Mystery illness, Possibly Lymphoma, Not Eating

[Mac and Cats]

Danno is SO CUTE! My boy has an orange smudge too. I'm glad he seems a bit better today and I'm looking forward to your updates. Here's my sweet orange man for your enjoyment:

 

[silent meowlook]

Some of the not feeling well can be nausea. With his chemo treatments, I would give the Cerenia at home for at least a couple of days, if he was my cat.

 

[RussellsMom]

IndyJones, by "energetic bath" I meant he washed himself with something like his normal energy. I would never wash a cat unless they'd gotten into something toxic - thanks for making me clarify!

 

[IndyJones]

IndyJones, by "energetic bath" I meant he washed himself with something like his normal energy. I would never wash a cat unless they'd gotten into something toxic - thanks for making me clarify!

Oh I thought you meant you bathed him and he went tasmanian devil on you. Kabuto sometimes needs his feet washed and he screams and bites. I now just use a paper towel with luke warm water if he needs cleaning. His rear feet sometimes get litter in them because he has trouble squatting in the box now (arthritis).

 

[RussellsMom]

Danno had a pretty good day yesterday and today - eating OK (sufficiently, I'd say, with some coaxing and some going over to his food bowl on his own). He's weak and not his usual well self, but he's sociable, not withdrawn. That's a few not bad days in a row, so I've got all my fingers and toes crossed. Pred taper starts tomorrow...hope that goes OK. If anyone can share their experiences with tapering pred in lymphoma, good or bad, I'd be very grateful.

Mac and Cats, I bought the RC Mother and Babycat you recommended - thanks. I haven't tried it yet, but have put it in my store of backups. Also, just as a PS, I loved the photo of your magnificent cat! My Russell also has a very charming mustache (see below):

 

[Mac and Cats]

Danno had a pretty good day yesterday and today - eating OK (sufficiently, I'd say, with some coaxing and some going over to his food bowl on his own). He's weak and not his usual well self, but he's sociable, not withdrawn. That's a few not bad days in a row, so I've got all my fingers and toes crossed. Pred taper starts tomorrow...hope that goes OK. If anyone can share their experiences with tapering pred in lymphoma, good or bad, I'd be very grateful.

Mac and Cats, I bought the RC Mother and Babycat you recommended - thanks. I haven't tried it yet, but have put it in my store of backups. Also, just as a PS, I loved the photo of your magnificent cat! My Russell also has a very charming mustache (see below):

View attachment 469525

Russell is so cute! I love his little face and his pink toe beans! So glad you got the RC mother and baby cat. Please let me know if it helps. My orange man is on day 2 of his Chlorambucil (every other day) and so far so good! I haven't given him an apptite stimulant yet and he's so far eaten pretty well. He actually woke us up at 5am because he was hungry! My boy started on 5mg of Pred for a month and then we went to 2.5mg. he was on 2.5 for several months and then we had to bump it back up to 5mg. Hoping we can bump it back down in a couple weeks now that he's on the Chlorambucil. Looking forward to your updates!

 

[RussellsMom]

Today was frustrating. I called ahead of time to ask how Danno was and they said he was "off his food". When I got there around 5 pm, they said he'd eaten about 1/2 a 3 oz can of FF chicken in the morning but nothing else. There was a bowl with 1/2 a can of clearly untouched FF, crusted over, on the floor. I asked if that was the 1/2 can of chicken (I worry that they consider it sufficient just to put food down, not to ensure that he actually eats it) and was told no, it was fish. It had clearly been there for hours. So I opened a can of FF turkey, and Danno scarfed down 1/2 can in one sitting, followed by a few Greenies treats. I said, "He's not off his food, he's just off the fish." "Oh," was all I got in response. So he basically went without eating until 5 pm because they didn't think to try a different flavor??

This despite my weeks of comments and even written notes about "If he doesn't like one, try another one" or "He doesn't like this one today, but he might like it tomorrow - you have to keep trying different things." Not to mention several spiels about how the chemo has weakened his immune system, so it's important to keep the dishes clean and not let the food sit out too long. I try to be diplomatic because I don't want to lose my access to Danno. I reserve blowing my top for when I get home - my poor husband!

Sorry for venting, but this is the kind of thing I'm dealing with. I feel like I'm fighting this terrible enemy (lymphoma) on my own and in a window of only an hour or two a day, when there are three potentially perfectly capable warriors actually present 24 hours a day who could be helping fight this battle but for some reason prefer just to slouch around on the sidelines and wait for me to arrive. I'll have a chance later this coming week to spend more time over there - possibly several overnights - so hopefully that will give me more opportunities to feed and cuddle with Danno, and also to observe the household's interactions with him.

