Feral Socialization - Need Some Fresh Imput and Advice

To start off, greetings to you all This is my first post after lurking around for awhile. It seems like there's a lot of knowledgeable and helpful folks on here, so hopefully I can get some advice.

Here's my situation, starting from the beginning (sorry it's pretty long, but I figured the more info, the better):

My mother feeds and cares for several feral cats at her house. One of them, whom she calls Bandit, had gone missing for about two weeks. By some chance he decided to show up on a day that my boyfriend and I happened to be down there to visit for the day. Upon seeing him is was obvious that he severely injured and needed to see a vet ASAP. The entire right side of his face was, for lack of a better description, falling off. He's pretty fluffy, so it was difficult to get a good idea of what exactly was going on. He also had a bad wound on the bridge of his nose. We decided to trap him and take him into the vet the next day. After unsuccessful night (although we did manage to trap a different outdoor cat and one of my mom's indoor cats in the process), we finally caught him later the next morning.

The vet looked him over and found that he had had a pretty severe wound to the side of his face that had abscessed and then ruptured. The abscess literally covered the entire left side of his face from behind his ear down to his chin. The top half had burst open and much of the tissue had died, while the bottom remained intact. She debried and flushed the wound and abscess as well as she could given the extent of it. When we went to pick him up, she was very clear that if we wouldn't have manged to get a hold of him and bring him in when we did, he almost certainly would have died. He tested positive for FIV on top of everything else, so his immune system is and was compromised. This is likely a large portion of why the wound got as bad as it did. She recommend that he be kept inside for the rest of the week at least, and longer if possible.

My mom is confined to a wheelchair, and with how feral he was, there was just no way she was going to be able to care for him on her own. After some discussion, we decided that it would be best for him to come home with my boyfriend and I until he was well again, could be neutered and then released back outside. Naively, we thought this process would only take a week, maybe two weeks at most. As a result, we set him up in our bathroom and while I did make a point to sit with him occasionally to get him used to people, I wasn't making an outright attempt to socialize him. He is ~5 years old and has been outside (that we know of) for at least 3, maybe 4 years, so he is almost as feral as it gets.

After a week and some extra antibiotics it was obvious that Bandit (who we had now renamed Dooder) wasn't making nearly enough progress as far as healing goes. He was better than when we brought him home, of course, but still not very well. Most worrying was that the area of dead tissue had dried up and scabbed over. He managed to scratch off this scab, leaving nothing but exposed muscle. At this point we decided to take him into our own vet for a recheck. They pulled up some skin up from the lower part of his face and stitched it over the the muscle, and cleaned up the rest of the wounds well. He also got a dose of Frontline for some fleas that I hadn't noticed, some dewormer as he was pretty anemic, and a new antibiotic.

Now, where my mom lives is a pretty small town, so I'm sure her vet gets in a lot of barn and feral cats. The vet was more than happy to take him in. We had informed her that we were pretty positive that his wounds had been inflicted by a raccoon, as my mom had seen one around with almost as severe of injuries soon after Dooder had gone missing. She gave him a rabies vaccine because of this and simply told us to keep an eye out for any strange behavior in the next two weeks.

I, on the other hand, live in a large city, and while the tech I made the appointment with at our vet told me that they would have no problem with him being feral, it was a totally different story when I actually got him there. The vet treated me like I was absolutely absurd for not having him put down to begin with. After informing her that he is FIV positive and that he was likely attacked by a raccoon, she became even more difficult. She disappeared for a few minutes and came back to tell me that she had called the DNR to see what needed to be done with him since he is a rabies candidate. She informed me that there is a six month mandatory quarantine period, which could be done in home, and that she had passed my information on to the DNR. She asked me if I was going to comply with this, and of course I said yes. Only after this did she agree to treat him.

So here I am, not intending to have this cat in my care long term, now forced to keep him for who knows how long. Don't get me wrong, I will gladly keep him as long as it takes, but now I am faced with the dilemma of socializing him and making a more permanent space for him other than my small bathroom. I do have an extra bedroom, and the only reason he wasn't put in there to begin with is because it was far easier to cat proof the bathroom on such short notice and because his wounds were actively weeping for the first week or so and cleaning pus and blood off of tile is far easier than carpet. Since he came home from our vet (a week ago tomorrow), I have been doing my best to spend time in his room with him. I also opened up the cupboard under the sink and made it into a hiding place for him. Up until then he had just been hiding behind the toilet.

