What ultimately cured your cat's C Perfringens overgrowth?

[bethany5]

Been dealing with intermittent diarrhea with my cat for a few months now. At the end of January, we did a Diarrhea PCR and her C Perfringens toxin levels were pretty high (2,885 THOUS/g for the Alpha toxin and 6,518 THOUS/g for the Enterotoxin). We did a 10 day course of metronidazole, but she was still having sporadic diarrhea afterwards. So, we did another Diarrhea PCR and her levels had gone down since the first test, but were still too high (I don't have a copy of the results, so I don't have the exact levels on hand). We did a 5 day course of Tylosin (thank god for Double Chicken + Marshmallow compounded liquid from Wedgewood and someone's recommendation on here to give her some Churu before giving the med. I do NOT recommend the Fish + Marshmallow, as just a tiny bit made her foam profusely at the mouth. Even more so than non-flavored Gabapentin made her foam at the mouth). We just finished that last week and I'm waiting to hear back from her vet (who isn't in until later this week) on what the next steps will be. I'm guessing we'll run the Diarrhea PCR one more time to see how effective the Tylosin was. BUT, my baby is having diarrhea today. Sooooo I'm anticipating her Perfringens toxin levels will still be too high :/ What ultimately worked for your cat when their Perfringens levels were too high? I want to be prepared with plans to ask the vet about when I hear from her later this week.

For additional background on my cat: At the recommendation of the vet, I give her some FortiFlora daily. I was also giving her an S Boulardii probiotic for a couple of weeks too, but I recently switched to Nexabiotic since it contains S Boulardii and many other probiotics. My cat is semi-feral, so she is easily spooked, but I haven't noticed her be stressed by anything this week, so I don't see that being the cause of her diarrhea. I did have my sister and her kids over on Saturday, and my cat mostly hides when they are here, but she is used to them enough that she doesn't seem noticeably stressed by them being here, she just doesn't want to be around them. She'll still eat her food while they are here, and sometimes she will watch the kids through a window, while they play outside. And once they leave, she will immediately come out. Can something that causes only very minor anxiety, such as having my sister and her kids over, cause an increase in C Perfringens? Or would it take a more significant stressor?

 

[daftcat75]

S. boulardii was what eventually cured Krista's c. perf. I think she got it from an undercooked turkey drumstick in the slow cooker for bone broth. Basically my fault. We did the metro. It didn't work. I read about s. boulardii and we tried that. It worked. But it took a long time. A month or two of increasingly promising results until I finally brought in a sample for a PCR and the vet laughed me out of the office--"if her sample looks like that, you don't need to waste your money on a PCR to know she's back to good again." Fortunately Krista loved the taste of s. boulardii so it was piece of cake to get her to eat a quarter to half a capsule several times a day. Keeping a steady state of at least twice a day dosing is what's going to help it work the best. I wouldn't bother with other probiotics yet because you need to scrub out the c. perf which is what the s boulardii will do. S. boulardii has a similar structure as the gut wall. This makes it essentially a decoy gut. The c. perf binds to it and gets flushed out in the poop.

The Jarrow brand with MOS is what you want to be using. The MOS works synergistically with the s. boulardii. Some of the other probiotics include prebiotics which could be having the unintended effect of feeding the c. perf. That's why I like the Jarrow brand with MOS better. Both MOS and SB act like decoy gut to scrub out bad guys who feed on the gut wall.
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[bethany5]

How much of the Jarrow do you give your cat a day? I more started the other probiotic cuz after having two rounds of antibiotics, I'm sure her good bacteria has been diminished, so she probably needs the other probiotics just in general, not to help the C Perfringens. Was your cat's diarrhea happening consistently? My cat has plenty of perfect stools in between her diarrheas, so I wouldn't be able to use a normal stool sample as an indicator that her C Perfringens levels were back to normal :/

 

[daftcat75]

I gave Krista between a quarter and a half pill two to four times a day. Hers was quite consistently soft to straight up blowouts. I had extra boxes for her that summer so that I could keep up. It did get better slowly but noticeably until her first solid poop. (Censored. But impressive!)

She was pretty excited about it too.

Then another. And eventually the c perf was gone. I wanted to retest and the vet said don’t bother. Never had a recurrence.

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

With my cat who had C. Perf, we didn't even bother with antibiotics (even though the Vet did recommend them). We went straight for the S. Boulardi with MOS, AND the highest fiber food I could find. My cat did NOT like the S. Boulardi with MOS, so it was hit or miss getting that into him, so my guess is that it's the high fiber food that really worked for him. And I will say his diarrhea cleared up very quickly with it, probably just a couple of days. I finally figured out a way to sometimes get his "meds" in him, and that is by putting maybe 1/8th capsule in my palm and covering it up with FortiFlora, If I was lucky, he would lick that up maybe once per day. I actually still do that because he got used to me giving it to him and I think he looks forward to this special treatment he gets. The high fiber food actually started causing constipation because it bulked up his stools so much, so I had to back off of that and mix it with lower fiber food, I talked to his Vet a few months after his diagnosis and asked if he needs another PCR run, and she said they don't do another one if there aren't any symtoms anymore. So I'm guessing he's fine now, thank goodness.