On the plus side, I got Danno to eat almost a full can of FF, a few bites of A/D, and lots of treats before I left. And the two little bowls of kibble that I leave out for him every day had mostly been eaten, so I know he got at least that much today.

 

[RussellsMom]

URGENT QUESTION time again: Danno is lethargic and inappetant today. It's only noon where we live and my brother actually called me around 9 am because he was so worried. I came right over. I was expecting Danno to be unresponsive, given that it takes a lot for my brother to get worried. But he looked up when I came in - he's pretty alert, just obviously not happy. He's lying on the wooden floor in the hallway rather than in his usual heated cat bed, but he's not hiding. He's clearly uncomfortable and he turned away from the many different foods I held up to him.

I gave him 1 mg of ondansetron (he fought me a bit over it, which I didn't mind, because it showed he had the energy to do so). After about 20 minutes, I did get him to eat a few licks of FF. And a little later I got him to eat a tiny amount of Beech Nut chicken with Stella Dinner Dust on it and about a tablespoon of RC mother and baby cat. He eats a few bites, then turns away. He's just lying in the same spot on the floor, but does respond and sit up a bit when I come by with a plate of food. He eats Greenie treats with no problem. ?

My question is, can I and should I give cerenia as well as ondansetron? I've been avoiding using the cerenia because of what I've read about its potential to cause inappetance in cats. That's absolutely the last thing Danno needs. I gave him 1 mg ondansetron about 2 hours ago. Should I give him cerenia as well? Should I not give cerenia but give another 1 mg (or more?) of ondansetron? Should I do that now or wait a few hours? Any other thoughts, tips, and advice would be greatly, greatly appreciated. Thanks

 

[RussellsMom]

Is it possible the Greenies treats (a new addition as of 2 days ago) have caused some nausea? They do have wheat gluten in them, fish oil, etc. When I read Danno's last 7 years' worth of vet reports, I found that they'd been suspecting IBD all those years (he threw up his food almost daily all those years - only since this recent illness has he not thrown up at all), so it's possible he could be sensitive to some ingredient. He's in pretty poor condition at the moment, so I can't really figure all that out now - I just need to get him to eat and feel a little better. He loves the Greenies. I've given him about 10-12 a day (spaced out) for the past 2 days.

 

[fionasmom]

Cerenia and ondasetron can be used together according to the correct dosages and administration schedule given to you by your vet. I am not familiar enough with cat Greenies to know if they could be causing a problem. The Greenies site itself says that you can feed up to 16 per day or 1/2 cup for a meal. However, they are selling the stuff. I only wonder if a cat who is ill might not have problems digesting too many treats.

You are in a difficult position as he needs to eat and have also come to a point where what you are doing, rightfully so, is trial and error. On the site Toxic/Unsafe Foods – IBDKitties bread is listed as unsafe as it expands in the stomach and I don't know if this extrapolates onto a product with wheat gluten.

 

[IndyJones]

Is he lip smacking at all or coughing/dry heaving? Those are signs of nausea. It defenatly could be greenies causing cramping. Iirc they are pretty plant heavy. Cats are carnivores and can't process plant matter well.

IBD in people at least can cause cramping and bloating if something that is hard to process is eaten. Ive no experience with it in cats though.

 

[silent meowlook]

You need to call the oncologist handling his chemo. This after care is all what you pay for. Dano is on some serious chemotherapy drugs. At the first sign of something wrong you need to call the oncologist and let them know right away. They have to be the ones advising you on how to help him. It’s far too complicated medically for anyone including a regular veterinarian (unless they are consulting with the oncologist) to help.

 

[RussellsMom]

Thank you all! I called the oncologists and made an appointment for tomorrow afternoon (the earliest I could get).

They recommended giving him cerenia, but I'm very nervous about it. I gave him 1 mg ondansetron this morning but it didn't seem to make a difference. About three weeks ago, I gave him a 16 mg tablet of cerenia, per the ER vet's instructions - this was before lymphoma was diagnosed. I didn't notice any particular side effects, though it didn't improve his appetite at that point.

Should I give him cerenia today? If so, should I at least cut it into quarters?

He's resting near us all day (that is, not shunning company), and he's alert, but I haven't been able to get more than a few tablespoons total of food in him. He won't touch the water bowl, which worries me.

The Greenies might be at fault? He eats those no problem, which makes me wonder if a) he's suddenly developed an overwhelming taste for them and doesn't want anything else, and b) that they might also be making his stomach uncomfortable. I've enjoyed his enjoyment of them, but maybe I should hold off. I don't know.

