo!

 

[renny]

Well...talked to the vet and told her about the eosinophilic granuloma complex information and she agreed that that could fit the bill. So at 6:30 I'm going to take Rambo to the vet and we are going to try 2 things - a steroid injection and a blood smear to see the eosinophils. If that's what it is we'll try a hypoallergenic diet for a few months to try and rule out food triggers....if it's a dust/airborne allergen we might never find the trigger and we'll jsut have to deal with the outbreaks.

if this doesn't work...well...I have no idea!

 

[jcat]

That's the problem with EGC, if that's what it is: It's nearly impossible to find the trigger sometimes. Steroids usually help, as does fish oil (Omega fatty acids). I've even heard of some cases of severe EGC, where inner organs are affected, being treated with (French) cat birth control pills. that you find some answers.

 

[rapunzel47]

I'm glad that you have some new things to investigate. Maybe you'll find some answers this time -- I hope so.