Older male cat/new male kittens dominance issue?

[michmt]

Hi everyone, this is my first post here.

I'm actually posting this question for a friend of mine who is having a very strange problem with her cats. She has two older cats in her home, a male and female, both fixed. She acquired (by accident) two males kittens (approximately eight weeks old) that she's trying to find a home for, but in the meantime she's keeping them at her house. She has tried to slowly introduce the kittens to the other two cats. The female cat basically ignores them, but the male cat will pin one kitten to the floor by the scruff of his neck and won't let go. If my friend separates them, then he goes after the other male kitten and does the same thing, and he alternates between the two kittens. He won't stop doing it, and she basically has to keep them in separate rooms, but then the male cat will sit outside the door of the bedroom that the kittens are in and cries for them to be let out. She said the male cat is not biting hard at all; he just keeps them pinned to the floor and won't let them up. I told her it's probably a dominance issue, but how long should that be going on? She's afraid to let the kittens out of her sight for any amount of time because she's not sure what the older cat will do.

Does anyone have any idea of why he's doing this, how to fix it, or how long it might take for the older cat to relax his "grip" on the kittens?

Thanks! Your input is much appreciated!

 

[epona]

This is exactly what Radar and Sonic were like, Radar would pin Sonic down and chase him around incessantly, but not actually hurt him. It's part play-fight, and part a show of dominance. Separating when your friend can't be there to supervise is the best thing to do; although the older cat crying at the door between them rather than hissing and growling shows that to him it's fun rather than aggression (does he roll around on his back whining pitifully, chirping, purring, and pawing at the door too?) there is always a risk with the size difference that he could inadvertantly hurt the kitten.

Now you will want to know how Radar and Sonic are now, 5 months on. Well, they are still at it! Sonic is nearly the same size as Radar now, and the dynamics have changed - Radar mostly wants to play and acts quite submissive but is still top cat, so Sonic takes it much more seriously and challenges Radar by choosing a higher place to sit and staring at him, to see if Radar will try to usurp him from his perch. There is a lot of splatting, pinning each other down (although when Radar pins Sonic it is a mixture of play-biting and licking!), rolling around like a big ball of cat, and from Sonic the 'come and try it' stare, but no blood has been shed, no growling, and the only hissing is from Sonic when he has had enough. Radar lets Sonic eat his food and will only pin him down again when Sonic has walked away from the bowl. They aren't doing proper fighting or aggression, and I know that in time they will sort out who is in charge, although we still separate them when we're not around as they don't let each other sleep and aren't happy to curl up together yet. Throwing toy mice for them when they are together helps to distract them for a while.

It can be a lengthy process! But all that you describe sounds quite normal, and not a bad reaction as such.

Oh I forgot to say welcome to TCS!

 

[beandip]

I agree with Epona. I observed the same things between Beandip and Junior, when Junior was a kitten. Junior screeeeaaamed a lot when they "played" but that's really what it was (play). He did the jaw-hold on the neck move, too. Interestingly enough, when we added 4 girl kittens (at once), he was a bit gentler with them but did teach them a thing or 2 on "proper" playing...i.e. when it's OK to bite, how hard, claw retraction, etc. He hasn't hurt a kitten yet. I would separate them when there's no supervision, but other than that I would let them interact.

 

[michmt]

Thanks, you two. I gave my friend the link to this thread so she could read the answers for herself. Hopefully, this issue will resolve in time.

 

[urbantigers]

Exactly the same with Jaffa and Mosi. Mosi is now 18 months and they're still at it!

 

[strange_wings]

Sho does this to Tomas too, though this is usually when Tomas crosses the line and is pushing Sho (harassing Sho while he's trying to sleep). He'll pin Tomas but has never hurt him, and honestly Tomas does settle down afterwards.

Sometimes Sho will hold him for quite a while and I'll tell him to let Tomas go, surprisingly, he always listens.

I wouldn't let an adult male cat do that to a tiny 8 week old though, that would make me much too nervous.