I was also feeding raw at the time, so tossed all of his regular food back then, and when I tried reintroducing it after a couple of months, it was a no go. He must have realized his food caused the issue and now wants nothing to do with it

 

[bethany5]

With my cat who had C. Perf, we didn't even bother with antibiotics (even though the Vet did recommend them). We went straight for the S. Boulardi with MOS, AND the highest fiber food I could find. My cat did NOT like the S. Boulardi with MOS, so it was hit or miss getting that into him, so my guess is that it's the high fiber food that really worked for him. And I will say his diarrhea cleared up very quickly with it, probably just a couple of days. I finally figured out a way to sometimes get his "meds" in him, and that is by putting maybe 1/8th capsule in my palm and covering it up with FortiFlora, If I was lucky, he would lick that up maybe once per day. I actually still do that because he got used to me giving it to him and I think he looks forward to this special treatment he gets. The high fiber food actually started causing constipation because it bulked up his stools so much, so I had to back off of that and mix it with lower fiber food, I talked to his Vet a few months after his diagnosis and asked if he needs another PCR run, and she said they don't do another one if there aren't any symtoms anymore. So I'm guessing he's fine now, thank goodness.

I was also feeding raw at the time, so tossed all of his regular food back then, and when I tried reintroducing it after a couple of months, it was a no go. He must have realized his food caused the issue and now wants nothing to do with it

Which food did you get that is high in fiber? Sounds like my experience is different than everyone else's, because it seems like everyone else's cat had consistent diarrhea, so it was easy to tell when the C. Perf was gone. For my cat, her diarrhea is very intermittent. She'll have several days of great poops, sometimes a couple weeks of normal poops, then anywhere from 1 to a handful of days of diarrhea BUT she usually has some regular poops within the diarrhea timeline as well.

 

[bethany5]

Which food did you get that is high in fiber? Sounds like my experience is different than everyone else's, because it seems like everyone else's cat had consistent diarrhea, so it was easy to tell when the C. Perf was gone. For my cat, her diarrhea is very intermittent. She'll have several days of great poops, sometimes a couple weeks of normal poops, then anywhere from 1 to a handful of days of diarrhea BUT she usually has some regular poops within the diarrhea timeline as well.

Also, luckily my cat likes the Jarrows Boulardii. Which is funny cuz she is a pretty picky eater.

 

[bethany5]

With my cat who had C. Perf, we didn't even bother with antibiotics (even though the Vet did recommend them). We went straight for the S. Boulardi with MOS, AND the highest fiber food I could find. My cat did NOT like the S. Boulardi with MOS, so it was hit or miss getting that into him, so my guess is that it's the high fiber food that really worked for him. And I will say his diarrhea cleared up very quickly with it, probably just a couple of days. I finally figured out a way to sometimes get his "meds" in him, and that is by putting maybe 1/8th capsule in my palm and covering it up with FortiFlora, If I was lucky, he would lick that up maybe once per day. I actually still do that because he got used to me giving it to him and I think he looks forward to this special treatment he gets. The high fiber food actually started causing constipation because it bulked up his stools so much, so I had to back off of that and mix it with lower fiber food, I talked to his Vet a few months after his diagnosis and asked if he needs another PCR run, and she said they don't do another one if there aren't any symtoms anymore. So I'm guessing he's fine now, thank goodness.

I was also feeding raw at the time, so tossed all of his regular food back then, and when I tried reintroducing it after a couple of months, it was a no go. He must have realized his food caused the issue and now wants nothing to do with it

Also, luckily my cat likes the Jarrows Boulardii. Which is funny cuz she is a pretty picky eater.

 

[Jabzilla]

One of my cats had a C Perf. overgrowth with the alpha toxin last year. I was giving him Jarrow S Boulardii for a couple months and then switched to Renew Life S Boulardii after finding out the Jarrow has tapioca starch in it. Cosmos didn't have diarrhea at all, instead the C Perf. was causing drops of blood to show up on his bottom after pooping. That escalated to a prolapse a few months later and thats when I switched to Renew S Boulardii. Since I wasn't sure if the tapioca starch was contributing to the problem. I gave him 20 bill CFU of S Boulardii every day for two months, then reduced it down to 15 bill CFU a day. Now, a year later, he gets 1/2 a cap of S Boulardii with breakfast and another 1/2 with dinner, which is a total of 10 bill CFU.

Since your cat has intermittent diarrhea and likes the Jarrow S Boulardii, I would give her a full capsule of it twice a day for a few months. Once she no longer has any diarrhea, I would reduce it to one capsule a day. S Boulardii is safe to be given indefinitely since it doesn't colonize the gut and is completely removed a few days after its no longer given. If its been months and no sign of diarrhea, then feel free to stop the S Boulardii entirely, or continue giving 1/2 cap a day or however often you like. It's a good tool to help give the gut a good sweeping and to help make it harder for bad bacteria to colonize to the intestines.

