My cat's cholesterol is too high, what should I do?

[violet]

Originally posted by Carolina

Violet, you know this cat is eating a mixed diet of grain free canned and raw, right?

Yes. Unfortunately, in my experience, a grain-free diet, etc, doesn't automatically mean that a cat will not have out of range blood values including an elevated cholesterol level. And so I can only urge a very thorough approach that does not try to sweep the cholesterol level under the rug.

On the other hand I'm quite sure that if any and all underlying health problems can be ruled out the cholesterol level will respond to a weight loss program and a very carefully designed diet that avoids certain protein sources.

I would most definitely want to do a fasting level chemistry profile and then I would also ask my vet to help me track the cholesterol level under normal circumstances with attention to different foods and protein sources.

 

[carolina]

Violet, thanks for the explanation.  I'll try to get fPLI and hyroid test as well.  Now I know what you meant by masking symptons.  I'll also try to find a holistic vet.

Carolina, my regular vet also told me on Friday that I could fast him before I check cholesterol again if I really want.  Before I get to any conclusion, I think Hercules still needs to lose weight.  It's a burden for his joints.  Do you think 100% raw would make Hercules lose weight?   Is a wet food or raw with 6 to 9% fat considered alright?  Some canned food like weruva has 1.5% fat only.   I wonder if that is a good choice.

I tried to cut down his daily intake by about 2oz, but he is not happy.  I can't tell if he is hungry or he just wants to eat; he wouldn't leave his dish alone.  

Yes, I think it would.... What commercial raw are you feeding him, and how much? How much he weights? Has your vet told you how much he should weight?

 

[carolina]

Yes. Unfortunately, in my experience, a grain-free diet, etc, doesn't automatically mean that a cat will not have out of range blood values including an elevated cholesterol level. And so I can only urge a very thorough approach that does not try to sweep the cholesterol level under the rug.

On the other hand I'm quite sure that if any and all underlying health problems can be ruled out the cholesterol level will respond to a weight loss program and a very carefully designed diet that avoids certain protein sources.

I would most definitely want to do a fasting level chemistry profile and then I would also ask my vet to help me track the cholesterol level under normal circumstances with attention to different foods and protein sources.

No... it doesn't but your posts gave me the idea that the kitty was eating a high carbs diet and it is not the case here. I just wanted to make sure you got that.
I am not telling the OP to sweep the cholesterol issue under the rug either. But for a level that is not highly elevated, that was not done fasting - clearly, at the least I would redo it the correct way. IF there is a problem - I would go straight to the heart test FIRST. Especially because limping can be a sign of a blood clot and HCM. And that is serious. That that test that we posted will pick up easily - as well as other abnormalities of the heart.
This kitty is 9, obese.... was overweight all his life - this has joint problems all over it for me.
My opinion.FWIW.

 

[violet]

Going back to earlier posts in this thread, in post #9, Sugarcatmom wrote

What are you feeding Hercules now? High cholesterol in cats tends to be more related to high carbohydrate intake (can also indicate liver or metabolic issues, but you'd probably see some other lab results out of whack). Weight gain is also often a result of excessive carbs in the diet, so if you're feeding kibble I think it would be a good idea to switch to a low carb canned food instead.

And space 1101 answered:

Sugarcatmom, he eats mostly grain free canned food and commercial raw. He actually gained weight after quitting kibbles, I don't know why.

Okay, so.......

For weight loss and controlling certain conditions a low-carb, low-fat diet is very important.

And the fact that kitty actually gained weight after quitting kibbles suggests there is a problem with the fat content of the present diet that needs to be addressed.

Also, since space 1101 wrote

I tried to cut down his daily intake by about 2oz, but he is not happy. I can't tell if he is hungry or he just wants to eat; he wouldn't leave his dish alone.

this suggests there is a need for a very good, healthy fiber source that would help kitty feel satisfied. Brown rice would be one such very good, healthy fiber source. Rich in nutrients and, from what I've learned, brown rice also doesn't have the alkalinizing effect some other grains have, so it would be safer for the urinary tract. (Urinary tract health is always an important consideration with any diet.) Some canned foods contain brown rice, so I would start with looking for some of those. I would also want to see if kitty would accept a little bit of home cooked brown rice with the commercial raw. (In addition to its other benefits brown rice is also a very good food for lowering cholesterol.)

