Help! Charlie is FIV+

[ldg]

I don't remember which of your kitties is FIV+, but the highest risk category are unneutered males (an unspayed females), fighting over territory or a female, or a female getting bitten during mating or in a territory fight. Once they're neutered/spayed, the odds fall off the map - especially if they're healthy - that they'll contract FIV. It can happen, but they don't know how it does, because it's rare.

All the vets we work with have clients that have FIV+ cats and FIV- cats living together, and they haven't seen one of the FIV- kitties contract the FIV. And once inside full time, even the FIV kitties tend to do well, because if they're not exposed to things that could make them sick, then the immune system doesn't have to fight illness to which they may be exposed. Most FIV+ kitties die of something other than the virus itself.

FIV+ cats do tend to have problems with their teeth, and that can be a source of illness or concern, so regular dental cleanings (and probably teeth extractions) are really important when caring for them. We just bought the Biotene stuff to put on Charlie's gums twice a day, and we add food grade hydrogen peroxide (1 1/2 teaspoons to a gallon of distilled water) to their drinking water (also helps fight gum disease). It's good for all the cats (and us, too!).

 

[gloriajh]

Our family: Three original cats, KiKi, Simon & Phoebe - always inside, haven't had their vaccines updated since they all were kittens, KiKi, mn - age 6, Simon, mn - age 4, and Phoebe (Simon's sister) - fs.

Short answer - so you don't have to read all the other stuff:
Gray - #1 Stray - has FIV
Buddy - #2 Stray - has FeFv

The story behind the story:

Then, the cat that started my efforts with TNR - is Gray. I'd say he's about 2 (?), unneutered when he arrived - and, I absolutely knew nothing, no known resources, no experience whatsoever. I did know from this website that I needed to trap him and get him neutered. I tried to get help from the shelters around here, tried to get a free trap - people are so overwhelmed here - so, didn't get any call backs, and the sad news continues ... along with Gray came a little female. I knew she was a female because she was three colors. Before I could get Gray trapped, she became pregnant, and in December of 2008, I was surprised with the view of 2 kittens - suspected one male, and one female.

Gray came "home" one day with a huge gash from his ear down to near his eye. Fortunately by then I had gotten a trap. I picked him up - something I had been basically fearful of doing - and put him in my laundry room while I tried to find out where I could take him, and, not cost me $100's of dollars.

I emailed one person at one of the no-kill shelters, and he told me where to go to get Gray's wound cared for. Through a lot of trial and error, I took Gray to the Animal Samaritans clinic where they neutered him and took care of his wound. All the while, I was surprised at how he allowed me to handle him. He even walked right into the trap for transportation to the clinic. Of course, the clinic did not test for any diseases, all they did was give him a rabies shot.

I met a lady at the clinic, who knew her way around, and saw me with Gray, asked me questions, and finding that I had a female with two kittens, offered to loan me her traps one weekend, and "showed" me the ropes about the clinic and getting the surgeries that I'd need for these three.

Before Gray had been wounded, the female was coming into heat, and I was panicking - I broke them up once - she was fighting him off. She didn't get pregnant!

I was able to trap the hungry little boy first, then his mommy. I now had three traps. The little girl kitten was more difficult, and I trapped her the second night. They all recovered in our garage. I kept them all - I could have given the kittens to the woman that helped me - but I just couldn't break up the family. I have pictures and videos that are remarkable. They show how the family actually acted like a family - with Gray being the protector.

In late 2009 Gray was getting so fat that he had been unable to groom his britches, and he had something attached in his long fur that wasn't coming out - he was extremely bothered by it. And, he sure let me know that there was NO WAY I was going to try and comb it out - I'm no fool.

Finally in March of this year I couldn't take watching him struggle any longer, and called my vet to see if there was a chance that they would groom him so he would be okay. I actually was surprised that they were willing to take him.

Of course, they would do tests on him, give him his vaccines, and the grooming.

The snap test showed positive FIV. He's healthy. I haven't had the more expensive IRA test, but will have another snap test.

I cannot keep him inside all the time - I do bring him in at night so that he won't be running off other cats and getting hurt, or picking up some other "bug".

I do watch him closely during the day, and he is staying home in one of the shelters we've provided, or in the garage or laundry room.

When I pick him at at dusk, he knows where he's going, and you should hear the hissing that I get sometimes. By now he knows the routine, and after failed attempts at digging under the laundry room/garage door, or tearing down the gate on the door I have on the laundry room/hall door, he now just settles himself on top of the washing machine.

During the day - especially the hot days of 100+ weather, he is sleeping, and even volunteers himself to be in the laundry room where its air conditioned. I don't know what our electric bill is going to be with the door to the garage open enough for him to go out if he wants. I am trying different ways to keep the heat out, and the A/C in, but - there is exchange of air, for sure.

