is innova really worth it?

[mechanicalman]

The cost of dry food is so low for me (one ~10 lb cat) that I basically ignore price when choosing a dry food. I have a few coupons for free bags, but I've decided to give them to friends. I'd estimate that feeding EVO is costing me less than $6 a month, so the money isn't an issue. I'd rather feed her something I'm happy with than something that is simply inexpensive or free.

Originally Posted by LondonKat

My cats seem to like it, but the "end product" is quite stinky if you catch my drift.

I've noticed that as well.

I've considered ordering a bag of Orijen to see if that is an improvement, but I'll probably stick with EVO. *shrug*

 

[sharky]

Originally Posted by MechanicalMan

The cost of dry food is so low for me (one ~10 lb cat) that I basically ignore price when choosing a dry food. I have a few coupons for free bags, but I've decided to give them to friends. I'd estimate that feeding EVO is costing me less than $6 a month, so the money isn't an issue. I'd rather feed her something I'm happy with than something that is simply inexpensive or free.


I've noticed that as well.

I've considered ordering a bag of Orijen to see if that is an improvement, but I'll probably stick with EVO. *shrug*

ORIJEN was the only grain free with no digestive issues here smell or loose

 

[leila]

LondonKat, this article is quite helpful for explaining why wet food is better than dry food for cats: Why Cats Need Canned Food

The website also has other helpful information about cats on a wide variety of topics

 

[mechanicalman]

Dry food typically contains 35-50% carbohydrates, mostly as starch. (The new "grain-free" foods may be as little as 20% carbohydrate).

Either this article is outdated or the author is simply misinformed.

Canned cat foods contain 45-50% protein

And so do some dry foods.

At least some of the "you're evil if you feed your cat dry food" articles that I've read contain factually accurate information about grain-free dry food.

 

[sharky]

Originally Posted by MechanicalMan

Either this article is outdated or the author is simply misinformed.


And so do some dry foods.

At least some of the "you're evil if you feed your cat dry food" articles that I've read contain factually accurate information about grain-free dry food.

TYPICALLY true PREMIUM dry cats are 25-50 % carbs... yes grocery types can be as high as 70 % carbs ... Grain frees vary from 25 down to 7% carbs

Wet food PREMIUM is usually about 50% protein..... Most premium wets contain 3-10% carbs

WET food protein is MUCH MUCH more bio avail and digestable than the same % protein in a dry food

 

[aquarius]

Originally Posted by MechanicalMan

Either this article is outdated or the author is simply misinformed.

I think the article is referring to the fact that a lot of the dry diets have a claim that there is 7% carb or less, however when a group of "low carb" dry diets were independently lab tested, the percentage was actually 13% (from Hodgkin's book, which was released this year). Kind of sad, and I wonder if this may be due to the fact that a pet food company is only legally obligated to use the ingredients listed on the bag once every 6 months.

At least some of the "you're evil if you feed your cat dry food" articles that I've read contain factually accurate information about grain-free dry food.

Well, I don't think you're evil if you feed dry food. But canned food is quite a bit better if you can swing it. A cat's natural prey (mouse) is made up of 66% water, 56% protein, and 27% fat. Canned food is usually anywhere from 78-80% water. In the wild, cats don't drink that much water, and they rely on their prey for most of their water consumption. A dry food usually is composed of about 10% water, so if a kitty doesn't make up for this by drinking more (and many don't), this could cause some strain to the urinary tract. And this is why some nutritionists are arguing that cats on dry diets are more likely to develop UTI's.

Additionally, canned foods are cooked at a lower heat, and don't have to be processed through an extruder like the dry foods do, so the protein is much higher quality and more digestible.

You mentioned you were interested in more current sources. A few good ones are:
Sandy Arora -- Whole Health for Happy Cats -- published in '06
Elizabeth Hodgkins -- Your Cat -- Published in '07
Joan Weiskopf -- Pet Food Nation -- published in '07

The thinking is really changing about dry foods and cats. The clinic where I work recommends canned food for kitties, if at all possible!

 

[sharky]

I think the article is referring to the fact that a lot of the dry diets have a claim that there is 7% carb or less, however when a group of "low carb" dry diets were independently lab tested, the percentage was actually 13% (from Hodgkin's book, which was released this year). Kind of sad, and I wonder if this may be due to the fact that a pet food company is only legally obligated to use the ingredients listed on the bag once every 6 months.

Well, I don't think you're evil if you feed dry food. But canned food is quite a bit better if you can swing it. A cat's natural prey (mouse) is made up of 66% water, 56% protein, and 27% fat. Canned food is usually anywhere from 78-80% water. In the wild, cats don't drink that much water, and they rely on their prey for most of their water consumption. A dry food usually is composed of about 10% water, so if a kitty doesn't make up for this by drinking more (and many don't), this could cause some strain to the urinary tract. And this is why some nutritionists are arguing that cats on dry diets are more likely to develop UTI's.

