6-month-old kitten ONLY 2.6 lbs!

[charlie91]

Waiting on a moderator to accept the pictures I posted.

So we SHOULD at least do the GI Panel?  What about testing for T. Foetus?

The TLI would be the Fecal Culture test, right?... That's like $270 We're considering that CareCredit thing, but we'd like to try and avoid it if possible.

Oh and our vet mentioned, according to Kelly who just chimed in, that it could be a really inflamed GI tract.

 

[finnlacey]

I'd be especially surprised if it was pancreatitis. That's different from pancreatic insufficiency which is more likely what it is. Pancreatitis, he wouldn't be playing or eating, he'd be in a lot of pain. But malabosorption is definitely present here, FOR SURE. B12 is a MUST!

 

[charlie91]

Pancreatic Insufficiency, yes!  Our family-friend who is a vet gave me his top 3 list: 1) Giardia 2) Pancreatic Insufficiency 3) T. Foetus.

And okay, I'll ask them for B12 tomorrow at the vet then!

 

[finnlacey]

I wouldn't be surprised if he had more than one of those actually. 

 

[charlie91]

I wouldn't be surprised if he had more than one of those actually. 

 How problematic will that be? 

 

[charlie91]

I wouldn't be surprised if he had more than one of those actually. 

 How problematic will that be?

 

[ldg]

What you should do is spend a little time with the vet. Explain that you are college students with limited funds. You want to do what's right for your Charlie, but you need to be selective in what to look for: tesing for coronavirus titres that provide no actual answer to "diagnose" a disease that cannot be cured is not a preferred way to manage diagnostics. You want to figure out what's going on with Charlie, but you want to focus on "most likely causes" - within options that can be cured.

I've never had a cat with pancreatitis, I've never had a cat with IBD, I've never had to have GI panel done, and I've never had to do anything more than take a stool sample to the vet and have it sent out to get answers as to what's in it, if anything. The "traditional" GI panel includes the PLI and the TLI, and before anything is done, I'd want to be sure that IS what's being looked for (pancreatic insufficiency).

Even though pancreatic insufficiency is often caused by pancreatitis, as Lisa explained, pancreatitis comes with pain, lack of appetite, and lethargy. But that doesn't mean this isn't pancreatic insufficiency - it just may mean its EPI without pancreatitis. :dk:

I remember when Lazlo was diagnosed with cancer. Everything was just "buzz" and I remembered very little of what my vet said. But she'd given us her cell phone number and email address. She always took whatever time we needed to explain things, to make sure we knew what decisions were being made and why. Vets are not gods, and we pay for their services. When we ask questions, we are not necessarily questioning them, we're trying to understand what's happening. If you have a kitty with something that will need lifelong management, you want your vet to be at least your partner, if not a friend. And you want a vet that is sensitive to your needs and financial situation, one willing to answer your questions, someone who doesn't resent you searching for answers on your own, and someone who is willing to take the time to make you comfortable that you understand what's being done and why. So I'd sit down and have a straightforward conversation with the vet. And there is NOTHING wrong with saying, "I need some time to digest all of this, and I want to consider getting a second opinion." And they should NOT be dismissive. If they are? Then you definitely want a new vet anyway, IMO.

Of course... tomorrow kitty will have been fasted for 18 hours, and ready for the test. But at this point, that system reset probably is a good thing.

But if you're not ... completely comfortable, then I'd consider scrapping everything, and I'd schedule an appointment with the holistic DVM as soon as possible, bring a copy of all records, and go over everything with her or him. They can run the exact same tests, and I doubt the cost would be much different. We work with a number of vets in the area, and everything costs roughly the same.

and !!!!!!!

 

[charlie91]

Well I've been trying to post replies.  For some reason it's been making me wait on moderators to confirm my responses.  Hopefully this one will go through.  Charlie's been seeping all night (when he gets panicky and finicky when we enter the bathroom with him (it's tile so it's the best location for drips).  Tonight he was in the middle of quite a large amount of seepage when I decided to pick him up and place him in the litter box, which he typically decides to try and climb out, but I held him in there for a few seconds and out it all came.  He finally let the load out; it looked like he was in quite a bit of discomfort/pain 

.  HOWEVER this was the first time I've noticed he had blood on his anus afterwards and it looks really irritated!  I believe that's a good sign of a parasite correct?

