Need input - FIV+ and FIV- cats living together. Risks/Concerns

[catsnip404]

Oh wow!  This IS a great breakthrough!  Sounds like Orville was just letting Chaucer know not to try anything too serious, and it all worked out well.  

I would not want a cat fight, or startled cats, on my legs either!  Yikes!!  

Yes, they do have additional tests but they are really expensive.  I debated even bothering to do the FIV one, since it won't make any difference except set my mind more at ease if it turned out he was negative.

About the tooth, I wonder if it's related to the FIV.  When Nero had his teeth cleaned, they told me he has lost all but one of his tiny incisors, poor guy!  No more nibbling corn on the cob for Nero I guess!

Wonders about kitty dentures.....hmmmmm.....

I'll have to think of where to post The Cat Bachelor.  LOL!!

 

[chaucer]

The Bachelor:   Cat Style

You might have videos going viral with your Bachelor version.

I'm mostly concerned now about Henryetta. Orville is getting pretty tired of her hissy fits and is starting to follow her around. I am hoping there won't be a confrontation.

Orville looks like he has all his teeth except for the missing bottom front tooth.

 

[chaucer]

Update:  Orville spent his first night in the house and it went okay.  I woke up at 2:00 AM, though, and couldn't go back to sleep. About 3:45, Henryetta managed to get my door open and she and Chaucer came in my room. At that point, I decided to just get up and feed them. It was a good thing I did get up because when I opened the window, as I have to do every morning for Henryetta to sniff the air,  (Cats!) Orville became restless. I eventually saw him in the living room next to the rug-on-rug preparing to squat. I picked him up and carried him to the litter box in the den, sat him in it, worked his feet and he took the longest tinkle, and then with Chaucer (and me) observing, he pooped in the box!  He spent an inordinately long time covering everything, but I praised him and tried to give him a treat which he didn't seem to want, but did go eat the rest of the cat food I'd put for Henryetta.

So, let's hope and pray that he now knows to use the litter box.

 

[kittyluv387]

Oh wow awesome you caught him beforehand!

 

[catwoman707]

This is very good.

I have no idea the size of the boxes you have but highly recommend the large open boxes with a good amount of litter for the best chance of him getting to be a faithful user.

I don't think it's so much the leaves/dirt he needs to associate, it's the fact that he is used to having a large area and lots of whatever to bury his business with.

The one I use is 17" x 22" x 7" tall. Both my girls are big but Simone would poop at the very end sometimes getting it on the side of the box so this one is perfectly sized so that doesn't happen anymore.

Over time once he is established as faithful user, you can cut back somewhat on the depth of the litter in the box, it's not cheap I know!

 

[zed xyzed]

Boy you have some circus going on in your house, always something exciting happening. Thankfully it has all been of the good kind  for the most part. I really look forward to every update.

 

[foxxycat]

Just wanted to tell you that you are doing an awesome job with the cats.

Also I see that you have been worried about FIV+ and I wanted to say something about this. I hope you don't think that this is weird but from my knowledge about viruses and biological sciences to me I equate FIV as similar to HIV. They are not interchangeable meaning we can not get the feline version or at least I have yet to see anything. But try to think about it in terms of what we know about HIV.
1 its hard to catch. In order for successful transfer there has to be no air contact with the virus. Just like in humans its not caught by kissing or sharing dishes. Also in order to catch FIV there would have to be blood or other fluid exchange. I don't see this happening with the way they get along so well.

I hope this helps put it in perspective better and relieve your fears. I am not a doctor but in my limited understanding about how this virus works I don't think you need to worry about transmission. I'm amazed by how well he has come inside and cruised around with the other cats.

This cat definitely was a housecat at one time. I caught or rather lured a feral cat in the kitchen after weeks of working with him and I made the mistake of closing the door. He went absolutely nuts. If this cat was really feral he would not want anything to do with you or the cats.

So glad to see him getting more comfortable in the house. As far as litter boxes you can get some plastic cement mixer containers that I have heard are much cheaper than the litter boxes. Or even those storage containers that are narrow height sided but a good size wide And long so he can get used to cat box.

As far as cement mixer containers I've seen this suggestion in one of the feral Facebook page I follow.

 

[chaucer]

Just wanted to tell you that you are doing an awesome job with the cats.

