Chickster Growling at butt

[snickerdoodle]

Okay guys. Me one more time. Chickie Sue has bouts of constipation, I know that, and she will go through the growling, hissing and swatting of her own butt (she never really catches it) and runs around the house hiding sporadically and briefly in certain places.
I gave her 1/4 teaspoon of miralax mixed in a good bit of water yesterday, ... trapping her is very dangerous as she is absolutely wild in this state.
This morning she was playing, jumping, eating, everything was fine until she saw Boca and then she started her butt-fighting again. Now she's looking out the window completely calm.

A few minutes ago, after about 30 minutes of her running about hissing and growling, I trapped her and shut her in the litter box room with me. She rubbed on me as if to say she was sorry and went pee. She left the pan and went to the door. I put her back in the pan and she eventually started scratching like mad, then pooped. It was a good sized poop and she gave a pathetically hard grunt towards the end. Part of it was very, very solid and the other half was soft but together. She is still occassionally growling and hissing (stopped now that she's in the window with something to take her mind off of it maybe) but I am wondering if her butt doesn't hurt a bit from it. It's like she refuses to go poop because maybe it hurts her?

I have been grooming her and have switched her over to Sensitive Systems by Purina One since I am thinking the Purina One "Special Blends" Chicken and Rice was constipating her.

Besides this, should I be worried about anal glands? (I've never had any experience nor never [as far as I know] had any cat have their anal glands expressed) She needs to go in for her shots soon and I will make sure to bring this up with my vet, but it is really starting to worry me, not to mention the agonizing sound of her hissing, growling and throwing fits. The weird thing is, yesterday she was doing it until I laid down to sleep and she came up and laid down with me and was totally quiet. So this is why I'm not entirely sure if it's a butt related problem or a jealous "I want time with my mommy" problem or both. I don't know. She's very confusing to me.

Thanks guys for any help. I am putting extra water out everywhere (she is not a big water drinker)

 

[sharky]

It sounds like glands or possible IBS

 

[otto]

Originally Posted by Snickerdoodle

Okay guys. Me one more time. Chickie Sue has bouts of constipation, I know that, and she will go through the growling, hissing and swatting of her own butt (she never really catches it) and runs around the house hiding sporadically and briefly in certain places.
I gave her 1/4 teaspoon of miralax mixed in a good bit of water yesterday, ... trapping her is very dangerous as she is absolutely wild in this state.
This morning she was playing, jumping, eating, everything was fine until she saw Boca and then she started her butt-fighting again. Now she's looking out the window completely calm.

A few minutes ago, after about 30 minutes of her running about hissing and growling, I trapped her and shut her in the litter box room with me. She rubbed on me as if to say she was sorry and went pee. She left the pan and went to the door. I put her back in the pan and she eventually started scratching like mad, then pooped. It was a good sized poop and she gave a pathetically hard grunt towards the end. Part of it was very, very solid and the other half was soft but together. She is still occassionally growling and hissing (stopped now that she's in the window with something to take her mind off of it maybe) but I am wondering if her butt doesn't hurt a bit from it. It's like she refuses to go poop because maybe it hurts her?

I have been grooming her and have switched her over to Sensitive Systems by Purina One since I am thinking the Purina One "Special Blends" Chicken and Rice was constipating her.

Besides this, should I be worried about anal glands? (I've never had any experience nor never [as far as I know] had any cat have their anal glands expressed) She needs to go in for her shots soon and I will make sure to bring this up with my vet, but it is really starting to worry me, not to mention the agonizing sound of her hissing, growling and throwing fits. The weird thing is, yesterday she was doing it until I laid down to sleep and she came up and laid down with me and was totally quiet. So this is why I'm not entirely sure if it's a butt related problem or a jealous "I want time with my mommy" problem or both. I don't know. She's very confusing to me.

Thanks guys for any help. I am putting extra water out everywhere (she is not a big water drinker)

The thing is this (what I bolded) is how megacolon starts.

It hurts to poop, so she holds off from pooping as long as she can. The poop sits in the colon getting larger and larger and stretching out the colon.

Unless her routine vaccine appointment is within the next week I would not advise waiting. This constipation needs to be dealt with now.

