Booboo is confusingly not well

[snickerdoodle]

Yes, I am afraid he will eat it if it is shredded. The reason for that is the Vet mentioned on the phone that he may try to eat shredded newspaper as well and that could block him and cause him to have surgery (Along with blockages from clay and from pine pellets)

Chickster was looking scared this morning because I think she was afraid I would try to blame her for the pooing and peeing outside of the box. She is using the pan fine and has no problem with the pee pads. After I was home for a few hours she started to chill out when she realized. Maybe it was my imagination, too though, but since Boo has had these problems pop up these past couple of days, when I am in the pan room cleaning, she comes down and stares at me from the hallway with these huge eyes, and she's never done that befoer.

Idk, my mind is playing tricks. Anyway, his stool is slowly working its way back to normal. It isn't watery but it is still diahrrea, but there is no blood in it. It has some form to it. If that makes any sense. He was purring and drinking water (of course) and eating when I left. Will keep an eye on him and update tomorrow.

I would switch to yesterday's news which we used after his PU but I am broke after the pee pads and the pine pellets, and have to wait until Friday to go trying anything new. I used old newspaper copies we keep for the wood stove in winter.

Thxd guys

 

[otto]

That eating litter thing is frustrating! I tried the pine pellets once many years ago. My then cats tried to eat it. I went back to clay and have stayed with it.

I don't post in your thread every day but I am reading every day and keeping up with Booboo (and Chickster)

 

[snickerdoodle]

Thank you Otto

Yes, Chickster decided she hates the puppy pads too, so I took one of the four pans, put it up on a high spot where Boo can't reach (Let's hope, Mr. Smarty Pants finds ways around things) and showed Chickster where it was. I put the clay back in it and put her in it, and she peed in it. She peed on the rug in the livingroom, and I knew something was amiss when I came home and saw her sliding her eyes over there and back to me about 14 times. I Said, hmmmm I wonder what you did?? Then I saw her scratching at the area on the floor and found out mighty quick.
Boo still has the runs though they are not watery, they have a bit more form to them. If I were to put it on a plate, it would not immediately run off. It would take a minute or two to slide. Anyway, his eyes look great, Mom said he's been running around all night and this morning his tail was up, he was sitting in his window, drinking water, eating great.. I mean he's acting totally normal. Purring, and meowing when you say "Hey boo!" He goes "Mew!" And his tail is up, which I've always read means he is happy or relaxed.
Sub-q's were a little tough, but we got it done and I gave him 50mL more just to try and cover some of the diahrrea.
Anyway. This is just a quick update. I will try to update more later. I have not even him any more supplements until this diahrrea stops and we're still not sure if it was the supp's or his eating litter. His food has not changed. His appetite is good. He is not lethargic. And obviously he is pooping quite a lot. Mom said one of his poops had a bit of an actual poo bit in it. So. We will see. Thank you guys so much

 

[snickerdoodle]

Well it's nearly 3 in the afternoon. Boo has had a couple more runny poop spells but it looks like more solid is coming out with them. When he does go he has gas with them too, at least that's what it sounds like. And boy do they stink. He is walking around and checking out a new cardboard box and even got with me on the bed for a minute. He's meowing, eating... I just don't know. This wasn't the supp by any means, I do not think, not a half of a CC would cause runs for this long? I think it was the litter. And he may have been eating at it for longer than we realize, too.
But everything taken into consideration he is eating like a pig, he is drinking water but not way too much, he's jumping, walking, meowing, acting pretty decently normal, except he is still trying to find a high place to play so he is not itchy. Still not seeing any fleas and Chickster is not itching/scratching.

I'm going to try to get him to calm down and sleep a bit and so will I. Will update in the morning unless something changes. Could it be possible that changing his pans so drastically is causing so much stress that it is causing/continuing the runs? I will just have to call the vet again tomorrow.

 

[katkisses]

Originally Posted by Snickerdoodle

Boo still has the runs though they are not watery, they have a bit more form to them. If I were to put it on a plate, it would not immediately run off. It would take a minute or two to slide.

