Did the Siamese possibly see another cat out the window? I've read that if they can't take their aggression out on the cat they saw they will turn to the other cat inside.
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Aggression Between Sibling Cats
- Thread starter jensmar
- Start Date
There is a (large) list of possible cat stressors on this site
I suggest you buy toys with cat nip already in them. I have 2cats that play hard with the cat nip toys. as all cat owners know that cats LOVE cat nip, and that is what gets my cats playing hard so they can get tired. I got my cat nip toys off of Amazon and went to Pet Smart. hope this advice helped you!!
Bonniewood, I found this site in my rigorous googling after my cats' terrible incident on Saturday:
http://www.animalhumanesociety.org/training/library/aggression-household-cats
It lists types of aggression and possible reasons. I *think* my cats are going through #3, fear-based aggression? But it was so out of nowhere that I'm not positive. I hope this site helps. Boy, after all the educating myself I've been doing about cat behavior since Saturday, I think my next career will be as a cat behaviorist. :-(
I took Ira to the vet Monday morning and she took one look at what a wreck I was and insisted that I board Ira until my friends arrive next weekend to take George away. It's not ideal, but it's brought me some peace and sleep and George is SO much happier. I'm looking forward to bringing Ira back this weekend, and working on him and preparing him for George's return. Some of this might be medical stuff, but I haven't heard yet from the vet on results of bloodwork and ultrasound they are going to do on him. He's lost 2 pounds in 2 months, so that's not a great sign, and they do feel a mass in his abdomen that they felt a couple of months ago, but they do say it's not growing. We'll see. I'm trying to think positive thoughts and not catastrophic ones. My dad is a retired clinical psychologist whose specialty was anxiety, so I'm lucky that he's kind of reminding me that I have to eat and sleep and not spiral into negative catastrophic thinking. Ugh. I appreciate all the help on this forum!
CatGirl, I will try out some catnip toys. I've had mixed results in the past, but I am willing to try anything. I definitely want to try one of the feather on a string toys that I see on My Cat From Hell all the time. Those seem to be universally loved by cats.
TDOnline, you are one dedicated cat parent! I'm so glad your sleep routine worked and I'm sure they are happy to have you back from your trip.
http://www.animalhumanesociety.org/training/library/aggression-household-cats
It lists types of aggression and possible reasons. I *think* my cats are going through #3, fear-based aggression? But it was so out of nowhere that I'm not positive. I hope this site helps. Boy, after all the educating myself I've been doing about cat behavior since Saturday, I think my next career will be as a cat behaviorist. :-(
I took Ira to the vet Monday morning and she took one look at what a wreck I was and insisted that I board Ira until my friends arrive next weekend to take George away. It's not ideal, but it's brought me some peace and sleep and George is SO much happier. I'm looking forward to bringing Ira back this weekend, and working on him and preparing him for George's return. Some of this might be medical stuff, but I haven't heard yet from the vet on results of bloodwork and ultrasound they are going to do on him. He's lost 2 pounds in 2 months, so that's not a great sign, and they do feel a mass in his abdomen that they felt a couple of months ago, but they do say it's not growing. We'll see. I'm trying to think positive thoughts and not catastrophic ones. My dad is a retired clinical psychologist whose specialty was anxiety, so I'm lucky that he's kind of reminding me that I have to eat and sleep and not spiral into negative catastrophic thinking. Ugh. I appreciate all the help on this forum!
CatGirl, I will try out some catnip toys. I've had mixed results in the past, but I am willing to try anything. I definitely want to try one of the feather on a string toys that I see on My Cat From Hell all the time. Those seem to be universally loved by cats.
TDOnline, you are one dedicated cat parent! I'm so glad your sleep routine worked and I'm sure they are happy to have you back from your trip.
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this is really helpful to hear, MikeLI. I'm kind of thinking of 2014 as the YEAR I get me cats back together. Reading about your experience and TDOnline's experience makes me realize I just need to be patient and do a little bit each day. I'm really determined to work hard and get them back together, even though I am realistic and maybe their relationship won't ever be the same as it was before the fight.
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I am going through almost the exact same situation with two of my cats. Before this incident they were best buddies (see my profile pic of them in better days). Approximately a month ago they got into a huge fight that escalated before I could separate them. I am not sure who started it as I did heard it but did not see it. I initially thought this was redirected aggression but now I think it was territorial aggression. They are both around 4 and apparently this happens sometimes when cats reach maturity.