Cholesterol 325 is high, way over the normal range. It shows there is a problem somewhere. On a normal, healthy diet, even without fasting, cholesterol should not be above the normal range when a cat goes in for a blood test.

And there is still the question whether there is an underlying health problem here that hasn't been addressed.

 

[carolina]

 
this suggests there is a need for a very good, healthy fiber source that would help kitty feel satisfied. Brown rice would be one such very good, healthy fiber source. Rich in nutrients and, from what I've learned, brown rice also doesn't have the alkalinizing effect some other grains have, so it would be safer for the urinary tract. (Urinary tract health is always an important consideration with any diet.) Some canned foods contain brown rice, so I would start with looking for some of those. I would also want to see if kitty would accept a little bit of home cooked brown rice with the commercial raw. (In addition to its other benefits brown rice is also a very good food for lowering cholesterol.)
 
Cholesterol 325 is high, way over the normal range. It shows there is a problem somewhere. On a normal, healthy diet, even without fasting, cholesterol should not be above the normal range when a cat goes in for a blood test.
And there is still the question whether there is an underlying health problem here that hasn't been addressed.
 
 

Not necessarily IMHO - we don't know what/how much the kitty is eating..... How much the kitty weights..... How much the optimum weight is.... I wouldn't load the kitty with rice in an attempt to satisfy the kitty.... We don't know what "mostly raw and grain free diet means". We don't know how fast those 2oz were cut from his diet, and what the percentage of the food was - that can have an impact on the kitty asking for food.....

Again, the test was not done fasting - it was done 30 minutes after a meal... and we don't know how many hours after a night meal.
Kitty should fasted for 12 hours.
To me, that's moot.
Cats do not need rice.... especially overweight cats.... IMHO. Brown rice might be a great source of fiber for humans.... very nutritious.... but cats d not need brown rice IMHO :dk:
IMHO, if a fiber should be given there are better options then rice.

 

[violet]

I do believe we should leave dealing with this problem to a holistic vet who practices nutritional healing. Or perhaps even a veterinary nutritionist. We are not nutritionists, we are not qualified to give nutritional advice, decide what a cat should or should not eat based on our own personal opinions, especially since we really don't know anything about this kitty's health status. Some cats can't do without a certain amount of fiber in their diet, others can't handle fiber because of various health problems. Taking this into consideration makes me say, we really are not qualified to give specific advice regarding fiber. 

 

[carolina]

I do believe we should leave dealing with this problem to a holistic vet who practices nutritional healing. Or perhaps even a veterinary nutritionist. We are not nutritionists, we are not qualified to give nutritional advice, decide what a cat should or should not eat based on our own personal opinions, especially since we really don't know anything about this kitty's health status. Some cats can't do without a certain amount of fiber in their diet, others can't handle fiber because of various health problems. Taking this into consideration makes me say, we really are not qualified to give specific advice regarding fiber. 

Well..... Which is why I was asking questions - how much the OP fed, of what, how much the kitty weighs, and if the vet gave her an optimum weight.
I did not recommend a fiber for this cat :dk: I know however, that there are fibers that can help with that, without the calories- for cats. I do have experience with it - yes, for cats. Yes, prescribed by a vet. I also know that we don't know anything about this kitty to begin with to start recommending loading him with carbs. Sure, cats do well - but does a obese kitty need it?
There are simple caloric guidelines for cats to lose weight..... including as many vets say, if fat feed a bit less, if skinny, feed a bit more.
I asked questions, because when feeding raw (which the OP feeds) and the daily feeding is 4-6oz a day, cutting back 2oz is a lot. So yes - kitty will scream for food. And yes, I am not going to say anything without knowing details.... That is not a matter of opinion.... It is a matter of informed advice. If this kitty is obese, and if it gained weight after it stopped eating kibbles, there is a reason for it - it can be eating too much. Throwing advice out there without having any idea of what this kitty eats, his caloric intake, etc, IMHO does no good....
I was asking questions - Perhaps my posts about that got lost in the thread....
There are ways that the OP can have a safe weight loss on this kitty without having to resort to a nutritionist..... She might just be feeding too much - but we don't know.
Yes, I did ask her to rerun the test too.... I think it is a sound idea. I would done the same.
Her vet is not too concerned with the levels (which was my experience with Bugsy as well - however he did not have the limping on the legs).
To the OP:
Per my vet, he only worries on a higher #.
My concern is this limping - I would definitely redo that test on fasting and see what happens..... if it is still high.... run the Heart blood test we posted just in case.... to rule out HCM.... that's the first thing I would do....
Work on getting him to lose weight :heart3:
I am doing the same with my Bugsy now
Hang in there

 

[auntie crazy]

Hi, Space!

