Sneezing/runny eyes after FVRCP?

[jaupuc]

Hi, 

I've searched around and haven't found anything too similar to my situation, so I figured I would join and start my own thread. 

Around February we took in a stray that we later found out was pregnant, and she had a litter of 6 kittens about a month later. The kittens are now almost 5 months old and only 2 have been given away. We took in 2 of them (mom & a boy) to get spayed/neutered last week, as well as get their rabies shot & FVRCP vaccine. A few days ago we started to notice the kitten sneezing pretty often, but I read online that sneezing can occur after a distemper vaccine so I didn't think much of it. Last night I started noticing that the kitten that has the sneezing problem also has 1 runny eye - no color to the fluid, just clear. The mother cat is also sneezing and has slightly watery eyes, but I wouldn't say hers is as bad as the kitten.

I'm having trouble figuring out what this could be. Correct me if I'm wrong, but shouldnt the FVRCP vaccine prevent URIs where these symptoms would most commonly show up? I called the place that did the surgeries & vaccines and am now waiting for a call back from the vet there; they said it was not normal. These 2 cats have also not been separated from the other 3 kittens and the other kittens haven't shown any similar symptoms, which makes me think whatever it is they have isn't spreading. It's been 9 days since they've had the vaccine, so any sneezing that would have resulted from that should have come & gone by now. 

The kittens have never been outside; the mom must have lived outside until we brought her in (she looks no older than a year and a half).

Basically what I'm asking is.. Where are these problems coming from if they both got the vaccine that is supposed to prevent things like this? Thank you for any help.

 

[stephenq]

 
Hi, 

I've searched around and haven't found anything too similar to my situation, so I figured I would join and start my own thread. 

Around February we took in a stray that we later found out was pregnant, and she had a litter of 6 kittens about a month later. The kittens are now almost 5 months old and only 2 have been given away. We took in 2 of them (mom & a boy) to get spayed/neutered last week, as well as get their rabies shot & FVRCP vaccine. A few days ago we started to notice the kitten sneezing pretty often, but I read online that sneezing can occur after a distemper vaccine so I didn't think much of it. Last night I started noticing that the kitten that has the sneezing problem also has 1 runny eye - no color to the fluid, just clear. The mother cat is also sneezing and has slightly watery eyes, but I wouldn't say hers is as bad as the kitten.

I'm having trouble figuring out what this could be. Correct me if I'm wrong, but shouldnt the FVRCP vaccine prevent URIs where these symptoms would most commonly show up? I called the place that did the surgeries & vaccines and am now waiting for a call back from the vet there; they said it was not normal. These 2 cats have also not been separated from the other 3 kittens and the other kittens haven't shown any similar symptoms, which makes me think whatever it is they have isn't spreading. It's been 9 days since they've had the vaccine, so any sneezing that would have resulted from that should have come & gone by now. 

The kittens have never been outside; the mom must have lived outside until we brought her in (she looks no older than a year and a half).

Basically what I'm asking is.. Where are these problems coming from if they both got the vaccine that is supposed to prevent things like this? Thank you for any help.

The FVRCP will help prevent an Upper respiratory but it won't always prevent it entirely, and on top of that your cats could easily have been exposed just prior to getting the vaccine and before they got any of the protection. So they should be treated as if they have a standard URI with standard treatments via a vet.

 

[jaupuc]

 
The FVRCP will help prevent an Upper respiratory but it won't always prevent it entirely, and on top of that your cats could easily have been exposed just prior to getting the vaccine and before they got any of the protection. So they should be treated as if they have a standard URI with standard treatments via a vet.

Thank you for the quick response. Do cats start showing symptoms immediately after contracting the infection? Because I would assume it would have already spread to the other 3 kittens but none of them have shown any symptoms. I will isolate the 2 cats just in case.

I thought maybe they could have caught something at the spay/neuter facility or even at home, but I'm just skeptical that both cats that happened to get the vaccine already are the ones who are sick now. Could it be a reaction to the vaccine? I think I read somewhere that cats with herpes will react badly to FVRCP vaccines, could this be the root? Momma cat has never been tested for anything, but I'm sure it's very possible she could have something seeing that she lived outside her whole life.

 

[jaupuc]

Vet said let it run it's course & I have the 2 separated from the other 3, although I have a bad feeling the rest are going to get it too since it seems to spread pretty easily and they've been together since it all started. I put them in a steamy bathroom for ~15 minutes to clear out their nasal passages & then they seemed more interested in their food.

She also stated I could give saline drops in their noses. Has anyone done this? Does it help & how much should I give?

