Chronic Heart Failure, Confusion (my Dad)

[weebeasties]

My dad was hospitalized yesterday with fluid buildup around his heart and blood pressure of 265/227. It happened suddenly because my mom monitors his blood pressure daily.
I was wondering if anyone has experience with heart failure and may be able to offer insights as the info from my internet searches differ from what the doctor said.
Three weeks ago dad started having some memory loss, confusion at random times. My mom made an appointment with a neurologist for next month. At times it seems like dementia, but other times he is fully aware. All of this came on very sudden.
When he was hospitalized I began looking on the internet for info on heart failure and repeatedly see that it can cause memory loss and confusion. When mom asked his doctor about this, he said there is no connection and dad just has dementia.
I'm wondering if I am reading too much online, or if dad has an uninformed doctor. Anyone had any experience with this?
Thanks.

 

[neely]

First, I am deeply sorry for what your dad is experiencing as well as your mom and you. It sounds like he has what is known as pericardial effusion. A B.P. of 265/227 is off the charts but I'm sure you know that. It's really difficult to say if his symptoms are synonymous with dementia, i.e. forgetfulness and confusion, or a combination of his existing heart problems but definitely wise of your mom to make an appointment with a neurologist. I don't know your dad's age but if he is older, (over 55), there are geriatric specialists who are very knowledgeable in this area. The internet can be helpful and misleading when looking up symptoms. If you suspect your dad's doctor is uninformed you may want to consider a 2nd opinion especially from the appropriate specialist at a medical teaching hospital. Best of luck, please keep us updated on your dad.

 

[AbbysMom]

I'm also very sorry you are dealing with this and have to agree with Neely that a second opinion may be best.

 

[weebeasties]

Thanks for your well wishes. Dad is doing better this morning. His blood pressure has come down and stabilized. There are other doctors working on him now and that makes me feel better. More sets of eyes and opinions is a good thing, I think.
My parents are in their 80's and I live about 1000 miles away from them so I feel a little helpless at the moment. Mom says he is doing much better though and she even held up the phone so I could hear his voice! He is deaf so he can't hear me, but hearing him was wonderful.
They also did a CAT Scan. One of the nurses said that they would see what they could do to get him to a neurologist sooner. I am feeling very hopeful.

 

[betsygee]

I'm glad you're feeling more hopeful about the situation. I always think second opinions are a good idea and I'm glad to hear there's a team working with him now. for good news soon.

 

[boney girl dad]

Sorry your family is going through this. My wife and I had similar experience with her daddy in 2016. He was 87 and also deaf. The deafness is a terrible form of isolation, making it hard for him to understand the details. There were dementia like symptoms, memory loss and hallucinations. Other times total clarity. Most symptoms were heart, oxygen and medicine related. Truly a most difficult time. Keep searching for answers and positive treatments. Most importantly, spend all the time you can manage with him.

 

[white shadow]

I was wondering if anyone has experience with heart failure and may be able to offer insights as the info from my internet searches differ from what the doctor said.

Anyone had any experience with this?
Thanks.

Hi weebeasties !

It seems that The American Heart Association offers varieties of discussion forums...some like this, some on FB........have a look: Support Network Home - American Heart Association | American Stroke Association

Hoping that might help !
.

 

[Kreatorcat]

Peace and love sent your way.

 

[raysmyheart]

weebeasties , I am sorry to hear that your Dad had to go to the hospital, but so glad to hear he is doing better today. I agree with you that more sets of eyes are a good thing and am glad to hear that he has a care team there. Please know that you are in my thoughts and prayers, I know it is hard for you.

 

[arouetta]

I'm sorry about what you are going through.

My own family experience, doctors throw "dementia" around far, far too often. It seems to be code for "I don't want to bother to find and treat the cause because they're going to die soon anyway" or for "a colleague screwed up majorly and these are symptoms of what was ignored and worsened, but if I claim it's dementia then that takes away any basis for a malpractice lawsuit".

Just as a guess there could be hypoxia involved. A heart that's struggling seems like it would have a hard time getting properly oxygenated blood to the brain cells on a consistent basis. It could explain both the symptoms and the fact that they come and go.