So far I have been able to touch him, but only the back half of him when he is behind the toilet. I believe he allows this because he isn't able to see me. The second he sees me while I'm touching him he growls and hisses. I'm honestly surprised how much he will let me touch him like this. I was able to cut away a very large matt on his back this way. It took at least 20 minutes and he didn't make a sound.

He does not hiss or growl at me otherwise though. This isn't the case with my boyfriend. I'm not sure if this is because he doesn't spend nearly as much time with him, or what, but he has hissed at him quite a few times. Overall he just seems terrified of me. He cowers and shuts down. When I bring him treats he acts like he doesn't see them and won't touch them even after I've left. I usually sit in the bathtub when I visit him, and he won't move around the room. For the most part he just watches me for awhile and falls asleep when he's decided I'm not going to attack him. He has gotten up to eat and drink once while I've been in the room with him and I'm actually in here with him right now, and he got up and paced around for a couple seconds before going back to sleeping.

I try to spend time with him at the same time every day, but I'm in school full time, so this isn't always possible and some days I'm not able to get in here with him at all. I hope this won't make a huge difference in his progress.

Also, I feel like I've probably put him off a bit by making a lot of eye contact. I really haven't had much of a choice since I need to check up on his wound and it's right on his face. I do my best to look past his eyes, but it still seems to freak him out.

So, after that super long story, I guess my questions are:

• Should I consider moving him into the extra bedroom? I feel like it would be beneficial because there won't be people coming in and out to use the bathroom all of the time, but I'm afraid the move will freak him out.
• What can I do to make more progress as far as socializing goes?
• Should I wait for him to come to me, or can I try to pet him on my own?
• What is the likelihood of him coming around? It's been about two and a half weeks that he's been with me and I've honestly seen almost no progress. Admittedly, I haven't been trying very hard until now, but still...
• As far as food rewards go, I haven't been able to find anything he really likes. Any suggestions? He does not like canned food. I've also tried soft cat treats and baby food - chicken and beef.

Thank you so much to anyone who actually takes to time to read through this and I really look forward to any advice and input I can get : )))))

Hello,

              I am actually new to the sight also. I too have a feral cat in my bathroom. I caught this kitten back in Nov of 2013. I had it neutered and was going to put it back outside after a week of recovery, but the weather was very cold and I couldn't do it. So I decided maybe I would keep it. I had it in a carrier which was hooked up to a large cage that had food and litter in. It had a pretty good space to live in.  But after a week since I didn't return it to the outside, I brought it up stairs and put it in my bathroom. I had a carrier in there for it to sleep and hide in but that didn't work. It stayed behind the toilet. I finally realized that when I opened the bathroom door the carrier was facing me and I don't think the cat wanted to be seen.  So I just removed it. I had a little straw house that I put in that faces the toilet and it seems to like that now and sleeps in there.  It spent most of its time hissing and looking at me in terror from behind the toilet. I would go in as many times a day as I could and sit on the floor and talk to it. I read not to look at it in the eyes and also get down to its level, but in your case you had to. I put its food and water out but it would never come and eat it until I left. This kitten was 7 months old when I trapped it, and it was pretty wild already. I started to use the toilet while it was behind it, hoping it didn't snatch me up. But it got use to me doing that. Just never put your hands down the side of it. Now I can go in take a bath, use the toilet, and do about anything else I want to. But we have two bathroom so no one else can uses this one but me. I have had this kitten since Nov-2013, so the end of this month it will be 4 months. That's how long it took me to get this cat to trust me this far. I still can't touch it thought. I go in and get its food ready and when it hears me tap the spoon on the bowl it will come closer to me.  I sit on the floor with my drink mix in the morning, or a book and put the food close to me and it will come over to eat. It watches me so I don't try to touch it. I just sit as still as I can to gain its confidence more and more. This took a long time to get it to do this. I started out by putting the bowl in the middle of the floor and now finally it is beside me. When I get a bath it will walk around. I throw treats at it and it will go get them. I use party mix treats. Leave some treats on the floor when you leave the room, see if it eats them. Mine didn't eat anything while I was in the room at first. Mine will play in the tub when I am sitting on the floor.  I have balls and things in the tub when not using it so it can play. I have a string on a pole that I drag across the floor that it will play with. Like I said this took me a long time to get this kitten to trust me this far. All cats are different but the older they are the harder it might be to tame them, you just have to have patience because it could take a long time.  I myself wouldn't give it a bigger room because it will be harder to catch it. How did you catch it to take it back to the vets the second time? Is this the only bathroom you have? My boyfriend looks in once in a while and I told him to start using this bathroom so the kitten gets us to him also. He tells me to let it loose in the house now, but I said no, not until I can touch it and catch it if I have to. I extended my fingers out one day it was in the tub and it clawed me, so that was the end of that. I can't believe you can touch that one. I tried that from the other side of the toilet and it hissed and turned around and jumped at me. So I quit doing anything that scares it. I read to just be patient and don't do anything to scare it because if you do you might have to start all over with the trust issue. So now I just keep my hand placed on the floor when it is eating and it will sniff it. It has come up to me and sniffed my feet. I have left some of my clothing in there for it to smell. Here is my other problem, I have two cats already. I figured one would have a problem but the other one wouldn't, and the fact that this kitten has claws is an issue. I don't want to have a fight and have my cats clawed. But so far its been OK. My one cat that I thought would be OK  with it, didn't go well. The kitten ran up to her and she hissed and took off. But as of today they go nose to nose and are civil and chase each other.  The kitten runs out and right up to her and is excited to see her. Now the other cat, she has come into the room, got a drink and has seen the kitten but no close contact, and I don't really expect her to become friends. Now for your cat, right now I would leave it in the bathroom, because it also has issues you need to watch. Just go into the bathroom and do whatever you have to and maybe spend some time sitting on the floor. Don't starve it but get it on a feeding time that when you go in it knows its time to eat and its hungry and maybe in due time it will come out and eat when you are there. Fill the bowl and set it far away from you. Maybe a little tuna would get its attention, something that smells. Then after days slowly move the bowl closer to you when your sitting down. Sometimes you just have to sit there, I know it gets boring that's why I take a book. Like I said this took 4 months to get this far with this kitten. It does take time and patients. Hope you understand what I am trying to say, hard to get things across when so much to say. Are your intentions to keep this cat? Do you plan on keeping him as an indoor cat or are you putting it back outside? You know that they say to only put the cat back outside in its own environment where you found him because he already knows the territory and any cats that are around. That's kind of another reason I  wanted to keep this kitten because I had it in the house so long it might not get along well outside. Well hope I answered some of your questions. This is all from my own experience. When I started with this kitten,  I was getting kind of impatient thinking it was going no where but it took a good 1-2 months before I noticed some progress, then it started to come faster.  I think it made pretty good progress, now I just have to get it to let me touch it and then I think it can come out of the bathroom. Love to hear about your experience with the cat, and I do hope it gets better soon. 

