Creating a home-cooked resources sticky

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #81

ldg

TCS Member
Thread starter
Veteran
Joined
Jun 25, 2002
Messages
41,310
Purraise
843
Location
Fighting for ferals in NW NJ!
Cooked Food Resources


Recipes

One very easy option is to start with meat or meat and organs and add a commercially available premix of nutritional supplements that will make the food nutritionally balanced.

By Dr. Donald Strombeck: http://www.dogcathomeprepareddiet.com/feeding_a_normal_dog_or_cat.html#cats
Donald R. Strombeck, DVM, PhD, is Professor Emeritus, University of California, Davis, School of Veterinary Medicine, and an honorary member of the College of Veterinary Internal Medicine. He is widely published and has received numerous awards. The home page: http://www.dogcathomeprepareddiet.com/

From TCFeline (a manufacturer of Premixes) http://tcfeline.com/2010/08/16/cooked-meat/

At IBD kitties: http://www.ibdkitties.net/Homecooked.html (requires a grinder)

TCS home-cooked recipes & discussion:

Cooked Recipes Thread
My first cooked chicken cat food!


Nutritional Supplements (Premixes)

Note: some are designed to make just meat complete; others require liver and/or a source of calcium to make the recipes balanced & complete. For most, a source of fiber is optional (which can be important for IBD kitties or as a method to lower fat for specific medical reasons). Some of these were designed with raw feeding in mind, but provide appropriate supplemental nutrition for home cooked food. Please ensure you purchase the correct supplement for the recipe you intend to use.

Alnutrin http://www.knowwhatyoufeed.com/
Balance IT https://secure.balanceit.com/ -- NOTE: Clarification on the use of Balance IT premixes - TCS thread
Call of the Wild http://www.wysong.net/products/cotw-dog-cat-supplement.php
TCfeline http://tcfeline.com/
U-Stew http://www.knowbetterpetfood.com/cat_food_u-stew

Alnutrin and Balance IT have online calculators and recipes.



Sources of Calcium

Warning: Never feed cooked bones, even if ground; these can splinter and harm your cats.

Most home-cooked recipes will include either bone meal, calcium carbonate, or eggshell.

If you want to create your own diet using real bone, this thread describes a method that does not require a grinder, just a pressure cooker and food processor: http://www.thecatsite.com/t/261751/bone-question-dr-piersons-ground-recipe

If you want to use a source of bone other than bone meal, there is a freeze dried bone option. It is called Microcrystalline Calcium Hydroxyapatite (MCHA). In the U.S., there is only one supplement available that has no other ingredients. It is manufactured by NOW, and is called just "NOW calcium hydroxyapatite." Note that MCHA costs considerably more to use than bone meal or eggshell powder.

How to balance meat (and organ) for just the calcium component of the diet using eggshell or MCHA: http://www.thecatsite.com/t/263426/...hydroxyapatite-to-balance-meat-or-meat-organs



Impact of Cooking

Even for carnivores, cooked meat is easily digestible:



Energetic significance of cooking. "While cooking has long been argued to improve the diet, the nature of the improvement has not been
well defined. As a result, the evolutionary significance of cooking has variously been proposed as being substantial or relatively trivial. In this paper, we evaluate the hypothesis that an important and consistent effect of cooking food is a rise in its net energy value." Carmody & Wrangham 2009. The Energetic Significance of Cooking, Jour Hum Evol 57 (2009) 379–391.

Nutrient Retention, various cooking methods (PDF file). USDA Table of Nutrient Retention Factors http://www.ars.usda.gov/SP2UserFiles/Place/12354500/Data/retn/retn06.pdf

Nutrient Retention data from the USDA: information for just cooked meats summarized in data tables in this TCS thread: http://www.thecatsite.com/t/263946/nutrient-retention-values



Food Safety & Proper Cooking Temperatures

Revised Recommended Cooking Temperatures, FoodSafety.gov: http://www.foodsafety.gov/blog/meat_temperatures.html

How to keep your food safe: http://www.epicurious.com/articlesguides/howtocook/primers/foodsafetymeatpoultry

New York Times article, Bending the Rules on Bacteria, with information about reheating previously cooked food.


