Vets and raw

[ldntown]

I understand vets aren't nutritionists but everytime I say "I feed raw" I get the most horrified and shocked looks. They actually imply that it's going to kill my cats. I've even had a vet tell me not to give them COOKED chicken because "they should only be eating cat food". - do they even know what goes in cat food??!

So my question is, why are vets so misinformed? Raw is completely based on logic, and what kitties need and get in the wild when they don't have humans telling them what to eat. Is there anything that can be done to educate people? Are vets taught this because of the pet food industry not wanting to lose money? I don't understand.

Maybe there's someone here that is a vet or knows one and can shed some light.

 

[catfella]

I've seen the same level of idiocy in medical (people) doctors. It's rampant.

They will look at you like you are crazy for implying that you can prevent most diseases by just eating right, drinking water, exercising, and sleeping. But oooohhhh no, you need DRUGS to live better!

Sorry for the random rant.

 

[otto]

I Are vets taught this because of the pet food industry not wanting to lose money? I don't understand.

.

Yes.

I'm lucky, while she doesn't know much about it, my vet is very supportive of me feeding my cats raw. She asks a lot of questions, and sometimes even takes notes. She volunteered the information that she knows of a cat with stomatitis who was cured on a raw diet, and a cat with IBD who was cured on a raw diet. When I first started going to her I knew almost as little about feline nutrition as she did. I began learning and have passed my knowledge on to her.

What we can do is keep talking about it, keep telling people your experiences, and if they show interest, direct them to a raw feeding forum such as this one, for more information.

 

[ldg]

Follow the money.

http://www.mndaily.com/2010/02/18/vet-school-relies-external-funding

http://www.uoguelph.ca/news/2008/04/royal_canin_can.html

http://www.purinavets.eu/home/about/news.htm#n92

http://www.purinaveterinarydiets.com/veterinarian/education/dailynutritionmatters.aspx

http://clubs.ncsu.edu/scavma/PurinaFAQ1.htm

http://veterinarynews.dvm360.com/dv...ute-Puri/ArticleStandard/Article/detail/54515

Royal Canin sponsors the ACK scholarships for vet students: http://classic.akc.org/news/index.cfm?article_id=3925

http://www.hillsvet.com/professionals/vet-students.html

http://www.allaboutfeed.net/Home/Ge...t-Nutrition-supports-vet-students-AAF004233W/

Etc.

 

[southpaw]

Unfortunately all the studies out there are, of course, funded by your big name companies like Science Diet or Purina. Sooo all the information in textbooks, everything a veterinarian learns about nutrition (and honestly they don't learn that much), is coming straight from pet food industries.

I'm a vet tech and my short course in nutrition was an online program offered by Purina. Surprise surprise, a big chunk of what I "learned" was about  why Purina is so awesome - "we have such and such amount of protein, and diets for puppies and kittens who's nutritional needs vary in X ways, and we have prescription diets..."
 

It's really just a big joke. But these companies have SCIENCE backing them up. Studies show pets do "okay" on these diets. Raw just has anecdotal evidence to support it, and well... common sense too. But I can see why it's hard for people to support it since it's not "proven." And it's also very easy to get caught up in the fact that, since humans can't eat raw meat, then that must mean my pets can't either.

As far as vets go, I really do understand why they feel the way they do. Of course they are going to believe what they learned in school. If they start questioning what they learned about nutrition... then what else are they going to start questioning? Is everything they learned incorrect? It's a weird line.

So I really don't blame the vets. Most of your traditional vets are just going to work off of what has studies to prove it - not just anecdotal things. I suppose it's probably the same in human medicine. You have to go to a more holistic doc if you want the "unconventional" solutions.

 

[ldntown]

So I really don't blame the vets. Most of your traditional vets are just going to work off of what has studies to prove it - not just anecdotal things. I suppose it's probably the same in human medicine. You have to go to a more holistic doc if you want the "unconventional" solutions.