Welcome!   I will return to you both later on, in 8-10 hours.  Unless others chime in and gives adequate/excellent answers.  Like they usually do.

First off, thank you for taking care of Dooder.  I am certain he would not have survived without your kindness.  It's going to be a long road ahead, but one that will be very rewarding for you both.

I would suggest moving him to a totally cat proof bedroom.  Put the mattress and box springs either directly on the floor (no bedframe) or pick the bed up.  You do not want him to hide and get stuck under the bed.  It will be the first place he will run.  Also make sure he can't get behind any book shelves, dressers or other small spots.  Do give him a place to hide such as a cat tree with a hiding hole or something simple like an old box with a cozy blanket.  Give him a few toys too.  You can set up the room with his food/water on one side and his litter box on the other side. 

Visit him often for short periods.  When you come into the room, sit directly on the floor at his level so you are not looming over him.  Talk quietly to him.  You might offer a yummy special treat so that he associates you with good things.  You can offer plain cooked chicken, tuna, or Gerber stage 2 chicken/turkey baby food.  This is for treat purposes only not his regular food.  He may not eat any of it in your presence but that is ok to start with.  When you come into the room, sit down and talk so he gets used to your voice.  You can even read aloud from a book/magazine to him.  I would also suggest playing soft music 24/7 for awhile.  There is some excellent cat harp music you can download from Amazon.  Do you have a feliway diffuser?  This will help to calm him down a bit.  You can also try Composure feline treats or liquid. 

Allow him at first to take the lead.  Do you try to pet him, if he seems scared.  Don't make eye contact, instead use slow blinks and look at him over the top of his head.  Cats are often threatened by direct eye contact. 

Keep your goals very simple.  Socializing feral cats is hard work, but so very rewarding.  Just take it very very slow.  Keep him in the room until he is comfortable with you.  Don't rush the process.  There are many steps along the way, but keeping it simple right now is best.

After the 6 month quarantine are you planning to keep him?  Will you neuter him once his infection is cleared? 

Once again thank you for caring for him. 

Oh, bless you for your caring, kind soul!  Dooder is a lucky cat.

He needs to feel safe, first and foremost. The bathroom is not a bad solution, but as you pointed out, there's a lot of activity. So the spare bedroom would work too.

