Any Correlation Between Raw Food and Incidence of UTIs in Male Cats?

[maxkitteh]

Hi there,

My cat's been on a raw diet since 4 months, and he's 2 years and 4 months now. I've been using Primal formula as a base (for its bone and other supplements) along with raw meat (beef or pork) from the store and raw liver which I keep frozen in individual packets until it's ready for use. I also supplement with cooked, grain-free EVO for variety.

My cat, since I've had him, has had two Urinary Tract Infections. Granted, it's been 2 years, so two UTIs in two years may not be that bad.

However, my vet is eyeballing the raw diet as the culprit, and I just don't see the mechanism. If anything, his water intake is better-than-average due to meat containing 80% water by volume. His drinkwell fountain did break a couple months ago, so it could be that he was drinking more water before and that I need to get him a new fountain, but he's not a big water-drinker anyway. I just always keep him well fed and I work from home, so I don't miss his meals or anything. He loves his raw meat, especially the raw liver.

His priority: Liver, fresh and raw meat with EVO/Primal being his least favorite, though he eats everything eventually (before next mealtime). He has a good appetite.

What I really would like to have answered is this; I know there are evidence-based reasons for the raw diet for cats. What can I tell my vet via email to help convince her that I am not doing harm to my cat simply by feeding him a diet which comports with millions of years of feline evolution? Does anyone have links to other vets who do support the raw diet? My vet sells food, so I am wary of any commingling of commercial food-manufacturers and vet advice about the raw diet. Plus, a lot of people simply don't consider a lot of the facts that make our felines able to deal with the very food they thrived-on for millions of years. Cats, as I understand it, can deal with a higher bacterial load due to their short intestines, and chewing on meat (instead of wolfing down pate') actually better-prepares their stomachs for digestion.

Any evidence-based help would be great.

Other quick facts:

Max is 100% Burmese (contemporary), acquired from a breeder (due to girlfriend's suspected allergies to other cats)
I use Dr. Elsey's 'Cat Attract' litter which I keep clean
Max is an indoor-only kitty.

Thanks!

MaxKitteh

 

[sarah ann]

Some cats have a predisposition to urinary issues. An all meat diet is not going to get my one cat's urinary ph low enough to prevent him from having crystals. 

Your best bet is to look at the urinalysis. If the ph is about 6.5 or higher than yes you could have a problem. My cat's ph stays between 7 and 8.0 on any diet. He has to be on a urinary acidifier or else he gets crystals.

 

[paulinehurt]

Hi MaxKitteh,

I do not think there is anything wrong with what you are feeding him and I do not believe there is a link between that particular diet and his UTIs. Cats normally get UTIs unfortunately, quite often and this is just more common in some cats than others. Obviously, it is possible that there is an underlying problem, but if he has only had 2, he might just be a cat that will get one each year and all you can do is treat them. Sounds to me like you really know your stuff and what you are doing, so if I were you, I would just use my best judgement and do what you think is right for him. I know of a few cats that have had one UTI per year and there is not much that can be done about it. If he is well taken care of and there is absolutely nothing in his life and environment that can be causing it, there is not much you can do besides treat the UTIs when they come. Let me know if you have any other questions and/or comments.

Cheers,

Pauline

 

[maxkitteh]

Thanks for the insights, and it does make me feel better. Any further insight is welcomed. I suppose there's not much more I can do. I will see about getting him a new fountain post-haste, since I know moving water tends to stimulate cats to drink a bit more than they otherwise would. That should help.

I just gotta make sure my vet isn't letting some kind of raw-food paranoia interfere with our treatment. Also, she cited the opinion of a 'nutritionist', but a 'dietician' is actually authority with far more training. Is there such a thing as a pet dietician? I don't know.

I'll take the nutritionist's advice with a grain of salt (heh) unless there is a very compelling and evidence-based reason how I could reduce the incidence of UTIs in my kitteh.

Thanks again!

MaxKitteh

 

[katluver4life]

Some cats are genetically prone to UTI's. Stress can also induce a prone cat to getting one.

Though wet/canned/raw and lots of water is the most beneficial diet for these cats, there are also factors within those diets that may need to be looked at. Mainly the phosphorus ratio. You may want to try and find meats or canned foods lower in phosphorus. Unfortunately I'm not good at all in explaining the technical side of that, though we do have members who can.

