Distemper vaccine linked to kidney failure in cats?

[tailzzz24]

I can't post a link yet because I'm new here, but how many people here are aware of this link?

I lost several cats to kidney failure over the years and truly regret vaccinating them for this and other diseases. Apparently the distemper virus is cultured in kidney cells, and eventually the immune system becomes confused, attacking the kidneys.

Is this link common knowledge? I just learned about it maybe 2 years ago.

 

[lillydsh]

I stick with the AVMA standards for vaccination. They know what is best for cats. I have heard about the distemper vaccine possibly causing immune system or kidney problems.

Kidney failure is most often caused by a sudden, serious drop in blood flow to the kidneys.

Here is Lilly's vaccine history:

8-Weeks: Feline Distemper, Feline Rhinotracheitis, Feline Calicivirus, Feline Chlamydia

10-Weeks: Feline Distemper, Feline Rhinotracheitis, Feline Calicivirus, Feline Leukemia

12-Weeks: Rabies

14-Weeks: Feline Distemper, Feline Rhinotracheitis, Feline Calicivirus

1-Year: [if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:WordDocument> <w:View>Normal</w:View> <w:Zoom>0</w:Zoom> <woNotOptimizeForBrowser/> </w:WordDocument></xml><![endif]Feline Calicivirus, Feline Chlamydia, Feline Distemper, Feline Rhinotracheitis

2-Years: [if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:WordDocument> <w:View>Normal</w:View> <w:Zoom>0</w:Zoom> <woNotOptimizeForBrowser/> </w:WordDocument></xml><![endif]Feline Calicivirus, Feline Distemper, Feline Leukemia, Feline Rhinotracheitis

3-Years: [if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:WordDocument> <w:View>Normal</w:View> <w:Zoom>0</w:Zoom> <woNotOptimizeForBrowser/> </w:WordDocument></xml><![endif]Rabies

 

[vball91]

Is the link you are referring to www.catinfo.org? Written by a vet, it has a great section on vaccines. I didn't know this information until about a year ago. I will never blindly vaccinate any pets ever again. I do believe that vaccines have their place, but their use in pets has to be examined more closely.

 

[lillydsh]

I vaccinate against feline distemper, as it can be fatal to cats and is a very serious disease. Kidney failure is usually caused by a sudden, serious drop in blood flow to the kidneys. It is also caused by damage from medications, poisons or infections. I have heard of feline kidney proteins in vaccines being a risk factor for immune-mediated diseases, though. If interested, here is Lilly's entire vaccine history:

8-weeks: feline distemper, feline rhinotracheitis, feline calicivirus, feline chlamydia

10-weeks: feline distemper, feline rhinotracheitis, feline calicivirus, feline leukemia

12-weeks: rabies

14-weeks: feline distemper, feline rhinotracheitis, feline calicivirus

1-year: feline calicivirus, feline chlamydia, feline distemper, feline rhinotracheitis

2-years: feline calicivirus, feline distemper, feline leukemia, feline rhinotracheitis

3-years: rabies

 

[sarah ann]

Lilly- there is a university studying the link between vaccination and kidney disease. The results suggest that vaccines may cause kidney disease.

I believe, but I'm not entirely certain on this,  that the eye drop/nose drop FVRCP vaccine is not a risk as it was not developed using kidney cells.  You may want to double check that.

 

[tailzzz24]

vball91, no, that wasn't the link, but I've bookmarked it because it has a lot of great info. Thanks!

I agree with Sarah Ann though, especially with indoor-only cats. The makers of the vaccine don't care if they're killing cats - all they care about is the $$$ And if vaccines are so effective, why must cats receive a lifetime of boosters? Also, I haven't received vaccines since I was a child, which begs the question: are the makings of the feline immune system that much different than that of a human that they require annual boosters to maintain effectiveness? Look at how they market flu shots to humans - my doctor actually requests an exemption every year from the flu shot, and she's willing to lose her job over it if necessary. If I could undo all of my vaccines and that of my pets, I would do it in a heartbeat.

 

[Winchester]

Once our cats are finished with their kitten shots, we give no vaccines, except for the rabies vaccine....and that's only because it's a state law here. Our vets used to push the vaccines, but they're not even that willing to push them anymore. I remember when one of our vets lost one of his cats to sarcoma, caused by a vaccine. And there was one time when we had given Banshee (our Rainbow baby) a vaccine and she developed a very bad lump at the shot area. 

