Two difficult to care for cats

[addiebee]

Well, streambeck, MY boyfriend is an unrepentant CAT lover!!!

 

[strange_wings]

Well, considering that bastetservant's other post sounded like she was was flirting a bit (

) you just need keep looking.

One thing that might be a problem, if you're younger but more mentally mature it will be more difficult to find someone very close to your age that's as mature. I had a friend who had this issue (I swear he acts like like he's 37 not 27) and he ended up finding a girlfriend who was 10 years older than him.

They're very happy and he adores her cats.

 

[streambeck]

Haha, well, I wouldn't want to discount other people my age or claim I'm more mature, but I'll admit to being generally attracted to women a few years older than I am (it's never ranged beyond 4 or 5 years difference). I'm not looking for any major, life-long commitments right now, and I'm confident in my ability to meet women (I'm trying not to sound arrogant haha), I just wanna get the issues in the apartment squared away before I start having girls over, and then I'll deal with attitudes towards cats as they come up I guess.

I'm only 23, so time isn't really working against me right now.

 

[ldg]

I will say cats tend to be excellent judges of character.

When you do have people / girlfriend(s) over, pay attention to the kitties.

...And allergies are an excuse, trust me. I have allergies, and that wouldn't have stopped me from dating or marrying someone with cats. Any animal lover could care less about allergies - other than figuring out how to get around them. Keep zyrtec and visine on hand.

I'm lucky enough DH and I "found" our love of cats together (he used to hate them), but we live in an RV with 8, and I keep my allergies under control. And I am VERY allergic.

I've got heaps of ideas for you if you find another girl that's allergic.

 

[bastetservant]

Oh, No! I'm not flirting. I'm being "grandmotherly" as that's how old I am compared to steambeck.

 

[streambeck]

Well the past couple of weeks have been pretty trying, and I've come to a pretty critical decision that I want some feedback on. It's not an easy decision, but I think it's best for everyone.

Basically, despite my best efforts, keeping the mess under control and keeping the smell in my apartment tolerable has proven to be pretty difficult. Beyond that, these cats each have really specific needs that the presence of the other cat makes really difficult to address. Chandler is so restless and bored in a studio. Beyond not being able to go outside, he struggles with not having anything to explore and just generally not anything to do. I try to play with him, but I think he really pines for independence like he used to have. This manifests with him eating all of the food the second I put it down. I don't mind sitting with him while Zeppy eats, but Zeppy is a different kind of eater. He likes to eat a little bit at a time, and then go back for more later, but now there's never anything left when he goes for seconds.

Beyond that, Zeppy is really starting to show his age, and I need to frequently give him lots of attention. Chandler doesn't like not being the center of attention (when he's not eating, he's constantly trying to get love). He shows disdain for Zeppy whenever I give Zep attention and everytime I let Zeppy eat first (which is every meal). Zeppelin shows disdain for Chan every time he returns to the bowl to find it empty and every time his attention is interrupted by Chandler coming between us.

I decided to look into sending Chan to a family member on the east coast. He would have a house to explore, he'd be allowed to go outside, there's a kid there, and Chan loves kids, and he used to live with this family member, and I know from experience that he'd be well loved.

I struggle with this decision for two reasons (and this is what I want feedback on): I don't want Chandler to think he did something wrong (preferably, I'd be making the trip with him and making sure he's settled in before coming home), or that I'm abandoning him or something, and the second thing, I don't know how well the cats will cope with being separated. They've been together for a decade, and even though they haven't always gotten along, particularly in the past few weeks, they've always had each other. There's no real visible comradery between them, and there never really has been, but there's gotta be something there.

I just think this would be the most logical decision to make. Zeppy would get to eat when he pleases, and would get the attention he needs from me. Chan would get the freedom he really wants and would still be loved. I would only be caring and cleaning up for one cat, and Zeppelin is far and away the cleanlier of the two. I just want some feedback on the idea. I think it'd be best for everyone, but I don't want Chan to feel betrayed, and I don't want Zep to worry over what happened to his "brother".

 

[ldg]

My initial response is that it's probably a good idea. I have one question though - what happens to Zep while you deliver Chandler?

 

[streambeck]

Well, I'd hopefully be able to find a friend responsible enough to give him his meds and feed him for a day or so (I wouldn't want to be gone long, and it'd definitely have to be air travel if the vet says Chan is up for it, I can't be gone for a week+). If that's just out of the question, I'd have to send Chan alone.

I'd be sending him to my cousin, who he used to live with, plus Chan is the most loving and adaptable cat I've ever met (Zeppy refuses anyone's love but mine, but Chandler? A robber could break into the apartment and murder me, and it'd be three minutes before Chan was rubbing up against him, purring). I would just feel really bad sending him alone. He'd eventually be fine, I just wouldn't want that to be, I don't know, how he remembers me? I just feel like I'd feel pretty guilty stuffing him in a box and shipping him off without making sure he's settled into the new place first.