Books & Other Resources

Home-Prepared Dog and Cat Diets, Second Edition (2010). "The new edition of Donald Strombeck’s classic handbook has been completely rewritten by new author Patricia A. Schenck to reflect the latest nutritional recommendations based on current research."

Some books with cooked recipes people could take a look at to see what they think:
The Ultimate Pet Food Guide: Everything You Need to Know about Feeding Your Dog or Cat The recipes are heavy on seafood, IMO, and the author is a dog trainer, not a vet. Nutrition info is given in simple terms.

Dinner PAWsible: A cookbook for healthy, nutritious meals for cats and dogs
The recipes are in cups, tablespoons, etc., and in grams, with calorie counts and indications for calcium supplements or ground eggshell. They have veggies and some grains like brown rice. Ground sunflower seeds are used a lot. Note that one of the authors, Susan Thixton, runs the Truth About Pet Food site.

Both books are available in paperback or as Kindle e-books. You don't have to have a Kindle to read them, as you can download a free Kindle app for your PC, tablet or smartphone.

Helpful Resources: Raw & Home-Cooked Cat Food Forum

.
 
Last edited:

AbbysMom

At Abby's beck and call
Staff Member
Moderator
Joined
May 18, 2005
Messages
78,668
Purraise
19,877
Location
Massachusetts
Cooked Food Resources


Recipes

One very easy option is to start with meat or meat and organs and add a commercially available premix of nutritional supplements that will make the food nutritionally balanced.

By Dr. Donald Strombeck: http://www.dogcathomeprepareddiet.com/feeding_a_normal_dog_or_cat.html#cats
Donald R. Strombeck, DVM, PhD, is Professor Emeritus, University of California, Davis, School of Veterinary Medicine, and an honorary member of the College of Veterinary Internal Medicine. He is widely published and has received numerous awards. The home page: http://www.dogcathomeprepareddiet.com/

From TCFeline (a manufacturer of Premixes) http://tcfeline.com/2010/08/16/cooked-meat/

At IBD kitties: http://www.ibdkitties.net/Homecooked.html (requires a grinder)

TCS home-cooked recipes & discussion:

Cooked Recipes Thread
My first cooked chicken cat food!


Nutritional Supplements (Premixes)

Note: some are designed to make just meat complete; others require liver and/or a source of calcium to make the recipes balanced & complete. For most, a source of fiber is optional (which can be important for IBD kitties or as a method to lower fat for specific medical reasons). Some of these were designed with raw feeding in mind, but provide appropriate supplemental nutrition for home cooked food. Please ensure you purchase the correct supplement for the recipe you intend to use.

Alnutrin http://www.knowwhatyoufeed.com/
Balance IT https://secure.balanceit.com/ -- NOTE: Clarification on the use of Balance IT premixes - TCS thread
Call of the Wild http://www.wysong.net/products/cotw-dog-cat-supplement.php
TCfeline http://tcfeline.com/
U-Stew http://www.knowbetterpetfood.com/cat_food_u-stew

Alnutrin and Balance IT have online calculators and recipes.



Sources of Calcium

Warning: Never feed cooked bones, even if ground; these can splinter and harm your cats.

Most home-cooked recipes will include either bone meal, calcium carbonate, or eggshell.

If you want to create your own diet using real bone, this thread describes a method that does not require a grinder, just a pressure cooker and food processor: http://www.thecatsite.com/t/261751/bone-question-dr-piersons-ground-recipe

If you want to use a source of bone other than bone meal, there is a freeze dried bone option. It is called Microcrystalline Calcium Hydroxyapatite (MCHA). In the U.S., there is only one supplement available that has no other ingredients. It is manufactured by NOW, and is called just "NOW calcium hydroxyapatite." Note that MCHA costs considerably more to use than bone meal or eggshell powder.