And no I don't think this is an anal glad issue. It surely sounds like chronic constipation to me. What I have learned from dealing with chronic constipation is a grain free all canned diet is the first step. This helps keep the stools at a reasonable size, and keeps kitty well hydrated. Adding water to the grain free canned food is even better.

If a megacolon has started (diagnosed by xray) a laxative such as miralax should be started, but cisapride usually is needed also.

Cisapride, a prescription medication, is a motility agent, meaning it keeps the muscles of the intestines moving, so the poop doesn't sit in the enlarged colon, as it will do otherwise.

So, my advice is to get Chickster in now for an evaluation, and start transitioning her to an all canned grain free diet.

And, of course, keep us posted!

 

[snickerdoodle]

Problem is, she hates canned food. I never could get her to eat anything canned. I will be taking her into the vet Monday morning because she has had the worst fit of all tonight, I mean I swear she's going to hurt herself. She is peeing, but no poop. She is very aggitated and earlier when I tried to get to her to feel her bum she absolutely freaked out and screamed in the worst horrifying way, never heard her do that before.
I can't afford to take her to an ER vet and honestly, I don't trust the couple that are around here. But this is enough of this and I don't want her in pain. She's been eating and drinking water well though. One second she's fine and wanting loving, she slept on the bed with me again for quite a long time this morning and was ok up until around the time it got dark an hour or two ago.

*sighs* I hope it is not IBS or Megacolon, I am hoping it is just glands... thanks guys.

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

Well, with Sven, who has chronic constipation, but not megacolon, I give the Miralax twice a day, EVERYDAY, no matter what. I mix 1/4 teaspoon with 1 to 1.5 cc water and give it to him via syringe since he also will not eat canned food. He DOES, however, drink lots of water, since he's a kidney cat.

Question: why to you have to trap her to put her in a separate room? Can't you just pick her up and carry her in there, then quickly exit the room? (maybe distracting her with a treat or something to make your escape?)

 

[snickerdoodle]

I had to throw a towel or shirt over her because she continued to run away from me and hissed and growled at me. I didn't want to get attacked. I trapped her to took her to the pan room hoping she would poop, since we weren't sure if she wasn't going because it hurt or whatever it was. She pooped once (when I took her in there and shut the door), but hasn't again over the weekend. She's peed. And I've seen her drink water and eat. It seemed her scratching in the litter really got her stuff moving that one time. But it hasn't worked again. I was afraid it was a UTI too but I will find out in the morning, am taking her in the AM. She refuses to use the corn litter anymore and is back to using clay.

Once when I tried to take her back to the pan room she screamed like she was being murdered, it was such a horrible sound I left her alone and just said I would wait, I was doing more harm than any good. I had to keep eating Xanax just to keep calm with all her yowling, growling, hissing and thumping around the house all weekend. Somehow it didn't bother Mom at all.
Her tail will be twitching and she'll turn her eyes towards her tail, pupils fully dilated, and I'll make a sound to distract her. She looks at me, pupils contract and she stops growling. She even played all weekend whenever I wanted to play with the stick and never stopped once in the middle to growl at her butt.

I am just praying it is nothing extremely serious. I've seen a couple of photographs of abscessed anal glands and I've felt of her tookus and her butthole and don't -feel- anything (except a small bit of poop at the base of her tail in her rectum) but that of course doesn't mean anything.

I will update you guys as soon as we get a report from the vet. Thanks guys.

Edit: And in the past, when she got a large cross wrapped around her tail by a string and went thrashing around the house because it scared her, I went to try to help her and she growled, hissed, yowled and then attacked me. She is quicker than a rattlesnake and nothing like Boo, so after that incident I do not take any chances with a mad Chickster

 

[snickerdoodle]

Quick update - She pooped overnight. It was soft, mostly, a couple of smaller bits were pretty hard. Bout the thickness of a nickel, looked normal and brown. No blood. She is still after her rear. Taking her in right this moment. Prayers, vibes and crossed fingers that it is nothing too serious!!

