At wit's end

[oneandahalfcats]

PS: As Striker is experiencing constipation, it might be wise to rethink the Metamusil for Sassy or go very easy on it. You can gauge this for yourself based on how many feedings you have added it to so far.

 

[baileytc]

Oh, poor Striker. 

Any fiber product like the Metamucil powder your vet suggested will help both constipation and diarrhea. The Miralax should help get things moving as well. Other things helpful for constipation are the hairball remedy products and even yogurt, which you can give in small quantities if Striker likes it. If it gets really bad, your vet can prescribe lactulose, which will get things moving right away; the problem is that then he's likely to have diarrhea for a little while until his digestive tract gets back into balance.

 

[oneandahalfcats]

When using stool softeners such as Lactulose and Miralax, once a cat has had a reasonable bowel movement, you reduce the dosage and see how things go. If used appropriately, these stool softeners do not produce diarrhea unless you have used too much.

I have two years of experience with constipation on and off in my male cat, and have used lactulose with good results. I have also used psyllium and pumpkin, with not so great results. Psyllium and pumpkin are both a source of soluble fibre which can work for some cats, but not all cats in the case of constipation. Water consumption when taking psyllium is very important. If there is not enough water being consumed, the psyllium will expand and create too much bulk, making constipation even worse.

As there are already sources of fibre in the Blue Buffalo in the way of veggies, pumpkin, etc., adding more fibre may not be a good thing. Both cats are receiving the new diet, but Striker is not (to my knowledge) getting any of the psyllium, but is becoming constipated, possibly from the high fiber in the Blue Buffalo. Sassy on the other hand is probably benefiting from the fibre in the Blue Buffalo and this may be what is taking care of her diarrhea. I wouldn't want to hear however, that she too has become constipated as the result of too much fibre, which is the point for the suggestion to go easy on the psyllium, as she may not be needing it.

 

[lunariris]

Sounds like it's a very complicated situation. My first question was going to be if the vets ran detailed blood work on her, but I see you said they ran multiple tests. 

I've read that going to the bathroom (peeing) in excess can signal kidney issues.

We have a spayed indoor-only female, had her since she was just weeks old, who also had started peeing out of the blue outside her box on and off at around 6-7 years old. At first we just thought it was her vision (she's been partially blind since she was a kitten and her sight's gotten worse with age, as our vets informed us it would), so we weren't sure if she was just having issues seeing the box. We looked at the color of her urine (slightly darker than normal) and the fact that when I had picked her up she meowed at me, something she never did before. Turns out she had bladder stones, and after that started having urinary tract problems on and off. Our big indicator now with her is if I pick her up and it's uncomfortable for her, she likely has a urinary issue again. (Of course it could be something entirely different with another pet, but with her it's a red flag something's wrong). There's an article on it here:  http://www.thecatsite.com/a/feline-lower-urinary-tract-disease-flutd

As a side note, we later found out at the vets that she has started having arthritis and that could be contributing to her not always using the box, but we've always had issues with her kicking litter over the sides, so we got high-sided boxes with just a low-entry area to get in and out, so it's easier for her, but still keeps the litter in. 

She's about 12 years old now and what helped her the most is her being on canned C/D vet diet food (we separate her from everyone initially at meal time so she gets her special diet food, then she can go back with everyone else, and at first she didn't want to eat away from everyone so it took some time to get her adjusted and she got used to the food. She's also a picky eater and this is the only one she'll eat out of the urinary formulas), and having a water fountains instead of regular dishes to drink from, and she drinks a lot more from it. Some of the other cats like dry food still (we feed both wet and dry), so I often add water to some of it so it's like cereal. Some of the cats actually prefer it that way, including her so if she tries to eat any dry she still gets hydrated. She's been so much better since going on C/D though. Staying well hydrated is a major help with urinary issues.

Also as a side note-speaking of water, last year a friend of mine said that all of her pets (she has dogs and cats) started getting sick around the same time, she said some of them were puking here and there, but they all started getting diarrhea, and they couldn't figure out why. She ended up finding out that it was their tap water she was giving them to drink, something got in it and it was making them ill. (I don't know what's wrong with it, she never had it tested, but they had done some blasting up within a mile or so from her house for a while so she thinks maybe it cracked a line, I don't know for sure). She no longer gives them her tap water because there's something wrong with the water so she gets her drinking water delivered in 5-gallon jugs and fills their dishes with that. She boils her other water before using it for eating/drinking and said the diarrhea stopped when she started buying her water. Just thought I'd throw that out there, if it helps anyone. 