This really does make sense and thank you for your reply.

I do like this website quite a bit because it lists resources from doctors and research as well as to why raw is good. 

http://www.catnutrition.org/resources.html

I don't want to start sounding like a crazy person and yell "CAT FOOD IS KILLING YOUR CAT". But I am very close to it 

And of course people should be allowed to make their own decisions. I don't want to force "my way" on them just because it is what I think is right. But if only the information was more widely available I'm sure it wouldn't be such a big deal.

Thank you everyone for your input! I think I am going to make it my mission to teach everyone at the shelter about this, and to make sure new kitty parents are aware of their options outside of cat food.

 

[mickeys mom]

I understand vets aren't nutritionists but everytime I say "I feed raw" I get the most horrified and shocked looks. They actually imply that it's going to kill my cats. I've even had a vet tell me not to give them COOKED chicken because "they should only be eating cat food". - do they even know what goes in cat food??!
 

I got the same reply from someone at my vet hospital when I mentioned feeding my kitty, raw chicken. The technician told me, "never feed your cat raw chicken it's very bad and your cat will get very sick".  So than I mentioned it to my vet doctor and she said, the only issue would be how it's handled and if others in the household know how to handle it safely because of the salmonella issues for people. Than she told me that she had no problem with me feeding my kitty, raw chicken, and that it's actually very good for him.

So at this time I'm feeding him raw and canned until I can get a very good supplement to add to the raw chicken for a better complete and balanced diet. Than I will go with more of the raw diet.

 

[otto]

I feed a combination of canned and raw to my cats. I know your Mickey has proved stubborn when you tried with commercial raw. I'm lucky, my cats love the Rad Cat (though Mazy took about a month before she would eat it) I do balance the homemade raw portions with Alnutrin eggshell calcium. I feed liver for their organ portion. They don't get more than an ounce of homemade raw a day. The rest is Rad Cat and canned.

I'm glad your vet is so supportive. I don't like the tech at your vet! :lol3:

 

[otto]

This really does make sense and thank you for your reply.

I do like this website quite a bit because it lists resources from doctors and research as well as to why raw is good. 

http://www.catnutrition.org/resources.html

I don't want to start sounding like a crazy person and yell "CAT FOOD IS KILLING YOUR CAT". But I am very close to it 

And of course people should be allowed to make their own decisions. I don't want to force "my way" on them just because it is what I think is right. But if only the information was more widely available I'm sure it wouldn't be such a big deal.


Thank you everyone for your input! I think I am going to make it my mission to teach everyone at the shelter about this, and to make sure new kitty parents are aware of their options outside of cat food.

I know how you feel. I've come a long long way in my knowledge and understanding of feline nutrition over the past 6 years. For the 30 years before that I fed canned food, because I knew that was best, but I didn't know anything else. It was during the melamine poisoning that I really starting questioning what I was feeding my cats. Back then I never ever thought I'd be feeding raw, ever. But here I am with three cats on a partial raw diet.

Anyway as I was saying, now that I know what I know, I want everyone with cats to know it. It's frustrating, when you try to share this information, and people are at best unresponsive, at worst skeptical or down right disbelieving even to accusing you of being "dangerous" for telling people to feed their cats a better diet. (yes I have been called dangerous!).

All we can do is keep talking, keep politely sharing our knowledge, experience and links, and hope we are making a difference. If we reach even ONE person, it's a success. Because, when that one person sees the difference the diet improvement makes in the cat, that person too will begin spreading the word.

Never give up. Like I said, I never dreamed I'd ever be feeding raw. But..here I am, and the cats and I are reaping the benefits!

 

[oakshimmer]

I was so afraid to feed raw just because of all the vets, techs and random people that told me that I could possibly make my cat very sick or even kill my cat!