I then kept them totally separate from each other for a few weeks (This was around the holidays). I consulted a behaviorist immediately because it stressed me out so bad. I also talked to my vet and she prescribed Prozac for both boys. At this time I began doing the sock exchange and brushing each with the same brush. They both were initially a little reactive but then were able to sniff the sock and be brushed with no problem. I attempted to let them explore the other's room but that was too much too fast. They were very hissy/growly so I backed off.
Fast forward a few days after talking with the behaviorist....I began letting the cats out individually for free roam time with my third cat. One was initially a little hesitant and would smell everything and want to hiss at the other's closed door. He evenutally calmed down and now is relaxed in the living room. He also began to ignore the other's door so I was able to leave him out during the day while I was at work.
My other boy is a whole different story. When I let him out he just paces and paces and meows and meows. If he hears the other boy in his room scratching or meowing he makes a beeline for the door and gets all puffed up. This has caused me to put up baby gates in the hallway so he doesn't fixate too much on the door and get even more agitated. I play with him and give him treats in the living room and just try to let him get used to things. I know his behavior is because of all the stress and change that has happened recently. He is calm and sweet in his room.
Two days ago I decided to start the stressed out boy on Prozac that was prescribed by my vet. About 2 hours later after the first dose he went crazy. Screaming/howling running around and growling. It sounded like a cat fight. I was so concerned that he would attach my third cat in the process because he was so upset. I read up on Prozac and apparently this can be a side effect. I was hoping that the medicine would help to calm him, but I sure can't put him or me throught that again. No more prozac or drugs for us.
I am afraid to let him out of his room again because he was so worked up the other night. I"ve heard that cats can associate the site of an incident to bad memories. The other boy could immediately sense what had gone on in the living room the next day and began to hiss.
I don't want to resign to keep the stressed boy in his room forever.
Does anyone have suggestions for me given these facts? It's good to hear positive stories. I know this will be a slow process and I am willing to wait. I also know that they need to set the pace. It just stresses me out so much.
I then kept them totally separate from each other for a few weeks (This was around the holidays). I consulted a behaviorist immediately because it stressed me out so bad. I also talked to my vet and she prescribed Prozac for both boys. At this time I began doing the sock exchange and brushing each with the same brush. They both were initially a little reactive but then were able to sniff the sock and be brushed with no problem. I attempted to let them explore the other's room but that was too much too fast. They were very hissy/growly so I backed off.
Fast forward a few days after talking with the behaviorist....I began letting the cats out individually for free roam time with my third cat. One was initially a little hesitant and would smell everything and want to hiss at the other's closed door. He evenutally calmed down and now is relaxed in the living room. He also began to ignore the other's door so I was able to leave him out during the day while I was at work.
My other boy is a whole different story. When I let him out he just paces and paces and meows and meows. If he hears the other boy in his room scratching or meowing he makes a beeline for the door and gets all puffed up. This has caused me to put up baby gates in the hallway so he doesn't fixate too much on the door and get even more agitated. I play with him and give him treats in the living room and just try to let him get used to things. I know his behavior is because of all the stress and change that has happened recently. He is calm and sweet in his room.
Two days ago I decided to start the stressed out boy on Prozac that was prescribed by my vet. About 2 hours later after the first dose he went crazy. Screaming/howling running around and growling. It sounded like a cat fight. I was so concerned that he would attach my third cat in the process because he was so upset. I read up on Prozac and apparently this can be a side effect. I was hoping that the medicine would help to calm him, but I sure can't put him or me throught that again. No more prozac or drugs for us.
I am afraid to let him out of his room again because he was so worked up the other night. I"ve heard that cats can associate the site of an incident to bad memories. The other boy could immediately sense what had gone on in the living room the next day and began to hiss.
I don't want to resign to keep the stressed boy in his room forever.
Does anyone have suggestions for me given these facts? It's good to hear positive stories. I know this will be a slow process and I am willing to wait. I also know that they need to set the pace. It just stresses me out so much.