 

[weebeasties]

By Friday, Dad was unable to stay awake for more than a few seconds. He then began to have severe tremors. They finally realized that while he is breathing in oxygen, carbon dioxide is not being exhaled. There is lots of carbon dioxide in his blood. According to mom, it is making bubbles in his blood.
After they began treating him for that he had one good afternoon. He was awake and aware and eating well. Talking and joking with with my mom and brother.
Unfortunately by Saturday afternoon he began to decline again. Lots of sleeping and a return to the mental confusion.
They said the carbon dioxide levels have come down a lot from what they were. They are continuing to monitor him, but are either unsure of what is wrong or are not sharing the information well.
Mom continues to sit attentively at his bedside holding his hand. We fear she may collapse from exhaustion, but she refuses to leave him for a moment. I have never seen two people more in love than my parents. Completely devoted to one another. I fear that if dad doesn't pull through, mom won't be far behind. He is her world.

 

[artiemom]

OH weebeasties
I am so sorry you are going through this. My dad had Congestive Heart Failure for many years. His blood pressure was elevated, however, I do not thing it was as elevated as your dad..

I am sure your dad has a 'Team" of doctors on board, to help him.
Your mom, just loves him so much, that she does not want to leave his side..

I really feel for you..

My dad was seen by a Cardiologist and had many hospitalizations.
A common side effect of CHF, when it is uncontrolled, is a type of dementia/confusion, which is caused by the brain not having enough oxygen. The heart is restricted from pumping hard enough to provide the brain with adequate oxygen. Once the CHF, Fluid was reduced, by diuretics, his personality returned to normal.

The fluid can even be so much that it backs up things into the space surrounding the lungs:
Pleural Effusion.. that can restrict blood flow to the brain, even more..

If you understand the mechanisms, than you can realize how much "confusion", hence, what is referred to as dementia, can be attributed to CHF...

The hospital is probably going to do a full work-up to find the source of the CHF. It can be valvular disease, or a prior heart attack, even abnormal electrical system of the heart (the system which causes the heart to pump); and even check out his kidneys..

The is a very strong relationship between kidneys, and blood pressure/heart.. so strong a link..

The first line is to lower the fluid level, by fluids, and hypertensive drugs.

You dad, must have such swollen legs, ankles. These are usually the first sign of fluid being accumulated around the heart. Once stabilized, you dad will be weighing himself daily. If there is anything more than a 2 lb increase, overnight, then he will need to contact his cardiologist for treatment.. yup, that small of an increase can signify impending CHF crisis..

But... Right now, Your Dad is in the hospital, getting really good care. He is being monitored by a TEAM.. That is great.. and the TEAM will do their utmost to get him comfortable and get the CHF under control.

They have to find the source of it.. and medicate appropriately.. It is such a long, hard road..

I have been there.. although, I cannot say, how you feel, being 1,000 miles away; I know full well how stressed/anxious you are about his health..

Just remember, there are many, many, new drugs and treatments available...
The main thing is to find the source, get it under control..

People can live with CHF, as long as it is under control..

Not certain about the neurologist appointment... but, we are not there to see exactly what is going on with your dad.. change in personality is a cause of uncontrolled CHF and dementia.. these things seem to go hand in hand..

sending you tons of
and hugs

keep us updated.. you are part of our family...
love to you

hoping this helped you a bit... in understanding...

 

[weebeasties]

Thank you artiemom , not only for your sympathy but the explanations as well. Normally I would be scouring the internet to collect as much info on his condition as possible, but I am dealing with another issue as well. We received a call last week that my partner's ultrasound showed a mass. We are now waiting for a referral to an oncologist. I think my brain is sort of paralyzed by fear and worry at the moment.

 

[raysmyheart]

weebeasties , please know that I am thinking about you and praying for you. Marianne.

 

[artiemom]

weebeasties thinking of you.. wondering how you are and how things are going??

