Hostility from Breeders??

[ciggggg]

Hi everyone, As i stated in my introduction post a few weeks ago now, I am aspiring to one day become a registered breeder. Although at this point i havent really pin pointed which breed is the one for me. I wanted to do as much research into every breed as possible and attend cat shows and interact to get a feeling of which might be best suited for me. Ive been searching for breeders around australia and emailing them, introducing myself and explaing my goals and just generally asking what drew them to thier chosen breed, what kind of complications they've experienced if any with the breed and so on and so forth Am i going the wrong way about this? some of the people i have email have been nice and given me advice, but the majority of responses have been rather rude. One in particular was rather hostile, one person actually wrote "theres no place in the cat world for a dirty BYB like you". I definately understand that these people are very busy and protective of thier cats, andi dont expect novels to be written back, but this is really upsetting me, all im trying to do is get information to prepare myself to achieve my goal in a few years time. If anyone here is a breeder, would you find this approach through email from me rude? I understand that people are very protective of thier breeds with good reason. But its nots like im saying i wanna buy a breeder and make it have kittens n sell them all over town for lotsa cash. Sorry for my vent im just finding the reactions im getting very discouraging. Am i going about this the wrong way? Is what im doing offensive? should i just wait to attend cat shows to do research?Thanks guys

 

[nerdrock]

I'm not a cat breeder but I am a dog breeder, some of the attitudes you speak of are similar so I thought I'd chime in. 

You have to try not to take it personally, these people don't know you from a hole in the ground and are very protective of their cats, their lines, and all of the work they have put into it. Some have had people they mentored that have gone on a different path from them, whether it's the right one or the wrong one is open to interpretation with each situation, which can create hostility to new comers because of past experiences. It's not necessarily right, but it is what it is. 

You are on the right path with emailing people, just keep it up and don't get discouraged with nasty emails. The helpful people will be a great support system for you and many will become good friends for you and your program should you start it at some point. Others that may seem hostile through email but when you meet them at a show they will have a completely different attitude. Don't write someone off just because they were unkind in an email. 

Somethings to think about when you are emailing other breeders that seems to really make a difference; check you spelling, punctuation and grammar. Make sure you are letting them know what you are emailing about right at the beginning and tell them you're plans for the future but keep it brief. Thank them immensely for their time and understanding. Try to keep your questions short and to the point, if they email you back and it's friendly, feel free to ask them to elaborate when they have time. Try to keep in mind that breeders know other breeders and talk. It's not unlike high school (at least with dogs), when you burn one bridge you inadvertently burn 5 more just through word of mouth and can ruin your reputation before you even get started. Keep everything friendly, if you get a nasty email and feel the need to respond be nice about it. When you do attend cat shows, have a list of people that were nice to you and helped you out. If you see them there and they aren't busy, go up to them, introduce yourself and thank them for answering your email and providing you with information. Breeders get a lot of emails and, I've noticed, things tend to stick in their mind if they're reminded about it in person. 

Also, don't limit yourself to Australia. You can email breeders in the US, Canada, Europe, etc to pick their brains. Some things will be different but they are usually minor. Two of my best breeder friends are located in a different country and we've helped each other out so much over the last few years. 

Good luck!

 

[missymotus]

A lot of breeders will only sell entires to people that they know, which is no reason to be rude of course or suggest you'll become a BYB.

You are probably better off chatting to breeders at shows, but you can also find much of the information about breed personalities online.

Also depending on the breed it can be difficult, I don't sell entires within Australia and know others who are the same.

 

[orientalslave]

To me wanting to be a breeder and then deciding what breed is back to front.  Also, the best way in my view to find out about different breeds of cats is to go to cat shows, where you can see them and talk to the owners, who may or may not be breeders.  It's far easier and more natural to talk to people about why they love their breed face-to-face than by email with someone you don't know.  Also ask about what care it needs - with Orientals they don't need grooming (stroking is all mine need), but Persians need grooming every day.