Just read all these posts. My thoughts, for what they are worth...

1) You believe your kitty is overweight and has been for a while, he gained weight when switched to his current diet (which consists of commercial canned and raw foods), and he's been limping lately.

2) You don't really know if cholesterol is a problem or not. Even if the numbers from the first test are accurate - and they're probably not - the second vet doesn't think they are alarming as they are.

At this point, I would focus more on weight than on the cholesterol issue. Get a new test done, properly, if you want, but in the meantime...

What, exactly, is your cat eating (brand and flavor), how much at each meal, and how many times a day do you offer meals? How much does he weigh and why do you think he's overweight?

Two ounces of food a day are no-where near enough food for most cats, never mind a big one, so I'm not surprised your boy complained. And cats need a comparatively high amount of fat in their diet, 25% - 35%; this isn't optional, they *need* it for proper physiological functioning. In no way would I cut down on your kitty's fat and add fiber (which cats have *no* physiological need for), most especially not in the form of such a species-inappropriate product as rice.

It is unusual for a cat to gain weight when switched to canned, and nearly unheard of on a raw diet. Because cats process protein directly into body repairs or energy, protein calories are never stored, and because they need so much fat to maintain basic functions, you really have to feed a LOT to make a cat gain weight.

So something is definitely going on here... I'm very interested is what this kitty's daily / weekly menu looks like.

AC

 

[space1101]

Thanks for the advice from you guys.  My cats used to eat science hills kibble TD (teeth formula), and they get home made meat with brown rice for treat.  They weighed alright.

After I switchd them to canned and commercial raw, their appetites became really good, and they eat alot more, all three of them, especially Hercules. They develop the habbit of begging for food.  I didn't notice they gradually gained weight since it is a gradual thing.  Hercules weighed 10.8 pound a year ago, was a agile cat, now he is 12.5, not agile.  All the people think he is obses except me, but now I do.   In the past few months, everytime he did summersault, he landed poorly, so he quitted doing it.  Hercules normally eats one 5.5oz can  and about 50g commercial raw, sometimes the other way around, they get freeze dried treat and I also add olive oil in their food.   I feed different brands of  food,  mostly nature’s variety rabbit and lamb, occasionally innova kitten,  raw food is mostly beef and lamb, plus  Nature’s variety freeze dried, wysong freeze dried.  Freeze dried food  is very fattenting.

  I was more worried about my other 2 elderly cats, but to my surprise, Hercules, the youngest, has joint problem first ( if it was arthritis).

Now I cut off 2oz canned from dinner and cut oil.  

 

[auntie crazy]

Originally Posted by space1101


Thanks for the advice from you guys.  My cats used to eat science hills kibble TD (teeth formula), and they get home made meat with brown rice for treat.  They weighed alright.

After I switchd them to canned and commercial raw, their appetites became really good, and they eat alot more, all three of them, especially Hercules. They develop the habbit of begging for food.  I didn't notice they gradually gained weight since it is a gradual thing.  Hercules weighed 10.8 pound a year ago, was a agile cat, now he is 12.5, not agile.  All the people think he is obses except me, but now I do.   Evertime he did summersault, he landed poorly, so he quitted doing it.  Hercules normally eats one 5.5oz can  and about 50g commercial raw, sometimes the other way around, and I also added olive oil in their food.   I feed different brands of  food,  mostly nature’s variety rabbit and lamb, occasionally innova kitten,  raw food is mostly beef and lamb,  Nature’s variety freeze dried, wysong freeze dried.  Freeze dried food  is very fattenting.

Now I cut off 2oz canned from dinner and cut oil.   I was more worried about my other 2 elderly cats, but to my surprise, Hercules, the youngest, has joint problem first ( if it was really arthritis).