Also I see that you have been worried about FIV+ and I wanted to say something about this. I hope you don't think that this is weird but from my knowledge about viruses and biological sciences to me I equate FIV as similar to HIV. They are not interchangeable meaning we can not get the feline version or at least I have yet to see anything. But try to think about it in terms of what we know about HIV.
1 its hard to catch. In order for successful transfer there has to be no air contact with the virus. Just like in humans its not caught by kissing or sharing dishes. Also in order to catch FIV there would have to be blood or other fluid exchange. I don't see this happening with the way they get along so well.

I hope this helps put it in perspective better and relieve your fears. I am not a doctor but in my limited understanding about how this virus works I don't think you need to worry about transmission. I'm amazed by how well he has come inside and cruised around with the other cats.

This cat definitely was a housecat at one time. I caught or rather lured a feral cat in the kitchen after weeks of working with him and I made the mistake of closing the door. He went absolutely nuts. If this cat was really feral he would not want anything to do with you or the cats.

So glad to see him getting more comfortable in the house. As far as litter boxes you can get some plastic cement mixer containers that I have heard are much cheaper than the litter boxes. Or even those storage containers that are narrow height sided but a good size wide And long so he can get used to cat box.

As far as cement mixer containers I've seen this suggestion in one of the feral Facebook page I follow.

Thank you, and thank you for the information.

Orville is using Henryetta's litter box that I put out because it is the largest of the three I have. I had purchased one but it is too small for him. I look forward to the day I can put  a littler box for him in the laundry room with the ones for Henryetta and Chaucer.  Orville seems to be a cat who wants his business removed right away, which is a problem overnight and when I'm not at home, but at least he is using it.

I agree about the former house cat thing now. He has settled in well, and he seems to understand the words "No," "Hey," and "Down."  He's picked up quickly on the routine, even mewing outside my bedroom door like the other two do.  He also has tried out most every piece of furniture in he house and has sat on my bed some.  The worry now is  that I took someone's indoor/outside cat, but again I can't imagine someone not taking care of his hurt foot back last February when he started coming her some to eat. I found a few photo from back then and he doesn't even look like the same cat now. He looks twice the size and his eyes are bright.  And what a playful cat!  I just wish Henryetta would stop hissing and growling at him. Today, she was eating and he started eating with her. She suddenly glanced over and realized it wasn't Chaucer and hissed at Orville.

My hope is that this thread will encourage those who have FIV cats to share their experiences for all of us learning to deal with a blended cat family.

 

[chaucer]

OMG!  Look what happened a little while ago. 

Siblings.jpg

• chaucer
• Feb 1, 2016

There was something very interesting about Orville's behavior with Henryetta.  He had never played with her through the door so there wasn't that familiarity as there was with Chaucer.  When Orville came in the house, he was very determined to become friendly with Henryetta. He respected her boundaries but didn't give up. Earlier today, she was hissy and growly but I thought there might be a slight thaw and it was an act so I began to touch her or rub her back when she growled at Orville.  When I went to my bedroom,  she came with me and jumped on the bed. I sat down to pet her and he came in and jumped on the bed. Each time she growled, I petted her. Instead of doing whatever it was I went in there to do. I picked up a book and sat on the bed reading. Orville kept gradually getting closer to the curled-up Henryetta. In maybe 10 minutes, this is what happened.

I really believe he recognized her and that maybe they are litter mates and he knew it. I have photos of the  "getting closer," but this was the final one and I love it.

 

[catwoman707]

OMG! If you could see the huge smile and chills I just got from seeing this pic.............

I see her eyes, she is fully aware of him there touching her, and see his eyes? Thinking he juuust might be getting away with this, but anticipating a full on reaction from her.....but hoping not......heehee,  this is incredibly heartwarming to see.....he is most definitely seeking her acceptance. Playing the male role to a T.

A GIANT step in the best direction!! 

Just as sweet as can be, this pic is a keeper )

 

[catsnip404]

That's fantastic!!  What a fabulous update!  I love that pic, and agree with Catwoman -- you can almost see what they're thinking in their eyes.  So glad for this breakthrough!  Orville seems like a real sweetheart!  I imagine you're still a little nervous, but I hope with each of these moments your fears are subsiding a little at a time.  

 

[zed xyzed]

what a wonderful picture, Orville is indeed a very special guy. And you are amazing, it seem you have done everything right. Like mentioned above this picture puts a smile on my face

 

[chaucer]

 
OMG! If you could see the huge smile and chills I just got from seeing this pic.............