 

[ldg]

No, sending an animal via air cargo is not ideal and is very stressful.

Unless you're VERY sure about the friend, you might want to look into boarding at the vet. Having him stay in your apartment is the least stressful, but having him boarded at the vet with some of his things and something like a sweaty t-shirt of yours may be better for his health re: meds.

The only thing I'd want to make VERY sure of is that the family member that's taking Chan understands all of his issues and is prepared to deal with them. It's hard to have a cat with a peeing problem. Now - being an alone kitty and being allowed outside may solve that issue.

As to breaking them up.... if they aren't using blankets or cat beds or something now, I'd put some out. That way things that smell like Chandler will be left behind (even though his scent is probably all over the apartment) - but more importantly, you can send Chandler with things that smell like Zep. That may help the transition.

I don't think there's any way to know in advance if they'll "grieve" for each other. But it sounds like Chandler, at least, will be busy enough.

Like I said - my gut on it from what information I have from this thread is that it's actually a good solution. It may turn out they've actually been adding to each other's stress with their very different needs.

 

[streambeck]

If the vet gives the thumbs up, I'll definitely disclose everything to my cousin. These issues, though, definitely stem from being an outdoor cat who isn't allowed to go outside. Chan could always pack away his food, but he didn't hog it completely when he had other things he wanted to do, and he definitely never made a mess. When I lived at home, Chan would hang around to eat, get loved on, nap, and sleep at night, but other than that he was totally independent and tore up the neighborhood. I remember, when I used to walk our dog, he would try and follow stealthily behind us, but whenever I turned around, he'd hide or pretend to be doing something else, it was really entertaining.

My cousin actually does have another cat, but Chan has never had problems with other pets (...at least pets he lives with) as long as he gets his fair share of love, and my cousin loves Chandler a lot (when I brought up the idea to her, she was actually bummed that I wasn't also considering sending Zeppy, she's been a big part of their lives, but not for the last several years).

 

[bastetservant]

If you have any doubts about your friend taking care of your cat while you are away, especially since it involves giving medicine, maybe you can find a cat sitter service who will do it. I have a wonderful service who visits for only $16 per visit. They feed, scoop, wash dishes and litter pans, play, and will give medicine. They also will take in mail and water plants. They are bonded and insured, and have been totally reliable every time I've used them. You can get e-mail updates or call to get reports. They leave a written report on everything every day they visit.

Or, some vets board cats. Mine does. Then you'll know he's taken care of. However, boarding is much more stressful for cats than staying home and having someone come in.

It sounds like you've found a solution that will be for the best. I know nothing about transporting cats via plane. But it sounds tough on them. I think I'd consult a vet regarding tranquilizers for the cat during the trip.

I have traveled across the country several times with cats in a car - Chicago to Montana and back. The cats were loose, which I know is not recommended, and not what I usually do when transporting them to the vet, but it worked with two different cats. They did fine.

Robin

 

[streambeck]

I appreciate the advice, and I might look into a service like that if I decide to visit my family on Christmas.

Unfortunately, Chan has a heart murmur. It's not causing him any discomfort or anything right now, but he shouldn't be traveling until we see if the meds have an effect, and if they do, I need to look into what's causing the issue (the only thing they could check before waiting for the meds to calm it was his thyroid, which isn't an issue). Even if he could travel, we have a lot of history with this vet and I trust them to take good care of him, this could potentially be a problem down the road if it's not looked into now.

So for the time being, it's gonna be the three of us I guess. Finding a system where Zeppy gets enough food is tough, but I'll make it work somehow. And the act of cleaning doesn't really bother me, it's just how frequently it's necessary. Got a third box and mat though, so that should help.

 

[streambeck]

The food situation is seriously becoming a problem that I don't know how to handle. Chandler just eats relentlessly, and no matter what time of day it is, how much he's already eaten, or even if he's asleep, if I go in the kitchen to give Zeppy something to eat, Chandler is right there, ready to finish the job when Zep is done. Zeppelin just isn't getting enough food, and I don't want to overfeed Chandler (beyond the fact that, even though my family is helping me out, I can't afford any more food for them than what I'm getting). I just can't think of a system where they both have their own food, and Chandler gets restless when he knows food is around that he can't get to.

Also, I don't understand Chan's peeing habits. I have three litter boxes, all of which I clean constantly (I pretty much clean each as soon as it's used), and he'll willingly pee in all of them, but he still pees in the corner, and he's always peeing on the mats. It just doesn't make sense to me, because he'll pee on a mat when the litter box is clean, but he'll later pee in a litter box without issue without any change in scenario. I mean, I can't think of how I could get him to stop peeing on the mats.