 

[mservant]

A positive breakthrough for Sassy but fingers crossed you can settle Striker again and still keep Sassy on track with her issues.  How exhausting.  

Any way you can get them to eat separately so don't have to cope with each other's special needs?

Here's to more settled days and nights for Sassy, and getting Striker back to the form you had achieved before.  

 

 

[billchamb]

And, now...back to the drawing board.

After (2) days of no messes, Sassy urinated on the open floor again.

She had gone in the covered box last night, which I cleaned before heading to bed.  Woke up this morning, and only had to clean a Striker clump from the covered box.

Then, for God knows what reason, after we were awake and about this morning, she went down and...went.  In the meanwhile, Striker had also gone and added a new clump to one box and some poo in the other (still not sure if this is him suddenly being territorial or what).

At the very least, Striker seems to be back on track.  Going back to 100% ZD and 1 more dose of Miralax for him.

Sassy has not had a bowel movement since Wed. night or Thursday morning (which were non-diarrhea).  She really only had a little of the fiber supplement, so I don't think that's the cause.

We are going to try adding the 3rd box, assuming Striker couldn't possibly use all three in one pass.  Maybe that will leave something available for Sassy?

House stress is sky-high as the time frame for the new (to us) home keeps slipping away from us and the circumstances are not seeming to get better.

 

[billchamb]

PS: As Striker is experiencing constipation, it might be wise to rethink the Metamusil for Sassy or go very easy on it. You can gauge this for yourself based on how many feedings you have added it to so far.

We kept the Metamucil away from Sassy completely.  Striker received it sprinkled over a 1/2 finger length of Petromalt, and devoured it.

 

[oneandahalfcats]

 
And, now...back to the drawing board.

After (2) days of no messes, Sassy urinated on the open floor again.

She had gone in the covered box last night, which I cleaned before heading to bed.  Woke up this morning, and only had to clean a Striker clump from the covered box.

Then, for God knows what reason, after we were awake and about this morning, she went down and...went.  In the meanwhile, Striker had also gone and added a new clump to one box and some poo in the other (still not sure if this is him suddenly being territorial or what).

At the very least, Striker seems to be back on track.  Going back to 100% ZD and 1 more dose of Miralax for him.

Sassy has not had a bowel movement since Wed. night or Thursday morning (which were non-diarrhea).  She really only had a little of the fiber supplement, so I don't think that's the cause.

We are going to try adding the 3rd box, assuming Striker couldn't possibly use all three in one pass.  Maybe that will leave something available for Sassy?

House stress is sky-high as the time frame for the new (to us) home keeps slipping away from us and the circumstances are not seeming to get better.

While a minor set back with the urinating on the floor, I see at least two good thing here. Striker seems to be getting back to normal and Sassy's last bowel movement was not diarrhea, which is awesome! Hopefully she will go again today.

Good idea to introduce the third box, especially given that you will have the opportunity to have boxes in more than one room in the new home. It could be that Striker may be monopolizing the litter boxes or interfering with Sassy uses them. He looks to be a much bigger cat than Sassy and if he is anything like my male, looks can be every bit as intimidating as actions. Sassy out of loyalty, may be deferring to him which might explain why she ends up peeing on the floor sometimes. Just a theory/possibility based on personal experience - My female will often step aside and let Max eat her food, which is why I feed her in a separate room now.

The progress is good. Continued prayers and positive vibes for this to continue and that your pending house purchase can get back on track.

 

 

[billchamb]

 
Good idea to introduce the third box, especially given that you will have the opportunity to have boxes in more than one room in the new home. It could be that Striker may be monopolizing the litter boxes or interfering with Sassy uses them. He looks to be a much bigger cat than Sassy and if he is anything like my male, looks can be every bit as intimidating as actions. Sassy out of loyalty, may be deferring to him which might explain why she ends up peeing on the floor sometimes. Just a theory/possibility based on personal experience - My female will often step aside and let Max eat her food, which is why I feed her in a separate room now.