I have to agree with that ... plus the best dry food is about 30% less digestable than it s wet counter part

Additionally, canned foods are cooked at a lower heat, and don't have to be processed through an extruder like the dry foods do, so the protein is much higher quality and more digestible.
Actually the temp is about the same as is the length of cooking

... 10-15 minutes at 250-350 degrees ... unless baked then 40 ish minutes at 400-500 degrees ( see why I dont feed BAKED??) ... cans are cooked in the can thus the higher metal levels ... The water or broth actually works to start the digestive process prior to entering the mouth

'

 

[chausiefan]

but evo is so high in fat, what if your cat has a weight problem? whats the best food for fat cats?

 

[mechanicalman]

Originally Posted by Aquarius

I think the article is referring to the fact that a lot of the dry diets have a claim that there is 7% carb or less, however when a group of "low carb" dry diets were independently lab tested, the percentage was actually 13% (from Hodgkin's book, which was released this year).

Then she could have cited a source and said something to the effect of "as little as 13% or less" instead "as little as 20%," which is an amount that is apparently contradicted by the study/book that you're referencing, not just by pet food manufactures. It seems that "20%" was simply pulled out of the air.

I'm not bothered by people trying to scare cat owners away from dry food, I'm only asking that they do so without being dishonest or misleading. That article focuses heavily on the potential harm of a high-carbohydrate diet while portraying all dry food as high in carbs and low in protein. I've seen other anti-dry articles that reference grain-free foods like EVO by making statements to the effect of "These foods are better than typical dry cat foods, but they are still unsuitable as a primary food source because...." However, some of these articles essentially deny the existence of low carb, high protein dry food while warning that "a high-carb diet will harm your cat."

And BTW, the "next thing" that I usually see mentioned after "dry food is too high in carbs" is "your cat will not get enough water by eating dry food." And frankly, I'm not entirely convinced by that argument, either. I'm perfectly willing to accept that cats may need more water than they typically consume with dry food and a water dish (or gimmicky water fountain), but I'm not convinced that feeding wet food is the only way to hydrate a cat. I haven't really done any "experimenting" with this yet, but it seems to me that you could simply provide a cat with a (healthy) liquid that is more appetizing than water. My cat seemed to agree with my hypothesis when I gave her the water from a can of tuna. I need to do some research on the subject, but I suspect that I may eventually start using some kind of "flavored water." It seems logical to me that a cat would drink plenty of something that it found appealing.

 

[londonkat]

Okay, I am officially overwhelmed and unsure about what to feed my kitties now...

I am also shocked to learn that vets don't know any of this... how can they be the medical authority and not know the latest research like in any other field? I am floored.

Can anyone help me decipher what to do? I am looking for the best option as well as the most economical (value for price, etc). Also, I am concerned about wet b/c I don't know how much to feed my kitties and how often. Plus, if I go out of town (for a long weekend), I would have to leave dry for them? If I am gone for multiple days, I have someone to check on them, but not every day...

Thanks!

 

[sharky]

Originally Posted by LondonKat

Okay, I am officially overwhelmed and unsure about what to feed my kitties now...

I am also shocked to learn that vets don't know any of this... how can they be the medical authority and not know the latest research like in any other field? I am floored.

Can anyone help me decipher what to do? I am looking for the best option as well as the most economical (value for price, etc). Also, I am concerned about wet b/c I don't know how much to feed my kitties and how often. Plus, if I go out of town (for a long weekend), I would have to leave dry for them? If I am gone for multiple days, I have someone to check on them, but not every day...

Thanks!

Send me a PM and I will work with you for what you can get

 

[mzjazz2u]

Originally Posted by LondonKat

Hi! I'd like to jump in on this topic b/c I have a lot of questions surronding this. I have been reading up on different types of cat foods in order to educate myself and keep my 6-month-old kitties in the best of health.

I recently bought a bag of dry EVO. I wanted something natural and without any of the grains or other stuff that is not helpful for cats. The bag of EVO was actually cheaper than Science Diet! My cats seem to like it, but the "end product" is quite stinky if you catch my drift. I don't think they have diarreha, it's solid and maybe a little soft... but it smells BAD. Also, it seems like my kitties get a little gassy (again, very stinky). (sorry if that grosses anyone out!)

I was raised on the "dry is better" philosophy, but now I am reading that wet isn't bad for them. Also, I've been leaving the dry out (about a cup and a half for the two to share, following the guidelines of 3/4 cup per cat per day) for them to graze on all day. I am concerned that one is getting heavy too soon. But, they are only 6 months old, so I don't want to deprive them.

