Fostering a momma cat and her 5 kittens for the first time!

[heatherwillard0614]

You just started the first treatment today. I would think it will take a few days until you see any improvements. If you are concerned though you should just give the vet a call and just explain to them what you did here and see what they say about her eye.

If the vet recommends keeping her away from the others I would take that advice. You don't want to chance the other kitties getting whatever infection she has.

 

[emocatowner]

You just started the first treatment today. I would think it will take a few days until you see any improvements. If you are concerned though you should just give the vet a call and just explain to them what you did here and see what they say about her eye.

If the vet recommends keeping her away from the others I would take that advice. You don't want to chance the other kitties getting whatever infection she has.

Thank you!

The main worry is that it looked like it got a bit worse, crusting shut and all. I'll probably send them an email with a pic tomorrow, just to be sure, and call an online vet if it gets significantly worse.

I'm also wondering where she could have gotten this from, that rest weren't exposed to. She went to the vet a week and a bit ago, but her brother was with. She got vaccines, he didn't yet, could the weakened immune system make it flare up? She fell in the dirty toilet (just pee) a week ago, I forgot to mention it to the vet, she only got her paws and belly wet and I washed her off immediately afterwards, but maybe she got some of it in her eye?

Also, how do I keep her from freaking out? She keeps meowing and pawing at the door, and her momma just started doing the same on the other side of the door.

 

[heatherwillard0614]

She fell in the dirty toilet (just pee) a week ago, I forgot to mention it to the vet, she only got her paws and belly wet and I washed her off immediately afterwards, but maybe she got some of it in her eye?

If this is the only difference in her and the rest of them I'm going to say it is highly probable that is what caused it.. but I truly don't know for sure.

As for trying to keep her calm is there anyway someone can spend time in there play with her until she is done like wear her out. Then she will be ready to sleep. Do you have a way she can sit and look out a window in the room?
Cat music? Even a TV if there is one in the room maybe if you put on some type of nature channel with birds and such I leave a TV on for Gabby whenever we leave the house you can youtube cat TV that's what I do for our baby.. maybe these things all combined will help. I'm sorry I don't have better recommendations for you.

Also I think letting the vet know is a good idea. Even if it is going to take a few days to see any improvements at least you know for sure.

 

[Sarthur2]

I generally use a tube of terramycin triple antibiotic ophthalmic ointment for eye infections. They usually clear quickly, and I’ve never seen it spread from one kitten to another. Since everyone is going crazy not being together, and since she is already on treatment, I think you can allow them back together.

 

[emocatowner]

If this is the only difference in her and the rest of them I'm going to say it is highly probable that is what caused it.. but I truly don't know for sure.

As for trying to keep her calm is there anyway someone can spend time in there play with her until she is done like wear her out. Then she will be ready to sleep. Do you have a way she can sit and look out a window in the room?
Cat music? Even a TV if there is one in the room maybe if you put on some type of nature channel with birds and such I leave a TV on for Gabby whenever we leave the house you can youtube cat TV that's what I do for our baby.. maybe these things all combined will help. I'm sorry I don't have better recommendations for you.

Also I think letting the vet know is a good idea. Even if it is going to take a few days to see any improvements at least you know for sure.

Yea I probably will call again tomorrow, mentioning the toilet incident, asking how big the risk is to the other kittens etc.

I opened the balcony for her as well. Poor gals got evicted from there on their birthday week... but this kitten has no interest, she sniffed a bit and went back to meowing at the door.
We've been constantly playing with her, pulling all the best toys, including several new toys. They maybe distract her for a bit, but then she's back at yowling at the door. And as soon as momma makes a peep, she howls even louder, which makes momma howl more too. There was some peace when she snuggled up to my bf and snoozed, but that's about it. She's barely eating too.
And momma is getting really pissy with us, she started growling at us again when we go in her room. She actually scratched my bf pretty bad as he was putting one of the kittens that snuck in back outside.

Good idea about bird tv, it seems to be distracting her a bit more now. I've been putting some on for them on YouTube for a few days now. I hope momma won't start complaining about missing out.

I also really dread to think about how momma will react once we actually start giving some kittens away... She'll probably regress to full feral for a while.

