Should I seperate?

[twinsen]

Zoe is now officially out of her heat... she is back to her old "crazy cat who won't stop trying to catch flying bugs jumping to the lamps and hitting kenzo all the time" self.

And I guess we can start counting... OH MY GOD I'M SO EXCITED!

 

[brightlightrbs]

Originally Posted by Twinsen

And I guess we can start counting... OH MY GOD I'M SO EXCITED!

Hello Twinsen -

prepare yourself. The next 60 to 65 or so days will be the longest days of your life. LOLOLOLOLOL

I am so excited too. Can't wait to see my grandbabies

Mommy of Zoe and Kenzo
Rena Kalina
Brightlight Cattery
www.geocities.com/brightlightrusblu
http://photos.yahoo.com/renakalina

 

[celestialrags]

Originally Posted by SolarityBengals

I wonder how long it can take before a second ovulation occurs, maybe a week or more?

I really do think celestialrags just experienced this. The first kitten came with very little hair on the body, appeared heavily premature. Then the rest of the litter came full-size and healthy.

I don't think leaving them together for less than a week would be a problem, and most likely the female is out of heat by then anyway. But any longer I would worry about a second ovulation.

I agree, I have a male that doesn't spray and they were not seperated. I feel because of this my queen expirienced two different ovalations resulting in the premeture kitten.
I think it is done differently by breeders, but for now on I think I will allow supervised matings in a breeding cage for a couple days up to mabey 5 or some thing. If it doesn't take, then I will just try again next cycle, kitens a month later then planned is less stressful then this premeture kitten expirience Ice and I just expirienced.

This is a link to the little preme, he never took a breath so he is NOT alive in the picture, I don't want any one to see it that doesn't want to, so I will put the link. The picture isn't very clear and you can't see how transparent it was, but you can see how tiny she was. weight: 37.4? grams (it was under 40, the others were 81.7-102 grams or so. so it was about half the size of the rest.
[img=http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/8287/danteandnacho0144gc.th.jpg]

This is the next born:
[img=http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/8673/danteandnacho0168vh.th.jpg]

 

[gayef]

Originally Posted by FamilytimeRags

I appreciate everyone's opinion. I find this topic very interesting.

Me too!

This is the statement that I found interesting by a very well known vet ...

"....We know a lot about feline reproductive physiology since
domestic cats are used as models to study ways to assist reproduction
in endangered feline species. There is a wealth of up to date
information on feline reproductive physiology in journals like
Biology of Reproduction and Theriogenology.

I can assure you that queens ovulate only once during a cycle, and
all eggs are fertilized within about 24 hours. It makes no sense for
a queen to have a litter where the kittens are different gestational
ages - it would lead to even higher kitten mortality rates than cats
already experience......"

Then how does one explain the fact of superfetation in cats? It does happen and is documented in cats. I have a lot of articles regarding Feline Reproduction and Theriogenology (my current vet is a theriogenologist) but most of them are extremely clinical. This one is not ~as~ clinical - there is a paragraph under the graph chart of The Feline Estrus Cycle that spells it out pretty clearly.

http://www.felinevetclinic.com/articles/repro.pdf

I have enjoyed the responses we have had.

As have I ... it is my hope to continue having these sorts of discussions here in this Forum. We all possess valuable knowledge and can share that information with the other breeders here - I sincerely hope we all can continue to contribute in this way.

I look forward to more in this discussion.

 

[goldenkitty45]

In controlled breedings you should not have 2 different fathers - that would only happen in random breedings of outside cats (strays).

My question to those that keep the pair together and let them mate a long time (over a period of days) WHY? If you witness several successful breedings, then why in the world would you want them to continue mating?

You might not have had it happen in the past (with premature kittens) but it could happen in the future - why take the chance?

I'd be willing to bet that if the pair were allowed free run of the entire house and not caged together for a week, she would let him breed a few times and be done with it. By confining them to a cage, all they do is mate. IMO its not necessary to let them continue breeding after 2-3 days at the most.

 

[kai bengals]

Originally Posted by GoldenKitty45

In controlled breedings you should not have 2 different fathers - that would only happen in random breedings of outside cats (strays).

My question to those that keep the pair together and let them mate a long time (over a period of days) WHY? If you witness several successful breedings, then why in the world would you want them to continue mating?

You might not have had it happen in the past (with premature kittens) but it could happen in the future - why take the chance?

I'd be willing to bet that if the pair were allowed free run of the entire house and not caged together for a week, she would let him breed a few times and be done with it. By confining them to a cage, all they do is mate. IMO its not necessary to let them continue breeding after 2-3 days at the most.

I can see your point if a cage were used. Do breeders actually cage their cats for mating? That's unacceptable to me.
Our studs are housed in their own 180 sq foot rooms. When we place the female in with the stud, she has ample room and opportunity to get away from him if she needs to. Maybe this is why the week together period works for us and doesn't cause problems.

 

[celestialrags]

Originally Posted by GoldenKitty45

In controlled breedings you should not have 2 different fathers - that would only happen in random breedings of outside cats (strays).

My question to those that keep the pair together and let them mate a long time (over a period of days) WHY? If you witness several successful breedings, then why in the world would you want them to continue mating?

You might not have had it happen in the past (with premature kittens) but it could happen in the future - why take the chance?

I'd be willing to bet that if the pair were allowed free run of the entire house and not caged together for a week, she would let him breed a few times and be done with it. By confining them to a cage, all they do is mate. IMO its not necessary to let them continue breeding after 2-3 days at the most.

My cats are free to roam in the entire house and I never really seen them mate. But, they were allowed to mate for as long as they wanted to and I had the problem with the premeture kitten, wether it was due to them not being seperated sooner, or not, I don't know. I don't think you are directing your question to me, just breeders in general, but I didn't leave them in a cage for a week to breed, they are loose and just did their thing. In the past, Ice went to a stud, and she was kept there with the male until she came out of heat, so it was right around for a week she was there and there wasnt any problems then. Sucessful mating isn't nec. sucessful breeding, If i'm going to put my cat through the hastle of having a male all over, i'm going to let them be for a few days and BE sure the mating took. rather then have them be together for 2 days and then shortly later come into heat again and haveto breed again, i'm just going to let them breed for a little longer and have a better chance. The next time I do breed they will be doing it in a cage and then be seperated after a couple days, just incase being free to breed caused the problem with the premeture kitten.

 

[goldenkitty45]

Yes most breeders with males will have the pair in a very large cage - not free roaming. Each male has a separate pen (some large like a room, some a very large cage. That way you can put a female with one male and another with a different male and keep them from breeding to a different cat.

If you have witnessed several successful breedings (over 2-3 days) then it really is not necessary to continue to let them mate over and over.

My question was in general to the breeders who feel they must keep the pair together until she is out of heat.