Its odd because Striker has always been a pushover, despite the size difference (literally 2x Sassy's weight).  Sassy has typically been the "bully" about most things.  We are fairly certain that he has not been around or even aware of all her "accidents," so I'm not sure how convinced I am, especially since this started so infrequently.  I know its a possibility, though, and one I will keep considering.

Two things I wish we could now solve, after 12 years together with these two:

1) feeding them separately without crossover;

2) setting up a box that only Sassy could use

We just don't have a convenient way to split them up when eating, and we don't feed on a rigid schedule.

 

[oneandahalfcats]

 
Its odd because Striker has always been a pushover, despite the size difference (literally 2x Sassy's weight).  Sassy has typically been the "bully" about most things.  We are fairly certain that he has not been around or even aware of all her "accidents," so I'm not sure how convinced I am, especially since this started so infrequently.  I know its a possibility, though, and one I will keep considering.

Two things I wish we could now solve, after 12 years together with these two:

1) feeding them separately without crossover;

2) setting up a box that only Sassy could use

We just don't have a convenient way to split them up when eating, and we don't feed on a rigid schedule.

That's good to hear that Striker is such a gentleman with her .. Max is a pretty laid back cat for the most part, except when it comes to food. Sometimes the dynamics can change between cats for whatever reason - getting older or in response to changes in the environment such as when new cats are added to the mix. We were adopted by Thomas our little Tuxedo in late 2012, and initially there were problems between Thomas and Maggie. I was quite concerned that we would have to find a home for Thomas as Maggie was quite upset with his presence and we weren't sure if this would ever get resolved. Thomas on the other hand is quite a sweetheart (good natured) and really wanted to be friends with Maggie. Over time and through some intervention, things have gotten a whole lot better between them. There is still the odd hissing going on, but today, they are co-existing quite well, and we think, secretly do like each other.

For feeding, its just a matter of scooping up Sassy and putting her in a bedroom or downstairs bathroom. If possible, putting the box close to where the feeding takes place, might prompt her to start using it more readily. The routine for cats is usually to go not long after they have eaten, but this is not a strict rule. The other important factor, is that it would be beneficial if you can start introducing scheduled feedings. This can help regulate digestion, whereas feeding at irregular times can contribute to delayed or improper elimination.

If you can provide us with a few details as to the number and type of rooms you have now, and a basic idea of layout, this will help to get a better sense of things in order to come up with some ideas.

 

[therese]

RE:  The PEEING......Bill, I won't be a pest or mention this again, but PLEASE  go to Petsmart, Petco or somewhere and buy a $15  SPRAY BOTTLE of the Feliway....and spray it all over the rugs and areas your cat is peeing.  

I am telling you, its a small investment to stop the peeing on the rugs.....I did as much as YOU did for my cats to stop PEEING and no matter what I did, NOTHING helped ( and we ruled out all the health stuff)    

At my "wits end,' as you are, I saw on the Feliway website to spray the SPRAY  all over the PEE area.......I swear it was like flipping a switch....he stopped peeing that night and oddly enough hasn't moved over to another rug, either.  There is a biological brain chem thing about this, and it REALLY works!    What do you have to lose for $15  ??       I also used the diffusers plugged in, too, but even the diffusers  didn't stop the peeing directly on the rugs ( they stopped the fighting but not the peeing.  )  I had to spray every twelve hours on the rug, and sprayed thoroughly, but it works, I swear.  It probably will work on poop too. 

I won't bring it up again because I don't want to be a pest, but I JUST got thru with this problem and my house is restored to normal.   Now you may have more than one problem going there, but I think if the PEE stopped, you would be half way there.    I know that time is running out, which is the only reason I am putting this up on the board again

 

 

[mycatwasthebest]

Did you talk to the vet before stopping the Metamucil? it seems she was making some progress so I don't understand why you would withhold it without doing so.

Also, why can't you take her to your new home in this condition?

Unless there is a VERY good reason I suggest you forget about that issue while dealing with her.

 

[billchamb]

 
RE:  The PEEING......Bill, I won't be a pest or mention this again, but PLEASE  go to Petsmart, Petco or somewhere and buy a $15  SPRAY BOTTLE of the Feliway....and spray it all over the rugs and areas your cat is peeing.  