That was it. No more shots. They get rabies vaccine and that's it. The vet put a sticker on each of their hospital charts that they are not to get any vaccines, other than rabies. They're all indoor cats.

I agree that many of the vaccine makers are interested in the money. And I also think that, after a while, there's so much of the vaccine built up in the cat's body that repeated vaccines are not necessary. As vball91 said, vaccines do have their place and I won't deny that. But I also think it's something that each pet owner has to decide for him/herself what to do for each cat.

 

[flintmccullough]

Mine are show kittens, and the shows require it, altho, there is no vet check, but, they have a higher degree of exposure. My brother has a show dog, German Shepard, altho he doesn't show. We were discussing vaccines, and he said his breeder told him, that we over vaccinate our pets, cats and dogs. I have no idea, what the rules of dog shows require. The kittens go in Fri for their rabies boosters, its the law, and I will ask my vet about this. 

 

[tailzzz24]

My cats haven't even had their rabies shots - they're overdue. But they've had chronic GI issues, so the vet hasn't pushed any vaccines on me or even mentioned them when I take my cats in - all I get for them is the occasional vaccine reminder in the mail. For similar reasons (chronic health problems) a vet once wrote me some sort of excuse from the required rabies vaccine for another cat I had that was in renal failure. So if you have a pet with chronic health issues, you can always use that as a way to avoid even the rabies vaccine. Just ask your vet for an excuse. If my own doctor won't take a vaccine and is willing to forfeit her job for it, that's telling. I have to wonder what the rabies vaccine is grown in anyway. Bottom line, my cats aren't getting it unless I'm caught, at which point I'll pay the fine and beg my vet for an excuse.

 

[denice]

I personally think that the kitten series and 1 year booster for distemper is necessary.  It's a really nasty virus that we can bring in on our shoes.  There was someone here not to long ago with a 7 month old indoor kitten that had it.   The kitten did survive, probably a combination of being 7 months old and his owner having the resources for the cat to be hospitalized for a few days initially on an IV.  He was really kicking himself for having neglected getting those initial shots for distemper.

After the one year boosters I do agree that vaccinations should be carefully evaluated.

 

[maewkaew]

 The risk of panleukopenia (aka  "feline distemper"  or "feline parvo" or "feline infectious enteritis")  can be fatal too and is very easily spread,  and survives quite a while in the environment.  So I definitely do the kitten series.    Really if the last shot in the kitten series is given at 16 weeks or over,  there probably is not a need for a 1 year booster since by 16 weeks the maternal antibodies should have cleared and the kitten's immune system should be mature enough to make a good response.     But I can see still doing the 1 year booster.   I agree with Denice that further  boosters should be carefully evaluated,  considering that there is a good chance the immunity lasts for life. 

     I don't think the same is  true for the other 2 vaccines usually done together with it -feline viral rhinotracheitis and feline calicivirus.  but they do seem to last at least 3 years.     so one could just continue to get those separately.

 

[lillydsh]

If your cat comes in contact with another animal that has feline distemper and isn't immunized for it, your cat is going to get the virus. But, the virus can also be spread through insects and fleas. Kittens are more likely to acquire feline distemper than adult cats. Cats with distemper will develop a high fever. Prevention through vaccination is the best way to prevent disease.

 

[flintmccullough]

Just so ya all are aware, because I already been thru this, and it depends on the laws of your states. A vet excuse might keep ya from going to jail, or the cat sezied, if caught without the rabies certificate. But.....*if* the kitty should bite you or worse, bite someone else, accident or not.....doctors and hospitals are required, by law, to report any animal bite, cat, dog, racoon, any animal.  You will be contacted by the Health Dept, and asked for the kitties rabies certificate. Ya call your vet, they fax it over, have a good day.

*If* for any reason, ya don't have one, and they don't care why, the kitty is seized, and quarinteened, at your expense.

The vet excuse, won't get you out of that.

One of mine bite me, when I was combing her, she doesn't like it, I knew it, but wasn't paying attention. The vet faxed over her rabies cert, Health Dept said have a good day.

When one of mine had to be put down, he was in severe pain and scared. He bit the ER doctor. Even tho he was a show kitty, even tho he had his rabies cert, even tho he did not have rabies......they still had to send his head out to a lab, because, he was being put down, it is the law, believe me, I looked it up. Got a nice letter, he didn't have rabies, ah.....I already knew that. 

Bad enough there was nothing more they could do, bad enough I had to lose him, he was only 5 yrs old, but to have to have that done to him, I don't wish that experience on anyone. 