Are the predominant opinions now that wet food is better? No dry? less to graze on? I understand there isn't one "best" brand. Is there an article/book/website somewhere that rates all of the brands and their pros and cons for cat health? I want to research this further, I just need some help on where to look.

Thank you for your time,
LK.

My cats eat Evo canned. But I recently bought a bag of dry because my new cat likes dry better. Both cats got really nasty gas. But I think I didn't mix enough of the old stuff in with it. I'm hoping the gas goes away once I gradually reintroduce it a little slower.

 

[moggiegirl]

Originally Posted by LondonKat

Okay, I am officially overwhelmed and unsure about what to feed my kitties now...

I am also shocked to learn that vets don't know any of this... how can they be the medical authority and not know the latest research like in any other field? I am floored.

Can anyone help me decipher what to do? I am looking for the best option as well as the most economical (value for price, etc). Also, I am concerned about wet b/c I don't know how much to feed my kitties and how often. Plus, if I go out of town (for a long weekend), I would have to leave dry for them? If I am gone for multiple days, I have someone to check on them, but not every day...

Thanks!

Consult a veterinarian with a true understanding of animal nutrition. Holistic vets usually know more than regular vets. Perhaps these two vets Elizabeth Hodgekins and Lisa Pierson can help you. Elizabeth Hodgekins wrote a book. I'm thinking about buying it just for informational purposes.

http://www.all-about-cats.com/your_cat.htm
www.catinfo.org

 

[sharky]

Originally Posted by moggiegirl

Consult a veterinarian with a true understanding of animal nutrition. Holistic vets usually know more than regular vets. Perhaps these two vets Elizabeth Hodgekins and Lisa Pierson can help you. Elizabeth Hodgekins wrote a book. I'm thinking about buying it just for informational purposes.

http://www.all-about-cats.com/your_cat.htm
www.catinfo.org

I will skip that book... ORGAN meats are IMPERATIVE >.. ummmmm

... they are if making a homemade or raw diet

 

[icklemiss21]

To the original poster, $60 sounds fairly expensive, I can get the large bag of EVO for that but I know that it can cost up to $70 in another store so shop around, the 5 pet stores in my city have a big variance in pricing for premium foods.

Orijen is usually cheaper than Innova and EVO if you want to stick to a premium foor (and Orijen is made in Canada)

 

[moggiegirl]

Originally Posted by sharky

I will skip that book... ORGAN meats are IMPERATIVE >.. ummmmm

... they are if making a homemade or raw diet

Would you please explain the negative reaction? I haven't even read the book yet but she does seem like a very highly respectable vet as she specializes in feline diabetis and has been very helpful to people who have cats with this condition.

I don't think I would close my mind to a vet who actually has some knowledge in the area of animal nutrition. I'm not saying follow her advice or even read the book, noone has to, but to totally knock my suggestion and say that you will "skip this book." Whatever. I ordered it and I'm going to read it no matter who knocks it and if I like it I'll use the information.

 

[yosemite]

I should tell you that Orijen is not cheap - I pay close to $50 for a bag.

 

[littleraven7726]

Originally Posted by moggiegirl

Would you please explain the negative reaction? I haven't even read the book yet but she does seem like a very highly respectable vet as she specializes in feline diabetis and has been very helpful to people who have cats with this condition.

I don't think I would close my mind to a vet who actually has some knowledge in the area of animal nutrition. I'm not saying follow her advice or even read the book, noone has to, but to totally knock my suggestion and say that you will "skip this book." Whatever. I ordered it and I'm going to read it no matter who knocks it and if I like it I'll use the information.

I read it. It's a very good book. She is quite knowledgeable about nutrition IMO. She doesn't like foods with fruits and vegetables, and even says they aren't good for your cat because of how they are digested. I can see where that might not agree with some people. She also says that by-products are more digestible than fruits and veggies. She advocates the all meat, with by-products wet food from the grocery store over some of the "all natural" products because of the fruits/veggie issue.

It's probably a controversial book because she doesn't say what people want to hear. She tells you what your cat needs you to know. She says some by-products are actually good for your cat. Which makes sense, cats don't hunt blueberries and broccoli when left to their own devices.

I recommend reading it.

I also have read Whole Health for Happy Cats.

 

[icklemiss21]

Originally Posted by Yosemite

I should tell you that Orijen is not cheap - I pay close to $50 for a bag.

No it isn't (and you get it cheaper than me

)
It is cheaper than EVO or what the OP is paying for regular Innova though

 

[mechanicalman]

I know the OP is in Canada, but just FWIW, I think EVO is typically cheaper in the US. Orijen isn't available in my area yet, but even if I ordered both online, EVO would be a little cheaper.