Since he didn't test positive for FeFv, I'm hopeful that his family is also free of that, but ?? - and, they stay home really good, run away from other cats, so - again, I'm hopeful they stay disease free. They all may have FIV, but I may never know. I was on my way to getting them more socialized when Buddy came around, and now I don't have all the time I need to do that, or the space. I had them coming into the FR at night, but after Buddy and his FeFv, there's a possibility that they could also have this disease, and I can't be disinfecting the windows, walls, furniture, and kitchen cabinets every morning before the Original Three are allowed into the rest of the house. So, I've stopped letting them inside, much to my sadness.

Buddy is the one with the leukemia positive test results. The ELISA became positive after the timer went off, so my vet sent blood out for the other test, which indicated that it was 85% sure that he was infected - my Vet says she would consider him an "A" grade. I'm trying to be positive in a different way, and hope that he successfully fights this virus. Our guess is that after he got lost was when he came into contact with the virus, but we have no way of knowing for sure.

Sorry, that was a long answer to your post, I did have some help typing, Buddy typed a few letters - after all, he's the main reason I'm in here - which is to give him some attention. I have plastic bags on my shoes, and a large baggy shirt that covers most of my clothing. When I leave I will take everything off, wash my face (getting nose kisses), my arms, and my hands, - and since I have on shorts - my legs. I hope I can keep of this pace because both these creatures are worth the effort - and, our Three Original need to be kept safe.

 

[ldg]

Well, Charlie is getting more comfortable. Billy bopped him and he bopped back. He's playing with less reservation.

He ran around the cat trees yesterday - discovered the "house" part of the tree house - and went ALL the way to the top of the tree - and then crawled over to the top platform of the other one (the bigger kitties like Charlie have to squish to fit up there

).

Today we're bringing him over here later, and he's spending his first night.

 

[gloriajh]

WOW! You need a STARS calendar for Charlie Rewards! Of course, Charlie Rewards would be for everybody!

This is such great news - slow and steady IS the way of success!

Some days bring more progress than others - and your family is certainly continuing to move in that POSITIVE direction!

 

[ldg]

Yeah, well, Billy's been growly all day since Charlie came over.

I mean - at Charlie. Poor Billy is jealous. I practically ignore Charlie and LAVISH attention on Billy. He's gotten so many treats today.

We'll see what happens......

 

[otto]

First over night whoohoo!

 

[ldg]

Got 3-4 hours of sleep - but that was because of Gary, not the kitties.

Billy is upset, and redirecting his aggression/fear/jealousy/anger. He's been bopping Shel and Tuxedo and going after Ming Loy with unusual vigor. I'm practically ignoring Charlie and LAVISHING attention on Bill. He's being very nutty about it, because Charlie groomed BILLY for a minute!!!! (licking the top of his head!). But then a little later, Billy laid down next to Charlie and just growled at him, poor confused baby.

Everyone else seems to be (more or less) OK with him. There's nervous tension about personal space from time-to-time, but Charlie did jump up on the bed and relaxed, gave himself a bath and hung out for a little while. Didn't sleep here. I'm not sure he slept much - if at all.

Now I'm wondering - do I even bother taking him "home" to "his" trailer at this point. I'm wondering if that doesn't just set everything back a bit..... or does he need the stress break? The thing I'm most worried about is stress on his system.

If you have an opinion, I'd love to hear it.

 

[otto]

Keep him there, make the integration final.

 

[zoeysmom]

Not really knowing anything about cat intros other than what I've read here, I think you've done a TON to help both Charlie and your cats adapt to this change. Now that he's spent the night and is becoming more comfortable, I think I'd just keep him there. Maybe they are getting confused when you take him and bring him back everytime and just need to know that he's there to stay and they are going to have to learn to love him!

 

[gloriajh]

Sounds like Charlie is adapting just fine - maybe Billy is thinkin' Alpha Cat has arrived and he's reacting to the new lineup?.

My FIV guy (Gray) is so easy going - so, I'm wondering if Charlie is too, and the stress you're talking about is actually the other cats' stress ?

or, maybe yours.

Maybe the back and forth is too many changes - why don't you give it a shot and just keep him there - especially while you do still have the option of the trailer in case things get a little more heated than you'd like.

Hey, why was Gary keeping you up?

 

[lovewhiskers]

Joe and I both agreed we would keep Charlie at your place and just work through Billy's jealousy. I would not worry that Charlie has not got much sleep last night. This little boy is strong!

I remember when Sweets was out of his room and in the house, he did not sleep very much the first few days and I am sure he spent his first few nights learning everything about the house.

Billy licking Charlie's head is a GREAT thing, very nurturing. He will growl for a while and pick on the others a bit, but you are there to comfort them all

.

Do you happen to have a new toy in the house that you can bring out now for them? Even if it's a refill on an existing toy or something home made that you and Gary can think of (you know best what your kitties love).

Marina

 

[ldg]

Well, we agree with you. Charlie stays.