As for fiber, my cats get 1/8tsp of organic psyllium husk added to their raw food each day. I dont know if that helped with the C Perf, but I figured its worth mentioning.

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

Which food did you get that is high in fiber? Sounds like my experience is different than everyone else's, because it seems like everyone else's cat had consistent diarrhea, so it was easy to tell when the C. Perf was gone. For my cat, her diarrhea is very intermittent. She'll have several days of great poops, sometimes a couple weeks of normal poops, then anywhere from 1 to a handful of days of diarrhea BUT she usually has some regular poops within the diarrhea timeline as well.

Unfortunately, I had to go with a dry food for the high fiber because both my cats are so darned picky and I wanted to put both of them on the high fiber food just in case the other cat started having issued too, which thankfully he didn't.

Here is the food I finally found:

None of the other foods I found came close to the amount of fiber in this one, but I couldn't find it in stores. Had to order from Chewy.

I initially tried adding psyllium to their wet food, and they instantly rejected it . Tried a smaller amount, same result. Cats! Gotta love 'em.

 

[Jabzilla]

Some other options for increasing the fiber in your cats food are things like this probiotic. It has three different soluble fiber sources in it, along with the S Boulardii and probiotics. USDA Organic Probiotics with Prebiotics – Fera Pets Or you could buy inulin, FOS, psyllium, etc separately and slowly mix it into your cats food. This page has some good info on fiber, breaks down the difference between soluble and insoluble fiber, and has a list of various fiber sources that can be added to one's cat's food. Cats & Fiber: feeding plant matter? — The Little Carnivore

 

[bethany5]

Unfortunately, I had to go with a dry food for the high fiber because both my cats are so darned picky and I wanted to put both of them on the high fiber food just in case the other cat started having issued too, which thankfully he didn't.

Here is the food I finally found:
View attachment 476008

None of the other foods I found came close to the amount of fiber in this one, but I couldn't find it in stores. Had to order from Chewy.

I initially tried adding psyllium to their wet food, and they instantly rejected it . Tried a smaller amount, same result. Cats! Gotta love 'em.

Thanks for the rec! Dry food can be totally fine for some cats and luckily my cat is one of them. I am going to look into this one

 

[bethany5]

One of my cats had a C Perf. overgrowth with the alpha toxin last year. I was giving him Jarrow S Boulardii for a couple months and then switched to Renew Life S Boulardii after finding out the Jarrow has tapioca starch in it. Cosmos didn't have diarrhea at all, instead the C Perf. was causing drops of blood to show up on his bottom after pooping. That escalated to a prolapse a few months later and thats when I switched to Renew S Boulardii. Since I wasn't sure if the tapioca starch was contributing to the problem. I gave him 20 bill CFU of S Boulardii every day for two months, then reduced it down to 15 bill CFU a day. Now, a year later, he gets 1/2 a cap of S Boulardii with breakfast and another 1/2 with dinner, which is a total of 10 bill CFU.

Since your cat has intermittent diarrhea and likes the Jarrow S Boulardii, I would give her a full capsule of it twice a day for a few months. Once she no longer has any diarrhea, I would reduce it to one capsule a day. S Boulardii is safe to be given indefinitely since it doesn't colonize the gut and is completely removed a few days after its no longer given. If its been months and no sign of diarrhea, then feel free to stop the S Boulardii entirely, or continue giving 1/2 cap a day or however often you like. It's a good tool to help give the gut a good sweeping and to help make it harder for bad bacteria to colonize to the intestines.

As for fiber, my cats get 1/8tsp of organic psyllium husk added to their raw food each day. I dont know if that helped with the C Perf, but I figured its worth mentioning.

Thanks for the rec! So when you say to give a capsule twice a day, does that mean two capsules total? OR does it mean one capsule total, but split it into two doses?

 

[Jabzilla]

Thanks for the rec! So when you say to give a capsule twice a day, does that mean two capsules total? OR does it mean one capsule total, but split it into two doses?

You’re welcome. I meant two capsules total, one in the morning and one in the evening. Once the diarrhea has completely stopped, the S Boulardii can be reduced to 1/2 a capsule in the morning and 1/2 a capsule in the evening. I dont remember how many CFU the Jarrow brand has. The Renew Life S Boulardii is 10 billion CFU per capsule, so that’s how I gave my cat 20 bill CFU a day.

 

[bethany5]

You’re welcome. I meant two capsules total, one in the morning and one in the evening. Once the diarrhea has completely stopped, the S Boulardii can be reduced to 1/2 a capsule in the morning and 1/2 a capsule in the evening. I dont remember how many CFU the Jarrow brand has. The Renew Life S Boulardii is 10 billion CFU per capsule, so that’s how I gave my cat 20 bill CFU a day.

Thanks so much! I have been a little conservative with the Jarrows so far, cuz I wasn't confident in the directions i had read before, so now I'll start giving her more. Hopefully it helps! I'll have to make an update post eventually