Beyond those things, I honestly think Chandler is sort of unhappy here, and I just can't think of anything I can do for him. It's also getting harder for me to keep my wits and not be frustrated with him. I mean, I understand intellectually that he's not doing any of this out of spite or anything, and that he doesn't understand he's doing something wrong, and that what he really needs right now is love and whatever comfort I can give him, and I do love him, but after nearly two months of living entirely in service to the cats and their needs, and there being no respite in sight, it's hard to keep the compassion flowing when I catch him peeing on a mat or when he's devouring all of the food.

Can you guys think of anything I can do? About the food, the peeing, and Chan's general boredom and unhappiness? I know it's one issue after another, but I just really wanna get to a place where the cats are happy, comfy, and creating as little mess as possible. I'd just like to worry less, I guess.

 

[nekoha]

I am just catching up on everything that has been going on with you, and I just have to say - kudos to you!! You are really great to be doing all of this for these cats, so don't ever forget it!
If/when you decide to fly Chandler to your cousin's, I definitely recommend taking him in-cabin. I just flew my two cats from the East Coast to Japan in-cabin and I wouldn't have done it any other way! My husband (who, by the way, never owned a pet before meeting me, had serious cat allergies, and was actually afraid of animals but is now a total pushover for our two) flew with one cat without a hitch. My flight out of my hometown was delayed more than 3 hours and I had to be switched to another airline with and extra layover. I can't imagine how sick and scared my Piccalo would have been if she had been stuck in the cargo hold - and if she would have even made it, as the heat was unbearable that day!
As for keeping Chandler entertained - I agree that his boredom is probably at least partly due to being forced to stay indoors. I can relate to the small space issue, so let me tell you what I have done for my cats.
1) Utilize horizontal space! I don't know what your landlord will allow by way of nails in the wall, etc, or what your budget is, but check out some wall furniture if you can. I just googled "cat wall furniture" and got quite a few hits. I have never lived in an apartment that allowed me to do that sort of stuff, so I used tall cat perches to give my cats more area to roam.
2) Also, do you have any good windows? My cats loved watching birds and squirrels in our old apartment. I have heard that some cats get frustrated if they can't chase the birds, though, so I am not sure if that is a great idea for your cats or not.
3) One of my cats also really enjoyed the cat videos that are available, but as someone pointed out on this forum, most people have nice TVs now and having a cat bat at a good screen might damage the screen (we had an ancient TV that nothing could damage!!)

4) Use Feliway diffusers. I know several other members have suggested it, and I think these are great. If possible, put it near where Chandler is inappropriately eliminating.
5) What toys do you use? Laser pointers, teaser toys, balls that dispense treats or kibble, and toys that make noise (crinkle bags, toys with rattles or bells inside) are all good, and the last two can keep your cats entertained when you aren't there. I try to spend 1 hour a day playing with my cats (not 1 hour straight, though!)

6) Get some cat grass and put some catnip on a scratch pad. These are just more things to add variety to their life.
I hope at least one of these helps!! You are seriously awesome and I hope you can get this situation worked out to be the best for all 3 of you!!

 

[bastetservant]

Sorry you are having so many stressful problems, still. Here are some thoughts that come to mind.

Have you read the threads regarding problem peeing? I've had little experience with this, but it seems a lot of people here are knowledgeable about it. I don't know how you are cleaning the mats that Chandler is peeing on, but it seems that if the smell isn't eradicated by the use of enzyme cleaners, the cat will continue to mark the places.
A black light, available at pet stores, will show the places he's marked.

Have you changed the cats' food to a higher quality one? Maybe Chandler is not getting the nutrients he needs and that is why he is constantly hungry. I would think this would be something to discuss with the vet. I know you said you had him all checked out by a vet. But if I had a cat obsessively eating, and it was getting good cat food, and it was peeing inappropriately, I'd go back to the vet, or get the opinion of another vet. But, I know this all costs money.

As far as entertaining your cats, they aren't so young, so I am unsure that they need so much stimulation. Do you play with them? Most of my cats, except for the 7 year old, like the most to play with a wand type toy with me - the kind with feathers at the end. I don't do this every day, and only for about 10 minutes when I do. The 7 year old, my oldest at the moment, won't play, but he likes to watch me play with the others. And he'll play with catnip mice. I keep ziplock bags of catnip with toys in it. Once a week I gather up the toys through the house and give out catnip refreshed ones. It's a ritual my cats seem to look forward to. They play with the "new" toys off and on all week. And they play with each other. They also watch birds. I have a bird feeder just for them. And that's all I do to entertain them. They have scratching posts, and a couple of window seats, but no cat trees. Some of my cats were strays, but none of them have been outside in 2-6 years. They seem to have adjusted well to being inside cats. They never try to get out the doors, so I don't think they miss the outdoors.