How to balance meat (and organ) for just the calcium component of the diet using eggshell or MCHA: http://www.thecatsite.com/t/263426/...hydroxyapatite-to-balance-meat-or-meat-organs



Impact of Cooking

Even for carnivores, cooked meat is easily digestible:



Energetic significance of cooking. "While cooking has long been argued to improve the diet, the nature of the improvement has not been
well defined. As a result, the evolutionary significance of cooking has variously been proposed as being substantial or relatively trivial. In this paper, we evaluate the hypothesis that an important and consistent effect of cooking food is a rise in its net energy value." Carmody & Wrangham 2009. The Energetic Significance of Cooking, Jour Hum Evol 57 (2009) 379–391.

Nutrient Retention, various cooking methods (PDF file). USDA Table of Nutrient Retention Factors http://www.ars.usda.gov/SP2UserFiles/Place/12354500/Data/retn/retn06.pdf

Nutrient Retention data from the USDA: information for just cooked meats summarized in data tables in this TCS thread: http://www.thecatsite.com/t/263946/nutrient-retention-values



Food Safety & Proper Cooking Temperatures

Revised Recommended Cooking Temperatures, FoodSafety.gov: http://www.foodsafety.gov/blog/meat_temperatures.html

How to keep your food safe: http://www.epicurious.com/articlesguides/howtocook/primers/foodsafetymeatpoultry

New York Times article, Bending the Rules on Bacteria, with information about reheating previously cooked food.


Books & Other Resources

Home-Prepared Dog and Cat Diets, Second Edition (2010). "The new edition of Donald Strombeck’s classic handbook has been completely rewritten by new author Patricia A. Schenck to reflect the latest nutritional recommendations based on current research."

Some books with cooked recipes people could take a look at to see what they think:
The Ultimate Pet Food Guide: Everything You Need to Know about Feeding Your Dog or Cat The recipes are heavy on seafood, IMO, and the author is a dog trainer, not a vet. Nutrition info is given in simple terms.

Dinner PAWsible: A cookbook for healthy, nutritious meals for cats and dogs
The recipes are in cups, tablespoons, etc., and in grams, with calorie counts and indications for calcium supplements or ground eggshell. They have veggies and some grains like brown rice. Ground sunflower seeds are used a lot. Note that one of the authors, Susan Thixton, runs the Truth About Pet Food site.

Both books are available in paperback or as Kindle e-books. You don't have to have a Kindle to read them, as you can download a free Kindle app for your PC, tablet or smartphone.

Helpful Resources: Raw & Home-Cooked Cat Food Forum

.
Is everyone in agreement about this?
 

peaches08

TCS Member
Top Cat
Joined
Jan 11, 2013
Messages
4,884
Purraise
290
Location
GA
I'm not trying to be a pest, but why is Strombeck's site still included? I feel his "vegetarian" recipes go against everything we've heard about cats being obligate carnivores.
 
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #84

ldg

TCS Member
Thread starter
Veteran
Joined
Jun 25, 2002
Messages
41,310
Purraise
843
Location
Fighting for ferals in NW NJ!
Because he has balanced recipes with meat; some with rice, which may be good for some IBD kitties or kitties with constipation issues that can use the fiber.

I thought the final decision was the the link be left, and once the sticky goes up, anyone can post to the thread, stating that the vegetarian recipes included in Dr. Strombecks homemade recipes for felines are not species appropriate.
 

peaches08

TCS Member
Top Cat
Joined
Jan 11, 2013
Messages
4,884
Purraise
290
Location
GA
OK! I misunderstood. But I can easily see where someone reading the sticky would find "obligate carnivore" and "must be fed species appropriate diet with meat" then hit the tofu recipes would think that we're a bunch of flakes. Hence I had to ask.
 