I generally use a tube of terramycin triple antibiotic ophthalmic ointment for eye infections. They usually clear quickly, and I’ve never seen it spread from one kitten to another. Since everyone is going crazy not being together, and since she is already on treatment, I think you can allow them back together.

Good to know, thanks!

I am seriously considering giving her one more treatment and then letting her back in over night, though I'm also dreading the thought of momma needing eye drops...

 

[heatherwillard0614]

Just know you are doing everything you can. You are doing a fantastic job. I'm glad the bird tv idea worked some. Hopefully it will be just enough to keep her busy and not stressed about getting to everyone else. But honestly.. it sounds like they would be doing better together than appart. The only thing is that the vet said to keep them separated.. Hopefully when you call tomorrow they will say she doesn't have to stay quarantined. If you decide putting them back together just wait at least 1 more full day so she gets 2 days of meds in her just trying to make her happy while trying to be as safe as possible... If that makes any kind of sense..

 

[Sarthur2]

Once mom is spayed and recovered, and if you can keep the kittens with her for 16 weeks, and she gets to be rehomed with her favorite kitten eventually, she will adjust to the other kittens being gone much more easily.

 

[emocatowner]

Just know you are doing everything you can. You are doing a fantastic job. I'm glad the bird tv idea worked some. Hopefully it will be just enough to keep her busy and not stressed about getting to everyone else. But honestly.. it sounds like they would be doing better together than appart. The only thing is that the vet said to keep them separated.. Hopefully when you call tomorrow they will say she doesn't have to stay quarantined. If you decide putting them back together just wait at least 1 more full day so she gets 2 days of meds in her just trying to make her happy while trying to be as safe as possible... If that makes any kind of sense..

Yep I'm reading online that it may be a lot safer after the first 24h of treatment, so we'll have to deal with it tonight and see what the vet says tomorrow.

Once mom is spayed and recovered, and if you can keep the kittens with her for 16 weeks, and she gets to be rehomed with her favorite kitten eventually, she will adjust to the other kittens being gone much more easily.

I hope so. I worry for her, even my bf is starting to get fed up with her, and he's the biggest cat lover I know! And she scratched me tonight while trying to do the usual clicker training routine, though I get it, she's a bit on the edge, my bad for not being more cautious and using the finger instead of just the pointer. She is a good gal though, it was a mild jab, I just ignored her for a few seconds, presented the pointer again, and she was back to calmly booping it. I won't give up on her until I find a home patient enough to continue doing this work. Though things are a bit dire, I just got word from the rescue that there were another 6 kittens about to be put to sleep by the bigger shelters, though thankfully this local rescue managed to find another foster for them. I hope we will be able to help some more kittens.

 

[emocatowner]

Good news is the eye issues cleared up! A second kitten needed treatment too, but everyone else seems fine now.

Bad news is mom peed on the bed again, although we have a litter box in there now. It's the 5th time. My boyfriend is getting reeealy fed up with her. She also started placing herself in the door thresholds, and she lets me walk by just fine but she swipes at my bf's feet. It makes me really worried, because he really is extremely good with cats, every single cat we ever had loved him more than me, this momma is the first who doesn't like him!

I know Jackson Galaxy's advice is to just put the litter box on the bed, and then inch it to a more desirable location. But bf gave a hard "no" to the idea of having a litter box on our bed.

I guess I really gotta get her spayed, that may help, in case this is spraying. And in the meanwhile, no more unsupervised time in the bedroom, which is sad, as she really was starting to like watching birds on tv and snoozing in our bed. I'm also gonna try playing with her more to get her to feel more secure.

Any other ideas on what I should do with her? Here's a few more cute pics of her

 

[heatherwillard0614]

I wonder if she might have a uti or some kind of infection. Is there any outside cats that she could be seeing while she is laying on your bed? If so it could be territorial. Having her spayed and checked by the vet would be my next step.
Please keep us posted

 

[emocatowner]

I wonder if she might have a uti or some kind of infection. Is there any outside cats that she could be seeing while she is laying on your bed? If so it could be territorial. Having her spayed and checked by the vet would be my next step.
Please keep us posted

I don't think it's a UTI, the urine doesn't smell bad, if anything it's a bit too faint, but that may just be my nose being broken. There is also no straining when using the litter box, or any other sign of discomfort.