Thank you for replying.

This does not, however, give me enough information to make any guesses as what the problem could be. Can you please fill out the profile below?

Yesterday, I fed my cats like this...

Breakfast was _______ (brand of food, such as "freeze-dried beef") made by _________ (company who makes food, such as "Nature's Variety"). I will give the cats ______ ounces of food each.

Lunch was _______ (brand of food) made by _________ (company who makes food). I will give the cats ______ ounces of food each.

Supper/Dinner was _______ (brand of food) made by _________ (company who makes food). I will give the cats ______ ounces of food each.

And today, I am going to feed my cats like this...

Breakfast will be _______ (brand of food) made by _________ (company who makes food). I gave the cats ______ ounces of food each.

Lunch will be _______ (brand of food) made by _________ (company who makes food). I gave the cats ______ ounces of food each.

Supper/Dinner will be _______ (brand of food) made by _________ (company who makes food). I gave the cats ______ ounces of food each.

- - - - - - - - - - - - -

Do you ever feed snacks? If so, what are they, who makes them and how much do you give your cats? It is *good* that you stopped giving the cats olive oil. How much of that were you feeding to them?

AC

 

[space1101]

Thank you for replying.

This does not, however, give me enough information to make any guesses as what the problem could be. Can you please fill out the profile below?

Yesterday, I fed my cats like this...

Breakfast lamb canned_____ (brand of food, such as "freeze-dried beef") made by __nature's variety_______ (company who makes food, such as "Nature's Variety"). I will give the cats _2____ ounces of food each.

Lunch was __raw_lamb____ (brand of food) made by ____Nature's variety_____ (company who makes food). I will give the cats __2____ ounces of food each.

Supper/Dinner canned rabbit____ (brand of food) made by _nature's variety________ (company who makes food). I will give the cats __4____ ounces of food each.

And today, I am going to feed my cats like this...

Breakfast will be ___raw_chicen___ (brand of food) made by ___nature's variety______ (company who makes food). I gave the cats 2_____ ounces of food each.

Lunch will be __canned rabbit_____ (brand of food) made by __nature's raviety_______ (company who makes food). I gave the cats ___2___ ounces of food each.

Supper/Dinner will be  freeze dried__chicken___ (brand of food) made by _wysong________ (company who makes food). I gave the cats ___4___ ounces of food each.

- - - - - - - - - - - - -

Do you ever feed snacks? If so, what are they, who makes them and how much do you give your cats? It is *good* that you stopped giving the cats olive oil. How much of that were you feeding to them?

AC

Snack is usually half medallion of freeze dried lamb or bravo raw, ocassionaly one egg yolk for each cat (yeah, I know, cholesterol)

Now I want to cut off all snack and 2 oz from dinner.  

 

[auntie crazy]

Most of what I see here is what I'd consider a decent menu, except that everything is made by the same manufacturer.

You've already stopped feeding them olive oil, so that's good. I think your idea to reduce dinner from 4 ounces each to 2 ounces each is also good, and I think, if I were you, I would stop feeding Wysong's freeze-dried foods and replace it with a frozen food from another raw food manufacturer, like Rad Cat, Feline's Pride, or Primal.

I'd also swap out at least one or two of the Nature's Variety frozen meals for something from one of those other manufacturers. Of course, raw food advocate that I am, I think switching to all raw would be an outstanding idea - but definitely buy your foods from a variety of manufacturers, not just Nature's Variety.

During all of this, keep in close contact with your vet. Hopefully, you'll see your cats start losing weight soon. Whether they do or not, however, if you see any other problems pop up - take them in right away.

Good luck, Space!! And, if you don't mind, can you update this thread every now and again? I'd like to know how this goes.

Thanks!

AC

 

[space1101]

Thanks for the suggestion AC, and yes I'll keep updating Hercules' condition and weight reducing progress.

 I think Nature's variety tastes too good, so I buy lots of them. I'll try to feed more raw food from other companies.    I'll order Felin's pride raw along with other canned.

Today, I observe carefully his movement.  I think the problem is actually the right front leg, I don't know if it has always been the right front leg or it has changed location.   He limps more at night after taking a nap, and seems a bit better during the day.  I will observe him more and see if other legs have problem.  Overall he just looks stiff right after a nap.   It's weird that the regular vet said it doesn't hurt to give him cosequin, but he doesn't think it helps.

