Litter of kittens, four left

[fgj sfhdgj]

My cat had a litter of six kittens. Two have died, one I think from worms which came on very suddenly, and the other I think was killed by the male cat.  He is not fixed and is the son of the mother cat. I don't know if he is the father of the kittens or if that ever happens but I wouldn't be surprised if he were. And I know they both need to be fixed asap. But back to the kittens. They were being kept outside behind an unattached door until it started raining heavily and I decided to move them into a kennel. After a day in the kennel, and the kittens are about two weeks as their eyes have just opened, I found one kitten outside the kennel, fur wet, eyes and mouth open. He wasn't bleeding or anything. This cat was the same one who had been moved somehow away from the door when before it had rained. It could have been the mother or possibly my dog because we saw my dog with it in its mouth. But the kitten was okay. The mom cat moved it back a little while after that. Later that evening after I found the dead kitten I noticed that one kitten was being very sluggish. He wanted to eat but couldn't put his mouth on the nipple and i Noticed he was breathing more heavily. Then he started having diarrhea. It would just come out from him. I know that dewormer kills kittens and I didn't know what to do for him. I separated him from the rest by putting him in another kennel. The mom came by to lick him a couple of times but wouldn't try to feed him. he died later in the night. idk what i could have done for him, but there are four left. they seem to be okay but so did he earlier in the day. if the others should get sick, what can i do for them? why did he get worms? can kittens be born with worms? i also saw tiny oval shaped white things on the towel around the sick baby. they were just around, idk if these were the worms. if anyone could help me i would appreciate advice. i just don't want them to die. if they can survive long enough to leave their mom i can try and convince my mother to let them live inside. would that be better for them even if their mother and brother are outside? also, would fixing the male cat stop him from killing the babies? for now, i am just closing the kennel gate when they aren't being fed. 

 

[StefanZ]

Fixing them is always good, if you arent a breeder or really decided to have a litter. so do it... whoever is the suspected...  yes, do fix them asap feasible. Begin with the male.

Yes, it is good if you take them kittens inside when they are somwhat weaned. You will be sure this way they will be nicely socialized cats, also much easier to adopt out to others..

Both the dog and the male could have killed. They often kill in such cases by helding by the neck and shaking till the neck brokes. So ofthen there are no outwards signs.

A higly stressed mom can also kill, but she uses her teeth and often ates the body.

Yes, kittens can get round worms from mom. If the mom is free living, count with this, unless she is freshly dewormed.

Pure indoors cats usually dont have that problem.

As you say, most dewormers are harmful for kittens. although the widely sold Banminth has reputation of being mild even for kittens. May be ok from 2 weeks on I did read.  The active substance is Pyrantel.  So I assume, other brands who are based on Pyrantel are also OK.

If you do a try, use Banminth or if you cant find, some other preparate based on Pyrantel. Make sure the dosage is for cats - look so the dose is for small kittens. Make sure the datum is fresh, not too old.

The problem here, as you describe it it could be the tape-worm.  Banminth doesnt work against it.

Adult cats do get it from prey.  Kittens can get it from fleas, as  fleas are an intermediate host for tape worm.

So your kittens do probably have fleas on them too...

Do you have possiblility to let someone look at these worms? I mean, someone knowleable in this?

I suspect you dont afford a real vet.

So, they have fleas, almost surely round worms (if mom wasnt recently dewormed) and so they have tape worms...

If more kittens get sick. You did well to take the sick one aside, not to risk the others. The mom would prob do it too after awhile.

In such cases, if you want it to have a chance to survive, you must actively help it, feeding it etc...

It is not easy, not so few dies even if you try to feed them and help them - but it is worth a try if you want and can.  It give you an enourmous feeling if you do succees, if nothing else!

Good luck!      *vibes*

Ps. I suspect he didnt died from worms, something else and quicker took him.  But being infested with worms of course didnt help him fight it off.