 

[vball91]

First, here are links to sites written by vets that do recommend raw feeding of cats. You can find a lot of information there. Also, there are links to studies that support a species-appropriate diet in the Raw & Home-Cooked Cat Food forum. http://www.thecatsite.com/t/263955/helpful-resources-raw-home-cooked-cat-food-forum

http://www.catinfo.org/

http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/real-food-for-healthy-dogs-and-cats-cookbook.aspx

http://www.littlebigcat.com/nutrition/easy-homemade-diets-for-cats-and-dogs/

In terms of urinary health, it is actually quite rare (less than 2% of all FLUTD cases) for actual bacterial infections to be the cause, especially in younger cats. Did your vet do a culture & sensitivity test to determine the type of bacteria and the best antibiotic to treat it? It is possible that the bacteria was not fully eradicated and remained imbedded in the bladder walls. Here is some info on FLUTD and UTIs.How far apart were the infections? How is his GI health (normal stool)? And what are his grooming habits like?

http://www.catinfo.org/?link=urinarytracthealth

http://healthypets.mercola.com/site.../prevent-urinary-tract-infection-in-cats.aspx

 

[ldg]

Urinary tract infections are actually rare in male cats. Was an actual bacterial infection detected?

Or was the problem determined to be crystals present in his urine? Because that's not an infection, and can be controlled by controlling his urine pH. A raw meat diet naturally targets the proper urine pH - UNLESS there are other factors, which can be chalked up to genetic proclivity or, basically, stress. We have 8 cats on a raw diet, 3 are males that previously blocked (one several times, and we almost underwent the PU surgery for him). On raw, none of the males are having problems with crystals, but my highly strung female needs help controlling her urine pH, which I'm doing by controlling her stress.

It would help if we knew if you were talking about crystals, urine pH and an inflamed bladder, or an actual infection.

 

[maxkitteh]

Thank you for the links!

For the record, anything from Mercola is not something I would trust, nor would I give hits to that site. Mercola is a known crank, quack, pseudoscientist, etc.

I'm looking for links from DVMs or dieticians. I'll Google as well, and some of these other links will be helpful!

MaxKitteh

 

[ldg]

It's the Mercola site, but it is not Joseph Mercola. It is Dr. Karen Becker (D.V.M.) who is a vet that runs the pet wellness on the Mercola site. Here is her own website: http://www.drkarenbecker.com/

If you don't want to give hits to the Mercola website, you can buy her book:
Catinfo.org is written by Lisa Pierson, D.V.M.,

LittleBigCat is written by Jean Hofve, D.V.M.

These are the links vball91 provided, I'm just clarifying WHY the links are to sites written by vets that endorse/embrace raw feeding.

Here is another one by Andrea Tasi, VMD (D.V.M. just written differently - it means they graduated from University of Pennsylvania) http://feline-nutrition.org/health/a-vets-view-andrea-tasi-vmd

Another one is Dr. Elizabeth Hodgkins, the U.S. leading expert on feline diabetes: http://www.yourdiabeticcat.com

 

[ldg]

And it would still help if we knew if you were talking about crystals, urine pH and an inflamed bladder, or an actual infection. (You might have missed my first post above yours, as we posted at the same time).

 

[Willowy]

I believe there are tweaks you can make to a homemade diet to make it more suitable for a crystal kitty. less magnesium? Or something. I'll see if I can find something about that.

And it wouldn't hurt to add some extra water to his ground food. The more the better---might help flush the nasties out.

 

[ritz]

Yes, very important to know precisely (and I do mean precisely) whether it is an infection--bacterial or otherwise; crystals, what type of crystals, etc.
Ritz (female, around 4 years old) is prone to UTIs, in her case, stress induced. When I brought her in to the vets for her third suspected UTI in around 2.5 years, the vet said, if this is a UTI "we" may have to talk about a change in diet. I've been feeding raw for almost two years and I was seeing red (through my tears).
Blood work came back positive for a UTI--for e-coli, not for crystals. In her case, according to the vet, she licked the area where she pooped, then licked her vagina, and the bacteria got into that area.
Methionine is a natural acifidier, turkey breast is particularly high in it. If you go that route, write back, and people more knowledgeable than I can give you the doseage.
I think the website catinfo.org is particularly useful for vets: a vet talking to a vet.
There are holistic vets who are more open to raw feeding; you might look around for one. Perhaps that vet has a website with articles on it you can send to your vet.