I am thinking if you can't rearrange the furniture, a large crate may be helpful, at least initially.  He will be confined but that might actually help him feel safer.  Cover all sides of the crate except one.  I set my crate up on a table by the window, so he has a view but if you can't do this, OK.  A large crate can fit a litter box and carrier comfortably, with the front of the crate as the feeding area.  He will most likely retreat to the carrier when you open the door.  Cover it with a blanket while you tend to his potty, so he can't see you.  Talk softly to him whenever you come in and especially when you're inside the crate.

I also sometimes set up two, two-door crates - I zip-tie metal grids to the two side doors to make a tunnel that connects the two crates.  That way, one side is for the potty and one is for the carrier and feeding.

Shadow's advice about treats is right-on.  Gerber chicken only baby food is irresistible to most cats.

The only thing that worries me is the rabies.  The shot after the fact probably won't help if he's been exposed, so if he shows ANY unusual signs, call the DNR immediately.  That includes if he starts getting overly friendly all of a sudden.  I don't mean to scare you but that's a sign of rabies.  It attacks the central nervous system and animals will show all kinds of odd, out-of-character behaviors.

Remember, whatever happens, all that you are doing for him now is showing him that humans can be kind.  That is just what he needs now.

Just some small advice to add to what the advisor is saying.   If you are not sure about the rabies yet, don't touch it. You do not want to get scratched. Am I right,? I would like some more comments on this subject to help me and other people in a rabies situation.

buffy2011 said:

 
Just some small advice to add to what the advisor is saying.   If you are not sure about the rabies yet, don't touch it. You do not want to get scratched. Am I right,? I would like some more comments on this subject to help me and other people in a rabies situation.

Click to expand...

As I understand it, rabies dont comes with scratches, - you perhaps though on tetanus?

Rabies comes  with bites.   IF the cat is rabies-carrier, This is unusual.

Cats being carriers of tetanus is rare it too, but if you go to doc with a good scratch or bite, he will probably give you an extra tetanus shot.    (you will surely get swollen and get fever from this shot, but not sure you will get swollena and feverish from that bite - but it is a small insurance payment).

Althogh its no pleasure to be scratched either, there can be unpleasant bacterias giving you nasty infectiions, if you have unluck.

Observe, the most common with ferales biting is not because they are carriers of rabies, but usually because you tried to catch them, and the bite was purely defensive bite.  Entirely normal behavior in such a situation...

In such a situation at the self catching they can get severly excited, even violently aggressive.

Again, its not sickly, its entirely normal....   Left alone in their own room, they cool down after several hours and are normal, shy cats.

While a rabies sick animal probably will be visible excited hovewer long cooling time.

Many a resucers are anxious, especielly as the law demands this of them.  Im not sure I had anytime heard about someone being in real danger.     Apparently it is very rare cats are smitten by rabies.

On the question of rabies, do you have an up to date rabies vaccination - if not, get one just in case.  If you have to catch him, wear long leather gloves to protect your hands (a wise thing to do anyway).  Otherwise as noted by others, the chances of transmission are small.  And likely if he had a rabid bite he would have shown signs before now.  I was badly scratched and bitten trying to capture one of our ferals in the summer and went right away for a tetanus booster as my last one was more than the 10 year effective period. I was told that the danger was very slight unless the bite hit a vein or was deep enough to go into my bloodstream (typically not unless it's a really vicious attack or just plain unlucky) but keeping your tetanus boosters up to date is a good idea for multiple reasons - like rusty nails! 

As to the progress, it's early days.  I've been working on Ellie (our latest rescue) for 2 months+ and she is still very shy and hissy.  Let him set his pace.  The main thing is to keep him safe and get him well.  How are his facial injuries healing?  Is he able to eat ok?  It sounds as if you need a more sympathetic vet, one who will advise you on wound healing. 

