Introduction Frustration

aprilc

TCS Member
Thread starter
Adult Cat
Joined
Aug 5, 2015
Messages
116
Purraise
42
I have three boys.  Pootie, Rumble and Raspberry.  They are all roughly the same age, between 2 and 3 (or 4) years old.  All are neutered.

Pootie was the original cat.  He is about 2.5 and was adopted by my daughter from the shelter when he was about 5 months old.

Rumble is between 3 and 4.  He was kitty #2 and was adopted from the shelter a year ago this November.

Raspberry was a stray from the streets and he was kitty #3.  He is between 2 and 3.  He joined us in February.

Pootie was very excited when Rumble came to live with us, he practically burst into the room with a "YOU GOT ME A FRIEND?!?!?" look on his face.  Introduction took a matter of days and they were sleeping together.  There was some hissing and the occasional smack (between them, not me!) but nothing remarkable and they were best buds very quickly.

Raspberry joined us in February of this year.  He was a plucked from the streets stray who came to stay with us "temporarily" until his owners were found (it was a bitter winter, they were found and didn't want him back.  Seriously).  He was not neutered and was cryptorchid (monorchid really).  He was neutered about two weeks after he came to live with us.  Again, Pootie was trying to burst into the room desperate to meet the newcomer. The three of them were sleeping together about a week after introductions.

We moved in May and in June my oldest daughter, her spouse and their two cats came to live with us.  No issues.  My three boys regularly sleep downstairs with her cats to avoid my dog, I have to beg her to stop stealing my cats.  Pootie will often sleep upstairs though.

In mid-June we found a momma and her 5 newborns in our backyard.  They all came inside.  No one was allowed to meet momma or the kittens until the vet gave them a clean bill of health at the 8 week mark.  All three boys were a little put off by the kittens but eventually started playing with them.  Mom was a bit of a jerk and never got along with anyone.  There were no big fights, she would just smack at the boys when they walked by.  Pootie was the bravest and got smacked a lot.  Before momma and her kittens all found homes it got to the point that none of the boys would venture to the second floor (where Momma stayed, she wouldn't come downstairs because she didn't like the dog).  Mom and all five kittens are gone now.

Shortly before Mom left a beautiful orange boy (Thomas O'Malley) showed up on my porch and he never left.  After about 3 weeks of feeding him we brought him to the vet (he is FIV+) and then brought him inside. No owners have come forward or posted about him.  He has been in a few fights and has the battle wounds to prove it, but he is a lovely boy.  He was inside for 2.5 weeks before he got neutered this past Thursday.

We have been keeping the cats separate and are now allowed Thomas O'Malley a chance to explore while the others are kept locked up.  They have been allowed very small, restricted introductions. Pootie hissed (and still tries to burst into the room) but then ignored O'Malley to eat treats about 3 feet away from him so I thought this was a good sign.  The other boys hissed a little but weren't at all combative.

O'Malley is FIV+.  I have done a lot of research on this and had long conversations with my vet.  As long as there is no fighting there is very little chance of transmitting the disease, so if everyone gets along things should be fine.  FIV transmission is through deep bite wounds that occur in those "I am going to kill you" fights that Toms have over territory, food and females.  However, I need to ensure that these introductions go well.

Pootie camps out in front of the spare bedroom where O'Malley is kept (and this was typical with the other introductions as well).  Last night while I tried to bring in litter, food and water, Pootie scooted past me and went right for O'Malley.  There was just some swatting, nothing terrible, but I am very upset.

I know it is early in the introduction process but I can't understand why Pootie is acting like this toward O'Malley when he was fine with ever other cat that has come in. 

Could it be that he is just trying to tell me "ENOUGH DAMN CATS WOMAN!  I am all the kitty you need"? or perhaps because Momma was a little mean he is expecting O'Malley to be mean too.

I thought maybe he could smell the testosterone on Mr. O'Malley but Raspberry wasn't neutered when he came in either.

I just can't figure out why he doesn't like O'Malley.

We have Feliway up, just got new refills last night so maybe that will help. I need to get some more baby gates and I will fence off the door so they can see each other but not touch each other.