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #86

ldg

TCS Member
Thread starter
Veteran
Joined
Jun 25, 2002
Messages
41,310
Purraise
843
Location
Fighting for ferals in NW NJ!
If there were other, better cooked recipes anywhere, we probably wouldn't include that link.
 

mrsgreenjeens

Every Life Should Have Nine Cats
Staff Member
Advisor
Joined
Aug 13, 2009
Messages
16,482
Purraise
7,294
Location
Arizona
I'm not trying to be a pest, but why is Strombeck's site still included? I feel his "vegetarian" recipes go against everything we've heard about cats being obligate carnivores.
It's interesting that he states that any cat fed a "human" vegetarian diet will probably show signs of nutrient deficiency, then provides a diet that consists of "human" vegetarian food (tofu).  I don't get why he does that.  You'd think he would have just made that statement and not provided a tofu recipe, since he did provide other recipes that included REAL meats.  I wonder if it might be a good idea just to put a warning up along with that link advising that WE advise people not to use the two Vegetarian Recipes he lists for cats?  Just to cover ourselves, if you know what I mean
 
Last edited:

peaches08

TCS Member
Top Cat
Joined
Jan 11, 2013
Messages
4,884
Purraise
290
Location
GA
It's interesting that he states that any cat fed a "human" vegetarian diet will probably show signs of nutrient deficiency, then provides a diet that consists of "human" vegetarian food (tofu).  I don't get why he does that.  You'd think he would have just made that statement and not provided a tofu recipe, since he did provide other recipes that included REAL meats.  I wonder if it might be a good idea just to put a warning up along with that link advising that WE advise people not to use the two Vegetarian Recipes he lists for cats?  Just to cover ourselves, if you know what I mean
He also forgot to mention the increased risks of hyperthyroidism due to soy.

However, some kitties do better with rice etc to help with their tummies and he does have a lot of recipes.
 

mrsgreenjeens

Every Life Should Have Nine Cats
Staff Member
Advisor
Joined
Aug 13, 2009
Messages
16,482
Purraise
7,294
Location
Arizona
It's interesting that he states that any cat fed a "human" vegetarian diet will probably show signs of nutrient deficiency, then provides a diet that consists of "human" vegetarian food (tofu).  I don't get why he does that.  You'd think he would have just made that statement and not provided a tofu recipe, since he did provide other recipes that included REAL meats.  I wonder if it might be a good idea just to put a warning up along with that link advising that WE advise people not to use the two Vegetarian Recipes he lists for cats?  Just to cover ourselves, if you know what I mean
He also forgot to mention the increased risks of hyperthyroidism due to soy.

However, some kitties do better with rice etc to help with their tummies and he does have a lot of recipes.
yes, I have no problems with the recipes that  contain meat (even with the rice), it's just those two Tofu recipes that are questionable.  That's why it might be a good idea to have a comment at the actual link stating we advise against feeding the Tofu recipies or something similar.

Sorry, Laurie, I've been so busy I hadn't actually opened any of the links unless something specific came up
 
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #90

ldg

TCS Member
Thread starter
Veteran
Joined
Jun 25, 2002
Messages
41,310
Purraise
843
Location
Fighting for ferals in NW NJ!
He also forgot to mention the increased risks of hyperthyroidism due to soy.
I can't find the study, but Dr. Pierson refers to it here: http://www.catinfo.org/?link=felinehyperthyroidism#What_are_the_causes_of_hyperthyroidism_

VetInfo also mentions this. (Though they mention a number of things - especially canned foods that use "Isoflavones or BADGE (bisphenol-A-diglycidyl ether) is the main substance suspected of causing hyperthyroidism in this case. This compound is used for lining of aluminum cans with pop-top lids. If the canned food is rich in oils or fats, isoflavones will most likely get transferred into it." Included in their list of things to avoid to help avoid hyperthyroidism in cats are sweet potatoes, used in many foods. http://www.vetinfo.com/diet-recommendations-hyperthyroidism-cats.html

So it seems worthy of a caution.
 
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #93

ldg

TCS Member
Thread starter
Veteran
Joined
Jun 25, 2002
Messages
41,310
Purraise
843
Location
Fighting for ferals in NW NJ!
I updated it to make it more factually correct. (It can be further noted - not for the thread, but just as an FYI HERE, that raw feeders may feel that cooked food is not species-appropriate. ;) ). So hopefully this change will be acceptable.
 
Top