Of course I was pushed and even convinced that I should be feeding my cat a prescription diet or a very high quality canned food. My cat has IBD and I tried everything to help remedy her issue in the regards to canned or kibble cat foods. Nothing worked for her and she just continued to get sicker and sicker while eating it. Not to mention the cost of the high end canned cat food and prescription diets, it was outrageous. One day I was curious as to what was in cat food, and I was disgusted by what i found! Also when I found out that her prescription diet was mostly fillers I was highly annoyed and upset that I was paying such a high price for walmart grade cat food! Heck Fancy Feast canned meals were higher quality than the Vet prescribed diet!

Basically I decided that I had nothing to loose feeding my very sick cat a raw diet. I was afraid at first because of all the stuff that was pumped in my head about it, but pretty much after a week of feeding my cat raw, she started to improve! It makes total sense to me now that feeding a cat what it is designed to eat is the best you can feed your cat. It has been my experience that it is what my cat was lacking the whole time!

My vet also was slightly against Raw feeding, she also tried to convince me not to feed raw at all. One day on a appointment, I told her I was feeding raw and that my cat has never felt better, the vet seemed happy for us that something was working for her finally. She never mentions anything against it now that she has seen my cats improvements.

I will never feed "cat" food again!

 

[lilas]

I got the lecture from my vet too. I went in there while my cat was sick (pretty sure it was a URI but all he was doing was coughing and no runny nose/eyes/fever so who knows really) and asked her what she thought about feeding raw and got a whole lecture about how she doesn't recommend it because it's dangerous and the AVMA doesn't recommend it, blah blah. I went ahead with it anyway.

Sadly, my kitty did not get better while on raw (he started regurgitating 2 days after he was off all his meds -- I'm wondering now if it wasn't just sensitivity from all the meds) and when I took him back in, I told her that I he hadn't pooped in 2 days (while on raw he pooped every other day) and with the regurgitating I was a little worried. So she asked me what I was feeding him and I told her raw and she started going on about it again, and how cats are domesticated animals now and not wild animals. Then she told me that I should put him on dry food for hairball because of the fiber content and only feed him canned food as a treat. I just smiled and nodded and decided right then and there I would find a holistic vet or a vet that understands raw feeding as soon as I'm done with the Banfield Wellness plan. 

The worst part was that my mom tagged along for that second visit and then I had to hear a whole lecture about raw feeding from her! When she was the one who originally encouraged me to start making cat food. Best part of the conversation was when my mom said that my cat had never known the outside world (I adopted him from a shelter when he was 2 months old and who knows where he came from) and that cats are domesticated creatures and of course they should not be fed raw food! They are not evolved anymore to handle raw food! And when I asked her if she really thought that cats evolved so much in the 50-60 years of commercial food that their bodies no longer supported raw food she said yes... Oh mother. Thankfully my father told me to just ignore her

 

[otto]

People who don't want to learn, have to be ignored, we can't shove the knowledge down their throats, but we can keep talking about it and letting the results speak for themselves. The thing to remember is to not allow yourself to be baited. If someone gives you a hard time about feeding raw, the trick is to know when to drop the subject. Plant the seed, then let it grow on it's own. Or not, depending on the fertility of the brain the seed was planted in.

I speak from experience. Four years ago I was..while not exactly "anti-raw" I sure wasn't for it either. But I continued to read in raw forums, and gradually I began to see the light. Reading transition threads really helped me understand what it's all about. And lo and behold, eventually there I was making my own transition thread.

Of course then there are the ones who are not against it but afraid of it. It can be all so overwhelming. I was that person too. Again, reading reading reading other people's experiences and asking my own questions helped break it down into manageable pieces for understanding.

And then the best piece of advice I ever got was from our own LDG, she said I didn't have to worry about going totally raw, even just adding a little raw to their diet would benefit them. I realized the sense of that instantly, because I have used those words myself hundreds of times, when trying to sway people to feed a canned diet.

And Laurie was right. My cats are on a partial raw diet, and the benefits have been enormous.