Frustrated by male cats "bathroom" behaviors

[jenlynn71]

I have two male cats and a male dog.  All are fixed and have lived together for years.  In fact, the cats are very bonded with one another.  However, my youngest cat-- Kadin-- does not always get along with the dog.  The dog seems to think that Kadin is the Omega of the pack and will bark and chase him out of a room on occasion.  Kadin has never been hurt in any way, but his bathroom behavior has slowly been evolving in more negative ways.  First, he started to urinate in the bathroom sink.  Then, he added in the shower as well as the sink.  Then, he progressed to the kitchen sink... and twice urinated on the stove.  Now, as well as continuing to urinate in the kitchen sink, he is spraying the wall and a piece of furniture in the Dining Room and defecating along that same area.  He still occasionally uses the litter box.  There does not seem to be anything significant that I can tell about that wall (not near a window or in an area used by anyone).  

I have had him checked out physically by a vet who specializes in cats.  Kadin is healthy.  I have tried various litter boxes-- tops on, tops off.  We have three in the house right now, all safely stashed away from the dog.  We have tried all sorts of litter, some quite expensive.  We have tried Feliway.  We even tried putting a variety of scratching posts along that wall so that Kadin could "mark" the area in a more acceptable way.  This worked for a time, but yesterday he urinated fully (not a little spray!) on one of the cardboard scratching toys.  

Of course, my thought was he was upset about the dog and was showing signs of anxiety.  I have four cat trees for Kadin and his brother to use as escape routes, scattered throughout the house.  They are allowed now to get on kitchen counters, and I have given up eating at a table.  However, nothing seems to work... and it is really hard to keep my house clean and sanitary.  

HELP!  Any ideas?

 

[hexiesfriend]

Yep this is testing I know. I had a cat that started this one day and I kept enzyme cleaner and a rag by the door because I knew it was clean up time everytime I came home from work. Mine marked in the same 4 places every single day. I assume a UTI was ruled out for yours? I am not sure at one point medications may be considered. I wish in hindsight a vet made that suggestion to me because I would have tried anything. Maybe someone can chime in on the protocol for introducing pet meds to this kind of situation. It looks like you have exhausted all things here. Did the vet offer any advice?

 

[jenlynn71]

Thank you for the reply!

Unfortunately, there does not seem to be any medical reason for the behavior that we can find.  I think the next option is to try anxiety medication.  I hate this, because I suspect that Kadin will be harder to pill than his brother, who takes three pills a day to manage the symptoms of IBD (and is a gentler cat, but still makes it a 3 xs a day struggle).  However, I am at my wits end.  He defecated on the carpet just this morning.  I think it is time we go for a return visit to the vet.

Someone suggested I may need to retrain Kadin to use a litter box by keeping him closed up in a small room with a litter box.  But, that seems like it would be very traumatizing-- especially as he would be separated from his brother.  Has anyone tried this?  Did it help at all?

 

[2cats4me]

 
Thank you for the reply!

Unfortunately, there does not seem to be any medical reason for the behavior that we can find.  I think the next option is to try anxiety medication.  I hate this, because I suspect that Kadin will be harder to pill than his brother, who takes three pills a day to manage the symptoms of IBD (and is a gentler cat, but still makes it a 3 xs a day struggle).  However, I am at my wits end.  He defecated on the carpet just this morning.  I think it is time we go for a return visit to the vet.

Someone suggested I may need to retrain Kadin to use a litter box by keeping him closed up in a small room with a litter box.  But, that seems like it would be very traumatizing-- especially as he would be separated from his brother.  Has anyone tried this?  Did it help at all?

Do you have a room that you could make just for the cats ?  Put a cat tree  , beds ,  a few litter boxes .. Maybe put  one of those gates ( with the little pet door at the bottom ) in the doorway to keep the dog out but the cats can still come and go .. . This is what we have at our house . The cats love having their own room ..

 

[biancavd]

From what I understand, it seems that Kadin is the "leader" cat in your house. It's basically "his" house. However, your dog is assaulting him on his territory, which will give your cat more reason to pee all over the place to leave his scent to let everyone know it's his territory and his alone. He choses whom he shares it with.

It's either that, or he's under a lot of stress because of your dog. That can also cause them to pee everywhere. I'm guessing it's the first though. (I didn't take medical things into consideration, as you said he has already been checked on that).