Look at the cat registry websites and look through the breeds there.  In the UK I can also see how many cats of each breed have been registered over the years.  If you start to get interested in a breed, look for the breed club or clubs on the Internet and see if they have a listing of breeders - it's far easier if you end up with a breed where there are breeders in your area.

Personally I'd suggest that if you find a breed you really like that the next step is a neuter - hopefully a show quality neuter that you show.  In showing a cat you get to know what they should look like, you see a range of colours and patterns (well not if you go for Singapuras!), and you make contacts with breeders who get to know you, and get to know you are interested in breeding quality cats.  You might find you change your mind about 'the breed' - I did.  My first pedigrees were Asians, then I saw a lovely Havana at a show and was sold on Orientals.

At least in the UK, showing is pretty much essential for new breeders.  You get to know people, they get to know you, and nothing beats seeing a cat in the flesh over seeing photos, which might or might not be good and might or might not show the cat's flaws as well as it's good points.  And again in the UK, doing some stewarding for 'your breed' is well worth doing - you get to handle the cats, and you learn more about the breed (and others) from doing so and from the judges.  Must say though, some judges are great and one can learn buckets, others treat their stewards as dog's bodies.

I'd also recomend you foster a pregnant cat (or several, though one by one) so you see kittening and the kittens develop until they are leaving to be rehomed.  You will find out a lot about the reality of kittens and how well it fits into your lifestyle, and you will be helping the rescue while you are about it.

And I second the point about spelling, punctuation and grammar.  Some email clients have a built-in spell checker, if not consider composing your email in Word (if you have it) and then copy & paste the checked text into the emailer.

Once more in the UK, most breeders I meet at shows are of the older generation so spelling etc. are more likely to matter, and a number of them are not at all Internet-savvy.  My friend my two Orientals came from struggles to download photos from her camera to her PC, so I'm about to install TeamViewer on her PC so I can control it remotely from home!  The point is that with similar people, there is nothing to beat meeting them in person.   

 

[mr bengal]

Keep attending the shows, decide on what breed you want and then buy the best foundation stock you cab afford.

Some breeders can be stand offish because they see you as competition..

Find a good vet that well not bleed you dry.  Many vets do not care for breeders, so it may take some searching.  You need to learn to do your own inoculations.

You need a stock of supplies for kitten care, feeding, health, heating pads (kittens like heat) don't forget toys.  The more you interact with your cats the better personalities they have.  I try and give kittens 3-5 hours a day of attention.  Daily handling, playing by 3-4 weeks and clipping claws, and grooming as required.

I use large condos (wire cage), 3.5ftX6ft for birthing.  The queens go in at 55days.  They normally stay with the kittens until at least six weeks.  These need to cleaned at least twice daily.

I have about 20 years total as breeder, a small operation, 5-7 litters a year.  I still learn something new with every litter.

Good luck with your new endeavor.

 

[p3 and the king]

I am not a breeder but last year, I wrote a research paper on Persian Breeding and most of it was information I had gotten from breeders.  Many feel they need to discourage new potential breeders because there are so many homeless cats out there put down in shelters every day... Purebreds included.  Most are from BYB's who didn't really care in the first place most were breeding to make some money off of their animals.  Plus, most of my breeders reported people such as yourself that would approach them at shows or by email doing the same thing you are.  Most had not done their research so they are very "green."  This makes them appear silly and naive to breeders.  So they are going to be standoffish.  Because they are protective of their breed and lines.  Because they don't want to create anymore BYB's.  Because you don't appear to have it together.... They are not going to take you seriously.  It's like a scientist going to the committee to ask for funding but has no plans or prototype to show them.  Just has an idea but no ideas on how to even start.... Would you take it seriously and fund it? 

So,

#1.  Pick a breed.

#2.  Do your research- EVERYTHING.  Know all you can about the breed.

#3.  Have a passion for it and don't appear to think in any way that you'll become rich being a breeder... This is a red flag to them.