 

[RussellsMom]

Forgot to add: No, he's not lip smacking, drooling, dry heaving, or anything like that. He's just semi-reclining on the floor (not meatloafing) and turns his head away from every type of food (I've tried about 10 different flavors and textures today, including the big guns: sardines) and water. He's had a few licks throughout the day of FF turkey, RC mother and baby, Beech Nut chicken, and about 6 Greenies, spaced out.

It's not enough food. I'm thinking of trying to finger feed A/D and maybe syringe a few drops of water. I did that before he was diagnosed/started treatment, when he was nearly comatose in his bed.

Maybe he's just having a bad day? I'm pleased he's not hiding, but of course I want to help him feel better, and of course eat better.

 

[fionasmom]

The most important thing is that you made the appointment with the oncologist. In the meantime, try to feed him in any way that he might respond, and with any food that won't completely upset him that he might eat. I would try the A/D with your fingers if that has worked.

You might try the cerenia since it was recommended and it has not been used for a while.

 

[silent meowlook]

Hi. I wouldn’t give him 16 mg of Cerenia, that’s allot. Did the oncologist tell you to give that much? Depending on his weight half of that would be a better idea. Not a vet, so confirm with your vet.

 

[RussellsMom]

I've been keeping a record of food, mood, behavior, litterbox and meds since the start of Danno's illness, and I just read through them and saw that the three times I gave him cerenia, he didn't eat or ate very little for several days afterwards. It could well be coincidence - certainly the illness, other meds, and just plain stress could cause inappetance - but I opted instead for a second dose of ondansetron this evening. I gave him a bit more this time - 1/2 pill (2 mg).

I've been at my brother's for about 9 hours and have to go home now to my own family. I've spent all 9 hours trying and trying to get Danno to eat and drink, but with basically no success today. He had a few bites of food, no water. He also hasn't peed since I've been here - maybe because he hasn't had any water, but of course I'm scared of a UTI. At least we're seeing the vet tomorrow, so they can prescribe antibiotics and/or anything else he might need.

Silent meowlook, yes, the original, pessimistic ER vet did prescribe 16 mg. When I said I thought that was a lot, I didn't get much help. I only spoke with the oncologist's office today, not the oncologist, so I wasn't able to ask her about it, but I absolutely will flood her with questions tomorrow.

Danno's back in his heated Kitty Kup, licking his paws, so maybe it's not so dire right now. I hate to leave him tonight - his people have been asking me throughout the day how he is, whenever they walk by us (and the buffet of foods) seated on the floor, but they haven't themselves been doing the tending, so I'm nervous. Please send good healing wishes his way, friends - thank you!

 

[iPappy]

I've been keeping a record of food, mood, behavior, litterbox and meds since the start of Danno's illness, and I just read through them and saw that the three times I gave him cerenia, he didn't eat or ate very little for several days afterwards. It could well be coincidence - certainly the illness, other meds, and just plain stress could cause inappetance - but I opted instead for a second dose of ondansetron this evening. I gave him a bit more this time - 1/2 pill (2 mg).

I've been at my brother's for about 9 hours and have to go home now to my own family. I've spent all 9 hours trying and trying to get Danno to eat and drink, but with basically no success today. He had a few bites of food, no water. He also hasn't peed since I've been here - maybe because he hasn't had any water, but of course I'm scared of a UTI. At least we're seeing the vet tomorrow, so they can prescribe antibiotics and/or anything else he might need.

Silent meowlook, yes, the original, pessimistic ER vet did prescribe 16 mg. When I said I thought that was a lot, I didn't get much help. I only spoke with the oncologist's office today, not the oncologist, so I wasn't able to ask her about it, but I absolutely will flood her with questions tomorrow.

Danno's back in his heated Kitty Kup, licking his paws, so maybe it's not so dire right now. I hate to leave him tonight - his people have been asking me throughout the day how he is, whenever they walk by us (and the buffet of foods) seated on the floor, but they haven't themselves been doing the tending, so I'm nervous. Please send good healing wishes his way, friends - thank you!

I would not immediately say the Greenies are upsetting his stomach but I would definitely ask the oncologist tomorrow if it's possible. Bring the package so they can see the ingredients. I'm not trashing Greenies treats by any means (my cats turn into T-Rex's over them), but Danno's system is very sensitive right now and it might be something that the vet would prefer you crush and sprinkle over his food to entice him vs. eating many of them at once. I'm not sure though.
I'm sure you've already talked to them about this, but, could you write down a "daily to do list" and "things to watch for" list for them? I don't know if that would spur them to get more involved in his care or not. It's very odd as they seem to care for him, and are treating him for this lymphoma, but are so hands off with his day to day care.
A sick cat of mine that lays in bed and gives themselves a bath is encouraging to me. I'm hoping Danno just had an off day and the oncologist tomorrow will be able to help you and his people get him back on track.

