Does this sound shady, or is it just me?

carolpetunia

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Our Dylan was spayed by the SPCA the day before we met him, at eight weeks. At the time, we didn't know enough to even question whether that would affect his development.

But rather than being smaller than normal, Dylan has grown into a huge, lanky cat, so heavily muscled that he moves with the ponderous grace of a lion. He weighs about 18 pounds, and he's mostly a great big mush who climbs into Mom's lap during the evening news and sleeps sprawled on his back in the middle of the floor... but of all our cats, he's also the one who is the most "wild" -- the one who can genuinely frighten you if something upsets him. He rarely gets angry, but when he does, he's capable of real violence. We all know to back off if Dylan snarls.

Whether all of this has anything to do with his pediatric neuter, I don't know -- but it has always been my suspicion that he has a lot more testosterone than a neutered kitty should!


All of our other kitties were neutered between four and six months, except for Abby, who came to us at almost two years old, after having a litter of five (one of whom was my Clydie). They're all at least ten-pound kitties, but smaller than Dylan -- and none of them are wildcats like Dylan, either. I don't know whether that means anything or not, but it's always made me wonder about the efficacy of pediatric neutering.
 

nightcats

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Originally Posted by TortieBaby

"Thanks, Nicole. I appreciate the time/energy involved with caring for the kittens and the advise youâ€[emoji]8482[/emoji]re receiving. I am a licensed wildlife rehabilitator and know the time and commitment it takes to hand raise the little ones without their Moms. (Also I am a board certified veterinary anesthetist, just so you know my back ground in this quest.) In all honesty there is no reason for a kitten to not be anesthetized if properly supported on IV fluids, heat and appropriate anesthetics provided. Many shelters do the spay and neuters on young animals of 4 weeks of age. Itâ€[emoji]8482[/emoji]s easy (of youâ€[emoji]8482[/emoji]d like for me to) to find that info for your vet and give it to them if they are interested.. Itâ€[emoji]8482[/emoji]s called preadolescent gonadectomy. Its standard and accepted practice so the offering would be to have the tail and amputated and removed young (within the two week window you speak of) and have her spayed at the same time. Itâ€[emoji]8482[/emoji]s not really to save you money although its an added benefit…. but to allow the kitten to have proper anesthesia and analgesia for removing her tail segments which are cartilage/bone. Itâ€[emoji]8482[/emoji]s hard because a lot of vets thing because something is small they donâ€[emoji]8482[/emoji]t feel pain or are more susceptible to anesthetic risks. I do open chest anesthesia on 3 week old puppies and kittens regularly with very low mortality rates to correct congenital heart/pulmonary defects and if those guys can be anesthetized, pretty much anything can with care and conscientiousness.

For me, the issue isnâ€[emoji]8482[/emoji]t about money itâ€[emoji]8482[/emoji]s about the quality of life for the animal long term. It is best to remove the tail I am sure due to tissue necrosis but also because of increased pain thresholds proven in the literature on young animals (Dobermans, rottweilers, etc) who have tail docs and dewclaw removals without anesthesia/analgesia and their lower pain threshold scores later in life. Itâ€[emoji]8482[/emoji]s been proven if theyâ€[emoji]8482[/emoji]re sensitized to it early, it has lifelong effects on them.
And also, the FELV/FIV test is not worth spending the money on until they are 16 weeks old. This is because the tests will yield false positives if the kittens have an upper respiratory infection or have an exposure to FelCoV (which is any virus in the distemper family) so it will not prove they do or do not have the diseases.

Just trying to offer the best possible options and help you make the best choices with all the options that are available."


I'm sorry, but who in there right mind would regularly spay 4 week old kittens?!?!?!?! That's horrible! That is NOT a "standard and accepted practice". Why do youthink so many vets and shelters make it very clear that kittens are required to be 8 weeks old and weigh 2lbs before getting spayed?!?!
Nicole,I hope you dont mind me being so personal with your first name but this e-mail you had, sent the hairs on my neck into breakdance...seriously.

I agree 3-4 weeks is extremely young,Very few vets do it younger than 6 months of age in the UK.3 weeks of age is sending them to their death IMO.


The first thing I want to point out is the fact that IF she was a certified anaesthesist she would have reffered to herself as an Anesthesiologist,that is the correct term and in my experience if someone goes through the expense and years of training they want to be acknowledged as the qualified person they are,They certainly do not like to be termed in the laymans term as an anaesthetist.