I see her eyes, she is fully aware of him there touching her, and see his eyes? Thinking he juuust might be getting away with this, but anticipating a full on reaction from her.....but hoping not......heehee,  this is incredibly heartwarming to see.....he is most definitely seeking her acceptance. Playing the male role to a T.

A GIANT step in the best direction!! 

Just as sweet as can be, this pic is a keeper )

Thank you. You were right that he just wants to belong, be loved and owned.  He's a good cat with a sweet nature. He's friendly like Chaucer and just wants to be a part of things. She still hisses and growls at him, but his desire to be her friend is sweet. Today, he was up in the kitchen window with her and she didn't do anything.  The pictures I got of him and Chaucer on the sofa were cute too. Chaucer was curled up sleeping and Orville jumped up and laid down right against him. A one point, Orville put his feet on Chaucer and he did groom his back for a second. Chaucer didn't mind.

 

[chaucer]

 
That's fantastic!!  What a fabulous update!  I love that pic, and agree with Catwoman -- you can almost see what they're thinking in their eyes.  So glad for this breakthrough!  Orville seems like a real sweetheart!  I imagine you're still a little nervous, but I hope with each of these moments your fears are subsiding a little at a time.  

Thanks!  I am still a little concerned but I am getting better about it.  He's spent three nights in the house. 

I'm waiting for the Bachelor Cat! 

 
what a wonderful picture, Orville is indeed a very special guy. And you are amazing, it seem you have done everything right. Like mentioned above this picture puts a smile on my face

That's really kind of you to say. I think I have done everything the wrong way, based on how one is supposed to introduce cats but it seems to have worked. Mostly, though, I think it is due to the males' personalities. The female should come around. She acted like this with Chaucer at first, even though she let him play with her last kitten who was just three months old and had absolutely no fear of Chaucer and rough-housed with him for a month-and-a-half until my friends came to get her.

 

[catwoman707]

 
Thank you. You were right that he just wants to belong, be loved and owned.  He's a good cat with a sweet nature. He's friendly like Chaucer and just wants to be a part of things. She still hisses and growls at him, but his desire to be her friend is sweet. Today, he was up in the kitchen window with her and she didn't do anything.  The pictures I got of him and Chaucer on the sofa were cute too. Chaucer was curled up sleeping and Orville jumped up and laid down right against him. A one point, Orville put his feet on Chaucer and he did groom his back for a second. Chaucer didn't mind.

I think that you are/will continue to see that the 3 of them will blend perfectly together.

It couldn't go much better really.

As for you saying you have done everything wrong as far as introductions, I don't agree. You adapted the individual cat's dispositions including Orville feeling insecure about a closed door, and sort of played it as needed with each step.

They basically dictated how to proceed, and all is turning out beautifully!

Give yourself some credit!!

 

[chaucer]

 
I think that you are/will continue to see that the 3 of them will blend perfectly together.

It couldn't go much better really.

As for you saying you have done everything wrong as far as inductions, I don't agree. You adapted the individual cat's dispositions including Orville feeling insecure about a closed door, and sort of played it as needed with each step.

They basically dictated how to proceed, and all is turning out beautifully!

Give yourself some credit!!

The thing between Henryetta and Orville is interesting, and if he didn't have FIV I'd let it play out, but I do intervene some.  For example, I opened the small windows in my den/breakfast room. They are high on the wall. Henryetta was standing on ledge, enjoying the nice day and Orville was lying on top of the Edison which is the same height as the window ledge. Slowly, he stretched himself and put his head and front paws on the ledge next to her with his body suspended between the top of the Edison and window ledge. A good 10 inches of air was beneath his body. When she noticed this, she turned, growled, bit his ear (I'm sure not hard) and swatted his head. This big cat just laid there with his eyes closed.  He has followed her around all day today, jumping in the windows with her and just generally going around with her. She doesn't seem to like this. What it reminds me of is a male cat going trailing behind a female in heat. Is it posible that he knows she is female even though she is spayed and his "urges" are still there even though he was neutered a few months ago? I really do believe he knows her though.  When Henryetta first moved in, Chaucer went around after her, but he was trying to play. Of course, Chaucer was not quite 1.5 years old then.  Orville just wants to be near her.  It's sweet and sad at the same time, but I don't want him to get fed up with her hissing, growling, biting at and swatting him and then go for it and retaliate.