You just killed me with that, LOL! I needed the laugh tho!

Originally Posted by otto

I don't post in your thread every day but I am reading every day and keeping up with Booboo (and Chickster)

^^^ That. I read your thread every time I am on tcs, but sometimes I feel like I have nothing important to add.

Oh, that is the same price as Kv Vet Supply lol. I use the 18G needles too, that is what the vet gave me. I don't think I need the thin walls just yet.

Maybe you could put the litter box down every few hrs and let him use it supervised? That way if he goes to eat it, you can take it back up. Try shredding the newpaper and putting it in the box, then but um...

a #2 in there so get gets the idea. Watch him, and if he goes to eat it, take it up.

What did the vet say when you called?

I doubt it was the Vitamin that caused the runnies, could it have something to do with his kidneys? Stress can deff cause the runs too!

For no runny poo, and "be nice for fluids Boo."

**ETA: Here is a thread about anemia and eating litter, thought you would be interested:
http://www.thecatsite.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=216700

 

[snickerdoodle]

Boo has an appt with the younger vet (the wahoo up his yahoo vet) today and I am hoping we can have him feel his belly to see if he feels a blockage, he may get a big strong finger up his rear again, I am not sure, but I am hoping he will not require an XRay. If he does, we will manage it somehow, but I am so praying it is not a blockage.
The reason I am so worried now is because I am reading that cat litter, once ingested, can turn into "cement" in a cat's body. Then this causes the "incontinence overflow" in which whatever can get around it will, and it's always diarrhea. And once thinking about it, I wasn't sure how long he'd been eating the cat litter, I may have caught him doing it what, a couple weeks ago, but he may have been doing it for longer. He may not have done anything but taste a few granules (and we use Scoop away clumping with the fresh scent because it totally got rid of any odors and was so easy to use in a pan without liners, because they tore the heck up out of liners it was a waste of time and money) but I have no idea of telling how much he's eaten. The pine pellets, of course, he puked up, and it most of it had absorbed whatever was in his tummy and expanded, and when he puked it up (Or maybe it happened after he puked, with stomach bile outside of the body?) it had expanded into the sawdust. We have seen no pellets that we're absolutely sure of and I've seen no firm poopies come out.
This morning I saw he had pooped once last night, it was diarrhea, but it was just a bit firmer than last time, with some thicker stuff in it (like paste made out of flour, and some bits pastier than others. I know it's gross but I hadda be sure, thankfully I have latex gloves!)
He's done well this morning. He drank water, had his fluids (did great, gave him just a little extra to cover the runnies), ate a bit of dry food and he's resting in the closet again. He went to the window as usual. He's acting normal still, so far.
And no, we are fairly sure it is not the supp that is doing it, it would have totally been out of his system by now. It was just that the runs started about the same time we did the supp, but I got the supp because I noticed him eating cat litter. I am so dingy, I should have got the supp BEFORE all this happened! UGH!

Please believe me when I say I am so glad you read, even if you don't have anything to add, that's totally fine with me. I have no one else to really talk to about this, except you guys, and you guys keep me confident and really do help me out so much beyond belief, I really am so thankful for you guys. And I'm glad I could give a laugh

Because playing in cat poop, you have to have a little humor (I couldn't get through the day without it!!)

I will update after his appt today, vibes that there is no intestinal blockage!!!!

 

[otto]

Oh boy, hope all goes well today. An x ray very well may be needed.

Booboo!

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

Hey, I'm almost as bad as you (with your latex gloves!). After reading everyone's storires on this site, I follow all my cats around and make sure they are all peeing and pooping properly because now I'm so afraid of crystals, etc. I never had a cat in all my years of having them that EVER had a problem peeing, but now I'm paranoid!

Anyway, good luck with the dr. appt. I sure hope he doesn't have a blockage.

 

[snickerdoodle]

NO BLOCKAGE!