The rabies shot used to be given every 3 years, now it is given every year. Something about it being adjuvented, something about making the shelf life longer, but it caused sarcomas, others can prob better explain it. 

FVRCP, commonly referred to as the "distemper" shot, used to be given every year. Now it is given every 3 vets, as vets feel, we are over vaccinating, and its good for 3 years.  Found that out, the hard way, when one kitten was given the shot, and the other wasn't, and they go in at the same time, for everything, they have since they were 8 weeks old. Now their shot sched is screwed up. My fault, for not paying better attention, to their shot records.  Now each kitten has their own folder, and I pay better attention. 

   

 

[lillydsh]

After receiving the distemper vaccine, some cats will become lethargic. Anaphylactic shock is possible, but rare. Some cats will develop a mild fever, too. Some will even get a watery discharge from their eyes. In very rare instances, a cat may develop nasal ulcers.

 

[tailzzz24]

The rabies shot is every year again??? I didn't know that. Still, I think I'll take that risk. My cats are both indoor cats. Neither is an escape artist (had one of those in the past). And I already know that if the cat bites someone it gets reported, learned that recently. My sister's husband actually had that happen about a month ago, and they reported it. I think her cat was vaccinated though, so everything was okay.

But if that ever happens to me, I'll tell the ER that a stray did it. I don't know what they'll do to me? - cut my head off and send it to a lab? I don't really care because it is that important to me that I don't destroy my cats' immune systems, and I truly completely entirely believe that this would be what I would be doing. I'll pay for them to be quarantined - I don't care. I could kick myself that I used to be so compliant, getting all my cats their yearly vaccines - FIP and everything. 

You don't know the feeling that came over me that day that I was surfing the internet and found an article linking kidney failure in cats to the distemper vaccine. A wave of shock, anger, regret poured over me. I'd watched 2 cats die of (basically) poisoning because their kidneys could no longer filter the toxins from their bloodstreams. The most recent died in 2010 at about the age of 10, though he'd been in kidney failure since he was THREE years old, because of a vaccine. I watched the most gentle-natured cat bare his teeth, his eyes glazed and unfocused, while having a seizure in the seconds before he died. To this day I remember those final moments even more so than his life - it was that traumatic for me, and I am angry that this vaccine has rearranged my memories to the point that this is what I remember first and most about him, watching him starve and die of poisoning, and that angry, glazed expression on his face as he was dying. I'm even crying typing this because it's making me remember all over again.

I know some people see vaccination as a necessity, the law. And that's a personal choice one makes. My decision though to forego vaccination isn't based entirely on what happened to my cats, although this was what first opened my eyes to the dangers. I've read many books since, and what I've learned is that a lot of the diseases that vaccines get the credit of eradicating were on the decline already. That the immune system can become confused later in life. That there is a great deal of $$$ to be made when fear is the driving force - fear of dying from a disease. Many of the vaccines humans receive aren't even for fatal diseases, just mere nuisances that if a person were to contract might cause a short period of discomfort followed by the benefit of lifelong immunity - for free. And more recently I learned that my own doctor was willing to get fired over a flu shot requirement. She must know something I didn't.

And what is the rabies vaccine grown in? Do they tell us that? You don't find too much either on the internet about deaths caused by rabies, at least in the US. And even outside of the US most of rabies-related deaths come from the bites of wild animals, not domesticated ones. I'd go so far as to say that there are probably 0 rabies-related deaths caused by the bites of domesticated animals that have never been left to roam free in the wild. Plus, there is a post-bite treatment. These things are just some of the reasons I choose not to vaccinate - for anything. If I could undo the vaccines that my cats had gotten as kittens in the shelter, I would.

 

[denice]

There is a three year vaccine but it isn't as safe as the one year vaccine.  The only possible way of an indoor cat being exposed is a bat getting in the house.  I know I used to think that was far fetched until a man here in Ohio died of rabies.  He had removed a small bat that had gotten into his house.  Since it was small he didn't realize that he had been bitten.

If I get another kitten which I doubt, I will probably adopt adults from here on out because I am 57 now and hope that the ones I have will live for several more years I will still get the kitten shots and 1 year boosters.  Distemper is a nasty disease which very few kittens survive.  I think it is very rare for a young kitten to survive it.  There is also a very nasty calicivirus now.  It isn't necessarily just a bad kitty cold any longer.

 

[tailzzz24]

IMG_0205.JPG

• tailzzz24
• Nov 27, 2013

This is a picture of Kermie maybe a month or so before he died.