Wow. Thank you all so much for the replies and advise. My apologies for not being able to get back to this until today. I was out of town for part of the weekend, but I'm back now and on spring break for the week, so I should be able to respond fairly quickly. I was hoping to give some updates on his progress, but I honestly haven't been able to sit with him at all this past weekend. I'll spend some time with him later today and see how it goes. Hopefully my few day hiatus hasn't set him back too far : \ As you've all said, it really is a long and tedious process. Patience patience patience.

buffy2011 said:

 
Hello,

              I am actually new to the sight also. I too have a feral cat in my bathroom. I caught this kitten back in Nov of 2013. I had it neutered and was going to put it back outside after a week of recovery, but the weather was very cold and I couldn't do it. So I decided maybe I would keep it. I had it in a carrier which was hooked up to a large cage that had food and litter in. It had a pretty good space to live in.  But after a week since I didn't return it to the outside, I brought it up stairs and put it in my bathroom. I had a carrier in there for it to sleep and hide in but that didn't work. It stayed behind the toilet. I finally realized that when I opened the bathroom door the carrier was facing me and I don't think the cat wanted to be seen.  So I just removed it. I had a little straw house that I put in that faces the toilet and it seems to like that now and sleeps in there.  It spent most of its time hissing and looking at me in terror from behind the toilet. I would go in as many times a day as I could and sit on the floor and talk to it. I read not to look at it in the eyes and also get down to its level, but in your case you had to. I put its food and water out but it would never come and eat it until I left. This kitten was 7 months old when I trapped it, and it was pretty wild already. I started to use the toilet while it was behind it, hoping it didn't snatch me up. But it got use to me doing that. Just never put your hands down the side of it. Now I can go in take a bath, use the toilet, and do about anything else I want to. But we have two bathroom so no one else can uses this one but me. I have had this kitten since Nov-2013, so the end of this month it will be 4 months. That's how long it took me to get this cat to trust me this far. I still can't touch it thought. I go in and get its food ready and when it hears me tap the spoon on the bowl it will come closer to me.  I sit on the floor with my drink mix in the morning, or a book and put the food close to me and it will come over to eat. It watches me so I don't try to touch it. I just sit as still as I can to gain its confidence more and more. This took a long time to get it to do this. I started out by putting the bowl in the middle of the floor and now finally it is beside me. When I get a bath it will walk around. I throw treats at it and it will go get them. I use party mix treats. Leave some treats on the floor when you leave the room, see if it eats them. Mine didn't eat anything while I was in the room at first. Mine will play in the tub when I am sitting on the floor.  I have balls and things in the tub when not using it so it can play. I have a string on a pole that I drag across the floor that it will play with. Like I said this took me a long time to get this kitten to trust me this far. All cats are different but the older they are the harder it might be to tame them, you just have to have patience because it could take a long time.  I myself wouldn't give it a bigger room because it will be harder to catch it. How did you catch it to take it back to the vets the second time? Is this the only bathroom you have? My boyfriend looks in once in a while and I told him to start using this bathroom so the kitten gets us to him also. He tells me to let it loose in the house now, but I said no, not until I can touch it and catch it if I have to. I extended my fingers out one day it was in the tub and it clawed me, so that was the end of that. I can't believe you can touch that one. I tried that from the other side of the toilet and it hissed and turned around and jumped at me. So I quit doing anything that scares it. I read to just be patient and don't do anything to scare it because if you do you might have to start all over with the trust issue. So now I just keep my hand placed on the floor when it is eating and it will sniff it. It has come up to me and sniffed my feet. I have left some of my clothing in there for it to smell. Here is my other problem, I have two cats already. I figured one would have a problem but the other one wouldn't, and the fact that this kitten has claws is an issue. I don't want to have a fight and have my cats clawed. But so far its been OK. My one cat that I thought would be OK  with it, didn't go well. The kitten ran up to her and she hissed and took off. But as of today they go nose to nose and are civil and chase each other.  The kitten runs out and right up to her and is excited to see her. Now the other cat, she has come into the room, got a drink and has seen the kitten but no close contact, and I don't really expect her to become friends. Now for your cat, right now I would leave it in the bathroom, because it also has issues you need to watch. Just go into the bathroom and do whatever you have to and maybe spend some time sitting on the floor. Don't starve it but get it on a feeding time that when you go in it knows its time to eat and its hungry and maybe in due time it will come out and eat when you are there. Fill the bowl and set it far away from you. Maybe a little tuna would get its attention, something that smells. Then after days slowly move the bowl closer to you when your sitting down. Sometimes you just have to sit there, I know it gets boring that's why I take a book. Like I said this took 4 months to get this far with this kitten. It does take time and patients. Hope you understand what I am trying to say, hard to get things across when so much to say. Are your intentions to keep this cat? Do you plan on keeping him as an indoor cat or are you putting it back outside? You know that they say to only put the cat back outside in its own environment where you found him because he already knows the territory and any cats that are around. That's kind of another reason I  wanted to keep this kitten because I had it in the house so long it might not get along well outside. Well hope I answered some of your questions. This is all from my own experience. When I started with this kitten,  I was getting kind of impatient thinking it was going no where but it took a good 1-2 months before I noticed some progress, then it started to come faster.  I think it made pretty good progress, now I just have to get it to let me touch it and then I think it can come out of the bathroom. Love to hear about your experience with the cat, and I do hope it gets better soon. 