The second thing is she is trying to overwhelm you with info by saying about tail docking and the removal of dew claws..what she is saying is completely irrelevant because taildocking and the removal of the dew claws is done at NO MORE than three days old(previously in the uk-because daildocking is illegal now)but my point is she is making out it is acceptable to have dew claws removed and tail docking at weeks old when that is just cruel.
The reason taildocking is done at 3 days is because the ligaments in the dew claw and the tail have not fused so is less painfull for the animal.

Thirdly anybody who does so much open heart surgery would have been reffered to in refference manuals and therefore there would be some record in online veterinary medical refference librarys.

Nicole your instincts have given you a warning please dont ignore it.

I found this while I was searching you may be able to check out who she is.
An Anesthesiologist is a dedicated vet who specialises in anaesthesia so you may be able to check her out here if shes listed,but if shes not then I would send them an email.
http://www.acvs.org/VeterinaryProfes.../FindaSurgeon/

In case anyone from the UK is reading this and is concerned about a vet or nurse they can see if they are registered here...

Vets: http://www.rcvs.org.uk/Templates/sys...p?NodeID=89634


Nurses:http://www.rcvs.org.uk/Templates/sys...p?NodeID=89645


JUST TO ADD..a nurses name removed from the register may mean they have now taken further qualifications exceeding their nurse status(eg vet) if in doubt please contact the registry holders (RCVS)
 

diego

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Nightcats said exactly what I came back to say.

Do some research and inform vet and vet nurse registries of this imposter.

And I reckon you are going to spend a few times more than $100 on those kittens, so no $100 isn't too much.

Glad you have blacklisted that lady.

ETA: She also seems to really talk about things and go into a little more detail than necessary.
I'm not sure if you asked her any Q's but I get the impression she volunteered all that to you.

In my experience (and thats just me) Skilled people no matter what profession do not go into depth about things without being probed by someone first.
 

silentnate

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Originally Posted by white cat lover

The fact that she would want the kitten at 3 weeks to "hand raise" is awful! They need to either be with mom, or if they're already being bottled be with littermates.....not moved all over!
Agreed. I wouldn't let this woman have a kitten if I was a breeder.
 

jellybella

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Originally Posted by silentNate

Agreed. I wouldn't let this woman have a kitten if I was a breeder.
Agreed. Just the tone of that email is creepy. Too clinical...makes you wonder why she wants them so young and intact. I would also wonder why someone with so many vet connections would need to get your kittens (I know my vet has so many available these days, there's a cage of them in the lobby).

Listen to your gut.

As far as the adoption fee goes, no $100 isn't too much, especially if you can provide a breakdown of how much you've already spent on them (shots, sp/neuter, food, etc).
 

silentnate

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Originally Posted by JellyBella

(I know my vet has so many available these days, there's a cage of them in the lobby).
Thank goodness our vets doesn't do this- Epona would have filled our apartment up by now


Originally Posted by JellyBella

As far as the adoption fee goes, no $100 isn't too much, especially if you can provide a breakdown of how much you've already spent on them (shots, sp/neuter, food, etc).
$100 is very cheap for a kitten in England, I think your outlay should make this fee more than acceptable
 
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tortiebaby

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Thank you all for your support. Just to let you know, I sent her back an email telling her how sick I think it is that she would dare to make it a normal thing to spay/neuter kittens at such a young age. I also told her a couple other things, lol.

She wrote back saying" thanks and good luck with you kittens". Haha!
I guess I scared her away. Yippee!


Originally Posted by DIEGO

I'm not sure if you asked her any Q's but I get the impression she volunteered all that to you.
No, I never asked her anything. All I kept saying was "no" to her and so then she went into this long essay. Grrr.... I guess she's not used to not getting her way.


Oh yeah, did I mention that she never did fill out the questionaire(screening form) that I sent her? That was my #1 warning sign.
 
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tortiebaby

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Originally Posted by JellyBella

Too clinical...makes you wonder why she wants them so young and intact. I would also wonder why someone with so many vet connections would need to get your kittens (I know my vet has so many available these days, there's a cage of them in the lobby).
Good point, I never thought of that!
 

jellybella

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Originally Posted by silentNate

Thank goodness our vets doesn't do this- Epona would have filled our apartment up by now
Thank heavens DH came with me to the vets last time, or there would have been one more little black and white girl in our house
 

diego

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Originally Posted by TortieBaby

She wrote back saying" thanks and good luck with you kittens". Haha!
I guess I scared her away. Yippee!


Oh yeah, did I mention that she never did fill out the questionaire(screening form) that I sent her? That was my #1 warning sign.
Well thats interesting. And hey good on you standing your ground.
 
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