Not sure what to do

[acatnamedpete]

My stray cat that I've had for almost 1 1/2 years is sick. They believe he has cancer- some type of lymphoma. he is an old cat they estimate around 14-16 yrs.

1 week ago I noticed his behavior changing. Didn't wake me up in morning, didn't sleep in his normal spot. Then on Thurs we noticed his side was distended and very hard. Too him into the vet Fri morning and they took some fluid from his abdomen to send off for results. By Sat he was much worse, listless, still, not moving. Still managed to eat though

No fever. took him to the ER vet. They rehydrated him, gave him IV antibiotics, and removed a half of liter of fluid from his abdomen.

We brought him home yesterday(Mon morn) and he seems better, looks better. He's still old and fragile and the lump on his side is still there.

The question is this. What do I do? We discussed our options with the vet which include doing exploratory surgery to find out exactly what kind of tumors and what organs are being affected. Then we would do chemotherapy.

I'm 50/50 as far as this goes. I want him to live and be happy and pain fee and enjoy the rest of his life. Will surgery be the best thing for him to do? Will it make more pain for him? Do cats recover well from exploratory surgery?
What if the type of cancer is totally treatable and the this is the best thing for him?

I have him scheduled for surgery on Mon but I'm afraid since he is so old, am I causing him more pain? I have never been in this situation before--I dont want him to be in pain.

The other option is to do nothing and just keep draining fluid from his abdomen periodically.

Any advice? I could really use it. Thanks in advance.

 

[mews2much]

I would go with the surgery because then you will know what you are dealing with.
I did that with Stripe when she had a breast tumor.
It did have cancer in it but the surgery saved her.
It is worth a try with your cat.
I lost Stripe to CRF 7 years later.

 

[acatnamedpete]

Thank you for the reply.

Do you think his age increases his risk of not healing properly? That is one of my concerns.

The other is, does chemo have the same affect as it does in humans, ie;, does it make them sick? he would have to do it every 4 weeks.

 

[mews2much]

My friends cats have had chemo.
It depends on the cat.
Some cats do get real sick from it.
What does the vet say about the risk of the surgery?

 

[acatnamedpete]

She said as with any surgery there's always a risk. I asked her if she felt he was too sick to operate and she said he was as viable as any other cat in his situation she would do surgery on.

 

[darlili]

I really think most vets won't operate unless they think there's a reasonable chance of a better quality of life afterwards. And I have read that many cats can cope with chemo much better than humans do.

I have a friend whose cat had chemo - didn't seem to bother him much, and he lived for another three years, quite active, eating well, etc. In that case worth it, but you can't know unless you take a chance.

But there's always a risk in any sort of treatment - even a dental cleaning. But know that your decision, whichever it is, will be based on the love you have for your cat, so try not to second-guess yourself.

Prayers for your both.

 

[bunnelina]

Hello, I'm so sorry you're going through this with your guy. I have an idea of what you're going through, and I can see from your message that your priorities are right where they should be: doing what's best for your cat, and not causing unnecessary pain.

I lost a cat to lymphoma in the fall, age 15. A problem was spotted on routine tests, and she had lost weight, but no other symptoms. We were given three diagnostic options: exploratory surgery, exploratory endoscopy, and "no surgery but treat with steroids."

We chose endoscopy: it is not nearly as invasive as an incision. I didn't want my already-fragile cat to face recovery from an incision, etc. Your vet's answer about your cat's chances strikes me as a little evasive. I would press for a more detailed assessment of what his recovery might be like, given that he's already pretty sick (ascites, or fluid build-up is not a good sign). You might also ask her about endoscopy, keeping in mind that not all vets can do it and thus may not suggest it.

My cat's endoscopy showed intestinal lymphoma, which sometimes responds to chemo. We treated it for a couple of months with chemo every other day, steroids, and other meds (anti-nausea, etc.) in hopes of remission. Didn't work. It usually doesn't although some in rare cases it can buy a cat a couple of decent years.

Chemo can cause nausea, vomiting, and diarrhea in cats; your vet should have told you that. My cat seemed to feel quite ill for a few hours afterward. But not all cats will have side effects. Some cats seem fine during and afterward.