And Marina - I know it's a surprise, but it was CHARLIE licking Billy's head!!!!!! Charlie also licked Shelly's head. We have a cat bed at bed height that exactly fits between the bed and the wall (narrow spaces in RV bedrooms

). That is used primarily by Shel and Billy. (We keep a small container of water there too that everyone stops by to drink from). Shelly was passed out. Charlie was investigating the bed/bedroom (quite boldly!

) - and took advantage of Shelly sleeping to sniff him all over.

When he got to his head, he just started licking him Shelly woke up, yawned (without getting up), looked up at Charlie, and in a very leisurly kind of way, reached out his paw and put it on Charlie's head.

Charlie then came over and plopped down between us for a little while.

As to the toys, our kitties are loving the toys we gave Charlie, and he's loving the toys we had out (we rotate) for them, so they all think they've got new toys.

Charlie doesn't react to catnip (neither does Billy), so that's no help.

And Gloria, Billy was our last rescue and the most submissive cat we have. He was outside longer than the others, VERY close to his brother who we had to adopt out alone (

), and an EXTREMELY cat-friendly cat. That said - he is the baby. He's the biggest cuz he's fat, but he's the youngest (probably the same age as Charlie, actually) of the previously existing group (by two years). I am positive he's jealous. Tuxedo is unquestionably alpha kitty these days (though Lazlo likes to pretend he still is, and sometimes Tuxie lets him think he's taking the reigns LOL). Billy's just... laying some ground rules, I think, and letting Charlie know he's not happy about sharing anything with him. Another jealousy factor - Charlie is on z/d because of his allergies (and he does seem to be itching less!!!!), and I think it's really bugging Billly that Charlie gets special food (he can smell it's different). I'm pretty sure he also equates Charlie with no free feeding: we tried to stop free feeding, but after the first few days, they figured out it was permanent and really let us know they were NOT happy about the situation - so we went to measured free feeding. It was going pretty well - but with the two different diets, unless we move ALL the cats to z/d, we can't have any food down when Charlie's here. Billy is fat because he LOVES food - so he may well equate Charlie with the lack of access to food all the time.

 

[ldg]

Well, I don't know what's up, but Billy seems just fine.

And.... last night Charlie was lounging in the middle of the kitchen floor, hanging out. And then... he began playing with and chasing his tail!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Charlie appears to be having his "kittenhood."

 

[otto]

Awwwwww......!

 

[lovewhiskers]

Laurie, how cute is that

. It amazes me how the hormones were hindering Charlie's personality; he is a lucky litle boy and was guided to the right humans.
Marina

 

[ldg]

I can't believe he's only been here full time for four nights! He's getting more and more comfortable. In "his" trailer he loved being petted and brushed, and here he's been nervous about hands reaching toward him... but we had some pets, brushes and purrs today! OK - little purr - and next door he had a big rumbly purr - but we're getting there!

He's been running and jumping around the cat tree set up.

He's been lounging on the window seats. (Yes, lounging!)

He was on the bottom platforms of the cat trees - practically sitting on Ming Loy, licking the back of her head. She gave it a minute, then jumped down.

Shelly jumped up on the platform where he eats, because Shel figured out he gets different food (allergies), Charlie didn't react - and he allowed Shel to share his dry food. (I couldn't let Shel eat more than one munch, because Shel has a VERY sensitive tummy).

Billy went after Ming Loy today (as per usual). Instead of getting bug-eyed, Charlie jumped down, ran over... and as Ming Loy disappeared under the couch, Charlie approached Bill and put his head down into his chest - Bill sniffed him and stuck HIS head into Charlie's chest - and Charlie groomed him. (Again). !!

Charlie and Tuxie keep sniffing noses, and Tuxie keeps chewing on his ear.

Spooky doesn't hiss at him anymore (at least not more than anyone else.

).

He and Flowerbelle have been fine from Day 1.

SUCH a good boy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[killerapple]

This is such an awesome update!!!!!!! He sounds like such a sweet loving boy.

 

[ldg]

Some of you have seen these, but....

Charlie celebrating being here full time for a week.

http://www.thecatsite.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=218851

Charlie LOVES playing - but is a spaz!

http://www.thecatsite.com/forums/sho....php?p=2905834

 

[ldg]

OK, we're having a little jealousy issue with Shel now, but I think we're close to having that under control. Mostly it's just Shelly sitting around staring at Charlie.

He did run at him today - but thankfully that's about as far as our kitties go - and Charlie doesn't seem phased by it.

But I have GOT to video what has been happening. Billy walks around trying to get everyone to groom him (and he purrs when the other cats "pet" him LOL). Well - most of ours other kitties at this point will give him a few licks on the head - but that's it. Charlie will keep going. And when Charlie stops, and Billy bumps him again for more, Charlie will keep going. Billy's rather a "groom" hog, as when Charlie bumps him for "pets," Billy will give him one lick on the head and then bump Charlie for more.

I am not going to be surprised to see them curled up together soon.

 

[otto]

WOW!!!!!

You are some miracle worker!