So says the young vet anyway. He squeezed on Boo's tummy for a good long while, and by the end of this visit, Boo was one mad cat, I tell you what, I really and truly have seen a new level of anger from this poor cat.
He said he felt a firm stool in there probably 2-3 inches long, but it was working its way down. He isn't sure why he has the runs, but he said he didn't want to start trying to give antibiotics or do an x-ray, since he wasn't vomiting and even commented on his own that he looked really really good (he really does) and he has a lot of energy. (Still had energy when he came home)
Somehow I got his anaemia #'s wrong, they actually went up instead of down. They were 11% but went up at the second visit to 13%.
The vet gave him anti-diarrhea meds, 5 CC's once a day, and I made sure to ask that this would NOT constipate him, he assured me it would NOT constipate him. He said if this "Amforal Suspension" does not work, he would like to try antibiotics and then perhaps be talking about an X-ray, and we would definitely be talking about some blood work. But with him acting as he was and looking good, and his eating and peeing and drinking, like I said, the vet would like to try to wait it out, especially since his skin turgor is still very good.
I also asked him to feel of his kidneys, since the right one felt englarged to me (And this is just feeling on his sides near his spine) he told me it was enlarged, and went into explaining how he could just have CRF from old age, or he could have CRF because of some type of lymphoma. I said, wow, you're talking cancer? He said yeah, but I highly doubt that's what he has, unless this kidney starts getting even bigger in the next few months, but he really highly doubted that. I don't know why he got to talking about all that.
I made a point to tell him about the pine pellets, and the clay, and told him I took those away and put newspaper down, he was surprised he would use the newspaper. Well, we had issues but they are under control for the most part. I would try putting down the clay pan every few hours for him to use, but putting it up would be the trick. If he for some reason wanted it while I was asleep, we'd have a big issue and it would be all over the carpet. I think I will try to stick with the newspapers since he is getting very used to them. He even picked a puppy pad to pee on instead of the newspaper when we got home.
So he had a tech bring in this huge horse pill that was cut in half. I said excuse me, are you going to try to shove that down his throat? She said yes so happily, I said no, I'm afraid you'll have to crush that up and put it in water, and use a syringe. The vet just ticked him off like crazy squeezing on his bladder, kidneys and intestines and he is very upset.
Well it got way worse from there, we had to wrap a towel around him and I had to hold him by the scruff of his neck and try to hold his front feet on the table while she squirted this stuff into his mouth.
He nearly took her hand off! I increased my grip (Always careful not to hurt him, he is fragile but WOW HE IS STRONG!!) and I mean to tell you we had the awfulest time trying to get in 5 CC's of this liquid med stuff. It was just horrible. It took like 10 minutes and he was making the most wicked noise I've ever heard. At one point he somehow rolled onto his back on the table with the towel all a mess around him and his mouth wide open growling. he was TICKED.
As soon as we let him back into the cage, he was fine. He even stared at the vet tech as she baby talked him and apologized.
Anyway, sorry, rambling. He weighs 7.4 pounds, no real loss, I'm happy about that, and he was bounding around when he got home for a bit but I think it's caught up with him now. He's passed out on the bed (After having a bit of cat nip and dry treat for his trouble)
He tinkled as soon as he got home.

So, we will see from here, but I at least have a bit more confidence that it is not a blockage. This vet was right the last time and even though I've disagreed with him at certain points, I do have confidence that what he is saying is true. He had a dog in there at the exact same time that had swallowed a bunch of chicken bones and had a blockage.

So! I am going to cuddle up with Boo and we're going to get some rest! Thank you all sooooooo much for all of your support, concern, advice and time. You have no idea how much Boo and I really do appreciate it.

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

Yah for no blockage!!

sorry for the brain fart (at the moment I have no idea how to really spell yah, rhymes with say, but you get the idea. good news!!)

 

[otto]

Thanks for the happy update! Booboo is so sweet to hold no grudges.

Glad the newspaper is working out. How's Chickster managing? Are they, Booboo and Chickster very close?