Our cat was always hungry from the steroids, and I mistook her drug-induced interest in food for decent quality of life. As I look back, I see she was probably in pain from the lymphoma plus nausea and discomfort from chemo. We continued treatment because my vet seemed so hopeful. In our hearts, we knew it wasn't working and our cat seemed miserable. Eventually she developed a severe URI, heart failure, and seizures. We put her to sleep 2 months after her diagnosis.

I wish I had known then about subtle signs of pain that cats try never to reveal to us... cats instinctively try to hide their pain. Here's one source of info. If I had known all this, I would have seen that treatment wasn't worth the toll it was taking, especially at age 15.

So my advice to you is to focus strictly on your cat's well-being, pain signals, and quality of life right now, as opposed to your vet's long-term plans and goals for diagnosis and treatment. I can tell you are already determined to do what is best for your cat, which is brave, kind, and wise.

Ask your vet for an honest assessment of your cat's chances for long-term survival or a cure (and also how bad his recovery from surgery may be). Ask about how much more time medications like steroids and procedures like fluid-draining may give him. And then pay close attention to how your cat is acting, day to day. If you see that his behavior is unusually listless and subdued, and he's not interested in his old fun habits... your heart will tell you when it is time to do the merciful thing.

Make a list of our cat's favorite activities in the past, and then a list of how many of these your cat is enjoying now. That exercise ultimately told us a great deal, and it may enlighten you, too.

I really, really hope your cat will have a better outcome than ours. Thanks for reading my long post. In your heart, you'll know what's best for your cat. And keep in mind that you'll find a world of support, wisdom, sympathy, and understanding right here. Lots of us have been in the same place, and we somehow all got through it.

 

[the_food_lady]

Am very sorry that you and your dear kitty are faced with this

As for old cats having surgery, just wanted to briefly share my experience. My old boy Taco (was 14 at the time) had surgery to remove a large marble sized (hard) mass on his right shoulder blade. He was a big boy at 18 lbs, diabetic as well (though well controlled on twice daily insulin). The tumor turned out to be malignant and a very aggressive type. He had a major incision and he healed wonderfully; was up and about searching for food and trying to get the lid off of the can of treats the next day :-) I was so hopeful that they'd gotten "all" of the mass and that there were no residual cancer cells. Sadly, almost 4 months to the day of the first surgery, I found a new lump in the general vicinity. I kind of begged my Vet to try one more time and this time to take larger margins, be reallllly aggressive with removal. He agreed. He removed the equivalent of 2 golf ball sized amounts of tissue/mass and muscle. He went deep into the muscle. Taco had a super huge incision but he healed very very well, didn't even seem to be in pain. Sadly, 3 months later masses returned and I didn't wish to put him through further surgery and I didn't feel that chemo was a viable option as he had moderate kidney failure and that would have been total toast on his kidneys. through it all he was his usual self. Healed super well, even being diabetic.

Here's a couple of videos I put onto YouTube, taken just a couple of days after his second major surgery; and as you can see, big incision, still has the drain in.....but it surely didn't slow him down:

VIDEO 1:
VIDEO 2:

 

[ruby35]

I'm so sorry you have to go through this.

The light of my life, my Micky, was 15 when I had to put him to sleep. He had stopped eating and he stopped doing all of the things he used to do. He wasn't himself at all. I kept him going by force feeding him with baby food with a syringe. He growled the whole time at me and he didn't like it and I cried a lot trying to explain to him that I was just trying to help.

The vet gave me all of the exact same options your vet gave you. And I came here looking for advice on what to do like you are doing. I spent a ton of time with him trying to figure out what he would want me to do if he could talk. I know how much he absolutely hated - I mean hated - going to the vet. He would spit and growl and hiss and carry on whenever we would go, every time. I decided that, in his situation, it was for the best not to subject him to further vet visits. I'm convinced that he would have told me, if he could speak, that he didn't want to get poked and prodded any longer.

The day I had to put him down was truly the hardest day of my entire life. I still feel the loss every day. I think it was in early March, but to be honest, it hurt so badly that I don't even remember the exact date anymore. I think I may have blocked it out. It was a Saturday and it was way too close to my birthday. And now I hurt every single day that he is gone. I still cry every day for him.