That's all I can suggest for now. You deserve a lot of credit for not throwing in the towel about all this. I hope you get some respite soon.

Robin

 

[bastetservant]

More thoughts. Why can't you shut Zep in a room, the bathroom maybe, when it is his feeding time? Then he could eat in peace without Chandler hovering. I do this with 2 of my cats, "the little girls, " so that my big, fat, food obsessed one doesn't eat their food, even though he hasn't finished his own. I lock them up for 20 minutes to an hour (if I forget). They don't mind. I only have to do this once a day, when they get their canned food meal.

Because of the age of your cats, and the possibility of dehydration, canned food, at least part of the time, may be something to consider. It may help with Chandler's constant eating. But again, high quality food brands are a better deal in the long run.

I also wonder about how much Chandler is peeing, as you describe it. It seems like a lot. Something else to make a vet aware of.

I hope your family fully realizes the extent of the effort you are making to care for these cats. If the funds needed now exceed what was originally agreed to, they need to understand that things have changed and you need more help - if that is the case. Older cats usually become more expensive because of their health problems. It happens to humans, too. Your family also needs to understand how stressful this is for you at this point. It's not just your responsibility to handle this situation.

Robin

 

[streambeck]

Well, at the plea of my family, and after asking a few of my neighbors if they would mind, I decided to let Chandler outside about a half hour ago. He seemed really timid at first, and it was sort of unsettling, but I hung out with him until he seemed a little more comfortable and curious, and then left him on his own. He's been strictly indoors for over a year now, so I'm a little worried, but he was always pretty street smart when he went outdoors, so I'm hoping for the best. I honestly wouldn't have done it had my family not insisted.

As for toys and stuff, Zeppy isn't really the playful type (and wasn't, even when he was younger). As long as he's fed, has a clean space to lay down, gets a little love, and a lot of space for cleaning himself and sleeping, he's totally fine. Hopefully going outside helps Chandler, but up until now, I would usually just play with him using catnip and string, and simple things. He used to love trying to swat my headphones away from me, but lately he just seems so down. Again, I'm kind of hoping that going outside works out and this will be the answer to his depression.

I don't know that I'd say he's peeing a whole lot (I would say he's pooing too much), but it's hard to say since I don't always see it happening. And honestly, I try to clean the mats, but the pee seeps through and it becomes a huge mess, and I just end up throwing them out, cleaning the floor rigorously, and replacing them. It doesn't stop him though. This, too, could potentially be fixed by him going outside (when I lived at home, Chandler wouldn't ever use the litter box or go anywhere in the house, he took care of everything outside).

And the problem with the food isn't that Zeppy doesn't have a chance to eat first. I'll always sit with Chandler while Zeppy eats. The problem is that Zeppy has always eaten a little bit at a time, and he would stretch that out until the next feeding. Now he'll get his little bit, and Chandler will finish everything. If I put food aside for Zeppy, Chan would always go nuts, knowing there was food he didn't have access to.

As for whether or not my family is aware of the strain this all puts on me, I don't honestly have a comfortable way of telling them. In the past I wasn't exactly the most responsible or respectful person, and my family has had to jump through hoops for me in the past when they didn't need to. Add to that the fact that these cats briefly stayed with my sister, and she faced similar issues to mine, but instead of making an active effort to remedy the problem, she complained endlessly to my family, and constantly threatened to euthanize the cats, just because they were a burden on her. If I said anything that registered as a complaint, it would be immediately perceived as me channeling her. I'm not saying I'm taking care of the cats just to make amends, I do care about them, but I'm kind of backed into a corner because of the way my sister acted and because of my own actions in the past. So my family really has no way of knowing my situation.

I'll keep you guys posted on how Chan's adventures outside go, and if everything works out. Thanks again for all of the advice.

 

[carolina]

When you say he went outside, what do you mean by that? do you mean you are going to make him an outside cat? Or you are going to let him go outside supervised? Is he going to be inside outside? Is this inside cat all of the sudden going to be put to live outside for good? Is that what what you mean?

 

[streambeck]

He was an outdoor cat for the majority of his life. I'm gonna let him go outside now. He's still going to live, eat, and sleep here, but if he wants out, I'll let him out now. He knows how to handle himself and how to find his way back (so far, he's been out about three brief times, and knew to come back when he wanted in).

 

[streambeck]

Well, there's practically a litter of, I'm assuming, stray cats waiting outside my door for a crack at Chan, so... no more going outside for him.