 

[snickerdoodle]

Chickster wants to be close to Boo, but since he was diagnosed with CRF back in March, Chickster tries to leave him alone. It's like she knows he doesn't want to be messed with. But sometimes, for no good reason, if she's just laying in the middle of the floor sucking on her toe and Boo happens to be too near to her, he'll somehow blame it on her and swat at her. If I pet him when she's too close, he'll go and swat at her. As if to say, "This is my Momma and my petting time you go find your own mama!"
I dunno. I've occassionally caught Chickster laying a couple feet from him on the bed (when he would sleep on my bed) as if to keep him company. But, no, from day 1, Boo wasn't too enthusiastic about her. He's always been an only child

They will sometimes sit in the window together, and I think Chickster cares about him, and Boo sort of cares about her, but when Boo hollers (for water, or during a particular tough sub-q treatment) Chickster will come running in eyes wide and really act upset about it. She doesn't like to know he is in pain.
Chickster is acting as if she doesn't remember the pan is up on the table. I've taken her down there twice, once she pooped and once she peed. So I'm keeping an eye on her to make sure she's drinking water, eating, and picking her chubby butt up and taking her down there, putting her on the floor, then on the chair, then on the table so she can see where her pan is. I think she's just being huffy about having her pan moved. LOL. I don't know. But things are well with her. Thank you for asking. I have got to get some sleep LOL ... Everyone else is knocked slap out!

 

[kluchetta]

I just had a thought, have you tried canned pumpkin for diahrrea/constipation issues?

 

[snickerdoodle]

I have tried canned pumpkin before, and still have a can in my cupboard, but I would have to mush it up and inject it into his mouth and that may be a slight fight about that. He will not eat it on his own. Neither will Chickster (I think I tried using that on her for constipation issues in the past)
I read up on this Amforal and all it seems to be is aluminum magnesium and bismuth (Edit: It also has Kanamyacin in it for bacterial infections, i.e., salmonella), but while researching it I saw it mostly connected with dogs and not so much cats. I also saw some of the warnings and cautions and it got me a little worried, but... I have to get ready to give him this first 5 CC's in just a second, I do want to try it to see if we can get this runny poop stopped. It hasn't got any firmer. It's the "put it on a plate and tilt it, and it would take a minute or two to slide" (Sorry LOL it's the only way I can describe it)
He's doing pretty well this morning but being punky about eating his wet food. He wants dry and on top of that wants his dry "treat" (I give him 4 or 5 pieces of Purina One after his fluid treatments when he does well) more than he wants his wet. I think he is connecting the wet food to his runs. Which would make sense, it looks the same, and you can hear his little tummy growling. I don't know if that is a hunger growl or those runs in there bubbling down to come out.
Anyway. Time to get the meds in him and then do fluids. I will update in a little while

Thanks to all of you. I will call the vet and ask about the canned pumpkin and see if he wants to try to incorporate that into the Amforal.

 

[snickerdoodle]

Well. As of 10:05AM he still has the runs. He went down there and poo'd, not a whole lot, but it sure came out rather quickly. Sounds like he's got a bit of gas too. I gave him the Amforal at 8:30AM, ... One thing I forgot to mention to the vet was how horribly fowl these runs smell. I mean, they smell very very badly. But now, I am wondering if it's got anything to do with his cat nip. He doesn't like the catnip oil, so I take a very small pinch and put it on an oven mitt for him to lick. I make sure there are no sticks, splinters or anything, and it's only ever been a little bit. He's never had issue with that before, but he goes immediately to the catnip after fluids and after the runs.
This newspaper business is just really not helping matters. I am wondering if it would be feasible to pick up and put down a pan every few hours, but he is not pooing on a schedule, and if I miss a poo, .. well. I can't cover the entire room in plastic. I nearly broke my neck trying to clean up a wet spot earlier because the plastic is so slick LOL
anyway. He got to go outside for a bit and did not try to eat any of the grass or anything like he usually does. He's not lip smacking. He ate a lot of his Royal Canin dry and he ate a bit of wet. (This is as of 10AM or so, he ate before that this morning too)
My mother keeps insisting I reduce his fluids, and I try explaining I can't do that without an okay from the vet, and plus, diarrhea will cause even more dehydration, and if I reduce fluids, that will only make matters worse (I'm not listening to her, so don't worry

)
I am calling the vet now to find out when I should start seeing a change. And I will mention the foul smell. Something else that is odd (I feel like Dr. House trying to connect all these things) is that I am starting to have the same symptoms, and (sorry, TMI) it smells just as foul. Could we have picked something up, perhaps? Or I did, and transferred it to him?
..hmmm...