Click to expand...

Awesome of you to take the little one in. It seems like we're kind of in the same boat as far at the bathroom situation goes. He has been very good with us using the bathroom as well. Even showers don't seem to bother him much. He's gotten to the point where he just gets bored and takes a nap while we're showering. He also naps if I'm in the room with him for a long period of time and he doesn't want to move around. It's nice to see that he can be relaxed enough to sleep with me in his presence.

I like your idea of sitting near the food bowl. I've done this to gain the trust of some of the outdoor cats that have been at my mom's. I don't think he will go for it this soon, but maybe in a couple weeks. I've tried leaving a few different types of treats for him and the only thing he has touched is canned food, and he doesn't really enjoy that too much to begin with. It's strange. Everything my tame cats enjoy he has no interest in. It's a pain when it comes to getting him to take his antibiotics. I was putting them in wet food for awhile, and he stopped eating that, so I starting mixing wet and dry. He was okay with that for awhile longer then wouldn't touch that either. I've been trying pill pockets recently. I shape them to be roughly the size of the pieces of dry food but he pretty good at eating around them or spitting them out. He'll eat them eventually, but it makes him getting his full dose take sooooo long.

Accessibility to him was another reason why we decided to keep him in the bathroom, like you mentioned. I think we will move him after his face is mostly healed. He has an appointment at the end of the month to have his stitches removed and most likely get neutered, so we will put him in the new room when he comes home. Yes, we only have one bathroom and it's very small at that. That's why I usually sit in the tub. If I sit on the floor he doesn't really have anywhere to walk around.

When we to him to the vet most recently I attempted to scruff him while he was behind the toilet since he'll let me touch him then and put him in the live trap we caught him in initially. He wasn't too happy about it and managed to wiggle out of my grip and back behind the toilet (after trying to scale the shower curtain, falling, and knocking his head on the toilet). We ended up having to block of one side of the toilet and pushed him with a broom into the trap. I know it sounds kind of harsh, but he needed to go to the vet badly. I figure a health emergency outweighs five minutes of being terrified on his part.

I'm pretty surprised I can touch him too, even if it is only when he can't see me. I tried touching him with a brush a few days after he got here out of curiosity and he didn't even flinch so I tried with my hand and he had no problem with that either.

As of right now I'm not 100% sure we intend to do with him. I think the DNR quarantine issue will decide that for the most part. I haven't heard from them or the vet yet, so I'm not sure how the situation will play out. If he has to stay the 6 months, then I will either keep him permanently, or have him live with my mom after he is somewhat social. She has managed to socialize a few ferals herself, so I trust her to it. If either the DNR doesn't get involved, or if he hasn't made any progress after the 6 months, I am seriously considering letting him back out after his face is healed and he's neutered. He's been outside for most if not all of his life, so there is a possibility he might just be happier on his own. We'll see though. He's with me for the next month or two at least while he heals. And, yes, I do know to let him back out where he came from. My mom's been feeding him for years now. I can't imagine taking him anywhere else.

Thanks so much for all your other advice. It's good to know that it will likely take a long time to get on his good side, especially if your kitten is only so far after that long. I'm having to keep reminding myself to be patient and to not get discouraged.

ShadowsRescue said:

 
First off, thank you for taking care of Dooder.  I am certain he would not have survived without your kindness.  It's going to be a long road ahead, but one that will be very rewarding for you both.

I would suggest moving him to a totally cat proof bedroom.  Put the mattress and box springs either directly on the floor (no bedframe) or pick the bed up.  You do not want him to hide and get stuck under the bed.  It will be the first place he will run.  Also make sure he can't get behind any book shelves, dressers or other small spots.  Do give him a place to hide such as a cat tree with a hiding hole or something simple like an old box with a cozy blanket.  Give him a few toys too.  You can set up the room with his food/water on one side and his litter box on the other side. 

Visit him often for short periods.  When you come into the room, sit directly on the floor at his level so you are not looming over him.  Talk quietly to him.  You might offer a yummy special treat so that he associates you with good things.  You can offer plain cooked chicken, tuna, or Gerber stage 2 chicken/turkey baby food.  This is for treat purposes only not his regular food.  He may not eat any of it in your presence but that is ok to start with.  When you come into the room, sit down and talk so he gets used to your voice.  You can even read aloud from a book/magazine to him.  I would also suggest playing soft music 24/7 for awhile.  There is some excellent cat harp music you can download from Amazon.  Do you have a feliway diffuser?  This will help to calm him down a bit.  You can also try Composure feline treats or liquid. 