 

[otto]

Chickster

 

[darlili]

for a specific diagnosis of something easily treatable. My girl had an abcessed anal gland - I never even knew til they had her out for her dental and they could carefully examine the area - no pain in the box, normal activities, no scooting - I felt like a terrible mom, though. Luckily, they gave her a shot in the tucchus and she had a course of clavamox (which didn't go over well), and things seemed to go well. I hope your baby is as fortunate.

 

[snickerdoodle]

Well, they checked her out VERY thoroughly, and nothing. The vet was completely mystified. She said her anal glands were perfectly sized and empty, her colon was great, her teeth were beautiful, her coat was gorgeous, and she was 100%! She had no fever, and recommended I keep her on the Sensitive Systems Purina and keep an eye on things. She said the next steps are blood work and x-rays, to rule out joint issues. She mentioned sometimes nerves can sometimes spontaneously start acting up (Like phantom limb syndrome, I think she said) and maybe that was it. But she's had no injuries to her back or hips. In any case, she pooped and it was normal, no blood. So the vet thinks things are perfectly fine unless it continues, then she also mentioned behavior therapies (Meds) which would be her last choice. Chickster also likes to kick herself in the lower jaw with her back foot over and over and over again sometimes out of nowhere.
In any case.... um, 68 bucks later, she's perfectly healthy and acted like a total gem, she didn't yowl once, not even with the rectal exam, and she was very nice and didn't attack anyone. She did start panting on the way there but she was scared, and that has stopped.

Don't know what else to do?

EDIT: And not ONE SINGLE FLEA! ....... so we're all confused. Vet said not IBS and not megacolon either.

 

[otto]

I had a thought a while back while reading about some of these 'behaviors' she is having but decided to wait to mention it until I saw what the vet visit turned up. I am wondering if it's FHS.

http://www.veterinarypartner.com/Content.plx?P=A&A=1998

How old is Chickster?


By the way Mazy kicks herself in the head when she plays sometimes, and I have seen other cats do it too. But not to the extent you describe.

 

[snickerdoodle]

Thank you for that article. She was 4 months old in Sep 2008 with her first rabies vaccine, so that makes her birthday around June 2008, making her now 2 years and four months.

The doctor DID mention Hyperesthesia, this is when she started talking about medications. She has all the signs mentioned in the article save for pulling out fur and excessive grooming. She has not harmed herself yet. And when she does fall over in the floor, and kick herself in the face it's not violent, she's never hurt herself, but I don't like seeing her do it. It's not gentle, but not crazy, if that makes any sense. I didn't mean to make it sound like she was beating herself up, but it is like she is "play" (maybe roughly) fighting with her foot. Then she will start sucking on her back foot or her front paw, which is another thing she's had since she was little. I was reading up on torties and general behavior disorders in some cats that mentioned the face kicking thing as a behavioral issue, but it didn't ring any bells at the time. I just figured I received another weird cat (Always had very quirky ones)

The reason the vet mentioned Hyperesthesia is because she can be distracted during an episode. I can scratch on fabric or make a noise and she will look at me, totally fine. She will go 15-20 minutes or more playing with the stick with no obvious signs. Vet said if I can distract her like that and she's not wiping her butt on the carpet, no blood, no other physical signs, she would be leaning towards behavioral.

This is sort of distressing. Medication? That is worrisome to me. She's passed out sleeping in the bed now.
It very well could be bringing in Boca. I hadn't connected the two, and we kind of figured maybe Boca was just aggravating her constipation, but Boca is only transported through the house from the back porch to the front room where all of his stuff is set up and the door is shut. They only saw each other face to face once, when Boca mistakenly thought Chickster was going to attack him, when it was really her attacking her own butt.

So maybe that is what it is (Which I also mentioned to the vet).

I don't know. This is just worrisome to me. We've decided to keep an eye on her and if it continues, we'll do blood work and x-rays, but I was told rather loudly today that my credit was special circumstances for Boo and does not include Chickster, so I will have to try to save up some money. I used most of my bill money to pay her bill today. I didn't know rabies vaccs had gone up to 25 dollars... kind of shocked me.

Anyway, thank you for this article and I will do some more researching. Thanks so much

 

[otto]

I have read that diet can have an impact on FHS. Foods with artificial anything, or sodium nitrates or sodium nitrites (not a typo, they are two different chemicals) are all no-nos for FHS kitties.