Have you tried any flower essences, Composure, feliway plug in or feliway spray. All can be very helpful. You can try Rescue remedy or take a look at Jackson Galaxy's Spirit essences. I have found really good luck with Composure liquid Max. It's not a drug, but does relax the cat. I found that when I first started I had to double to dose and give it 2x a day. I gave it to both cats to start, but found only the more aggressive cat needed it after a few weeks. They do sell Composure feline treats too, but I have found the liquid works much faster and is also better.
I have had to keep my boys separated for months. Introductions had to be very very slow and I have to do the entire process over again twice. I have found that you cannot move to the next step until the current step is completely hiss/growl free and the cats don't seem agitated.
Also take a look at some of the suggestions by Jackson Galaxy. Here is one link http://jacksongalaxy.com/2010/10/01/cat-to-cat-introductions/ You can also look at his site or go to the section on "My Cat From H*ll" He deals with very difficult cats and has some great ideas.
Here is another article where he talks about medication
http://www.naturalcatcareblog.com/2...ats-per-square-foot-and-you-interview-part-2/
Having cats that don't get along is one of the most stressful situations. My two have been having issues off and on since mid August. I finally had things under control and from the beginning of Nov until Christmas we were having peace. Then while being gone for 2 days over Christmas, the aggressive cat had a fit that he was kept in a room alone. He had food, water, toys, litter box and all his comfy beds. This is also the room he sleeps in at night. Once out of the room when we returned he went nuts. He kept attacking our other cat. Now 2 weeks later, things are better, but he is still not back to normal yet. I am dosing him with Composure again and using flower essences again. Progress is being made and peace is returning.
Keep us updated.
I have had to keep my boys separated for months. Introductions had to be very very slow and I have to do the entire process over again twice. I have found that you cannot move to the next step until the current step is completely hiss/growl free and the cats don't seem agitated.
Also take a look at some of the suggestions by Jackson Galaxy. Here is one link http://jacksongalaxy.com/2010/10/01/cat-to-cat-introductions/ You can also look at his site or go to the section on "My Cat From H*ll" He deals with very difficult cats and has some great ideas.
Here is another article where he talks about medication
http://www.naturalcatcareblog.com/2...ats-per-square-foot-and-you-interview-part-2/
Having cats that don't get along is one of the most stressful situations. My two have been having issues off and on since mid August. I finally had things under control and from the beginning of Nov until Christmas we were having peace. Then while being gone for 2 days over Christmas, the aggressive cat had a fit that he was kept in a room alone. He had food, water, toys, litter box and all his comfy beds. This is also the room he sleeps in at night. Once out of the room when we returned he went nuts. He kept attacking our other cat. Now 2 weeks later, things are better, but he is still not back to normal yet. I am dosing him with Composure again and using flower essences again. Progress is being made and peace is returning.
Keep us updated.
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Thank you for replying! I forgot to mention that I am using feliway diffusers in each isolation room and the living room. I am using the spray as well in the living area. I have also have been putting resue remedy in their wet food each day. They have no problm eating the food but I can't say that I have noticed a change in behavior. I will look up the composure liquid and treats. I had not heard of these before.
I will also look into the flower essences. I admit to being a bit skeptical of these, but it's worth a try....especially since the medicine had such a bad side effect. Has anyone on this site seen success with the essences?
Slow and steady wins this race I know. I just need to work on myself to not be so anxious. This affects them I know. My poor babies....I love them so much and don't want to hurt them by putting them into stressful situations again and again.
I will also look into the flower essences. I admit to being a bit skeptical of these, but it's worth a try....especially since the medicine had such a bad side effect. Has anyone on this site seen success with the essences?
Slow and steady wins this race I know. I just need to work on myself to not be so anxious. This affects them I know. My poor babies....I love them so much and don't want to hurt them by putting them into stressful situations again and again.
I have used lots of essences. From Spirit Essences I have used Bully Remedy, Peacemaker, Self Esteem, Stress Stopper, Safe Space for Cats and Feral Cat Rehab. From Green Hope Farms I have used Jealousy and Outburst from their Animal Collection. Ordering from them is a bit quirky as you pay with a check after you receive the order and order through email. Yet their essences are top notch.
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one more thing that I am curious about regarding reintroductions when I feel my cats are ready...Has anyone done the re-introductions alone? I am single and don't always have someone to help me. If I try to feed them on both sides of the door I would have to feed one then go get the other and attempt to feed him outside the door. I wouldn't be able to see how they are both doing. Also, I wonder if using a crate will stress them out, plus there is the challenge of letting them see each other and getting agitated before the feed/play begins.
I have done alot of the reintroductions alone, but on occasion I have had some help. You could use 2 baby gates stacked on top of each other to keep the cats apart but still watch them. I found using a screen door was easier. I bought a cheap wooden one from Lowes ($20) and attached it to the door frame with cheap tension rods ($4). This keeps them apart, but allows them to see each other as well as you being able to see them. It can easily be put up and taken down. I have pictures of my set up if you'd like to see.
I also used a large dog crate. One of my cats was more than happy to go inside, but not the other one. So it really depends on the cat. If it would stress them both out it's not a good idea then. When using a crate and/or screen door, you would want to keep the interactions very short. Start with one minute and move up from there. You want to try and end each session before they get agitated. Reward them both with yummy treats saved especially for this time. I often used plain cooked chicken. Sometimes it is necessary to really wear out the more aggressive cat first. Have a huge play session with him so that he is tired. This will help to start the interactions in a postive way.
When ours weren't ready to see each other I would get the cat locked in the room to the door by calling her and sliding my fingers under to make sure she was there then I would talk to the other one beside me slide treats under the door and give one to the other, I did this for a few days then I would put some wet food outside, get in the room( hold a pillow or something so the other can't get in and can't see the other),give the one inside some wet food call cats name outside open the door an inch so they can see each other( brace it with your knee) and give them each treats, this is associating them with each other and good food..there will be hissing and growling but the treats will help,Don't forget to take the wet food and treats when you go in the room,it can be tricky to get in but maybe distract the other(throw a toy or something)( stopping with a pillow worked for me) and quickly get in.maybe put the wet food and treats inside earlier somewhere the cat can't get to inside a cupboard? So you arn't carrying too much later when you go in
I am in the same position and am also worried, living alone. This is one of the reasons I'm thinking of hiring a cat behaviorist to help me with the reintroduction of my cats. I really want help kind of figuring out the nuts and bolts of it. How to separate my small apartment into halves and what to do, exactly, when it's just me. I don't think there's one right answer. The folks in this forum have been really amazing at helping me begin to think through the steps. I think some of it will just be trial and error, there's no way of getting around it. And also, just recognizing that it may take a long time.
That screen door idea is great!
Next time I need to introduce the babies,and I mean that literally lol,I will try that
The way I did it I put one in the bedroom and one would have the rest of the place and switch around every 3 or 4 hrs so you can be with both when you are home,and hopefully one can stay in your room all night and not wake you or you may need to put in the bathroom.
To switch around I got a leash and harness($15) and tie the one up that is going to go into the bedroom somewhere that it can't see the one coming out,and shut the one coming out in the bathroom then untie the other and put her or him in the bedroom. It is time consuming but works to separate them without visual contact
Here is how I did the screen door. I also have a gate across the threshold for extra protection.
Update on our Kayla and Jenny,it has been about a month together now, cuddling a lot chasing each other,it is usually Kayla (the small one)chasing Jenny until Jenny has enough and give a little hiss,lol
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First of all, I think you are right to consider a cat behaviourist, as I think it would definitely help. I know there are behaviourists that you can contact online if you can't find one in your area. As to what is causing the aggression, I think the behaviourist needs to assess the specific situation, especially if there are triggers to the aggression or specific areas that it is taking place. All I can say about location is that it's my understanding that if any of the places where fights most often occur are near windows, then it's possible the aggression is territorial, and is being redirected from one cat to the other since they cannot reach the cats they see outside. With regard to the rewards, they work the same way for cats as for dogs--it doesn't have to be food if this concerns you, it can be affection or praise. Spray bottles are counterproductive, since they only teach the cat to be afraid of the spray bottle or of the person using it, and in any case negative reinforcement is ineffective with cats. Distraction is more effective for individual incidents, although it is not a long-term solution. I also have to say that shutting one cat into a bathroom while you are out of the house is only likely to make the aggression worse, and is unfairly restrictive to the cat. Sorry I can't give you any pointers about the cause of the aggression, but I would strongly suggest following up with the behaviourist to deal with this issue.