I hope the damage on his joint isn't permament and can be cured.....  

 

[carolina]

Thanks for the suggestion AC, and yes I'll keep updating Hercules' condition and weight reducing progress.

 I think Nature's variety tastes too good, so I buy lots of them. I'll try to feed more raw food from other companies.    I'll order Felin's pride raw along with other canned.

Today, I observe carefully his movement.  I think the problem is actually the right front leg, I don't know if it has always been the right front leg or it has changed location.   He limps more at night after taking a nap, and seems a bit better during the day.  I will observe him more and see if other legs have problem.  Overall he just looks stiff right after a nap.   It's weird that the regular vet said it doesn't hurt to give him cosequin, but he doesn't think it helps.
I hope the damage on his joint isn't permament and can be cured.....  

Can you post a picture of him? from the side and the top? Unless he is tiny tiny.... a 12.5 lb cat should not be that obese.... Overweight perhaps.... but obese? Maybe I am just used to larger cats... I do have an obese cat.... That one is a large breed though....

 

[space1101]

I''ll try to get a pic of him soon.  I didn't think he was very obese, but even the neighbors told me he is too fat, the regular also said Hercules should lose weight.   If he has been this big all his life, there shouldn't have been a problem, but he gained all the fat in one year, so when you touch him, you feel fat all under the skin, not much muscle.

 

[space1101]

     

Very hard to get a picture of Hercules.  This one is not blurry.  

He lost 0.2 pounds in 2 days since the food cut, and he was unhappy about the food reduction.   It's weird that he doesn't beg for food in the morning and midnight these 2 days, but was still obsessed about dinner.

 

[carolina]

Wow, he is gorgeous!
Is he an American Short Hair? He sure looks like one.... Just beautiful boy :love:
Do be careful with rapid weight losses though, as they can get sick.... Unless this is a scale fluctuation, it seems like too much weight in too little time..... If he loses this much weight again, add a little food back into his diet and go slower - this is not good for him.... Weigh loss in cats need to be done very slowly otherwise you risk Fatty liver disease... which is a very serious disease...

 

[space1101]

Thanks for the advice , Carolina.  I'll  add a bit back.

They said he is American Short Hair when  I got him from my grandmother 9 years ago. 

I'm also afraid of fatty liver disease.  I'ts hard to tell if he has eaten enough from his hungry face.   XD

 

[carolina]

How is his limping? Is it on one leg only?
The reason why I am asking you is because HCM is a genetic trait seen on American Short Hair..... and one of the symptoms of blood clots is limping.... Now knowing that he is an ASH, I would really advise you to run that test for peace of mind - it will tell you if he has HCM or not.... Especially since you said this limping showed up all of the sudden - from one day to the next..... your vet can easily do it :nod:

Here is some info on High Cholesterol Causes and proper testing too:
http://www.petmd.com/cat/conditions/endocrine/c_ct_hyperlipidemia#.Tw0zjnrJaSo

 

[space1101]

Thanks for the link.

I suggested the cardio test to my vet, and he said he has done 6 xrays, ultrasound, electrocardogram, and blood pressure, and everything is normal.  If I tried to convince him more, he might think I was questioning his medical profociency.   What do you think?  Sometimes I can't trust any vet 100%, but this vet has saved my other cat's life 10 years ago (after 10 other vets gave up), that makes me unable to doubt anything he said even when it might be wrong...

  Hercules now limps only after dinner nap, not as bad as 3 days ago, and I noticed it was actually more on right front leg now .  I gave him cosequin in the past 3 days just in case it was arthritis, I don't know if that has helped a bit.   3 days ago, he walked very carefully with big limp,  couldn't jump, and walked slowly like many joints were hurting.  Now he can jump and walk freely at day time, but still limps a bit at night after dinner nap.  

I talked to the regular vet again today, and he said it was "temporary numb feet" just like human.  Hercules has never ever had this before, so I can hardly accept it was numb feet.      The first vet said it was the high cholesterol narrowed blood vessel and causes bad circulation, which sounds pretty horrible to me.  

Do you think I should try to reduce his weight first and do another cholesterol test when his weight is down?  And maybe by that time his limp will disppear...