I know you will keep us posted and I'm sorry someone was insensitive enough to broadcast your billing concerns to the general public.

 

[snickerdoodle]

Ah, no problem with the billing. The lady looked really embarrassed after she did it and when I came back with the money she slipped out of the office. I try to be discreet when I make payments because I know they can't give credit to EVERYBODY, ... so no biggie. I'll get over it.

I will research the food. As for now, Chickster is all over me and slept on my bed all day and is following me every. single. place. I. go. Mom says she is jealous and wants my attention and we both believe Boca has a part in this. So I'm going to go spend some time with her.

Thank you guys for all your help. I'm glad she's physically healthy, but scared about the possible diagnosis.

 

[snickerdoodle]

Most possibly definitely has more to do with Boca than I previously thought. He is outside on the back porch and Chickster is watching him through the back door. When I looked to see all of this, she looked at her tail and started growling, then looked back at him (He had his back turned to her). Hmmmmmmm......

 

[snickerdoodle]

Just a quick update, Chickster did not have an episode last night while I was at work. The rabies vacc probably made her feel kinda icky and she stayed in Boo's tent last night then in the livingroom. This morning she is pretty normal and Mom said she didn't hear a peep out of her. Hoping this continues. Thanks for all of your guys help, I also found out a friend has a friend with a cat who has the same issues, so that will be of some help too.

 

[snickerdoodle]

Chickster had an episode not a few minutes ago. I looked up on youtube other cats with FHS and they apparently have rather mild cases compared to what Chickster does (Which is completely flip out, growl, just plain scary stuff) ... I read that a lot of people have had success with simply switching to a grain free food. Can anyone recommend some good grain-free foods? Wellness Core is one I saw recommended. I am going to do that tomorrow. She has been fine all day until this evening, and no other cats were around or outside to provoke it. This just makes me sad, I don't want to have to put her on meds and I'm afraid she's going to hurt herself.

Anyone think there's a possibility there could be a pinched nerve? She likes to jump and flip in the air and do twists... which I have personally put a stop to in case she's had any injury. Thanks guys.

 

[otto]

I can't comment on the pinched nerve, how would something like that be diagnosed, I wonder?

I think changing to a better, grain free, diet is a good start in your effort to avoid medication. I remember someone in another forum who had success with controlling FHS with a diet change.

She only eats kibble, right? So your choices, off the top of my head, are Wellness Core or Orijen.

Of course I'm sure you know this but will say it anyway for anyone reading who may not, be sure to do the transition slowly, over a period of at least two weeks and use a probiotic to help prevent tummy and intestinal upset during the transition and for a week or so after she's completely switched.

And...most important, keep us posted!

 

[snickerdoodle]

I bought the Wellness Core today. A 2 lb bag was all i could afford but I should be able to get more Friday. She does not seem interested in it at ALL. But .. mixing it in ... she'll get it.
She has had a few attacks this morning, BUT she went poop AGAIN over night and AGAIN While I was gone to the store not less than an hour ago to get her wellness core. Both were soft but the last one was a lighter color and very soft. Still together, but soft. And stiiiiiiiiiiiiiiinky.

She is cleaning her butt now and looks like she feels she isn't getting it cleaned, though is not focusing on her balloon-knot so much, she is cleaning back paws, entire tail and balloon-knot too

I will slowly transition her and keep you guys updated. Thanks for all the help

Edit: And the pinched nerve, I am throwing that idea out the window because I just witnessed her tail raise up in the air, it was strange, she looked back at it frightened and hissed at it. So like I've been reading, the tail seems possessed all on its own and that's exactly what it looked like.

 

[snickerdoodle]

Okay guys. Please bear with me but I'm trying really hard to keep my patience, ... Chickster is still having attacks, I am transitioning her over to Wellness Core, but she is going nuts this morning. Mom says it is best to try and soothe her when she is having an "attack" and I just don't know what to do. Should I leave her alone, should I try to distract her?

I am seriously at a loss here and she is making me outrageously nervous with her wailing crying growling hissing cat-fighting sounds. She's been to pee this morning. No poop yet.

I feel like I should be doing something but I don't know what!!!