 

[jennyr]

Many things can kill kittens outside. And certainly a male cat will often kill them so he can mate with the mother. He does not know if the kittens are his or not, he doesn't care. The best thing for these kittens would be to bring them and their mother inside until they are 10 weeks old at least, and you can find homes for them. If your mother will not allow that then keep them shut in the kennel to keep them as safe as you can. You may have a problem witht he mother though - she will need to get in and out as she cannot be confined in a kennel indefinitely. It is a difficult situation and the best thing is if there is a spare bathroom or even a proper shed where you can supervise them and nothing can get in.

 

[StefanZ]

Right, Jenny.   I was a little unclear.

To TS´s question; leave the mother outside, kittens in after a time - yes, feasible, was my answer.

Another, realy much better variation is take in kittens and mom together.  Being in their own room or so. The mom may be a little upset at first, but when cooled down and recognized this is just fine and even better than before - she will copy.

If it is safe and good for her children, she will cooperate.

Even ferale moms do so. You shouldnt have problems with her!  The welfare of the children is more important than "freedom". for human moms and so also for cat moms.

After the kittens are 10 weeks and mature to go to new homes - you can decide if mom seems happy with being inside and you perhaps want her inside too, or if you let her be your outside cat again.

Spayed and with your protection she will do fine outside, she is used with it.

Good luck!

 

[fgj sfhdgj]

where are these dewormers sold? and what do you suspect he died of? my mom mentioned cat parvo? i didnt know that existed. we cant take them to the vet. also, once i brought a kitten inside and after a couple of hours she started acting oddly, likeher head was heavy, she was acting a bit like the kitten did before it died. so we took her back outside to be with her mother and she got better. will this happen if the kittens arent with their mother? and im certain it wasnt my dog. she was brought in before the kitten was killed. so i do think it was the male cat. if the kittens start acting the way the other did, what should i do? should i force feed them pedialyte? or water? is it normal for their meows to sound funny? like they are trying to meow and very little sound is made? that happened a ouple of times with one but it also moewed nomally too. are there any general things i should do? is it normal for kittens to suddenly fall ill like that? ive seen it happen before. is it just my cats? it happened with a kitten that wasnt related to my cats once though. he just got sick one day. didnt move around a lot.the same way that heppened with this kitten. except he was older than two weeks. so you strongly recomend bringing the mother and babies in? sorry for the all over the place response. im just rtying to get all my questions down.

 

[fgj sfhdgj]

and thanks very much for the help by the way. im definintely going to get the mother and male at fixed so this cant happen again.

 

[jennyr]

First of all, calm down! It is normal to feel overwhelmed if you are not used to a sudden litter of kittens, especially after losing one or two. But sadly, all this is common in Nature. As I said, if there is any way to bring them and their mum in, that would be safer. Then you can monitor them properly and you know they will be safe until the kittens get homes and you can get the mom spayed. She can of course become pregnant again within a week or two of giving birth, so this is a very sensible option, to keep her away from the male outside, for her own good and the safety of the kittens. If you can do this, putting them all in a bathroom or utility room away from the rest of the house, with a large lined box to sleep in and a litter tray (shallow, so the kittens can learn to use it), then that is the first step. Then we can all talk you through the next steps. One thing at a time and it is all easier!

 

[StefanZ]

About your questions. Right, the meowings may be funny in the beginning. Some kittens dont learn to meow properly until they are perhaps 15 weeks, or even more. They may perhaps have this "silent meow".

What if some kitten gets sick. You can buy some time with pedialyte. or water If they have heavy diarrea a pedialyte is almost necessary.  If they get dehydrated - forcefeeding with pedialyte and or water.  But if mom isnt feeding them, you must feed them.

kitten substitute  mother milk.  KMR is a wellknown brand.  If you can get goat milk, it is OK (goat milk is common in some areas, in other not common at all). Cow milk is NOT OK.

Dont worry too much beforehand, but good to be at least mentally prepared. As things do happen, as you yourself tell us.

Them being indoors they will be more safe, both from enemies and some infections.

But  even indoors  not all sagas ends happily.

Good luck!

 

[fgj sfhdgj]

Ok. Thank you all for the advice.