Allow him at first to take the lead.  Do you try to pet him, if he seems scared.  Don't make eye contact, instead use slow blinks and look at him over the top of his head.  Cats are often threatened by direct eye contact. 

Keep your goals very simple.  Socializing feral cats is hard work, but so very rewarding.  Just take it very very slow.  Keep him in the room until he is comfortable with you.  Don't rush the process.  There are many steps along the way, but keeping it simple right now is best.

After the 6 month quarantine are you planning to keep him?  Will you neuter him once his infection is cleared? 

Once again thank you for caring for him. 

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Luckily our extra bedroom is more of an office, so a desk and a table is all there is for furniture to worry about. Not much of a way to hide in those. Will definitely make him a hidey spot when I move him.

Thanks for the ideas for treats. He won't touch baby food, but I will try chicken and tuna sometime this week. I usually play music for him while I'm in the room with him. I haven't noticed it make a big difference in his demeanor, but I still play it since it's not hurting anything. I believe my mom has a feliway diffuser at her house. Just need to get a refill for it.

Refer above as to what I plan to do with him in the long term. He will definitely be getting neutered though. He's set up to have the procedure done in two weeks if all is going well.

Ondine said:

 
Oh, bless you for your caring, kind soul!  Dooder is a lucky cat.

He needs to feel safe, first and foremost. The bathroom is not a bad solution, but as you pointed out, there's a lot of activity. So the spare bedroom would work too.

I am thinking if you can't rearrange the furniture, a large crate may be helpful, at least initially.  He will be confined but that might actually help him feel safer.  Cover all sides of the crate except one.  I set my crate up on a table by the window, so he has a view but if you can't do this, OK.  A large crate can fit a litter box and carrier comfortably, with the front of the crate as the feeding area.  He will most likely retreat to the carrier when you open the door.  Cover it with a blanket while you tend to his potty, so he can't see you.  Talk softly to him whenever you come in and especially when you're inside the crate.

I also sometimes set up two, two-door crates - I zip-tie metal grids to the two side doors to make a tunnel that connects the two crates.  That way, one side is for the potty and one is for the carrier and feeding.

Shadow's advice about treats is right-on.  Gerber chicken only baby food is irresistible to most cats.

The only thing that worries me is the rabies.  The shot after the fact probably won't help if he's been exposed, so if he shows ANY unusual signs, call the DNR immediately.  That includes if he starts getting overly friendly all of a sudden.  I don't mean to scare you but that's a sign of rabies.  It attacks the central nervous system and animals will show all kinds of odd, out-of-character behaviors.

Remember, whatever happens, all that you are doing for him now is showing him that humans can be kind.  That is just what he needs now.

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Rearranging shouldn't be too difficult, but a crate might not be a bad idea for the first few days or so if I can find one.  It would help keep him from getting over stimulated and running amok.

Apparently I've found the pickiest cat on earth. Hahaha. Neither chicken nor beef baby food has any effect on him.

I did a fair amount of research into the rabies issue, and if he was going to show signs of it, it would have happened by now. There's a slim chance he could still have it so I still keep an eye out. For the most part though, I'm not too worried. I honestly find it ridiculous that the DNR would have a 6 month quarantine period seeing as there is only a 10-day quarantine required for bite incidents. I actually still haven't heard from the DNR, so who knows what going to happen with them. I appreciate your concern though.

StefanZ said:

 
As I understand it, rabies dont comes with scratches, - you perhaps though on tetanus?

Rabies comes  with bites.   IF the cat is rabies-carrier, This is unusual.

Cats being carriers of tetanus is rare it too, but if you go to doc with a good scratch or bite, he will probably give you an extra tetanus shot.    (you will surely get swollen and get fever from this shot, but not sure you will get swollena and feverish from that bite - but it is a small insurance payment).

Althogh its no pleasure to be scratched either, there can be unpleasant bacterias giving you nasty infectiions, if you have unluck.

Observe, the most common with ferales biting is not because they are carriers of rabies, but usually because you tried to catch them, and the bite was purely defensive bite.  Entirely normal behavior in such a situation...

In such a situation at the self catching they can get severly excited, even violently aggressive.

Again, its not sickly, its entirely normal....   Left alone in their own room, they cool down after several hours and are normal, shy cats.

While a rabies sick animal probably will be visible excited hovewer long cooling time.

