I bought chicken!!!

[wolcar]

Okay, so my scale came.  I also went to the store and bought my first package of chicken ever. It was odd straying over to that section of the store.  I got boneless breast tenders. I chose these because it seemed like it would be easy for me to cut.  I gave each of my boys a few small chunks .3 ounces.  They each ate them up - they were cut up pretty small so I'm pretty sure they barely chewed on it.  I have a few questions:

regarding feeding:  Can I just keep putting a few peices in their dish each meal along with their primal? I lessened the primal when I added the chicken.

Should I slowly increase the size of the chunks?

Anything I should look out for?

Regarding chicken itself:  I cut up some of it and put in a glass container in the fridge for now. How long does chicken stay good in the fridge?  I put the remaining chicken that I didn't cut up into the fridge as well.  I plan on cutting it up tonight and portioning out but I wanted to know how long chicken lasts in the fridge before I do that.

Thanks for your help!

 

[turks rule!]

Hi - well done for making that first purchase of raw food for your cats!

You said that you bought the chicken from a store, if it was pre - packed it will have a use by date on it. If you bought it loose, then the seller will be able to tell you how long it will keep for.

However.... may i advise that you portion up the chicken and freeze it? That way, there will be minimal wastage.

You are quite right in introducing a new food into your cars diet gradually. The microflora in their tummies cannot handle a big sudden change in diet - which would in turn lead to tummy upsets and other problems. So slow and steady is the way to go. Adding a little more raw each day and removing a little more of their regular food is good, just as you are doing.

Chicken breast or tenders have few nutrients to sustain a cat fully and a varied mix of raw meats is needed. There are lots of people here to advise you on this. For example, i feed a "frankenpray" diet which consists of - chicken wing, sardines, gizzards, heart, pork, turkey, lamb, venison, kidneys, liver... i'm sure i have missed something! I dont add supplements.

Back to the freezer. Even if you are only introducing raw at the moment in tiny amounts it makes sense to freeze what you buy as it will go much further.

A sharp knife is essential. Mine is not very expensive and i use it for my everyday cooking as well, but i keep it super sharp with an inexpensive steel in a plastic holder. Twenty swipes through that and its ready for any type of meat!

I use zip lock bags , a meat only chopping board and scales wrapped in cling film. I wear gloves to protect the meat - not me as i cook the meat that i eat. I unzip the bags before i start( that saves loads of time!) and lay everything out before i start. Oh and a pen to label the bags of course!

It sounds daunting, but i prepare meat less than once every two to three weeks. I have duck and gizzards to bag tomorrow - three months worth, and it will take me half an hour.

The meat is not used until it has been in the freezer for at least three days, as this will kill off any nasties. Then it is taken out as needed and defrosted overnight in the fridge - i would NEVER defrost it in hot water.

Hope this has helped a little.

 

[wolcar]

Thanks for the tips in handling the chicken.  May I ask what you mean by "protecting the meat." 

I've been feeding the commercial raw for a few weeks now.  They are eating completely commercial raw. I started giving them an egg yolk last week. Now I'm slowly adding actual meat.  I guess as long as I continue to give them their Primal they've been getting they will get their balanced diet until I figure it all out.

I will cut up the remainder of the chicken, baggie it up, and freeze it.  However, how long once you thaw in fridge will the chicken be good for?

I've never bought, prepared, or done anything with meats so I really have no idea. I did know, however, that it is preffered to thaw in fridge; although I'm unsure why.

 

[ldg]

OMG you are SO my hero! I really can't believe you are doing this for your kitties. BTW - I have some questions on veganism, so I hope you don't mind if I PM you in a bit.

Here are the FDA recommendations: http://www.fsis.usda.gov/Fact_Sheets/Basics_for_Handling_Food_Safely/

Basically, when we buy meat, I portion/bag it up and freeze it either that day or the next day.

I usually take out what I want to feed them the next day the night before and stick it in the fridge to dethaw. Because I have such a large amount in bags (I'm feeding 8 cats and I don't individually portion their meals, just the total for each meal), I often use a bowl of cold water to mostly dethaw their breakfast, or it isn't dethawed in time.

Sometimes I have a bag of ground stuff in the fridge (I order ground from Hare-Today), and I will use it over a 2 - 3 day period. So it depends on how cold your fridge is and how good the circulation is, but if you didn't buy meat at the end of its expiration date, it should be fine for 2-3 days.

Basically, the reason for dethawing in the fridge or cold water is the rate/temp of dethawing - it prevents bacterial growth.

So have you thought about calcium? Are you going to supplement, or use bone-in meals?

 

[sbjforumman]

Thank you Turks rule!  for the mention of the microflora needing the gradual introduction of new diets. I've had cats for a long time but have never really had to deal with health issues.  For one reason or another our cats spend a good 5 or 6 years with us and then just disappear while they're still fully healthy.  Anyway, good to know this.