Could the operation and the chemo kept him alive a little longer? Possibly. Maybe. But at what cost to his quality of life? I spent as much time with him as I possibly could those last 2 weeks. I held him as much as he allowed me to. That last day I held him and tried to tell him that I loved him so much that I was only trying to spare him pain and suffering. I still ask myself if I did the right thing, I will probably always ask that of myself. And when I tell you there's a hole in my heart that will never heal, it's the absolute truth. But I've learned that sometimes the most loving thing you can do is to stop them from hurting and suffering.

I think you need to do what you feel is best for your cat. Not what would be best for you but what's best for him. That's the only decision that is right.

 

[acatnamedpete]

Thank you all for your replies. Each of you have valid points, which are pretty similar to what I have been thinking. I keep going back and forth. Today was a good day for my cat, for the most part.

His name is Grimmy by the way, and we think he is around 12-16 years old. He has always been thin since the day I found him and a little fragile. If he were a younger, more robust cat, I would not hesitate one bit as far as going through with the surgery. But he is so small. He weighs around 8 pounds. His skin hangs on him, you can make out his bones in some places, and when you pet him , you can feel every vertebrae on his back. (that part is the most recent--he was bony before but not that bony)

Sometimes, and even more so lately, he'll just stare at nothing and sit for hours in the same spot. And now, he likes to sneak away into the extra bedroom and just lay on the floor in there.

So tonight I bought him a little cat bed with a secret pocket for catnip and some catnip toys. He seems to like the bed and has fallen asleep in it. I hope he feels it's his own little private spot.

I cried when when I read your posts and my heart breaks for those of you who have gone through this before me. It's a horrible thing to have to go through something like this, but what hurts the most is knowing my little cat that I love is in pain, and that I cant communicate with him and have him tell me how he feels and what he wants me to do. I don't want to have to make that decision. what if it's the wrong one?

I took him outside today so he could enjoy the sunlight and the trees. He likes sitting out there in front of the house.

I love him so much and I just want him to be comfortable. My husband wants us to do the surgery. I'm on the fence- leaning towards not doing it. I am happy for those of you who had the surgery and their little ones survived. I don't want to put Grimmy through that though just to get him 2 or 4 more months of him living with chemo.

I hope I make the right decision.

 

[white cat lover]

Not necessarily similar - but perhaps helpful. I have a 16 y/o (spayed female) farm kitty. She's a good old girl, sweet as all get out, but loosing her hearing & almost blind. Still fat & sassy, though. She had rotten teeth, so despite her age last fall I opted for full dental extractions. I did bloodwork before surgery, and it came back OK for her age. It's now spring, she suffered from sort of injury to a paw so was just visiting the vet again - and there is a small lump on her neck. So I am in a similar boat - she may need surgery for the paw & we would biopsy/remove the lump on the neck.

If he's thin, I would most definitely do bloodwork if you haven't recently before you opt for surgery. He may have underlying health issues going on.

 

[acatnamedpete]

His bloodwork actually came back normal. I was thrilled to hear his kidneys and liver were functioning properly. His WBC was elevated. The cytology report came back inconclusive as far as detecting any cancer cells in his abdominal fluid that was extracted. I have him on Clavimox twice a day.

 

[kittkatt]

Originally Posted by Ruby35

I'm so sorry you have to go through this.

The light of my life, my Micky, was 15 when I had to put him to sleep. He had stopped eating and he stopped doing all of the things he used to do. He wasn't himself at all. I kept him going by force feeding him with baby food with a syringe. He growled the whole time at me and he didn't like it and I cried a lot trying to explain to him that I was just trying to help.

The vet gave me all of the exact same options your vet gave you. And I came here looking for advice on what to do like you are doing. I spent a ton of time with him trying to figure out what he would want me to do if he could talk. I know how much he absolutely hated - I mean hated - going to the vet. He would spit and growl and hiss and carry on whenever we would go, every time. I decided that, in his situation, it was for the best not to subject him to further vet visits. I'm convinced that he would have told me, if he could speak, that he didn't want to get poked and prodded any longer.

The day I had to put him down was truly the hardest day of my entire life. I still feel the loss every day. I think it was in early March, but to be honest, it hurt so badly that I don't even remember the exact date anymore. I think I may have blocked it out. It was a Saturday and it was way too close to my birthday. And now I hurt every single day that he is gone. I still cry every day for him.