 

[IndyJones]

Forgot to add: No, he's not lip smacking, drooling, dry heaving, or anything like that. He's just semi-reclining on the floor (not meatloafing) and turns his head away from every type of food (I've tried about 10 different flavors and textures today, including the big guns: sardines) and water. He's had a few licks throughout the day of FF turkey, RC mother and baby, Beech Nut chicken, and about 6 Greenies, spaced out.

It's not enough food. I'm thinking of trying to finger feed A/D and maybe syringe a few drops of water. I did that before he was diagnosed/started treatment, when he was nearly comatose in his bed.

Maybe he's just having a bad day? I'm pleased he's not hiding, but of course I want to help him feel better, and of course eat better.

My old cat got cerenia 16mg split into quarters (4mg once a day) once a day she was a very tiny cat not over 8lbs so it should be fine. Just make sure to not give on an empty stomach if you can help it. My understanding is it can actualy have the opposite effect on an empy stomach. She would throw it back up.

Edit. I looked it up and my cat actualy got 1/4 (4g) of cerenia every 3 days. This was because she would frequently throw her food up.

 

[RussellsMom]

I'm in a bit of shock. I called my brother's place this morning to ask after Danno and they all said he's fine, he's comfortable, he ate, etc. But when I got there around 11, he was in terrible shape - unresponsive, hot, unable to walk, and with head and neck tremors. I held some food up to his mouth and his head shook and then fell into the bowl - he couldn't raise his head. I got very angry and said we have to go to the ER NOW. I got quite a bit of pushback but eventually slid him into his carrier (he was totally limp), well padded with blankets, and got my brother to drive us to the oncologist early (there's a 24-hour ER attached to the specialist center). I honestly thought Danno was going to die in the car.

I briefly described his symptoms to the oncology tech who met us and she whisked him off to the hospital, thinking he might have neutropenia. I was sort of hoping it was some kind of infection that could be treated right away with antibiotics. But his CBC was all normal. They did a panel that showed somewhat elevated kidney values. He was extremely dehydrated.

They gave him sub-Q fluids, and B12, dexamethasone, and cerenia injections. The vet said it was possible that his symptoms were the result of not having drunk any water at all for 2 days (I'd syringed a few droplets of water, but he hasn't been drinking from his bowl at all) and not eating, but she was concerned about his extremely weak and wobbly back legs. She booked him for an ultrasound tomorrow to gauge the progression of the lymphoma. The original ultrasound suggested possible renal involvement, which can sometimes have a central nervous system progression.

I cried a lot at the vet, but I am trying not to let my thoughts go too far in any direction. We'll know more tomorrow. I will say that after his sub-Qs, etc., he was perkier - he was at least lying with his head up, looking around, on the drive back home. And the vet said he ate all the treats they gave him when he was in the hospital - they even gave us a bag to take home, and he did eat them eagerly. I'd brought a can of A/D with me and he licked a lot of it off my fingers in the waiting room. That's more than he did all day yesterday and this morning.

I stayed at my brother's until about an hour ago, and Danno spent the whole time in his carrier. I took the top off, but he just lay there in the blankets. He initially ate a good portion of FF and some treats, but turned away from all other food I offered him throughout the afternoon. Alarmingly, he'd sort of nuzzle my hand with the treats in it, but not take the treats. It gave me the impression that he smelled them and felt them and that he had a sort of memory of treats but that he didn't know what to do with them at the moment. He responded quite well to my massaging his ears and face, and then curled up in what looked to me to be a comfortable position (not the usual recent uncomfortable slouch) and was just resting.

I spent the afternoon sitting with him and occasionally researching. One particular rabbit hole led me around to Mirataz side effects, which include tremors and other neurological symptoms, especially when combined with ondansetron - both of which I'd given him recently. I'll ask the vet about that tomorrow. A long shot? But I'm desperate. I'd also told the vet that the onset of these symptoms coincided exactly with the first day of the pred taper (first day of no pred), and she said that was a possibility.

If anyone has experiences with any of these symptoms, please share. I'm going back over to my brother's in an hour or so and will spend the night there tonight to observe and be with Danno. All healing wishes very welcome - thanks!