It could definitely be territorial. The bedroom is the only room without windows, but that's the room where I do scent swapping with my resident girls. So the girls are in there at night, and kittens+momma go in during the day, so there is definitely a strong smell of "other cat" and it probably is my stupid for not having a litter box in there from the start. But bf says he can't sleep if there is a litter box smell. Our compromise is we have a litter box in during the day and remove it at night, and she does use the box, but apparently still wants to use the bed. Maybe I didn't spray enough enzyme cleaner on the bed or something.

But yea spay and check is definitely the way to go. I'll try to nag the rescue about it a bit more, I think their plan of having her spayed the day she goes to her forever home will likely result in her getting returned for behavioral issues.

 

[heatherwillard0614]

I don't think it's a UTI, the urine doesn't smell bad, if anything it's a bit too faint, but that may just be my nose being broken. There is also no straining when using the litter box, or any other sign of discomfort.

It could definitely be territorial. The bedroom is the only room without windows, but that's the room where I do scent swapping with my resident girls. So the girls are in there at night, and kittens+momma go in during the day, so there is definitely a strong smell of "other cat" and it probably is my stupid for not having a litter box in there from the start. But bf says he can't sleep if there is a litter box smell. Our compromise is we have a litter box in during the day and remove it at night, and she does use the box, but apparently still wants to use the bed. Maybe I didn't spray enough enzyme cleaner on the bed or something.

But yea spay and check is definitely the way to go. I'll try to nag the rescue about it a bit more, I think their plan of having her spayed the day she goes to her forever home will likely result in her getting returned for behavioral issues.

Another thing to bring up to them is she is comfortable ar your house for now.. if they were to spay her then her go to a brand new home might be too stressful and like you said if it is medical and it isn't fixed before she goes to her furever home that could more than likely cause her to be returned...

 

[emocatowner]

Another thing to bring up to them is she is comfortable ar your house for now.. if they were to spay her then her go to a brand new home might be too stressful and like you said if it is medical and it isn't fixed before she goes to her furever home that could more than likely cause her to be returned...

Yep that's exactly my worry. She'll have a lot going for her, she'll have suddenly lost the 2 kittens we're keeping, possibly others, be in a new environment with new scary people who may behave very differently, all while being in pain from the surgery (they will hopefully be able to give her painkillers in liquid snacks, but I imagine it still doesn't feel great)

I'm starting to wonder if this is what happened in the previous foster family (or home, not fully sure). All we know is that she suddenly was "staring at a wall all the time" and refusing to eat. So she got released back with her colony, because the working theory was that she was "depressed", and she did get better. Her brother was a lot friendlier, though she's always been a bit standoffish. I wonder if she peed on the bed in that home too, and they were yelling at her and ignoring her or something, which led to her acting out and withdrawing more and more. She does have a tendency to pee on blankets, she also peed on various blankets we set out for them in the kitchen, so we kinda stopped putting blankets, they weren't really sleeping on them anyway.

What would maximize her chances is to get her spayed while she still has all or most of the kittens here, and keep working with her to get her feeling secure, so that in a few weeks, she'll be more adoptable. Anyway, I wrote to them.

 

[heatherwillard0614]

Yep that's exactly my worry. She'll have a lot going for her, she'll have suddenly lost the 2 kittens we're keeping, possibly others, be in a new environment with new scary people who may behave very differently, all while being in pain from the surgery (they will hopefully be able to give her painkillers in liquid snacks, but I imagine it still doesn't feel great)

I'm starting to wonder if this is what happened in the previous foster family (or home, not fully sure). All we know is that she suddenly was "staring at a wall all the time" and refusing to eat. So she got released back with her colony, because the working theory was that she was "depressed", and she did get better. Her brother was a lot friendlier, though she's always been a bit standoffish. I wonder if she peed on the bed in that home too, and they were yelling at her and ignoring her or something, which led to her acting out and withdrawing more and more. She does have a tendency to pee on blankets, she also peed on various blankets we set out for them in the kitchen, so we kinda stopped putting blankets, they weren't really sleeping on them anyway.