One last thing - The fluid coming from the kittens eye is clear, which the vet (and some other internet sources) said is a good sign it isn't anything serious. However, I left him for a while without cleaning his eyes off & some of it gunked up near his eye and looked a yellowish color (think eye boogers). Did it only turn yellow because it had been sitting and dried up? I was told if the liquid had color then I should be more concerned.

Sorry for all the questions, I'm just kind of worried.

 

[stephenq]

 

First, cats get URI's all the time in many ways sometimes quickly, sometimes simultaneously but they don't get it from the vaccine.  There is a killed version and a live version and even the live version doesnt cause a URI although in cats who aren't healthy it can make them worse in theory.

But I don't agree with letting cat URI's run their course unless its a super mild case that is already basically over.  I work in shelter medicine where we see a lot of URI's and it is not standard practice to ignore them. Standard practice is to give antibiotics to prevent a more serious bacterial infection in the lungs, eye meds to prevent the eyes from getting worse and in some cases forming scar tissue, as well as supportive therapies like nutritional support, nose drops (saline) etc.

Gooey eyes can mean bacterial complications, watery eyes can mean viral, neither should be ignored imo.  Saline drops (Little Noses at a pharmacy) applied 1-2 drops per nostril 2-3 times a day can help, a steam bath can help, making sure they continue eating is very important.

I am not there and so I can't comment exactly on your vet's advice, but I have never seen a cat or kitten with an active cold (sneezing, nasal and/or eye discharge) that wasn't treated.

 

[jodig]

A very similar situation happened to me when I had a feral that lives in my backyard spayed at a clinic. A few

days after she came home while she was recovering in my bathroom, she came down

with a bad URI (sneezing, very bad drooling, congestion). She was also vaccinated during her time at the clinic.

It is my belief that she contracted the URI prior to being vaccinated. I honestly wish they would vaccinate

upon arrival at the clinic as she was there for about 5 or so days before she was spayed/vaccinated.

She subsequently infected 3 out of 4 of my other cats (who were vaccinated but hadn't received boosters in quite a few years).

And the kicker is they all came down with the sickness, like in a chain. First it was Peanut, then after Peanut started showing

signs of recovery, Bronte started sneezing, then a few days later it was Carly and Audrey. (Yes, I have a lot of cats! and that's

not including one who miraculously never got sick!)

There are a lot of good threads on here that helped me during that time.  Things you can do to help them is try

heating some wet food in the microwave to encourage eating, wipe their eyes and noses and just generally

comfort them. Some members here swear by L Lysine supplements that  you can buy at the grocery store in

the vitamin section and crush in their food. My vet also said it was good and safe when I mentioned it to him. 

And while I'm not entirely sure that it worked in my situation, it definitely is worth a shot and made me feel like

I was actively doing something to help them feel better.

The good news I have for you is that it will be over soon but I'm not gonna lie it was a stressful 2 weeks for me.

All of my cats recovered in about a weeks time though that included a vet visit for all them (It was a crazy 2 weeks indeed!)

If you don't notice them getting better, I would suggest a visit to the vet for a possible shot of antibiotics.

Our vet also gave us eye drops but from reading here people just use Little Noses that you can buy

over the counter.

I will send good vibes your way hoping the other kitties in the house do not become infected.

ETA: To answer one of your questions above about if cats start showing symptoms immediately after infection, I would say not necessarily. Incubation

period is something like 2-10 days I believe.

 

[jaupuc]

 
A very similar situation happened to me when I had a feral that lives in my backyard spayed at a clinic. A few

days after she came home while she was recovering in my bathroom, she came down

with a bad URI (sneezing, very bad drooling, congestion). She was also vaccinated during her time at the clinic.

It is my belief that she contracted the URI prior to being vaccinated. I honestly wish they would vaccinate

upon arrival at the clinic as she was there for about 5 or so days before she was spayed/vaccinated.

She subsequently infected 3 out of 4 of my other cats (who were vaccinated but hadn't received boosters in quite a few years).

And the kicker is they all came down with the sickness, like in a chain. First it was Peanut, then after Peanut started showing

signs of recovery, Bronte started sneezing, then a few days later it was Carly and Audrey. (Yes, I have a lot of cats! and that's

not including one who miraculously never got sick!)

There are a lot of good threads on here that helped me during that time.  Things you can do to help them is try

heating some wet food in the microwave to encourage eating, wipe their eyes and noses and just generally

comfort them. Some members here swear by L Lysine supplements that  you can buy at the grocery store in

the vitamin section and crush in their food. My vet also said it was good and safe when I mentioned it to him. 

