Started with crystals, now I am not sure.

[nansiludie]

Oh, I was hoping he'd be feeling better. He seems to have better days and not so good days. What are you feeding him? If it is the RX food, he may not like it. It may be worth asking the Vet if you could feed him anything else that he would eat, normally I would advise you to do so but given the surgery and everything else, its best if you were given a professionals opinion. I am wondering though, about the pain meds? I found the label that I was given for my cats' that were spayed, the name of it is meloxicam, it helps to reduce pain and inflammation. Given that the bladder was opened up, I am not surprised it is a little inflamed. Could you see if they would give you some meloxicam for Pumpkin?

 

[angels mommy]

Yes, I agree about the Rx food. I know a lot of people have said their cats didn't like the Royal Cane. I think Angel had that brand for something in the past & didn't like it either. I think it was the more gel like texture vs/ pate'.  Angel was on the Purina UR SO. (My vet knowing how I felt about Rx food ingredients not being great) it was the the one w/ the least amount of bad ingredients between the 3 Rx foods they carried for urinary issues.  

This is the Purina UR SO

IMG_0115.JPG

• angels mommy
• Jan 4, 2014

After more than a year on this, w/ the help of the natural pet food store here, I found this, & he has been on it ever since. A healthier, non Rx more natural alternative formula made for urinary care. 

http://www.chewy.com/cat/daves-pet-food-restricted-diet/dp/101617

 

[kellie90]

Well after going back and forth we decided that I would go pick up the capsules of Gabapentin and they would be split 4 ways the best that I can until the liquid comes in tomorrow.  The vet did feel that this medication wuld work best for him for pain and spasms of bladder, I am at a complete loss.  I do not think I have ever felt so helpless when it came to one of my fur babies. As far as the IV fluids at home, we did not discuss it maybe because Pumpkin was not really dehydrated....I just do not know but I can talk to them tomorrow about it.  I am only giving him RX canned food, he has 2 different kinds, 3 flavors.  He did eat a little bit earlier along with a 1/2 jar of chicken baby food diluted.  We did try the Purina UR but he refused to eat it.  Vet said that he doesn't not need to be put in the bathroom tonight, however he is going in because I can then monitor his urine output better....that is how I knew immediately this morning that there was a problem starting.  

 

[angels mommy]

 
Well after going back and forth we decided that I would go pick up the capsules of Gabapentin and they would be split 4 ways the best that I can until the liquid comes in tomorrow.  The vet did feel that this medication wuld work best for him for pain and spasms of bladder, I am at a complete loss.  I do not think I have ever felt so helpless when it came to one of my fur babies. As far as the IV fluids at home, we did not discuss it maybe because Pumpkin was not really dehydrated....I just do not know but I can talk to them tomorrow about it.  I am only giving him RX canned food, he has 2 different kinds, 3 flavors.  He did eat a little bit earlier along with a 1/2 jar of chicken baby food diluted.  We did try the Purina UR but he refused to eat it.  Vet said that he doesn't not need to be put in the bathroom tonight, however he is going in because I can then monitor his urine output better....that is how I knew immediately this morning that there was a problem starting.  

I am glad he will be getting the meds sooner. Hopefully that will make a difference, & turn things around for the better.

as far as the IV fluids, *Angel wasn't dehydrated either, he actually tested a very good moisture level (forget what name of that test was).  

The vet had me doing it as a way to keep him flushing out his bladder w/ all that extra fluid. Getting as much of the crystals flushed out, & letting the food do the rest, as well as the cosequin & the amatriptyline. 

 

[furmummy]

Prayers for your boy.

FWIW, steroids do not do much for inflammation in the bladder...

Also, don't forget that just because he had surgery to create another opening, that did not address the cystitis or its symptoms.

Cystitis being very much affected by stress... And one can say he has been plenty stressed, no?

Hope the Gapapentin workds. If not, ask for Buprenex. 

Get some Tinkle Tonic and use it for a long time..  See if you can have some laser treatments.

Keep him as happy and calm as possible...  Which you are already doing.

You are a very good Kitty Mom!  

 

[kellie90]

I have had to put him back into the bathroom as he is urinating on everything he can find, rugs, towels (that I put down for him) his bed and of course all the litter boxes.  It is just a constant path from one litter to another and all items in between.  He is actually urinating a fair amount for him each time, how does a cat have this much urine?  I gave him him first dose of Gabapentin at 2:45pm, he will continue to get a dose every 8 hours.  So far I have not noticed any difference other than he is restless and that could be the urge to urinate and not the medicine.  Anyone have any experience with this medication?