I am telling you, its a small investment to stop the peeing on the rugs.....I did as much as YOU did for my cats to stop PEEING and no matter what I did, NOTHING helped ( and we ruled out all the health stuff)    

At my "wits end,' as you are, I saw on the Feliway website to spray the SPRAY  all over the PEE area.......I swear it was like flipping a switch....he stopped peeing that night and oddly enough hasn't moved over to another rug, either.  There is a biological brain chem thing about this, and it REALLY works!    What do you have to lose for $15  ??       I also used the diffusers plugged in, too, but even the diffusers  didn't stop the peeing directly on the rugs ( they stopped the fighting but not the peeing.  )  I had to spray every twelve hours on the rug, and sprayed thoroughly, but it works, I swear.  It probably will work on poop too. 

I won't bring it up again because I don't want to be a pest, but I JUST got thru with this problem and my house is restored to normal.   Now you may have more than one problem going there, but I think if the PEE stopped, you would be half way there.    I know that time is running out, which is the only reason I am putting this up on the board again

 

Not peeing on the rugs.

Believe it or not, plenty of other distractions and stress while trying to work out what has turned into a very complicated job transition and relocation - thus Feliway slips down the list a bit.

Thanks.

 

[billchamb]

 
Did you talk to the vet before stopping the Metamucil? it seems she was making some progress so I don't understand why you would withhold it without doing so.

Also, why can't you take her to your new home in this condition?

Unless there is a VERY good reason I suggest you forget about that issue while dealing with her.

Haven't stopped the Metamucil; just haven't been able to get it to her consistently.

Don't want to arrive in a new home with a misbehavioral cat urination problem.  The new home does not have the same possibilities for a "cat bathroom" area.  Its VERY stressful to consider starting over in a new home and the fear and anxiety of having Sassy's "misfires" immediately make a mess of things.  Is THIS what you're suggesting I "forget about?"  Is my reason VERY good enough in your mind?

We want to be able to have houseguests and friends, etc. and DON'T want to have rooms ringed with aluminum foil like some alien/government conspiracy theorist.

Not trying to be mean or nasty to our cats, or anyone's opinion here.  That is just the honest truth.

 

[billchamb]

 
If you can provide us with a few details as to the number and type of rooms you have now, and a basic idea of layout, this will help to get a better sense of things in order to come up with some ideas.

I will try a little bit later to describe the layout(s), maybe add some visuals if I can.

 

[mycatwasthebest]

Why not just plan on having her confined to your bedroom when you move? Seems to me that would solve multiple problems.

 

[oneandahalfcats]

 
Why not just plan on having her confined to your bedroom when you move? Seems to me that would solve multiple problems.

I would think for the obvious reason that she is not using a litter box consistently. The poster is fortunate that the inappropriate elimination is happening on concrete in his basement which is much easier to clean than carpets. He may not have the luxury of a basement where they are moving, so it is appropriate to try and resolve this issue before the move, if possible.

 

[billchamb]

 
I would think for the obvious reason that she is not using a litter box consistently. The poster is fortunate that the inappropriate elimination is happening on concrete in his basement which is much easier to clean than carpets. He may not have the luxury of a basement where they are moving, so it is appropriate to try and resolve this issue before the move, if possible.

And...oneandahalfcats NAILS it!  AND sticks the landing.

YES, this is EXACTLY the concern.  Thank you for the support and affirmation that I am still making sense.

 

[billchamb]

billchamb Basement.JPG

• billchamb
• Feb 7, 2014

 

[dolface]

I am so sorry to hear about your troubles with Sassy and now striker. I had a similar problem with my beloved cat I lost 6 yrs ago last week. It took 3 vets and a lot of tests but they soon figured out that part of the problem he was having was that he had only 1 properly working kidney, and that at the advanced age of 18 yrs his other kidney had just started shutting down from over stress....we did all we could had him on medications and antibiotics and he was in the hospital on fluids because they can become very dehydrated from the diarrhea.

I would seriously thinking of seeing at least another vet if not 2. We had to use the doggy training pads under most of the boxes and around the outside kind of mad a mat. Then the idea of the shower curtain but if you go this route you have to make sure that the plastic is not too stiff or the sound will surely spook her if she's already stressed.

I'm so sorry and I hope that you are receiving at least some information and ideas to help alleviate the problem or at least deal with it until you figure out the causing factor for this sudden change in behavior.

Good wishes and gods luck