What would maximize her chances is to get her spayed while she still has all or most of the kittens here, and keep working with her to get her feeling secure, so that in a few weeks, she'll be more adoptable. Anyway, I wrote to them.

Have you tried to change the litter for her?
What kind of litter box does she have, covered or uncovered?
Maybe try offering a different litterbox all together?

Please keep us posted on what they say about spaying her while she is still with you.

 

[emocatowner]

Have you tried to change the litter for her?
What kind of litter box does she have, covered or uncovered?
Maybe try offering a different litterbox all together?

Please keep us posted on what they say about spaying her while she is still with you.

We used a bunch of different litters, maybe I've been switching them too much for her liking. I currently have them on Cat's Best Original, which they seem to be happy to use. Previously, I tried various non-clumping other wood stuff, and a non-clumping soil litter that made their paws all red.

They currently have the 4 litter boxes in the pictures. 2 in the kitchen, 1 in the hallway where they only go in during the day, and the last pic was of the box that we had in the bedroom. It could be that the box is too small (I accidentally ordered the wrong size, I meant to get the bigger ones), or stainless steel (they also seem to prefer using the non stainless steel one in the kitchen). It could also be that we move the box back to the hallway at night, and she knows it?

At first, we used to move the big black litter box from the kitchen to the bedroom during the day, and there was another closed plastic one in the kitchen I've since given to my resident cats, then I got the 2 stainless steel ones. It actually didn't happen during the few days when we had the black one in the bedroom, so maybe I just need to get another big plastic box for in there. The problem then is, how to convince my boyfriend to risk allowing her in the bedroom again... We have these nice big washable puppy pads, so she isn't doing any actual damage, but he has a strong "ick" reaction at the thought of there having been pee on his bed, which I can't really blame him for.

 

[heatherwillard0614]

We used a bunch of different litters, maybe I've been switching them too much for her liking. I currently have them on Cat's Best Original, which they seem to be happy to use. Previously, I tried various non-clumping other wood stuff, and a non-clumping soil litter that made their paws all red.

They currently have the 4 litter boxes in the pictures. 2 in the kitchen, 1 in the hallway where they only go in during the day, and the last pic was of the box that we had in the bedroom. It could be that the box is too small (I accidentally ordered the wrong size, I meant to get the bigger ones), or stainless steel (they also seem to prefer using the non stainless steel one in the kitchen). It could also be that we move the box back to the hallway at night, and she knows it?

At first, we used to move the big black litter box from the kitchen to the bedroom during the day, and there was another closed plastic one in the kitchen I've since given to my resident cats, then I got the 2 stainless steel ones. It actually didn't happen during the few days when we had the black one in the bedroom, so maybe I just need to get another big plastic box for in there. The problem then is, how to convince my boyfriend to risk allowing her in the bedroom again... We have these nice big washable puppy pads, so she isn't doing any actual damage, but he has a strong "ick" reaction at the thought of there having been pee on his bed, which I can't really blame him for.

I really think if it is a larger size and plastic that would help a lot I know my kitty doesnt like the stainless steel kind because of her claws scratching it.. that could be the same for her as well??

 

[emocatowner]

I really think if it is a larger size and plastic that would help a lot I know my kitty doesnt like the stainless steel kind because of her claws scratching it.. that could be the same for her as well??

Yep I read about this when I first got them for the resident girls, they had 2 stainless steel ones and the plastic one on the hallway was supposed to be theirs. And they seemed to like the stainless steel ones more, so I figured I'd get more, since they're so easy to clean.

It's weird that momma is willing to use them, no probs. And she always pees in this one spot in the bed, bf thinks it's because that's where it smells strongest of us, and it's a dominance thing.

It could be due to the litter levels running low. One reason my girls are ok with theirs is that I never let the litter get low enough to scrape the metal, but with the smaller ones for the foster, and me running out of litter and waiting for the delivery, it got a bit lower than I'd like.

 

[emocatowner]

I just realized I forgot the pictures!

And there is a fast thing to try: just have the plastic box from the hallway in the bedroom, and leave the stainless steel one out in the hallway.