OKay. Updates later. Thank you all so so so much

 

[otto]

My CRF kitty Ootay had very foul smelling poops too. My theory was because the kidney's aren't doing their job of filtering the blood so great, more waste product goes through the bowel. Dunno if that is even possible and my vet didn't say one way or another when I voiced my thoughts to her.

But Ootay's

poops stunk!

 

[snickerdoodle]

Chicksters manage to smell very strongly sometimes, but Boo's isn't just a bad poop smell, it's like a sick smell, like you only get when you've got a stomach bug and it almost makes you wanna just do more than gag.
The vet called back and said I should expect to hopefully see results by Monday or Tuesday. If by Tuesday he is still having the runs, I need to call back. They asked if he had eaten anything unusual for the foul smell, and I said besides CAT LITTER no, he has been eating regular stuff. Then they told me that yes, bacteria can cause a very foul odor. I am leaning towards bacteria myself, and thankful this stuff has antibiotic in it, but hoping it does harm him. I agree with you too, Otto, about the kidneys having something to do with it. They felt of his kidneys when we took him in and the one on the right is enlarged. Say the one on the left feels like the size of a golfball and the one on the right closer to a tennis ball. (Not THAT big, but noticeable) He is sleeping in his cat bed (for the first time in weeks and weeks) after I put one of my dirty (worn a couple days) shirt on it inside out. He's in a cool quiet dark room very comfortable and sleeping.
So today has been good so far. If I can manage to get him to use the pee pads, they absorb better than newspaper and he won't go continuing to step in them or have it run onto his legs. Poor little thing.

Thank you everyone for your support

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

Snickerdoodle, it looks like LDG, who posted "Whoohoo, 40 Hematocrit" knows a WHOLE LOT about anemia, and she posted some info after you posted in her above post. You might want to pm her about it, as she mentioned her Vet has found something that has worked in every case of anemia now. I don't know how it effects kidneys, but it's worth discussing with her, and your Vet. (just though I would let you know in case you don't go back once you've read a post)

 

[snickerdoodle]

Oh thank you so much!!! I will certainly go look right now!!

 

[snickerdoodle]

Well. It's 3 AM and I was just awoken to Chickster growling and hissing at her own rear end again. I've searched everywhere and can't find anything. I spent most of last night trying to connect dots betwee Boo and Chickster, and I can't come up with anything but my knowledge of feline diseases is very small. Boo had a small bit of runs (Maybe 2 tablespoons) with 2 little thicker chunks mixed in there.
Chickster also vomited earlier this afternoon but it was a very small amount and she had just finished drinking a goodly amount of water. This was also after a bout of hissing at her rear end.
A few minutes ago I managed to get ahold of her and take a fresh dingleberry off her tail that was hanging by a hair or two, and cleaned up another very small spot (quarter size) of vomit with a little hair mixed in.
I gave her miralax about 4 days ago. I am so confused.
But, Boo has been very quiet and chill all day, he asked for water a little while ago and got some (has to be tub water, ya know)
Chickster was pooping fine up until yesterday, this is when the little bit of runny happened with her. I have not seen her eating anything she's not supposed to be. No blood anywhere. She pooped 2 regular to large size stools on 2 days, which would have been Wednesday and Thursday or Thursday and Friday. I don't get this! Ugh!

Going to go do some more research. She is calmed down for now, I tried to wipe her butt down but she got growly with me, and when Chickster gets growly that's one cat you leave alone, because she will attack and not give a crap, unlike Boo who can stand a lot more from me.

Just need vibes that this is some sort of stomach virus that will pass, or something insignificant and nothing serious. Thanks guys.