I unfortunately have no idea how to stop him, as it's his natural behavior. Is he an indoor cat?  You can consider allowing him outside and hope that he finds a good spot to mark himself outside. I personally wouldn't lock him inside a room with a litter box, because to me that's just cruel. But I can completely understand how frustrating it is to have your cat dirtying your house everywhere.

 

[catpack]

It sounds to me that Kadin's behavior is due to stress from the dog. He is doing his best to mark his territory to tell the dog that this is his home too.

Do you have a spare room that you could dedicate to the cats that is 100% off limits to the dog? I would put 1-2 Feliway diffusers in the room and 1-2 outside the room, but in close proximity. I know it took 12 continuous weeks of using the diffusers before I saw ANY benefit. Now, if the diffusers run out, I can tell.

You could try confining both cats to their room for a week and see if this helps Kadin. I think he needs a big confidence boost and to know he has safe places to reside WITHOUT the stress of the dog. You may need the added help of anxiety medication as well, so another vet visit is still a very good idea.

If in doing these things Kadin begins using the litter box again, you likely need to reintroduce Kadin to the dog.

Has the dog received any formal training? Can he get in a "down" position and stay put? If not, would also be a good idea to work with a trainer so that the dog becomes less of a threat to Kadin.

 

[jenlynn71]

I would love to do that, actually, but I don't think I have a room.  I do have a baby gate up so the cats can go in and out of one of the bathrooms (which is their main designated litter box area) and the dog cannot come in.  My dog likes to "snack" in the litter box, so I had to come up with a way to keep him from surprising Kadin in a vulnerable position!  It has been up now for about a year and a half.  The newer, downstairs litter box is a "Buddha Box," which keeps the dog out.

I did put a cat door on a closet and tried putting another litter box in there.  Kadin's kitty brother had not trouble going in and out (although this was not his preferred box), but it freaked Kadin out.  After several weeks, it became clear that neither was going to use this litter box because of the cat door.

I suppose, if you mean in an attempt to "retrain" Kadin to use the litter box, I could temporarily redesign the guest bedroom into a cat haven for both cats and close them in there.  I, admittedly, hate to do this as it is typically a "no pets allowed" room and completely carpeted.  It is the one room that has not been urinated in, defecated in, or vomited in!   

I hate the idea of closing them off from the house and family for days on end if this is not likely to work.  I just don't know if anyone has found success with this method.

Thanks for the idea!  It is something to think about...

 

[2cats4me]

 
I would love to do that, actually, but I don't think I have a room.  I do have a baby gate up so the cats can go in and out of one of the bathrooms (which is their main designated litter box area) and the dog cannot come in.  My dog likes to "snack" in the litter box, so I had to come up with a way to keep him from surprising Kadin in a vulnerable position!  It has been up now for about a year and a half.  The newer, downstairs litter box is a "Buddha Box," which keeps the dog out.

I did put a cat door on a closet and tried putting another litter box in there.  Kadin's kitty brother had not trouble going in and out (although this was not his preferred box), but it freaked Kadin out.  After several weeks, it became clear that neither was going to use this litter box because of the cat door.

I suppose, if you mean in an attempt to "retrain" Kadin to use the litter box, I could temporarily redesign the guest bedroom into a cat haven for both cats and close them in there.  I, admittedly, hate to do this as it is typically a "no pets allowed" room and completely carpeted.  It is the one room that has not been urinated in, defecated in, or vomited in!   

I hate the idea of closing them off from the house and family for days on end if this is not likely to work.  I just don't know if anyone has found success with this method.

Thanks for the idea!  It is something to think about...

I understand , but  if you could bring yourself to just  try it and it works it would be worth it ..  You would not have to lock the cats in the room . You can buy doorway gates that have a little cat door built into the bottom so the cats can come and go as they please ..  Well good luck , I hope you can find a solution ..

 

[jenlynn71]

Thank you!

 

[jenlynn71]

Update!  I took Kadin in for another "let's be double sure" check up-- and he actually tested positive for a UT infection and constipation!  So, we are first going to try to treat these things, then look at re-litter box training if this does not help.  He peed on my house plant and carpet this morning...

 

[catpack]

Hope Kadin feels better soon! And hope the meds take care of the litter box issues.