We've been fasting him since 8:00 PM tonight, and I've got my notes ready to decide which tests are necessary for Charlie.

 

[meeepcosy]

That poor poor baby! I know the utter helplessness you must be feeling. It is terrible to watch your family member suffer like that.

I believe EVERYONE here is better suited and experienced to give you advice than me, but I'll try. I strongly recommend you feed Charlie only boiled chicken and rice (mind you, when Rasberry had the runs, she would have none of it, she only ate the chicken, hated the rice.). I believe they call it a bland diet, it doesn't irritate the bowels any further. How long have you had Charlie? And what did the previous family feed him? If it was different from what you are feeding him now, it would only throw fuel to the fire, and aggravate his problem further. The blood in his stool is most probably from his bowels being so irritated, depending on the colour (dark or bright red).

I'll leave the major problems to the really smart guys here, I would only tell you a bunch of nonsense. But I hope this helps Charlie's discomfort, albeit only a little. Sending good vibes your way! Good luck!

 

[keyes]

Having a good vet for your fur babies is like having a good doctor for yourself.  If the vet you're seeing is not taking you seriously then you need to find one that does!

 

[catnamedpanda]

When I had a kitten leaking like that, she had developed very raw skin at the base of her tail. The vet had me put hydrocortisone on it. If Charlie is developing raw skin you could check with your vet if it would be ok to use some on him too.

 

[charlie91]

That poor poor baby! I know the utter helplessness you must be feeling. It is terrible to watch your family member suffer like that.

I believe EVERYONE here is better suited and experienced to give you advice than me, but I'll try. I strongly recommend you feed Charlie only boiled chicken and rice (mind you, when Rasberry had the runs, she would have none of it, she only ate the chicken, hated the rice.). I believe they call it a bland diet, it doesn't irritate the bowels any further. How long have you had Charlie? And what did the previous family feed him? If it was different from what you are feeding him now, it would only throw fuel to the fire, and aggravate his problem further. The blood in his stool is most probably from his bowels being so irritated, depending on the colour (dark or bright red).

I'll leave the major problems to the really smart guys here, I would only tell you a bunch of nonsense. But I hope this helps Charlie's discomfort, albeit only a little. Sending good vibes your way! Good luck!

I know!  Last night I seriously was the most upset I've been in forever... It was so heartbreaking knowing that we haven't found the issue yet...  We have Charlie on Innova EVO and it's turned his poop from a light yellow-ish color to a brown color.  I posted pics somewhere?  We're going to switch to the holistic vet once we find his problem and see what they have to say.  Unfortunately Charlie's original diet was unknown.  The people we got Charlie from only had him for just over 24 hours before we snagged him up from them.  He was a stray prior to that, from what we understand.

UPDATE:  Took Charlie into the vet this morning, he'll be there all day.  They're sending out a test for the GI Panel and Fecal Culture to test for Pancreatic Insufficiency, Giardia, Coccidia, and other bacterial related problems.  It's going to cost an arm and a leg, however, I applied for CareCredit and was approved!  

  So I'll be building some more credit (I already have a good score, so I'm just looking at this as a great opportunity to expand my credit report for a higher score and of course to get Charlie better!!!)  So I'm pretty happy today, Charlie was bouncing off the walls this morning from being fasted, which we've not seen that kind of energy in a couple days!  So that was a good thing to wake up to this morning.

I'm printing off the article from Cornell and high-lighting all the key points to try and get the test for high titer waived as well.

 

[charlie91]

Also, if you go to page 2 those pictures I took last night are up.  It's the last post on page two of this topic.