 

[wolcar]

You're too kind.  I just love my cats and they seem to really enjoy the raw food so far.  It wasn't easy buying the chicken and cutting it up but as long as I don't waste it I'm thinking I'll be okay. I really hate waste especially animal products :-(  I figured it would be a very slow process for me to slowly incorporate raw meats in their meal.  It's a shame because I've been reading how some others have such difficulties with their cats adjusting. Mine seem to not have a problem at all - I'm the problem. lol

I hadn't thought about any suppliments as of yet  - I figured that I had some time to work that in as long as they were getting the balanced stuff in the Primal. Is this a correct way to think?  I have read other threads on calcium.  So basically I have three options, correct? A suppliment of some sort, grinding egg shells, or feeding them bones?  Well, it will be a long while before I'm okay with giving them bones, I think.  Right now they are getting one ounce of the primal for each meal (3X/day) and I am giving them 3 little tiny peices of chicken with each of those meals.  I guess I have to start figuring out the calories in the chicken and other meats *sigh*.

I did weigh a few of those primal nuggets.  None of the ones I weighed were actually an ounce.  They were mostly .8 ounces. Interesting.  This means that my Ulysses is getting less ounces than I had thought YET he still isn't losing any freakin' weight. 

LDG, you can ask me absolutely anything you want about veganism.  I hope I have the answers. I'm a raw vegan so my diet is pretty limited but feel free to ask.  You've answered just about every question I've had on this site - it's the least I can do :-)

 

[turks rule!]

Wow, i did not realise that you  are a vegan. Big respect for feeding your cats a species appropiate diet - i know it must be hard for you.

I have not been on this site for a long time so unaware of what you have been advised in the past. Have you looked at catnutrion.org or rawfedkitty.com? (they are the same site). This site will give you invaluble advice and you will be able to begin to see clearly on how to proceed on a raw diet.

We all make mistakes, and i know at first that it seems very daunting. It certainly was for me! Before you take away anymore of your cats balanced meals, i strongly advise doing as much homework on the above site as possible. When i started out on raw nearly eighteen months ago, there was a lovely lady called "Auntie Crazy" who pointed me in this direction. At that time, the raw feeding thread was used by about three members....

As i said in my last post, i feed a "frankenpray" diet, which needs no supplements. You just need to take into account the correct ratio of different meats fed. I know that people prefer different methods, but i feel that frankenpray is the most natural  - and the easiest!!!!

You asked why i use gloves to"protect the meat". I try not to buy pre packed meat as i have no idea how many times it has been handled by different people in the factory process. I belive that this adds avoidable bacteria to the meat. Cats are designed to to process a heavy bacteria load that is in raw meat - but why make it heavier?

Do you have a local butcher??? If so....make friends with him!!!!  Mine at first thought i was a mad woman, but after lots of long conversations about the benifits of raw, now feeds his dog a raw diet - can you imagine the stupidity of a butcher feeding his animal a processed diet...

Best of all, he does all the hard work for me. I can order gizzards for example which are uncommon in the UK but available in every butchers in Paris where we used to live. He will cut up the meat there and then. Best of all, if he has chicken wings left over from jointing a bird, he will chop them and individually bag them and put them in his freezer until the next time that i call in. I have had to put up with a certain amount of gentle jokes - ie being called "Mrs Gizzard" but i did not ask him do the wings and was so pleased when he first said that he had done them for me.

Your butcher from your point of view, will be able to do all of the cutting which understanably is difficult for you. All you then have to do is weigh and bag.Also unlike prepacked meats, you can ask for the sinews and cartliage to be left on as well as a little skin and fat.

I have been stood in a queue many times to ask for these things with the rest of the people thinking "what on earth is she cooking???

Pleae let me know if i can help any further.

 

[ldg]

Turks rule! has a really good point. You've probably never even BEEN to a butcher. But if you can stand going into one, it really might be VERY helpful to you in this process. :nod: Having the conversation, you may actually be able to pay extra to get them to make the portions for you? :dk: Can't hurt to ask IF you're able to handle the environment. :nod:

 

[wolcar]

I've been to those websites and have read them.  To be honest, I should probably go back  & read again maybe a few times more because at first read it's extremely overwhelming.  I  also intend the process of switching them to the raw vs commercial raw to be very very long, so I feel like I have a little time to learn some things. For a while over 3/4 of their meal will be commercial raw.

Gosh, I don't know if there are butchers near me.  Are these just the people behind the counter in the supermarkets (like where all the seafood is).  Do you think they could help me?  I know a guy that works at a supermarket maybe I can ask him. Or perhaps I will investigate butchers in my area and establish a relationship with one. I would really prefer to find some place locally that gets their meat locally.  If I  can choose not to make it a habit to go into the big supermarkets I would prefer that; however, I must say that our local Giant has actually started to provide SOME local produce.