 

[weebeasties]

Thanks to everyone for their concern.
My dad does not seem to be improving. They have managed to get most of the excess CO2 out of his system, but he still just sleeps, doesn't eat, has tremors. They are attributing it to dementia and have spoken to mom about putting him in a nursing facility. She would NEVER do that.
We are still waiting for the oncologist to contact my partner for an appointment.
And now one of our cats, Isabelle, is having liver problems.
This past week has been heartwrenching to say the least. I think I'm going numb. I've been trying so hard to not cry and "hold it together" but this evening I had a moment to myself at the house to just "cry it out" and I couldn't. Just feeling empty.

 

[arouetta]

It's good that you let yourself cry. You can't always hold it in and be strong. If you try, you will have a catastrophic breakdown, probably at the worst possible time.

It's not too early to look for support groups. Not only do you and your family need each other's support and you need other loved ones to help be a rock you can cling to for a bit, you likely will also need support from those who are facing the same things; who found ways of coping with it and know of treatments that your doctors might not know of. Even without a firm diagnosis most support groups will welcome someone when something looks likely, like possible dementia and a possible tumor. If it turns out that the initial possibility is wrong, most support groups are not going to hold grudges and will actually be happy for you.

 

[JamesCalifornia]

A common side effect of CHF, when it is uncontrolled, is a type of dementia/confusion, which is caused by the brain not having enough oxygen.

~ Yes ... this is very common. Same thing happened to my mom. Antidepressant medication can help improve mood if needed.
Home care is much better than any nursing home . If your father is on Medicare that will pay for most of it. There are home care nurses that will help .
Take care of Dad - and kitty . And take care of you also .

 

[artiemom]

Oh, I am so so so sorry... I mean this from the bottom of my heart..
Being sorry does not help you, but please know that we are here for you.. If you need a refuge, if you need to vent, if you need to scream, yell, ~~~ just get things out of your system.. we are here..

One thing I did learn, from my experiences; you need to daily find some time for yourself..
Be it, just 30 min, or a good hour, just be alone.. do what ever you want.. let your mind wander.. but just be.. I am serious. I was skeptical when it was mentioned to me, but I really looked forward to that time alone.. you can be in the same house, but just close ourself off in a room ~~~ no interruptions.. just be..
Do what you feel you need to do: cry, listen to music, go on line~~~ just be..

We are here for you..
Wish one of us lived closer, where we could physically comfort you.. ((hugs))

Yes, a support group sounds good, but a on-line one may be more to your preferences.
You can read up, and get tips. I do not know if it is still in existence, but I was reading a lot
on Care.com

They are suggesting a nursing home, because of the toll it will take on your mom, to have your dad at home.. almost 24 hour care.. but, if they can get things under control, medically, he may be able to come home, with home care. The hospital can set you up with a lot of home care agencies.. while your parents may have to pay part of the fee, it may be something to look into. There are many agencies out there, and many who can provide, nursing, personal care assistants, physical therapy, etc..
While not providing care 24/7, they can help out your mom.. although at her age, it will be almost impossible for her to take care of your dad, alone...

Unfortunately, in this day and age, hospitals do not keep their patients in for an extended length of time; due to Medicare regulations and the insurance companies policies. They use a Nursing home or Rehab as an adjunct to hospital care. The job of hospitals is to just
'put out the fires' and let the NH or Rehab handle the rest.. I absolutely hate that! I cannot begin to explain how much I hate the current medical care system...

This is why there are so many home care options for: Keeping the Elderly at Home..
You may be able to look at a local PACE program. It is to keep elderly at home~~ a Federally funded program to keep seniors at home. ... and, your parents local elder services department may have some thoughts on what programs to help them out.

And lastly, if your dad is as compromised as you are saying.. then, there is always hospice.. Do NOT Freak Out at the word. They provide home care, even when a person is not terminal.. all they need is a doctor stating that the patient will never improve..It is not an immediate end of life thing... it is to comfort the patient while they are at home..

But I will get off my soapbox.

I sincerely hope I have not confused, frightened you.. you are already confused and frightened..
I really wanted to say that, I understand.. many people here, understand..
We are here for you, anytime...

((hugs)) and love...

 

[doomsdave]

weebeasties hope all's well with you and your mom, dad and partner.

Everyone's already poured out tons of good advice I can't add to.