 

[meeepcosy]

That is wonderful news! Congrats! I really hope you find the problem with Charlie. I've read some very good advice in these posts, especially the one about the holistic vet. Sounds like a really good idea to have her check Charlie out. Whatever happens, I hope Charlie gets well soon. I saw the pictures you posted on Page 2, and it made me feel helpless all over again, reminding me of Rasberry's ordeal. And hers wasn't even as bad. Good luck to you!

 

[ldg]

The yellowish or greenish poop means it's just running right through them. At least the brownish poop is a bit of an improvement.

Is he back home yet? I'm not sure what all needed to be done that he had to be there for the day, but I'm SO glad you got approved for Care Credit so you can get the testing done! Now the waiting begins....

Did you ask the vet about his anus? There was someone who rescued a kitty recently, and the kitty needed surgery for anal prolapse. (Their vet took pity on them as college students and decided NOT to charge them for it!!!!!! :heart2: ). I can't really tell from the picture how inflamed it is, but hopefully they'll give you something for it. If they don't (didn't) send you home with something, call to ask. :nod:

I do hope you'll consider the bland diet for him for a little while. And I REALLY hope that with all the testing there are some answers, and a clear course of action. :cross:

PLEASE keep us posted! :heart2:

 

[charlie91]

The yellowish or greenish poop means it's just running right through them.

At least the brownish poop is a bit of an improvement.

Is he back home yet? I'm not sure what all needed to be done that he had to be there for the day, but I'm SO glad you got approved for Care Credit so you can get the testing done!

Now the waiting begins....

Did you ask the vet about his anus? There was someone who rescued a kitty recently, and the kitty needed surgery for anal prolapse. (Their vet took pity on them as college students and decided NOT to charge them for it!!!!!!

). I can't really tell from the picture how inflamed it is, but hopefully they'll give you something for it. If they don't (didn't) send you home with something, call to ask.

I do hope you'll consider the bland diet for him for a little while. And I REALLY hope that with all the testing there are some answers, and a clear course of action.

PLEASE keep us posted!

YES, my baby is home and sleeping in between Daddy's arms as I type this right now.  

 His poop is somewhat returning to a more normal state!  Not liquidy, somewhat solid, and it's like a typical poo mountain (kind of ice cream coned up).  I think that natural probiotic is working, and working quickly!

He had to be there all day for the Fecal Culture.  Due to the fasting over night for the GI Panel he had no poo to offer and they claim to have needed quite a bit so they had to do the GI Panel then feed him until he pooped enough stool for the Fecal Culture.  Forgot to ask about the anus.  It's been looking slightly better lately, but I'll call if it seems to worsen up a bit.  Wow that is so kind!  These tests put quite a large dent on my CareCredit already so hopefully they would help us if we needed it!

By bland do you mean wet?  And we are praying and praying for some positive news, but a direction will put a smile on my face, because it's one step closer!

And thank you Meeepcosy!  I'm in the "Honors" course for feline nutrition and health right now! 

 

[ldg]

YAY!!!! Aw, he sounds like such a trooper, and such a little love. :heart3: I'm so glad he found his way to you two... he's clearly got a fighting spirit, and I just know you're going to get him fixed up, and will enjoy a lifetime of love! :rub: :grphug2:

...His poop is somewhat returning to a more normal state!  Not liquidy, somewhat solid, and it's like a typical poo mountain (kind of ice cream coned up).  I think that natural probiotic is working, and working quickly!

That is FABULOUS news!!!


...and by the bland diet, I meant boiled chicken, the plain broth, and white rice. But if things are firming up... see how it goes, and play it by ear.

Did they let you know when test results should be back? :cross: I understood from the reading I did yesterday that it might take a week or more to know about the pancreatic insufficiency test results?

 

[eb24]

 It's going to cost an arm and a leg, however, I applied for CareCredit and was approved!  

  So I'll be building some more credit (I already have a good score, so I'm just looking at this as a great opportunity to expand my credit report for a higher score and of course to get Charlie better!!!)  So I'm pretty happy today, Charlie was bouncing off the walls this morning from being fasted, which we've not seen that kind of energy in a couple days!  So that was a good thing to wake up to this morning.