I know it is early days but every other introduction has gone so easily.
 

betsygee

Just what part of meow don't you understand.
Staff Member
Moderator
Joined
Mar 17, 2013
Messages
28,543
Purraise
17,836
Location
Central Coast CA, USA
Wow, that's a lot of changes and a lot of cats in a relatively short amount of time.  It sounds like you're doing all the right things.  Baby gates are a good idea.

It may be that it will just take more time for the introductions this time around.  It can take weeks or months for some cats to get used to each other.

How it is going now a couple of days later?  
 
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #3

aprilc

TCS Member
Thread starter
Adult Cat
Joined
Aug 5, 2015
Messages
116
Purraise
42
Still no change.  Pootie wants to charge in and rip Thomas O'Malley's face off.  Rumble doesn't care as long as he gets a spot on the cat tree and Raspberry just makes noise.

I had an 8 week old kitten sort of dumped on me this week, the lady that adopted it is severely allergic and the place where she got it wasn't responding about taking it back.  Kitten will only be with us for a short time, I have already found him a home.  Pootie was great.  I know kittens aren't a threat but I just want to pull my hair out.  Give Thomas a chance!

Thomas O'Malley was supposed to get a tooth pulled on Wednesday but broke out the window (again) overnight so that surgery has been put off until Monday.  I have held off doing a whole lot of work with the cats because Thomas is going to be miserable and sore after his surgery so I thought we should probably wait.  Thomas is pretty laid back and doesn't really care about other cats unless they start to get aggressive.  He is also only a week post-neuter so he is still a ball of raging hormones.  I figure a week or so after the tooth comes out he should be feeling mostly back to normal and he will be edging up on three weeks post-neuter.

Yes, it is a lot of cats in a short amount of time and my house has been mass chaos for a few months.  Pootie may just be fed up (so is my husband).

It is very frustrating.  I have spent a ton of money on this cat I know I am probably never going to be able to find him a home because of his FIV status.  I just see this life stretched out in front of me with 15+ years of stress.  I told Pootie we would start re-homing with the cheapest cats which means he is the first to go; I don't think he believed me.
 

betsygee

Just what part of meow don't you understand.
Staff Member
Moderator
Joined
Mar 17, 2013
Messages
28,543
Purraise
17,836
Location
Central Coast CA, USA
I told Pootie we would start re-homing with the cheapest cats which means he is the first to go; I don't think he believed me.
That's funny!  
    But don't give up hope yet.  It may just take more time and after Thomas has recovered from his surgeries, things may calm down.  Have you tried giving Pootie calming treats?  Those work for some cats.
 
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #5

aprilc

TCS Member
Thread starter
Adult Cat
Joined
Aug 5, 2015
Messages
116
Purraise
42
I have never heard of calming treats, but he is super picky and only eats the orijen treats. I have to go and get some today but my plan is to shower Pootie with treats when Thomas is around. Classic conditioning for the win.

We have made some small progress today. I couldn't stand Thomas O'Malley's crying anymore so I brought him downstairs and he has mostly sat on my lap all morning. Pootie has been around and there has been the odd swat exchanged. Right now Thomas is lounging in the sunroom and Pootie jumped right up where Thomas was and they exchanged a swat and went separate ways. I am standing here armed with a broom in case I need to separate them.

Thomas is not being aggressive and is laying here with his eyes closed, Pootie is watching intently from about 4 feet away but he closes his eyes when he is looking in Thomas' direction, and he does look away so it doesn't feel like an aggressive stare just a very interested stare.

I feel much more positive. We have gone from some very aggressive behaviours to what feels more like normal jockeying for position in the pack.
 

betsygee

Just what part of meow don't you understand.
Staff Member
Moderator
Joined
Mar 17, 2013
Messages
28,543
Purraise
17,836
Location
Central Coast CA, USA
I have never heard of calming treats, but he is super picky and only eats the orijen treats. I have to go and get some today but my plan is to shower Pootie with treats when Thomas is around. Classic conditioning for the win.