And while I'm not entirely sure that it worked in my situation, it definitely is worth a shot and made me feel like

I was actively doing something to help them feel better.

The good news I have for you is that it will be over soon but I'm not gonna lie it was a stressful 2 weeks for me.

All of my cats recovered in about a weeks time though that included a vet visit for all them (It was a crazy 2 weeks indeed!)

If you don't notice them getting better, I would suggest a visit to the vet for a possible shot of antibiotics.

Our vet also gave us eye drops but from reading here people just use Little Noses that you can buy

over the counter.

I will send good vibes your way hoping the other kitties in the house do not become infected.

ETA: To answer one of your questions above about if cats start showing symptoms immediately after infection, I would say not necessarily. Incubation

period is something like 2-10 days I believe.

I have a feeling the other kitties will get it too since I didn't catch it all that quickly, but at least I will be more prepared this time thanks to your guys' help. I think butters (the kitten) has been through the worst of it now, he seems to be getting better. Momma cat is having her worst day so far today & hopefully tomorrow she will be doing better. Had them both eat some wet food today, but Momma stopped eating after a few bites. Going to try again tonight heated up and get that Lysine stuff tomorrow while i'm out.

Tried giving them saline drops, they were NOT gonna have that. Not even sure if it made it down their nose before they shot it back out. 

 

[jaupuc]

Just had to feed momma through a syringe, she didn't even want heated up wet food. She was having a really bad time with it, so I stopped after only ~15ml of watered down wet food (I know, that's practically nothing). I'm just hoping she'll have a better appetite tomorrow so we don't have to go through this again. I gave her about an oz of water through the syringe as well, because I don't think she's drinking (it's hard to tell since she's drinking from the same bowl as butters) - just to be safe. Butters seems to be doing a lot better now; eating & drinking great and purring, not nearly as much sneezing - he seems to be happier now.

 

[jaupuc]

Bad news - Butters has gotten a bit sicker rather than better as I thought the other day, and is not eating either. Feeding 2 cats by hand has been lots of fun! 

 Also noticed today the other 3 kittens are all sneezing 

 I guess I'm in for a stressful couple of weeks ahead.

1 more question though: Since I'm assuming Momma and Butters will be better in due time, I'm going to guess the other 3 will still be sick. Will I still need to keep the 2 groups separated from each other? In other words, since the 2 first cats will be over the sickness, will being around the other 3 while they're sick bring their symptoms back? Asking this because the cats meow at each other through the walls and it's driving me nuts!!

 

[stephanietx]

I have one cat who can't have the FVRCP shot because she gets a serious URI after it every. single. time. 

Since they are all showing symptoms of URIs, I wouldn't worry about separating them.  It will be less stressful for all of you.  I would also call the vet in the morning and explain that their situation has deteriorated and that you're syringe feeding them and ask for an antibiotic for both the mom and the baby.  It's possible that the others won't need anything, but you're keeping a close eye on them so that if they start to get worse, you'll know right away.  You can steam them in the bathroom to help loosen up the congestion.  Get the bathroom good and steamy and then sit in there with them until the steam dissipates.  If you use saline drops, get Little Noses.  You can do 1-2 drops in each nostrils a couple of times a day.  Continue syringe feeding them about 4 or 5 times a day.  It's important that you get nutrition and water in them or you'll have other issues to deal with.

 

[jodig]

In my experience once the cats got over their illness, they did not reinfect each other because that was a concern of mine as well.

 

[stephenq]

I agree with JodiG, once they are over it they should have immunity for a time.

 

[jaupuc]

Thanks for all the replies. I have been doing the steam thing once or twice a day, but that doesn't clear them up enough to where they want to eat. They are both about 7 pounds. I've been giving them each 40-45cc of wet food with 500mg of lysine mixed in three times a day, once in the morning, afternoon and in the evening. This is enough food, correct? I don't have any other times I can feed them, my days have been hectic lately and it takes at least 30 minutes to get them both fed each time.

The other 3 kittens were supposed to go get spayed today, but I rescheduled because I didn't want them to spread the virus to other cats at the facility; Now scheduled 3rd of October. My only worry is that, assuming they'll be better by then, they'll get sick again because of the stress being in an unfamiliar place when they get spayed. I've started sprinkling lysine in their food as well, so hopefully they won't get as sick as boots and butters are (I hope that's an accurate assumption). 

It is normal for them to decrease activity when they're sick like this, correct? Because boots spends most of her time in a corner of the guest room closet, on a pile of old clothes. She still has energy, which is very evident when she decides she wants to stop being fed and tries to wiggle her way out. 