The one below is a picture of him in the hours before he died. This is what the distemper vaccine did to him.

IMG_0209.JPG

• tailzzz24
• Nov 27, 2013

 

[denice]

I am sorry for your loss, I know CRF is an ugly disease.    I just wanted to clarify, I think there is a misunderstanding here, when I say 1 year booster I mean when they are 1 year old.  I don't mean annually.  Only the very old school vets do that.  The current recommendation is every 3 years, many don't vaccinate after the booster at 1 year.  Some people get titers done and only vaccinate if the immunity falls below a safe level.

 

[tailzzz24]

 

[ldg]

I am so sorry. :heart2: Oh how heartbreaking!!!!!!!


******************

lillydsh

I stick with the AVMA standards for vaccination. They know what is best for cats. I have heard about the distemper vaccine possibly causing immune system or kidney problems.

Kidney failure is most often caused by a sudden, serious drop in blood flow to the kidneys.

Here is Lilly's vaccine history:

8-Weeks: Feline Distemper, Feline Rhinotracheitis, Feline Calicivirus, Feline Chlamydia

10-Weeks: Feline Distemper, Feline Rhinotracheitis, Feline Calicivirus, Feline Leukemia

12-Weeks: Rabies

14-Weeks: Feline Distemper, Feline Rhinotracheitis, Feline Calicivirus

1-Year: Feline Calicivirus, Feline Chlamydia, Feline Distemper, Feline Rhinotracheitis

2-Years: Feline Calicivirus, Feline Distemper, Feline Leukemia, Feline Rhinotracheitis

3-Years: Rabies

The AVMA doesn't have standards for vaccination. They have a position on vaccination principles: https://www.avma.org/KB/Policies/Pages/Vaccination-Principles.aspx

that recommends veterinarians develop their own protocols:

The use of vaccination is essential to the health of veterinary patients as well as the general public. Medical decisions related to vaccines, vaccine administration and development of vaccine protocols are among the most complicated decisions in medical practice. Appropriate decisions concerning individual vaccine selection and vaccination program choices are best made under veterinarian-client-patient relationships, wherein the practitioner and client must determine the best patient care programs for implementation. Veterinarians should create a core vaccine program, intended for use in the majority of animals in their practice area as well as a non-core vaccine program, intended for special circumstances/situations for animals in this same practice area and consider the potential for endemic disease exposure, susceptibility to disease and risk/benefit ratios. Veterinarians with an established veterinarian-client-patient relationship are in the best position to make educated recommendations as to the appropriate core and non-core vaccine programs. Vaccine programs should consider all emigration and immigration of animals within a geographical area and the risk of disease in the clinically relevant environment. Vaccine programs should follow all governmental regulations.

Here is their brochure, which is simply based on the USDA Veterinary Biologics: : http://ebusiness.avma.org/EBusiness50/files/productdownloads/2011_Biologics.pdf

You might be interested in these articles:

The Outdated Vet Vaccination Advice That Can Harm Your Pet (written by a vet, Dr. Karen Becker)

The American Association of Feline Practitioners is actually the organization that provides vaccination guidelines: http://www.catvets.com/guidelines/practice-guidelines/feline-vaccination-guidelines

And here is their client brochure: http://www.catvets.com/public/PDFs/ClientBrochures/ClientHandoutVaccination.pdf

Rabies, as of 2013, is no longer considered a core vaccine. It is driven by laws, which are taking time to catch up to the facts. The non-adjuvanted vaccine, that has instructions to use every year, has been shown to provide three-year coverage: http://winnfelinehealth.blogspot.com/2013/06/long-term-immunity-to-rabies.html

Here is another article by a vet, with information on the issues of over-vaccination: http://www.littlebigcat.com/health/vaccination/

And specifically on the distemper: http://truth4pets.org/2012/05/cat-distemper/

The summary of the first work done by Colorado State: http://www.cvmbs.colostate.edu/insight/2004/fall2004/cats.htm

Another version ( Journal of Feline Medicine and Surgery (2006) 8, 353-356 ) : http://www.catinfo.org/docs/VaccinesNephritis.pdf

The bottom line? Distemper is a disease of young cats. If your cat is indoor-only and you don't show your cat or foster kittens, why would an older can even need the vaccination? This is why vets are given the discretion to administer vaccinations based on the circumstances of the animal.

There IS no "one size fits all" vaccination schedule for pets.

*****************************************************************

Again, Tailzzz24, I am so, so sorry. :heart2: