6 Things I Learned from Our Ringworm Plague (book length....)

[rosiet]

Bunnelina good suggestion on the cold air not a bad idea for sure…. I'll think on that one. Might be worth a shot I could go room by room and open all the windows for a day or so….

I'm wondering also if instead of washing the walls again, if vacuuming the walls would be a better idea. Maybe I need to go really crazy on vacuuming… How often do you change the vacuum bags? AlsoI wonder if an air purifier that has a HEPA filter would actually be a good idea? And it wouldn't be wasted money as it would be a good thing to have for the future…. I've been trying to find any research on air purification systems related to ringworm and haven't found much… Ah I know I"m sounding desperate I just feel like we need to change the way we've been cleaning if Izzy has it again…. Thanks again!!!

 

[bunnelina]

You could swiffer the walls (microfiber, etc., is supposed to trap spores) or vacuum them.

I have a Miele vacuum cleaner with the HEPA filter and I didn't change the bags until they were full. With five cats and two shabby Persian rugs, I only get about two vacuumings before I fill a bag these days. The bags are "self-sealing" and multilayered, and the HEPA filter is designed to trap particles as small as ringworm spores, so when you vacuum, you're theoretically cleaning the air and trapping the spores. I did talk to at least one knowledgable person at Miele to confirm that the filter and bags trapped ringworm spores. And, as they recommended, I replaced the filter when we finally got the all-clear.

If you don't have a HEPA filter vac, that's what you could consider getting next. A regular vac will just send the spores flying back out the exhaust. Mine became my favorite "weapon." We had a very close relationship. For weeks, I thought nothing of tipping my huge sofa backwards with one hand so I could vacuum the underside of it with the other.. But ever since, we can only stand to spend time with each other about once a week.

If you already have a HEPA vac, I think you can relax. If you're interested in air purifiers because of allergies and other issues, you can call a company's customer service line or email them to request some facts.

I'm still hoping Izzy doesn't have it....

 

[rosiet]

Thanks Bunnelina, we do have a good HEPA vacuum that I bought with also self sealing, it's a Kenmore Progressive. I Just got home and am a mess.... Izzys spot has gotten worse and visually I'm almost certain it's ringworm. I feel utterly overwhelmed. I think we should wash all the clothes in our closest... What was the detergent you used? most of the clothes I cannot wash in hot water and only warm water and dry on low heat. I think I'll wash all the clothes and only leave a few out and put the rest in bins so they are out of sight....

 

[bunnelina]

Does Izzy go in your closet? If not, I don't think you need to worry so much about your clothes. Get rid of dust bunnies and do the usual cleaning in there. We use a lot of garment bags because we have moths, but I didn't worry about the things that weren't in bags.                

I used ordinary detergent and that Health Guard laundry additive (?), the one with Vibax, which is supposed to kill ringworm (and possibly everything else, including us). I made a dilute solution and sprayed it around the house, as a mist.

We have a condensation dryer that gets the clothes pretty hot, and I used that a lot. I fried everything that could take it, especially the sheets and Indian bedspreads covering our upholstery and bed.

Am I right that it's only Izzy who has any signs of ringworm?  How many of you are there, animal and human, and who has had what?

 

[rosiet]

Thanks Bunnelina just bought a gallon of the Health Guard. I know I seem crazy right now just trying to cover every loop hole possible as how she could have gotten re-infected....Izzy is the only one showing signs, fortunately me and my husband and Oscar have not yet. But we are dipping Oscar as a preventative. Oscar hopefully will stay negative (he was the original carrier when we adopted him). I will never adopt again without asking or testing for ringworm that's for sure!!! Thanks again!!!

 

[rosiet]

Cleaning question... I'm rethinking how we have cleaned walls and floors. For the walls we sponged them with Lysol multipurpose spray and water. Do you think it would be more effective to vacuum the walls? I think people mentioned they had swiffered the walls but since we have previously washed them would vacuuming be most effective for removing spores?

With the floors all our floors are wood. We have been vacuuming, then steam moping, and then bleaching and then moping with water to remove the bleach.. I feel like the bleaching might not be effective since wood is porous?

Thanks again !!!!!!

 

[bunnelina]

Wow, Rosie. I'm amazed at the amount of work you have done. I'm not sure how effective dilute bleach and Lysol are at killing ringworm spores, although cleaning that carefully surely did wonders for getting rid of every kind of dirt, including ringworm spores. I think both vacuuming or swiffering should be all you need at this point, because you have really deep-cleaned your place. 

The problem seems to be that Izzy isn't getting cured, not that she's picking up more ringworm from your house. Oral medication will eliminate ringworm throughout her system, making her an "unwelcome environment." The rest of you are fine, and have been fine for a long time — so you are clearly doing a great deal that's right. I think Izzy just needs more oral medication, and all the good things you can provide to keep her very happy because A) she's been through a lot and she deserves it and B) a contented, stress-free cat will have a stronger immune system.

And I think you need to stop worrying about what you haven't cleaned. You've DONE a GREAT job! Ringworm is just very, very unfair. I think you guys should spend this weekend at the movies or something. No more bleach.

 

[andreanora]

I have been dealing with this ringworm nightmare for 5 months. I adopted two kittens and Thoth since they were checked out by a vet, they were safe to have out in the house. So my two boys got it, me, my husband and new born baby. Then my 15 year old cat. No signs n our dog. My son got a quarter size spot on his head. I treated my kittens in a quarantined bathroom. Results after treatment
Completed on kittens said negative. Testest my old cat, inconclusive, testing several more times with hair falling out, finally came back positive. I am treating kittens and keeping them caged on my patio, old cat in quarantined bathroom.
I bleach my floors, vacuum with my Kirby, wash everything I can with hot water and add bleach. Always scrub after contacting area of the cats. Bleach door handles. And pathways after leaving the area. My old cat is not getting over it. And just today found a bald spot on one of the kittens that was dipped three times now since I found out my old cat still has it. I bleach the patio and Area I dip and hold the cats. I just want to cry. I don't know what else I can do. I want this nightmare to end.

 

[bunnelina]

Andreanora, I'm sorry you are going through what you accurately call a "nightmare." Many of us on this thread have been where you are and got through it, getting back to normal life with cured cats and family members. And you will, too! It will happen. Don't give up. And always keep in mind that ringworm isn't fatal. It's just disgusting and annoying and hateful. There are other threads you can read here by people losing their cats or litters kittens to fatal infectious diseases. Believe it or not, you are fortunate. I will take ringworm over panleukopenia or FIP any time. Also keep in mind that some people say that ringworm will cure itself given sufficient time. Meaning that if you did nothing, it would eventually go away. That's small comfort, I know, but there WILL be an end to it, I promise!

You might consider trying some different things since what you've been doing isn't getting/keeping everybody cured. You must be exhausted after all this time! There are some vets who have had a lot of success with particular treatment protocols, even in shelter situations, which are the very worst places to try to handle a ringworm outbreak.

A strategic approach using the latest knowledge and the most effective treatments is the way to go. Have you read this article, posted here on The Cat Site?

http://www.thecatsite.com/a/ringworm-in-cats

It's a good place to start. You might be familiar with some of it, but you might find some new ideas there. 

There's a link in that article to another article about cleaning. Vacuuming and swiffering often are better than bleaching selected areas, since you are dealing with airborne spores, not viruses or germs. You don't really need to kill them (although I know how very much you WANT TO. I do!). You just need to gather them up and get them out of your place. Cleaning doorknobs is not going to help much; think of ringworm spores as being like dust mites. They are teensy, they fly around all over the place. They are in our environment all the time and most of the time they cause no trouble at all. It takes a certain set of conditions for ringworm to develop. Animals with weak (older, ill cats) or developing (kittens) immune systems get ringworm when they are exposed to a high concentration of spores.

That article explains it better than I can. There is a lot of bad info on the web but if you google "Karen Moriello" and "ringworm" you will find a lot of very useful info from one of the top vets dealing with the issue.

I hope some of the other folks who've posted here will chime in with some thoughts, good wishes, and encouragement. Keep us posted on how you're doing and let us know if you have questions. Hang in there!

Bunnelina

 

[bunnelina]

 
Why do you write that we should NOT get the generic Sporanox? Can you share a link to any website that shows proof that the brand name is more effective? The animal pharmacy Road Runner online compounds the Itraconazole oral solution at their facility and supplies countless vet clinics. They only carry the generic Itraconazole to do this and it is $54 per 150 ml bottle versus $350 for the Brand name Sporanox,  same amount I have been quoted from other pharmacies online. My vet says the generic is fine as well...so I am very interested in your source of proof on Brand name being more effective. Thank you for taking the time to put together a wonderful list of helpful "to do's" weapons in this war against ringworm. And it is war... me against the spores. They must all be eradicated!

My source for the recommendation to use the brand-name Sporanox and not the generic came from Dr. Karen Moriello's writing, generally believed to the country's expert on feline ringworm treatment, especially in shelter situations. 

Here's a quote from a 2013  paper summarizing the treatment options. She didn't write it but her work is among the sources. 

RINGWORM IN CATS: THE ECSTASY & THE AGONY Valerie A. Fadok, DVM, PhD, Dipl. ACVD
Gulf Coast Veterinary Specialists
Houston, TX, USA 

Several options exist for systemic therapy of dermatophytosis. Griseofulvin is no longer recommended for routine use in cats due to its potential for bone marrow suppression when used at the doses required to resolve dermatophytosis. The gold standard has been the use of itraconazole at 10 mg/kg/day. When used for 21 days daily, this drug was shown to be safe and effective, and after that time, it can be used on a pulse basis, giving it daily for one week, breaking for one week, then alternating weeks on with weeks off until the infections is resolved. What has become clear is that Sporanox brand must be used (in the USA); when itraconazole is compounded into liquids at compounding pharmacies, failure can occur. It is believed that these compounded itraconazole liquid products are not well absorbed. Less expensive alternatives include the use of terbinafine 30-40 mg/kg/day or fluconazole at 5-10 mg/kg/day. Ketoconazole tends to be more toxic to cats, and we have seen some failures associated with ketoconazole treatment of animals with ringworm, so it is not recommended. 

 

[rosiet]

I have been dealing with this ringworm nightmare for 5 months. I adopted two kittens and Thoth since they were checked out by a vet, they were safe to have out in the house. So my two boys got it, me, my husband and new born baby. Then my 15 year old cat. No signs n our dog. My son got a quarter size spot on his head. I treated my kittens in a quarantined bathroom. Results after treatment
Completed on kittens said negative. Testest my old cat, inconclusive, testing several more times with hair falling out, finally came back positive. I am treating kittens and keeping them caged on my patio, old cat in quarantined bathroom.
I bleach my floors, vacuum with my Kirby, wash everything I can with hot water and add bleach. Always scrub after contacting area of the cats. Bleach door handles. And pathways after leaving the area. My old cat is not getting over it. And just today found a bald spot on one of the kittens that was dipped three times now since I found out my old cat still has it. I bleach the patio and Area I dip and hold the cats. I just want to cry. I don't know what else I can do. I want this nightmare to end.

Hi Andreanora, 

I feel so bad for you!! You sound exactly like how I sounded a few months ago when we were on our 6th month of treating ringworm. I have learned a lot since than and will share with you my experiences and recommendations - we might have gotten extreme towards the end with treatment but I didn't want to deal with it anymore!!

Humans:

Treating people should be much easier than treating the cats. I would whipe down any ringworm spots on my body with rubbing alcohol first and let the skin dry. This really dries our the area which ringworm hates (ringworm loves moisture). Once the area is dry, apply Lotrimin cream I bought the ULTRA version. Do this three times a day. Also shower twice a day if you can and really wash all the areas on your body. I you do this with your self and your family you should be all clear in 4-5 days. Also wash all your towels, and bath matts, and shower curtain in hot water every other day until your spots have cleared up. 

Cats:

The fun part…. Bunnelina give amazing advice, she was my huge source of help throughout this process so def. follow her recommendations above. Like she said, ringworm is more like dust and pollen - imagine these spores floating around in the air and falling on horizontal surfaces. If you think about it that way it helps a lot - as vacuuming aggressively is really your best fighter. Buy a GOOD vacuum that catches particle microns up to .3 with a Hepa filter. Literally vacuum every surface of your house including walls, ceilings, floors. Use the hard surface tool for ceilings and pretend you are vacuuming a floor. Vaccum door surfaces, base board trim - literally anything you can. This will suck up and trap a lot of the spores because ringworm spores are 5-8 microns in size. Bleaching… I regret that we did as much bleaching as we did. It is toxic to cats and people, and very bad for anything that is porous. Instead of bleach I ended up buying accelerated hydrogen peroxide (gallon size) and you can dilute your own mixture. I filled a spray bottle with the diluted mixture and used this for cleaning any surface (cages, windows, hard surface flooring, countertops). It does not smell, and kills ringworm in 5 minutes. I wish I had found the stuff earlier. http://www.revivalanimal.com/Accel-Disinfectant.html

Cat dipping….

We were aggressive with dipping it is the most effective way to kill ringworm. Our vet and what I read online was to dip all the cats twice a week. We bought a gallon of the lime and sulfur dip on amazon, and went through two gallons over our 6 months of treatment because our older cat also got it bad. We learned a lot about dipping… 

1. Use 1 cup per gallon of water dilution this is a 1:16 ratio and is the recommendation. 

2. DO NOT pre wet the cats or shampoo them prior to dipping. I wish I learned this earlier but it takes away the effectiveness of the dipping. 

3. Buy a storage tote instead of a bucket, this will give you more room to have one person hold the cat, and the other person to apply the dip. 

4. Buy a garden sprayer like this: http://www.homedepot.com/p/RL-Flo-Master-1-gal-Economy-Sprayer-1401P/100188485

It will make it much easier to load this up and soak into the skin of the belly and back of the cat. 

Use a sponge around the head, we tried a rag at first but it drips into the cat's eyes too easily. DO NOT get this stuff in their eyes, it can cause blindness. I got it in my eye once and realized that it literally  burns!!!!

5. Put a cone on the cats and let them air dry. Once they are dry remove the cone, and brush them lightly to remove loose hair that they will other wise ingest. 

Medication….& Cultures...

1. If any of your cats are still getting positive cultures, you need to get them on medication in addition to the dips. If you are using both you will speed this up. Are you doing any medication currently? We had great success with Terbinafine, it is inexpensive and I could pick it up at CVS for about $1 a day pill. We gave our cat a 3/4 pill of 250mg of Terbinafine once a day. Our cat was VERY picky so I would hide it with a spoon full of food, or wrap it in cheese and turkey a recommendation from Bunnelina. 

Once you don't see any new spot forming, go for another culture. We were doing a culture called a PCR ask your vet about it. We got results in 3-5 days instead of having to wait two weeks. It was more expensive (about 100$ a culture) but I felt like it was worth it instead of cleaning for another week when I didn't know if I needed to be or not.   "polymerase chain reaction (PCR) molecular test for rapid diagnosis of ringworm that uses new testing materials to specifically detect the DNA of M. canid"

Mental advice… this will pass. It seems like the worst thing ever and I can't even imagine how hard it is with children. Just try to focus on not thinking about how horrible this is, and put your stress and energy towards eradicating it through vacuuming, washing clothes in hot water and hot dryer, and dipping the cats twice a week. You will be done with this all before you know it.!!!!! and PLEASE ask us any questions. I'm no expert myself, but I have been through it and can offer you the best advice that I know! 

Best of luck and it will pass !

Websites: I found this website to be really useful, a little crazy over kill but the best bet if you are treating for as long as you have been. http://www.sheltermedicine.com/node/56

 

[rogue22912]

Hi I am new and my new 3 month old kitten just got ring worm and I have a question he was out playing with my two other cats a week before I went to the vet for his last round of shots when they discovered ringworm and my other two have not shown any signs of it. Do i still have to keep my kitten in a different room

 

[bunnelina]

Hi there,

Alas, dealing with ringworm can be pretty complicated, even though it just a fungus.

To answer your question, I suggest that you start by talking to your vet to find our what he or she thinks you need to do to treat the fungus. Does your kitten have a mild or severe case? Have all three cats been cultured and what do the results say?  Keep in mind that the ringworm spores are airborne, so if the kitten has been living in your house and with your other cats for days or weeks, the spores are already everywhere... so quarantine is not always a wise thing to do. But opinions vary on that.

Dipping all of your cats in lime sulfur solution will help protect any cats who don't have it, while it effectively treats the cats who do.

I'd suggest you read two excellent articles about ringworm posted here on The Catsite. Here's the first one: 

http://www.thecatsite.com/a/ringworm-in-cats

In that article is a link to a second article about housecleaning, since that is a huge part of the ringworm treatment. 

While I've got your attention, let me just say that it's great to hear from someone who doesn't seem to be in a total panic, as most of us were, when we first posted here! Keep calm and don't spend much time googling "ringworm," and follow the instructions you get from your vet (or that you find here, if by chance your vet isn't that up-to-date on treatments) and you'll all be fine... in a little while. In the meantime, you'll find support and advice here! Keep us posted!

Best,

Bunnelina

 

[rogue22912]

The vat said to keep them apart but I don't see why if they already been exposed per chance. I am waiting to here back from the vet as to what the culture says but he did glow under the black light so he is on the oral form of lamisil and they where back ordered on the shampoo so I have to wait a week for that to come in but I did order Lyme sulfur dip from Amazon that should be here tomorrow and I plan on dipping all three of my cats in that to be on the safe side. Oh trust me I did panic but reading all the helpful post on here helped me a lot to not panic any more. I just hate hearing his sad cries when he is in lockdown. I found out on Friday that he had it when I took him to get his last round of distemper and there was a spot on his foot and some fur missing on his face and I honestly don't know how long it was like that and he was around my other cats then. I am still a little in freak out mode. I was suppose to dog sit for someone next weekend but I canceled that because I don't want to risk spreading it to them even though me or my roommate don't show signs. Sorry now I am just venting but I feel like you all understand and get it. So you guys are like the only one I can talk to. Thank you for listening

 

[rogue22912]

Sorry forgot to add I think it is a mild case but I found a few more spots today. I really can't wait for the shampoo and the dip to get here cause I don't think the oral meds are going to cut it on there own

 

[bunnelina]

Hi again,

Oh, yes, we totally get it, and you are welcome to vent!  We understand panic and freaking out.

It's great that you and your roommate don't have it, and let's hope the other cats are negative, too. Dipping them will help with that.

And the oral meds will work, at the right dose, but they take a little time, and so that's why dipping is a smart thing to keep doing in the meantime.

It sounds like you are doing all the right things. Just curious: are you giving the kitten terbinafine? My vet thought it was too powerful for our kittens, so we only gave that to our adult cats, while our kittens got Sporanox liquid. Dosages matter so much, so it's good to be sure what you're giving is really safe and correct. (My vet has also gotten dosages wrong on occasion, so we are always double- and triple-checking now.)

Our situation, six years ago: my husband and I were living in an 800 SF apt with two old Persians and two new rescue kittens when we discovered that one of them had ringworm. This was about a month after we got her, so she'd had the run of the house for about three weeks. At that point, we didn't think it made sense to try to separate her. In our small apartment, it was too hard, and it would have been rough for her. So I just got everyone dipped every week, and on oral medications as a preventive. And I cleaned like a madwoman. I channeled all my anxiety into cleaning for about three months. (I sent our rugs to the cleaners so we had bare floors; took down curtains, got washable blankets, covered furniture with tacky Indian bedspreads and washed everything in hot water and fried it in the dryer....I learned how to tip my sofa with one arm while I vacuumed the underside with the other, since the kittens went under there.)  I had fantasies of burning down my building and living in a rusty van by the river that we could just hose down. But I kept my sanity, and only our other kitten got ringworm, just one big spot on his nose. The old Persian cats and the humans were fine. 

Six years later, it's a dim memory, like a bad dream. It will become a dim memory for you, too, I promise!

But I have never recovered from housecleaning; I burned out and am messier than ever! 

I hope others will chime in here with advice. Many others on this site did separate their animals, for example. People who live in big, carpeted houses often find it easier, at least for a while. There are differing points of view on that and many other things....

Hang in there and keep us posted!

Bunnelina

 

[rogue22912]

Hi again,

Just curious: are you giving the kitten terbinafine

Bunnelina

Yea the vet said it was fine, it's cut into quarters and I only give one quarter every 24 hours. I live in a small 900 Sq ft apartment and boy do I wish it was not carpeted, there is half carpet and half hard wood right now I have Gotham locked in the small master bath with the hard wood but I just feel bad. I went on a cleaning spree the day I found out I think I started cleaning at 11 am and didn't finish til close to 2 am and now I dust and vacuum every day all over the house, I am planning on cleaning the bathroom on Friday and I hope the Lyme dip will be here then. It's been just over a month since I got him and yea he had the run of the place since then it only took about a week for my other two cats to like him

 

[bunnelina]

So you are doing "pulse therapy," then? That is, a schedule where there's maybe a week of giving pills and then a week off? Or two weeks on and two weeks off? That's how we did our terbinafine. It's strong stuff.

Oh, the poor kitten, missing his new family..... The dipping should make Gotham much less contagious, but be sure to read up on how to do it effectively. You have to really soak them to the skin, and then don't rinse, just drip-dry, or whatever. Since they often get ringworm on their heads and paws, pay special attention to soaking feet and claws, and then carefully dab the stuff on the face so it doesn't get in eyes, nostrils, or ears but still coats the skin. If you've read anything by Dr. Karen Moriello, the ringworm expert, you've probably seen the instructions. It's often not easy to do, but you want to get it right so all that effort isn't wasted.

A warning: It's very smelly. It gave me breathing problems, since I have asthma, so we couldn't do it ourselves. I found the one groomer in Greater Boston who would help us. There were always lots of strongly scented candles burning when we arrived to get our cats! I hope you can open windows at this time of year and air your place out. That's good for the apartment, too.

When the dip dries, the cats will still smell, but it's not bad. Just strange. We got used to it,  they got used to it. It doesn't hurt them a bit. They just find it all pretty weird.

Many other people have managed to dip their multiple cats, and dogs at homes... so you can, too. I hope the dip comes soon!

Since you will be doing the dips, cleaning, and oral meds all at the same time, you are doing everything the way the vet experts recommend. So you should start getting negative cultures relatively quickly (they never come fast enough). You have a good plan and it sounds like you thoroughly understand the situation. Lots of people really struggle with ringworm and either skip or miss key parts of the treatment, so the situation drags on for months and even years, especially in homes with lots of animals and kids. So you are well ahead of the game. I hope you can feel good about that! 

Hang in there!

 

[red top rescue]

This is the shampoo we used on the shelter cats in foster care and it worked very quickly and very well after the lyme sulfur wasn't doing the trick.  We had a peculiarly tenacious strain.

http://www.valleyvet.com/ct_detail....E440meRsyqqnEEvmGy8318c3aSZtZm7uvnhoCVurw_wcB

 

[angieflux]

I need some encouragement big time.

We have three cats and two dogs. Recently, a vet in our area (NOT our normal vet) was looking for foster homes for kittens. My spouse and I talked it over and decided to volunteer.

After the kittens had been spayed and vaccinated, I noticed a crusty lesion on one of their heads and some scabby ear tips. I was immediately suspicious of ringworm, so we brought in all three kittens. They all tested positive, so the vet gave them lime dips and paid for itraconazole, and we bought the shampoo (the one that has an anti fungal and silver stuff in it--drawing a blank on its name).

We have been cleaning the house and shampooing ALL the animals preventively. The kittens just finished their oral meds yesterday (it lasted about 25 days).

Here's my issue...the kittens still have little scabs here and there. The large lesions and patches of hair loss have all filled in, but I can feel a few little scabs still (I can't see anything, though). On top of that, I think some of our own pets may be contracting it (the most likely one is our largest dog, who weirdly enough wasn't ever around the kittens). We brought this up to the vet. She said she would give us free exams for our pets but that we would have to pay for the medicine. And then she said she was going to euthanize the kittens!

We are so disgusted right now and have no intention of taking anyone back there!!! I guess my questions are if scabs can persist even if the ringworm is cured. How would we know? Can we black light them ourselves or should we just bring all eight to our normal vet?

We are NOT killing these precious babies over a fungal infection! This vet has sickened me.

Please give me some encouragement and advice. I'm feeling very sad today.