Boots.jpg

• jaupuc
• Sep 15, 2014

And here's Butters:

2014-07-29_1406648285.jpg

• jaupuc
• Sep 15, 2014

 

[stephenq]

Also it wouldn't be appropriate to put them under anesthesia while they are ill.  And they look super cute!

 

[stephanietx]

They will have decreased energy when sick.  Just like when you don't feel well and don't want to do anything, neither do they.  Keep a close eye on them and if you notice any deterioration in their health, get them to the vet immediately.  Also, no surgery until they are well, if that was a question.

 

[jaupuc]

I was also thinking that. But I'm also not quite sure they are really "sick" yet - no real symptoms other than the occasional sneeze as of right now, so I figured they were well enough to go - I just know the virus can spread easily and don't want to put anyone or their cat through this too. I still have them separated from each other in case for some reason the other kitties are able to get over it quickly without any fuss (I know, wishful thinking). I can live with the talking through the walls for a while 

. 

Not sure the Lysine is doing much, but I read that it could take up to 6 weeks to take any sort of effect? So I'm not necessarily expecting a miracle anyway. 

I won't hesitate to take them to the vet if I notice a decrease in health, but for now I'd rather not put them through the stress of the vet trip if they can recover at home. 

 Not to mention the cost. If they aren't showing any signs of improvement by tomorrow afternoon or so, I will call up the vet and see if they can get some antibiotics.

 

[jaupuc]

Took the cats to the vet today. They were given fluids, antibiotics, and nose/eye drops. She wanted them to stay overnight to have some additional work done (xrays, blood tests, & nebulizor therapy - but at almost $1,000 a cat I couldn't afford it. At the end, I paid around $150 for each cat and came back with additional antibiotics (Azithromycin), more eye/ear drops, and Mirtazapine (an anti-depressant that helps with appetite).

I fully regret giving them the mirtazapine. It's only been an hour since I gave it to them and they're already acting weird. I hadn't researched it until after I gave it to them or I would have never given it to them at all. I went downstairs and butters was standing on the litter box lid, and didnt run up to me like usual. Then he just stood by me staring straight ahead and just seemed very out of it, also seemed kind of wobbly (seems to be a common side effect). Boots, meanwhile, was hiding in her carrier like she was scared of something. Is there anything I can do to get this out of their system faster? I feel so bad for giving it to them.

Update: It's been about 3 hours and neither one of them still has an appetite. I feel awful, like I drugged them up for no benefit. Boots actually ate a little bit earlier when we got back from the vet, but over the course of the day she got less interested in food again. I gave them the Mirtazapine so they would get their appetites back, but nothing but bad has come from it. I'm about to throw the remaining pills out, it makes me upset to even see them.

 

[jaupuc]

Another update, I had to syringe feed them again this morning because they still didn't have an appetite from that crap drug i gave them. I noticed they were much more easily agitated and aggressive as well. Butters attacked me in the middle of feeding, bit my finger and drew blood! Was only able to give him about 38-40ml of food, and about 5 or 6ml of water after I gave him his antibiotics. With boots I managed to give her about 45-48ml of food until she finally had a real fit. Then, I snuck about 7 or 8ml of water in her mouth to hydrate her a bit more and get the nasty taste out of her mouth from the antibiotic. After I gave her the water, I set out a cup of canned food and she started eating it! I haven't been back home yet to see if she finished it but I am hopeful. 

The vet said boots seemed less sick than butters, which could explain why she's more willing to eat. She said his may have traveled to lower respiratory as well, but I wasn't given a definite answer because I declined the x-ray. She said the antibiotics would still help him the same way it would help a URI. 

I have noticed a lot of improvement in their eyes since giving the drops twice a day, but their noses still sound pretty stuffy. Not really able to tell if it's even making it into their nose because they tug away so fast once they feel it touch. Times like these I wish they could understand me so I could explain why I'm torturing them! 

 

[jodig]

I so sympathize with you! How are the babies feeling today?

 

[jaupuc]

Boots and Butters are feeling a lot better today. I no longer have to syringe feed Boots as she is eating and drinking well on her own. Butters clearly feels a lot better but still doesn't quite have an appetite, so he is still being fed by me. Bad news is, 2 of the other kittens are no longer eating on their own, so they are now being syringe fed and given the same antibiotics as Boots & butters. Somehow, the last kitten still hasn't shown any symptoms of sickness at all. I'm not sure how because she's always around the others. Should I give her some antibiotic even though she's not showing any symptoms, as more of a preventative measure? Or would that be bad for her if there is nothing for the antibiotic to fight?