Could the operation and the chemo kept him alive a little longer? Possibly. Maybe. But at what cost to his quality of life? I spent as much time with him as I possibly could those last 2 weeks. I held him as much as he allowed me to. That last day I held him and tried to tell him that I loved him so much that I was only trying to spare him pain and suffering. I still ask myself if I did the right thing, I will probably always ask that of myself. And when I tell you there's a hole in my heart that will never heal, it's the absolute truth. But I've learned that sometimes the most loving thing you can do is to stop them from hurting and suffering.

I think you need to do what you feel is best for your cat. Not what would be best for you but what's best for him. That's the only decision that is right.

I was going to try and reply, but after reading this I'm bawling my eyes out and can't think of what it is I was going to say.

Maybe it's hitting me so hard because it's exactly how I felt about my Maverick, whom I had to have put to sleep in January. The pain is just still too fresh.

All I can add is that you'll know when it's time to do what's best for Grimmy. You'll see it in his eyes. I personally don't think I'd put my cats thru chemotherapy, but that's just me. On the occasions I had to make that heartbreaking decision of putting them to sleep, I asked myself, "Would you put yourself thru that?" (meaning prolonging their life so I myself wouldn't have to bear the pain of losing them). If the answer was no, I wouldn't put my babies thru it, either.

Many

& for you & Grimmy.

 

[bunnelina]

I am surprised to see that I am recovered enough from all of my own heartbreaks over losing cats I've dearly loved to be able to comment about this without tears streaming down my face.

Or not.

I've been told that cats don't fear death. They fear suffering. Our duty is to make their last days — when we truly know they are beyond treatment or hope for a good outcome — as peaceful as possible. It's a great power we have, to be able to do that. It comes at great cost to our own hearts. Still, it's a mercy we can give to the animals we love. And it can be a consolation for us when we've done it well, terrible as it is.

When we've lost a cat we've loved, we don't have to stop loving. If we still have love to give, but no one to give it to, it adds even more loneliness, helplessness, and misery to our natural grief. I've found, despite my grief-stricken protests to the contrary, that there is always a cat, or cats, out there in the world, who need me. There are cats who will form new and different, but equally powerful and rewarding relationships with me.

There are simply too many thousands of cats waiting in foster care and in shelter cages, and living desperate lives on the streets, for that not to be true. So I let one (or two) pick me. I bring them home. I fall in love. And I come back into the land of the living. I will keep loving, and losing, cats for as long as I live. I have to believe this. The losses would kill me if I ever gave up hope in new love. I don't know any other way.

 

[acatnamedpete]

Well, yesterday was one of the worst days of my life and the end of Grimmy's life. Yesterday morning Grimmy didn't seem well. I had slept in the extra bedroom with him since that's where he seemed to be wanting to be-away from everyone in the house I suppose.

I was hopeful b/c he ate breakfast as usual but 30 minutes later he vomited all of it up. That got me scared so I rushed him to the vet and they gave him a steroid shot for pain. I took him home and when I got back from work, I noticed he was in the same spot I had left him in the morning. I tried to get him to eat but he seemed so tired and lethargic.

I knew he was getting worse and as much as I wanted to , I knew he was in distress and I didn't think he was going to make it through the night.

So I took him outside and we sat in the sun on the grass under the trees and listened to the birds. I tried to feed him again, but he wouldn't eat. So I sat there and just pet him and told him that I loved him and that I didn't want him to go but I didn't want him t suffer anymore. His little eyes seemed so sad. When the sun began to set, I knew it was time.

The weird thing is, my sister told me he would let me know when it was time, and she was right, he was telling me.

So I took him to the ER vet like we had done this past Sat and they put him to sleep. It was a horrible experience and I don't want to go into detail b/c I don't want to have that picture of him in my head as he was passing away in my arms.

I cried so hard. I told him I loved him so much and that I didn't want him to go. It was horrible. I wanted to die. I felt sick to my stomach and I was disgusted with myself for ending his sweet precious little life. I feel so guilty. I am so angry, so sad. I am heartbroken.

I just feel like he was wondering what was going on. Did he understand? Did he think I was betraying him? I just ache so much. I hope he wasn't sad or scared or felt abandoned....I don't know. I hate this feeling I have and I just want to crawl out of my skin. I wish I could just bring him back and make him all better. i just love him so much and I miss him terribly. It's not fair. he was so very very sweet. just so sweet.