It's hard to be in that environment, I must admit.  When I picked up the chicken the other day I passed the beef section and they had a poster of a cow and it was sectioned off and all the parts were labeled with the corresponding meat cuts.  *sigh*

I had to feed my boys canned this morning. UGH  I had absolutely nothing thawed. Bad planning!!!

 

[wolcar]

Okay, I googled and found a pretty local butcher http://www.haringbrothersmeats.com/Pages/default.aspx

After looking at their website it I realized I'm not sure what to ask them. As I said in my previous post, this is going to be a slow process...so can you give me some tips on some things to ask him for?  I want to slowly add things to their diet so maybe I can just pick up a few different items, have them cut it, and then put it in the freezer.  I know it must seem like I need my hand held through this process - sorry!!!  Also, how do I ask them to cut it so I don't have to?

 

[carolina]

Just a note Wolcar, before I go to bed.... You can, actually defrost the meat on hot/warm water, as long as you bag the meat into portion sizes. Meaning, you warm only what you will feed on that meal. Once you warm the meat, you have to use it, it can no longer be put back in the fridge to be consumed later. I defrost all my meals in hot water, but serve them immediately... All my meals are packed into Ziploc bags on meal size, and I pull from the freezer at the time of feeding....
As far as the butcher.... Can't help you there..... That's something my mom used to do, bot me, I will be watching this one!

 

[wolcar]

Just a note Wolcar, before I go to bed.... You can, actually defrost the meat on hot/warm water, as long as you bag the meat into portion sizes. Meaning, you warm only what you will feed on that meal. Once you warm the meat, you have to use it, it can no longer be put back in the fridge to be consumed later. I defrost all my meals in hot water, but serve them immediately... All my meals are packed into Ziploc bags on meal size, and I pull from the freezer at the time of feeding....
As far as the butcher.... Can't help you there..... That's something my mom used to do, bot me, I will be watching this one!

Thanks for the tip.  I had been freezing their primal in individual servings but for some reason I froze the rad cat in just small containers (probably 3-4 servings). I took it out last night and put it in the fridge and it was still solid as a rock this morning.  I was planning on going to the store today to pick up more primal for them - it went quick!!!  I gotta somehow get organized!!! Bottom line.

On a really awesome note:  My Ulysses weight in today at just under 15lbs. YAY!!!!!  I had to get back on the scale a few times to make sure I was right. He's been stagnat at 16.4 for a couple of weeks. I'm so very excited about this.  He still felt 16.4 lbs but the scale doesn't lie 3 times in a row :-)

 

[wolcar]

Sorry - correction.  He is just under 16lbs.  He just barely got into the 15lb range.  PHEW that would have been too much weight.  Still, VERY excited :-)

 

[turks rule!]

Ok, the butchers....

You do not have to pay extra for him to cut up meat for you - thats his job. There is no difference to him if you say" i would like a pound of turkey cut up into two inch chunks as i am making something special tonight, to i would like a pound of turkey cut up into two inch chunks with any sinews and cartalidge left on as i am going to feed it raw to my cat....

I find that the butchers is

Cleaner - he knows where all of the meat is from, prepares it himself.

No difference in price to the supermarket. As i buy in bulk, he will give me a discount. I can also buy cheaper cuts of meat that have a far greater nutritional content for my cat that are not available in the supermarket. ie duck thighs , turkey leg...

He will order those all important gizzards for me!!!!! Very important to my little frenchman, as he loves them.

I am supporting a local business.  He knows me, knows what i want, and makes the whole process of feeding raw far easier. Its a win win situation. Chicken wings that would otherwise have been thrown away, are now sold to me . He makes a small profit, i dont have to do the hard work of chopping them.

Greener, most of the meat is from local sources and of course is not sold in plastic trays...

Please make friends with him - he is very important!

When it comes to handling raw meat for my cat, i use the same safe practises that i use for handling raw meat for myself and family. i would NEVER defrost raw meat in cold water, warm water, in a cupboard, in a mirowave.... It must thaw out slowly in the fridge. That way there is far less bacteria build up.

 

[Willowy]

Problem is, butchers are fairly rare in the U.S. now . So if you found one in your area, you're lucky!

 

[mschauer]

Thanks for the tip.  I had been freezing their primal in individual servings but for some reason I froze the rad cat in just small containers (probably 3-4 servings). I took it out last night and put it in the fridge and it was still solid as a rock this morning.  I was planning on going to the store today to pick up more primal for them - it went quick!!!  I gotta somehow get organized!!! Bottom line.

It will also thaw faster in water even in the fridge. That's what I do if I want something to thaw overnight.