#4.  Approach them with a breed, a plan, knowledge and passion... Maybe then you will be able to find a mentor to help you get started.

Good luck!!!

 

[orientalslave]

<snip>

#1.  Pick a breed.

<snip>

And in some breeds pick your colour(s) and / or pattern(s).  If you know exactly what you want to breed you stand a chance of starting from the right place.  For example, if you want to breed self cats, a tabby isn't the right foundation queen, and vice versa.  However if Singapuras tickle your fancy then it's easy - they come in only one colour and one pattern!

 

[ciggggg]

thankyou everyone so much for your thoughts and advice. Looks like i still have alot more research to do and many big desicions to make... I wont approach breeders untill im sure what i want! Theres a cat show happrning at the end of may in my area so i will go to that just as a spectatre, i will listen carefully to te judgings also. mayind a breed be in fewdmonths when i finally find the breed that i know is for me i will stadt asking some more advice from breeders. I can definately ubderstand now why some breeders would treat me that way. i guess i would probably do the same..thabks again guys. its been a real eye opener for me

 

[ciggggg]

sorry for the horrible spelling/grammar. im typing this on my phone and the curser keeps going all over the place! ahh lol

 

[missymotus]

Find a good vet that well not bleed you dry.  Many vets do not care for breeders, so it may take some searching.  You need to learn to do your own inoculations.



I use large condos (wire cage), 3.5ftX6ft for birthing.  The queens go in at 55days.  They normally stay with the kittens until at least six weeks. 

The best way to find a good vet is to ask other breeders where they go, and depending on which state you are in self vaccinating is illegal in some states. Many prefer to have a vet do the vax anyway, as s/he also does a full health checkup at the same time.

I personally don't cage my girls, they give birth in my bedroom. I take leave from work when they are due and they never give birth alone, until a few days before due date they live in the house with the other cats. I leave kittens with their mum until they leave home at 12+ weeks old. I do use a kitten pen once the kittens can climb out of bed, but the girls have free access to the entire room, it's just used until the kittens are litter trained.

So you see, there are different ways of doing things. Likewise with controlling your breeding girls cycles, in Europe using the pill is very common, I use acupressure on my girls, other breeders keep a vasecomised boy.

 

[nekochan]

A lot of breeders will only sell entires to people that they know, which is no reason to be rude of course or suggest you'll become a BYB.

You are probably better off chatting to breeders at shows, but you can also find much of the information about breed personalities online.

Also depending on the breed it can be difficult, I don't sell entires within Australia and know others who are the same.

I don't know, personally I've found a lot of breeders are too busy at shows to want to talk much, or just don't seem interested in discussing things with people they don't know. The only breeders I found who would really talk to me where ones that had available kittens that were at the show. That's been my own experience anyway... My sister recently attended a show because they're planning to get a purebred kitten and they found a lot of times the breeders were just not at their benching tables or if they were they were too busy to talk.

 

[orientalslave]

Listening to the judging might well not mean much at present, and I suspect it won't tell you much if anything about the general personality of the breed.  Personally I would leave doing that until I've got a good idea of what breed I'm interested in.

My view is you want to find a breed you love first - and cross fingers it's something straightforward with plenty of other breeders.

 

[lestaterys]

Hi,

I breed ragdoll cats and am relitivly new too it. I got my first breeding queen less than a year ago but before then i was researching ragdoll breeding for roughly 5 years. Breeding isnt easy and i think long standing breeders are very careful with new comers, having said that i dont think there is any reason why breeders needed to be rude to you.

There are seminars around the world and these are very good to get you started as you will meet new breeders and long standing ones, I f they meet you in person then you may get futher with them. Cat shows are good for the same reason but you will also get to look at lots of different breeds and talk to their owners.

I can give you information on ragdoll cats and would happily but im still learning my self but im happy to share my experience with the ragdoll breed. only i live in england so i dont know if that would be any use to you. But happy to help if i can. contact me by PM should you like a chat.

regards Amanda xxxx