Thank you for letting me vent. It's hard to say anything to most of my friends b/c they don't understand how I feel about my animals., they are my family and I absolutely adore them and love them like any other member of my family.

Susie

 

[the_food_lady]

Hello Susie,

I am so sincerely sorry about your furbaby Grimmy.

This past year has been a difficult one for me; I had to help my 2 oldest (and first) cats cross over the bridge. The way you described how you felt, I felt as if I had written that myself. It seems like such a cruel thing for a pet owner to have to do, to make that call (even when the pet 'tells us it's time'), to take that step. It seems so wrong that we, the one who loves that pet the most, has to be the one to initiate that final act of love. I remember the first time I had to one of my old kitties put down, I felt like a monster, it just seemed to incredibly "unethical" to me, on one hand......I mean, we wouldn't "put to sleep" our ill loved ones (humans). It was such a struggle to take that step. I was furious that I had to take it. It just seemed so cruel to have to do it. And with my 2 oldies this past year, I knew it was 'time' before they got to the point where they were lethargic and not really with it........so in each case when I took them to the Vet, they would perk up a lot and I am still haunted by the looks on their faces as they were sitting there on that exam table and I was bawling and walking out the door (I cannot be present for it, I just cannot). My cat Taco, the look on his face to me was like he was pleading with me to stay, or to take him with me. It literally and truly haunted me for the longest time, and it still does (he had massive malignant, aggressive tumors to his back and shoulder, despite 2 surgical attempts to remove them).

But you know.........as much as my heart was burning, literally, on the drive back to my house...........having left my precious little friend.............I did feel a peace inside because I reminded myself that the moment they had passed, they had no more pain, no more discomfort, they were at peace. I would cling to this fact/belief. And I know it is true. It is nothing short of an enormous expression of LOVE to let our precious furbabies go on to peace and comfort. I firmly believe that they know this.

Just wanted you to know that I (as many here do) totally understand the anguish and sadness and anger that you felt and maybe still do. I am so sorry that you lost your precious, dear kitty. I know how tough it is, too, when those around you (who are not cat/pet owners/lovers) don't understand; it makes you feel quite alone. But know that we DO understand and we share your loss and pain.

Many hugs
Lisa

 

[bunnelina]

Dear Susie,

I am so sorry for your loss. I believe Grimmy was telling you it was time. That's what gave you the strength to do the hard thing. But even so, it always feels like an act against nature, like committing a crime, to put a cat to sleep, no matter how merciful it is. I can only assume that all of us who've been through it have felt similarly horrible afterward. Don't be hard on yourself — how could such a decision ever feel clear-cut and easy? It's always got to be messy, because we're kind-hearted humans suddenly dealing with powers of life and death over a loved one. It has to hurt.

You spared him a lot of suffering, I am convinced of that. You were brave to do the right thing. But being brave, and doing the right thing don't automatically make you feel great about it afterward. It's ghastly and unfair, as you say. You're having normal feelings of revulsion right now, because it was so unnatural. Expect to be a wreck for some days. It would not be normal to come away from that ER feeling noble and uplifted. Try to forget what you saw and focus on the fact that Grimmy's pain is over — we never get to see the pure relief and release they feel at the end. For Grimmy, the alternative would have been drawn out, painful, and much worse.

It might comfort you a little to talk to your vet and ask about the normal progression of lymphoma. If you are comfortable talking with him or her, you might get a better idea of how much you spared him. Lymphoma is an awful disease, and you would have likely spent weeks watching Grimmy feeling lousy and probably not responding well to treatment — yes, some cats do okay, but a large majority do not live more than weeks or months, miserably hanging on. As I recall, he was older and he had ascites. He might have had some good days, but he would probably have had lots of bad days.

What you did was right, not wrong. Merciful, not cruel. Beautiful, not terrible. Those of us who are corresponding with you on the forum can see that, but you're not seeing clearly right now because you loved him. Trust us on this one. You didn't fail him, you freed him from pain. And you'll survive this and get to the other side of it, in time.

Forgive me for sounding flaky.... but Grimmy might find a way to help you, too. I'm not religious or "spiritual" but I've experienced enough (after losing lots of beloved humans and cats) to convince this skeptic that death isn't the end of us, or our cats. Keep your eyes and heart open, and you may get a sign. I wish you peace and comfort.