We have made some small progress today. I couldn't stand Thomas O'Malley's crying anymore so I brought him downstairs and he has mostly sat on my lap all morning. Pootie has been around and there has been the odd swat exchanged. Right now Thomas is lounging in the sunroom and Pootie jumped right up where Thomas was and they exchanged a swat and went separate ways. I am standing here armed with a broom in case I need to separate them.

Thomas is not being aggressive and is laying here with his eyes closed, Pootie is watching intently from about 4 feet away but he closes his eyes when he is looking in Thomas' direction, and he does look away so it doesn't feel like an aggressive stare just a very interested stare.

I feel much more positive. We have gone from some very aggressive behaviours to what feels more like normal jockeying for position in the pack.
   That's great.  I know how discouraging it can be to feel like there's no progress.  
 
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #7

aprilc

TCS Member
Thread starter
Adult Cat
Joined
Aug 5, 2015
Messages
116
Purraise
42

Pootie still wants to rup his face off and takes any opportunity to give Thomas O'Malley a smack, but this is big progress!
 
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #8

aprilc

TCS Member
Thread starter
Adult Cat
Joined
Aug 5, 2015
Messages
116
Purraise
42
We have (mostly) reached tolerance with Pootie and Thomas O'Malley.  They can be around each other and seem to be mostly fine.  Occasionally they will take a swat at each other but things are mostly fine.  They still have only supervised time together. 

Last night (hubby was up, I was sleeping) there was a scrap and Thomas O'Malley chased Pootie upstairs and then today they were sleeping on my bed together with my husband with only about a foot and a half between them.  So frustrating.

Raspberry and Rumble are being the problem children now.  Raspberry is a little slow mentally.  He will come up to smell Thomas and then just make yowling noises and do nothing else, but if you try to step in to sooth him he will bite me and he freaks out if I try to move them apart.  This is getting better but it has been a challenge.

Rumble is a whiney little chatterbox and he will come into the bathroom and talk to me while I am getting ready for work.  Thomas hears this and comes running in like he thinks there is something going on.

We are getting there, slow and frustrating, but we are getting there.
 

betsygee

Just what part of meow don't you understand.
Staff Member
Moderator
Joined
Mar 17, 2013
Messages
28,543
Purraise
17,836
Location
Central Coast CA, USA
Oh this is good news!  The photo looks good, too, having them so close.  We have been trying to integrate a cat going on 10 months now.  She semi-tolerates our cat Ozzy (under supervision) but only because he mostly ignores her.  She still can't be around our other two cats without chasing them and trying to fight with them.  She's half their size and twice their age and they're still scared of her.  I'm not sure she will ever fully integrate.  

So hang in there--you really are making good progress!  
 
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #10

aprilc

TCS Member
Thread starter
Adult Cat
Joined
Aug 5, 2015
Messages
116
Purraise
42
Everyone keeps telling me that eventually it always works out, but eventually might be longer than I have patience for. Thomas O'Malley will not tolerate being kept in a safe room anymore so we can't really go back.

I don't care if they like each other, just no fighting. The FIV makes this more stressful. He is missing one canine tooth now so biting is harder, small (and expensive) blessings.
 

maisiemoo

TCS Member
Kitten
Joined
Oct 14, 2015
Messages
7
Purraise
3
Location
Kent England
Hi, we have a 3 year old female cat and recently got an 8 week male kitten . Wasn't really worried if my 3yr old would accept him , as she was very mothering to our other male ( who recently died suddenly ) . She hissed like crazy at first but has become a lot calmer around him recently . She watches him intently and has started to try and play . He now follows her but is respectful of her space. Our kitten has only been home for ten days but feel they are making great progress . Your photo looks exactly how my cat looks at the kitten . Thankfully there has been no aggression . Cats are pretty good at tolerating each other , so please don't give up . Just takes time .
 
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #12

aprilc

TCS Member
Thread starter
Adult Cat
Joined
Aug 5, 2015
Messages
116
Purraise
42
I can't give up. Thomas is FIV+ which would make it near impossible to find him a home, and I have put about $1600 of vet care into him (with more to go). He is an investment now ;)
 
Top