I know that he does not like the bathroom and that is probably adding to his stress, but I feel I have no choice till things calm down for him.  I am checking on him every 20-30 minutes, cleaning his litter, sweeping the floor and putting down clean towels.....I think I will run to the dollar store to see if they have the puppy pads to use instead of towels.  it is going to be a really long night and I am not sure that I could be any more stressed.

 

[angels mommy]

Well that's good news that he's peeing a lot! I was thinking the same thing about the puppy pads.  I don't have any experience w/ those meds, so don't know if that's what's  making him restless. That's why I liked the amatriptyline, it's a anti anxiety/ antidepressant, but helped relax his bladder.  I would still strongly recommend some comfort zone or feliway plug in diffusers to help calm any stress,  maybe a calming collar from the pet store would work & be less expensive too.

     

 

[nansiludie]

That is strange. I wonder if he is having trouble holding his bladder? I do not have any experience with the constant urinating like in his case. Its only been a few days since the PU surgery right?

 

[kellie90]

Actually he did not have the P/U it was the cystotomy that he had done on Wed 7/8 (6 days ago).  Pumpkin actually did really good last nite, allowed him to stay out after all since he seemed to calm way down with his urinating.  He loved laying in bed with mom and sitting in the open window all night.  This morning he was ready for breakfast and back to his normal self....I could feel the stress start to leave my body for the first time in over a month.  He urinated finally about 8:30am a fair amount and only went to the other litter once to finish emptying his bladder then went back to the open window.  THEN around 10am he casually went over the to litter, squatted, passed some urine and cried,  happened again about 1/2 hr later.  Ate his lunch and then he went and jumped up and the back of the couch and is sound to sleep....what is up with this???  The vet is going to be calling later today they said and I will be asking about this, may take him in to have them check his bladder and make sure it is fairly empty since I will be hopefully picking up the liquid medication for him.  Will let everyone know what know comes of this.

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

I took gabapentin for Shingles and it's known for turning one into an idiot

.  So I can see how  pumpkin might get restless on it.  That being said, it is also a pain killer.  Additionally, I found this thread where a cat got into his human's supply of it, and it caused him to run around peeing on everything!  Her Vet said this was a common side effect

.  So...that may explain what happened with all that peeing on the towels, etc.  As to the crying in the litterbox, maybe he was just afraid he would experience pain, and hopefully he didn't

 

[furmummy]

This may be helpful:

http://veterinarymedicine.dvm360.co...home-pain-control-measures-cats?rel=canonical

Here's an excerpt:

For cats that have had a diagnostic or surgical procedure and will require pain control during a short recuperative period (usually less than seven days), my first choice is buprenorphine applied to the buccal membrane. I dispense the buprenorphine in single-dose syringes with instructions to store at room temperature and away from light. I typically start with a dose of 0.01 mg/kg given three times a day but will increase the dose to 0.02 mg/kg given three times a day in situations in which the patient's pain is refractory to the lower dose.

For patients with chronic pain (i.e. joint disease, cancer, chronic oral disease), I recommend tramadol hydrochloride or buprenorphine. Tramadol can be administered orally at a dose of 1 to 4 mg/kg twice daily. Tramadol has the advantage of being an oral preparation that is not a controlled drug. However, some cats find the taste unpalatable, and both dysphoria and mydriasis have been reported as side effects in some cats, particularly at higher doses. Buprenorphine can also be used for chronic pain and is a good option in cats that are difficult to medicate or those that do not respond well to tramadol. However, the expense of long-term buprenorphine treatment combined with having to dispense multiple prefilled syringes make it a less desirable option than tramadol.

In feline patients with chronic pain refractory to tramadol or buprenorphine, gabapentin or amantadine hydrochloride are options. The starting dose I use for gabapentin in cats is 3 mg/kg per os administered once daily, but the dose may be increased to 5 to 10 mg/kg twice daily if needed. I avoid the oral solution of gabapentin because this preparation contains xylitol.

 

[furmummy]

This may be useful:

For cats that have had a diagnostic or surgical procedure and will require pain control during a short recuperative period (usually less than seven days), my first choice is buprenorphine applied to the buccal membrane. I dispense the buprenorphine in single-dose syringes with instructions to store at room temperature and away from light. I typically start with a dose of 0.01 mg/kg given three times a day but will increase the dose to 0.02 mg/kg given three times a day in situations in which the patient's pain is refractory to the lower dose.