I just have to say I so love your attitude about all of this. I know there have been down moments but way to take something most people would complain like crazy about (having to pay so much in vet bills that you need care credit) and turn it into a positive (that it will help improve your credit). Seriously, I was impressed before by your commitment to Charlie and desire to learn as much as you can to help him, but now I am above and beyond impressed. 

I'm so glad to hear Charlie is doing better after his fast. I also think trying the bland diet may be worthwhile. Others have said boiled chicken and rice which works great. If necessary, you can also use an all meat jar of baby food (one that's just pureed chicken or turkey). Double and triple check the labels that there is no onion or garlic in it as those are highly toxic to cats. When I make mine up I just cook off some white minute rice and do a 50/50 ratio of the rice and the baby food. Then, I add a little bit of warm water just to increase the fluid level. It's a good diet for a couple of days but any more than that and you have to be careful of his nutritional needs (cats need taurine which is not in baby food. Although, I question how many nutrients he is absorbing anyway). So, if the bland diet helps his stomach at all maybe get some nutrient paste at the Petstore and add that to it just to cover all your bases. At this point I think getting anything to stay in him is an improvement over where he has been. 

Next, have you tried putting some diaper rash cream on his anus? I have used Desitin before on a kitten with uncontrollable diarrhea (recommended by the vet) and it helped sooth his discomfort tremendously. A warm washcloth might help bring some of the swelling down too and make him more comfortable. 

A final thought: You guys are smart to keep him in the bathroom where it's easiest to clean up his leaks. Oftentimes, cats who have urinary/bowel issues develop a litterbox aversion because they associate the box with pain. It sounds like the other night you had to put him in there before he could really "let go." You may need to keep doing that. If he starts not using the box it's likely because he thinks the box hurts him. Putting some puppy pee pads down on the floor may really help with cleanup. This piece is super low on your list of concerns right now I just wanted to put it out there so you had some context in case he stops using the box. Once you get to the bottom of all this you can re-train him to his box, but you can't blame the poor guy for avoiding it if he thinks it's what's hurting him. 

 

[andrya]

I just have to say I so love your attitude about all of this. I know there have been down moments but way to take something most people would complain like crazy about (having to pay so much in vet bills that you need care credit) and turn it into a positive (that it will help improve your credit). Seriously, I was impressed before by your commitment to Charlie and desire to learn as much as you can to help him, but now I am above and beyond impressed. 

Hear hear!

l'm so glad this little guy found his way to you.

 

[charlie91]

Okay so should we try the bland diet as a consistent diet?  Or just do it for 2-3 days then go back to the soft food, then switch back off down the road and do another 2-3 days of the bland diet?  If we do boiled chicken will it have the Taurine in it?  And since things are firming up should I wait for a little before starting this bland diet to see how things go?

Test results should be back in 7-10 days! 

EB and Andrya thank you so much!  That's the kind of support I need!  Some family members have showed some doubt, which of course (if you know me) that just fuels the fire.  Of course, just like any other human, I need positive moral support to help keep the fire going towards what I'm aiming for.  My life philosophy is: Think Outside the Box.  When you're able to do this, you're able to understand that there is more than one perspective (I attempt to break down at least 4, like a box) so I know what people could possibly be thinking as opposed to how I view that something.  Well, when put into a situation such as this, you MUST find the positive perspective!  You'll never find happiness in something that seems bad if you can't step outside the box and switch your perspective to another side. 

We have not tried diaper rash cream!  Sometimes we use a hot rag, but when his diarrhea was bad, well.... We simply didn't have enough warm wet rags to keep up with his pace!  But now that it's slowing down I'll see what I can do to help this poor guy's bum feel a little better as well!

As for the bathroom, thank you!  Though we've created somewhat of a possessive scenario.  Mr. Charlie knows that that bathroom is where HIS litter box, HIS climbing/scratching post is, HIS food is, HIS water is, HIS blanket is and so on!  So now anytime anyone goes to use the restroom, boy you better believe he's right up on that door ready to claim his territory!  Hahaha, it's too cute!