The reason I feel I did things against advice is that I didn't separate him from the other two when he came in to live. He had full privileges. I would have separated him if I had a place, but as I said before, it really wasn't possible. Henryetta was separated but she was pregnant so she couldn't move around quite as well. She moved later to the storage room a couple of weeks before the kittens were born and lived there for five months before coming in permanently.  I suppose you are right though, I had to base it on the cats' personalities and trust issues.

 

[catwoman707]

It sounds like he is really urging her to befriend him.

Remember how I described the male/female roles and how they work? There's just no way he is going to get fed up and retaliate, he will continue to persuade her to like him, she will gradually give him more approval once she feels completely secure in her position, which to me seeing the pic yesterday shows she is giving some leeway now, meanwhile he will keep showing her he accepts this and begs for her to approve of him.

They know what sex they all are, girls smell like girls and boys like boys, fixed or not.

His hormones are adjusted now so that drive is for friendship. He must feel accepted by Chaucer so the focus now is on Henryetta.

 

[chaucer]

 
It sounds like he is really urging her to befriend him.

Remember how I described the male/female roles and how they work? There's just no way he is going to get fed up and retaliate, he will continue to persuade her to like him, she will gradually give him more approval once she feels completely secure in her position, which to me seeing the pic yesterday shows she is giving some leeway now, meanwhile he will keep showing her he accepts this and begs for her to approve of him.

They know what sex they all are, girls smell like girls and boys like boys, fixed or not.

His hormones are adjusted now so that drive is for friendship. He must feel accepted by Chaucer so the focus now is on Henryetta.

He really wants to be her friend and she's not convinced. I'm glad to see that about the sexes. The vet told me that if I got a third cat, then they would notice the sexes more. I've always thought Chaucer knew because of the way he would, well, mount Henryetta and then wrestle. She doesn't like it when he does the former. Orville just follows her around and rolls in front of her, and in front of Chaucer.

The one thing I don't like with Orville is his jumping on everything.  Chaucer is long, lean, and weighs just under 10 pounds so when he jumps on things it's light. Orville is heavy and lands with a thud and leaps on top of things - from the floor. All the cats have their claws and most definitely are keeping them, but  this may sound awful, but my house is full of family antiques and real vintage items. I'd prefer they not be destroyed by his jumping and scratching.  I'm hoping that he settles down soon. He also is introducing the other two to the joys of jumping on my counters. So, when I can get him to the vet for another worming, he is getting his claws trimmed way down. Ditto for the other two.

 

[chaucer]

Orville is at the vet becoming a real member of the family. Along with a worm check, nail trim, and exam, he is being micro-chipped which cements his place with me. He will be at the vet's all day because he has to be sedated, but I was really glad I'd been told that when I could get him in the crate, I could bring him without an actual appointment.  He was terrified when the technician and I got his dog crate into the room.  He was shaking, poor thing, but the technician was pleased with all my answers about his health, particularly since he is FIV +.  I don't know what the exam and fecal results will be, but he seems okay.  Hoping everything checks out okay with him.

Also, is it odd that a big strapping cat like  Orville mews like a kitten unless he is upset?  He sounds so much like a kitten that Henryetta goes to check.

 

[harleyq143]

Hi there, I've been following your post for the past couple of days. I was referred to this thread by a few other members who had written on my thread since I am currently in a similar position as you. I took in a male stray a week ago and after much chaos (which was the reason I started a thread in the first place) I just found out this past Monday that he is FIV positive. I also freaked out and was devastated because I have a negative cat at home who I feared for. Since Monday I've been doing as much research as I can and reading your thread. I'm now hopeful and feeling more reassured at this situation I've been dealt with. But I am still nervous and trying to ensure I create a good introduction between the two cats. He is currently staying in my upstairs bathroom and in several days I plan on opening the door a few times with two baby gates in the door way.

I'm so happy for you and impressed at the progress Orville has made into your family. Please keep the updates coming as I'll continue to check back about the integrating. I've been able to find a lot of useful information off your thread so thank you for starting this thread! Good luck to Orville on his doc appointment. My little guy will be getting a full checkup at the vet in 2 weeks, hoping he's ok.

Here's a link to my thread in case you may come across anything useful off of it as well although the members on your thread did a great job providing lots of info : http://www.thecatsite.com/t/313589/...s-abscess-i-dont-know-what-to-do#post_3928300

All the best!