We're also going to kick them out of the bedroom earlier, so we don't end up discovering the pee just as we're getting ready to unwind and sleep, which will make my boyfriend happy for now, as it won't cause us to have to stay up extra late to swap bedsheets etc.

I do worry about her, though. She's started taking swipes at me as well while I'm training her. Last night, I was giving her the reward treat after a good boop, and I got myself a swat. The kittens came running and I think she was a bit overstimulated, and my bad for trying to get the treats close to her, so the kittens don't eat them all before she gets to them. I think I spooked her. And she was still sweet about it, a cat can do a lot of damage if they want to, she just gave me a mild poke. But I'm realizing she absolutely can't go to a home with small children, and she'll really need someone very patient, and with lots of time.

I feel guilty for not spending more time with her, I used to ask her to boop me more times a day than I do now, though I am stretched a bit thin between trying to make sure our resident girls are still happy (one was starting to show signs of stress due to us not playing enough with her), making sure the kittens get enough cuddle time and trying to find ways to make them braver (they keep hiding whenever someone comes to see them, I think I need to harness train them and get them outside, so they're more used to strangers, it worked on my old dude)

 

[emocatowner]

I have 3x good news and one bad!

First good: the kitten with the heart murmur is perfectly healthy!
She had an ultrasound today, and was a complete sweetheart. She stayed there calmly as one vet was scratching her cheek and holding her, and the other vet was doing the probe stuff.
There is a tendon across the heart, which may cause a murmur later on, so it is a good idea to re-scan in a year to be 100% sure. And her right side is a bit larger, but slightly, not enough to cause issues.
So yea, nothing to indicate actual problems, just a benign murmur.

Second good: two kittens are going to their forever homes this weekend!
They seem like such a nice family, kids were really patient with the cats, and mom even stopped them from moving the wand toy too quickly so they don't hit the kitten, which is A+ in my book.
I'm preparing a care package for them, with their usual food, favorite toys, and I set out some blankets for scent soaking, I'll send them off with the one that they sit on the most.

Also some bad news: mom peed on the bed again, and this time I had the plastic box in.
I messed up and left her alone in the bedroom for a bit, and she peed in her usual spot.
But also good news: the rescue is making arrangements to get her spayed next week!
I feel really bad for her, she'll be dealing with losing 2 kittens and recovering from her spay... but at least she'll still be here, where she's relatively comfy, and I'll be sure to spoil her extra with treats and bird tv.

 

[heatherwillard0614]

Please don't feel bad.. you're doing the best you can like you said you are stretched pretty thin between caring for everyone. It is good that she swatted you gently.. well not good that she swatted but good that it was gently lol

I hope everything works out well.

I have 3x good news and one bad!

First good: the kitten with the heart murmur is perfectly healthy!
She had an ultrasound today, and was a complete sweetheart. She stayed there calmly as one vet was scratching her cheek and holding her, and the other vet was doing the probe stuff.
There is a tendon across the heart, which may cause a murmur later on, so it is a good idea to re-scan in a year to be 100% sure. And her right side is a bit larger, but slightly, not enough to cause issues.
So yea, nothing to indicate actual problems, just a benign murmur.

Second good: two kittens are going to their forever homes this weekend!
They seem like such a nice family, kids were really patient with the cats, and mom even stopped them from moving the wand toy too quickly so they don't hit the kitten, which is A+ in my book.
I'm preparing a care package for them, with their usual food, favorite toys, and I set out some blankets for scent soaking, I'll send them off with the one that they sit on the most.

Also some bad news: mom peed on the bed again, and this time I had the plastic box in.
I messed up and left her alone in the bedroom for a bit, and she peed in her usual spot.
But also good news: the rescue is making arrangements to get her spayed next week!
I feel really bad for her, she'll be dealing with losing 2 kittens and recovering from her spay... but at least she'll still be here, where she's relatively comfy, and I'll be sure to spoil her extra with treats and bird tv.

That is absolutely amazing mews about the kittens.

Also about momma being spayed while she stays there to recover. It might be a little hard but with the 3rs kitten still there she may be better than you may think about losing the 2.

It isn't good that she peed in the bed but maybe after her spay that will fix itself?? Maybe she is trying to mark territory in there? You can talk to the vet about it and see what they recommend when you take her in for her spay.