For patients with chronic pain (i.e. joint disease, cancer, chronic oral disease), I recommend tramadol hydrochloride or buprenorphine. Tramadol can be administered orally at a dose of 1 to 4 mg/kg twice daily. Tramadol has the advantage of being an oral preparation that is not a controlled drug. However, some cats find the taste unpalatable, and both dysphoria and mydriasis have been reported as side effects in some cats, particularly at higher doses. Buprenorphine can also be used for chronic pain and is a good option in cats that are difficult to medicate or those that do not respond well to tramadol. However, the expense of long-term buprenorphine treatment combined with having to dispense multiple prefilled syringes make it a less desirable option than tramadol.

In feline patients with chronic pain refractory to tramadol or buprenorphine, gabapentin or amantadine hydrochloride are options. The starting dose I use for gabapentin in cats is 3 mg/kg per os administered once daily, but the dose may be increased to 5 to 10 mg/kg twice daily if needed. I avoid the oral solution of gabapentin because this preparation contains xylitol.

Unable to post a link, but it was found on veterinarymedicine.dvm360 (dot)com

 

[nansiludie]

Oh, I am glad to hear of it. I hope he is feeling better today. I take it that they opened the bladder and removed the stones?

 

[angels mommy]

It's so good to hear he is doing better. I've been really praying for little Pumpkin.  I know how it is dealing w/ this stuff. It's also good news that you were able to relax a little from all the stress of it.

They definitely pick up on our emotions, especially stress, so that will also help him, for you to be more relaxed. (trust me, I know, sometimes easier said than done). 

Your doing a great job with him. 

  I know being out & around you will make him feel better too, so glad he is. "Mommies always make you feel better." 

The info & insight on the meds are good to know as well from mrsgreenjeens. That does explain a lot.  Yes, hopefully the crying was only fear, & not pain.  Maybe he was passing some crystals?

That would be a good question for the vet when you talk to them, & or take Pumpkin in for a follow up when picking up the meds. 

 

[kellie90]

Had to take our little one into vets again on Tuesday because Pumpkin was starting to run from litter to litter again.  Vet gave a steroid shot and sent home with "if this does not work we will probably have to put down".  Thank goodness it worked, he did excellent till the steroid shot wore off yesterday.  Talked to vet  in the morning and was told to give him a Prednisone which I did .  By 5:30pm  he still was not better so I made the dreaded call to have him put down.  While waiting for the vet to get back to me, Pumpkin suddenly stopped running to the litters and started playing with a fur mouse.  

He is still doing fairly well this morning, however I went into the vets this morning and asked about the medication Prazosin for his urethra spasms.  Said they would prescribe it for him however I really needed to watch for Tachycardia, now I am so scared that I am making the wrong choice...but I guess I need to look at it as what other choice do I have?  Has anyone had any bad experiences with this medication?  

 

[nansiludie]

No, I have never used it. I am very sorry you are having such trouble with this and everything. I think it may be best you try the medication and at least see how it goes than not trying at all.

You might regret it later if you didn't try it.

 

[angels mommy]

I really hope the medication works. i have no experience w/ it either. I think I would try all possible medications before doing the very last dreaded thing. 

I would think like us, you just have to find the meds that are the right fit for for him.  I would even ask about the amatriptyline. It worked for Angel.  Like I said before, I think it was a good choice because it's an anti-anxiety  /antidepressant that was used to help relax the bladder, but I think the anti-anxiety part would be helpful to Pumpkin after all he's been through. Maybe it will make a difference. everything is worth a try for his life.  

I pray you won't have to make that horrible final call. 

 

He will continue to be in my prayers 

 

[einzmer]

I checked what other people said about cystotomy recovery. Some people said their cats still peed tiny amounts or run from litter box to litter box because of pain or bladder irritation after surgery. It took someone 2 weeks before their cat became normal and another person 1 month. All these vet trips probably adds stress to the cat too.

 

[angels mommy]

Very good point, & I think important information. He needs more recovery time, & low stress, then things will probably get back to normal, or close to it. Given healing & recovery time, along w/ the cosequin reducing inflammation, hopefully time is all he needs.

 

[kellie90]

I do not want to jinx anything ....but so far so good.  Pumpkin was playing this morning with one of the dog toys, rolling around and scratching on the cat post.  Goes into litter one time, does his business and out he goes to continue with life.  Fingers crossed and prayers that just maybe.....