Many a resucers are anxious, especielly as the law demands this of them.  Im not sure I had anytime heard about someone being in real danger.     Apparently it is very rare cats are smitten by rabies.

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Exactly : ) If he was going to show signs of rabies, it probably would have happened by now, and rabies in cats is fairly uncommon. On top of that both my mom and myself have seen the raccoon that we believe attacked him since that happened, and it doesn't seem to be showing any signs either. Honestly, in my area there isn't a huge concern for rabies in raccoons. Skunks and bats are far more likely to be carriers. He has not once tried to bite or scratch me and if he ever did I wouldn't equate it to him being rabid - just a scared feral cat.

Lrosewiles said:

 
On the question of rabies, do you have an up to date rabies vaccination - if not, get one just in case.  If you have to catch him, wear long leather gloves to protect your hands (a wise thing to do anyway).  Otherwise as noted by others, the chances of transmission are small.  And likely if he had a rabid bite he would have shown signs before now.  I was badly scratched and bitten trying to capture one of our ferals in the summer and went right away for a tetanus booster as my last one was more than the 10 year effective period. I was told that the danger was very slight unless the bite hit a vein or was deep enough to go into my bloodstream (typically not unless it's a really vicious attack or just plain unlucky) but keeping your tetanus boosters up to date is a good idea for multiple reasons - like rusty nails! 

As to the progress, it's early days.  I've been working on Ellie (our latest rescue) for 2 months+ and she is still very shy and hissy.  Let him set his pace.  The main thing is to keep him safe and get him well.  How are his facial injuries healing?  Is he able to eat ok?  It sounds as if you need a more sympathetic vet, one who will advise you on wound healing. 

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As I don't have insurance and feel like a rabies booster would likely be pretty expensive, I'll take my chances for now and go without. I am up to date on my tetanus shot though, so that's all good.

As far as his wounds go: His nose has healed completely and looks wonderful. The side of his face is more of a mystery to me. For the past several days he has refused to sit in any way that would allow me to get a good look at it. I know he has been scratching and opening it back up though as he's got a trail of blood down his face and I find blood on the floor pretty frequently. I don't think he's managed to pull out any of the stitches since I haven't found any laying around. I'm not really sure if there's anything that can be done to keep him from doing this : \ He doesn't seem to have any trouble eating and drinking, thankfully.

I agree with you on the issue of the vet. If my mom's vet wasn't a two hour car ride away I would love to just take him there for check-ups since they were already so good with him and have been good with every other feral my mom has brought in. I called the local feral rescue a little over a week ago to see if they could recommend any vets in the area who are good with ferals, but I never got a call back. Suppose I should try again?

Just thought of a couple questions after I posted.

Can anyone recommend any specific music for him to have playing in his room? I'm trying to set up a playlist so I can just leave an iPod in there with him 24/7. I have some harp music playing for him at the moment, but was thinking...it has a lot of bird chirping in the background (it's supposed to be relaxing and whatnot). Do you think these bird noises will annoy/confuse/sadden him? I hope not.

Is it normal for ferals to meow? I know that meowing is mostly used to communicate with humans and I feel like I've read at one point that ferals are usually silent because of this. It makes sense that they wouldn't meow if they don't see humans often and have no intentions of communicating with them when they do. I ask because every other day or so, Dooder will meow while he's by himself. He doesn't sound distressed or anything. Just talking. The first time he did this it definitely startled me, so I ran in there to make sure he was okay and ended up startling him myself, I came in so quickly. He was perfectly fine, laying around in the cupboard minding his own business.

I have this one:


and this one

  Yes its normal for cats to meow.  My kitten was crying also, and I felt so bad.  But I think they are scared, confused, and don't know what is happening. Now she meow sometimes because she wants company.  I'm still so surprised you can actually touch that cat and it won't bite or scratch you.  Mine was hissing, jumping out at me and swatting at me if I would go any where near her. But she has come a long way. Actually today when I was getting her food ready she came over and touched my leg. I'm hoping by the end of this month she will be able to come out and roam the rest of the house. She just loves to see my other cat. When she comes into the bathroom with me, the kitten runs over and starts rubbing herself on her almost knocking her over. But I think you have a better start with yours then I had with mine. The fact that you can touch it. But the main thing is to get its wound healed first then decide what you want to do with it. It took my kitten a long time to eat what I put out for it. I just think they are scared and if they hear any sounds they just stay hidden. Most of the time they come out when everyone is sleeping. Over all the years with any of my cats, they never liked the cat treats I had.  But I finally found Purina party mix treats and they love them. Sounds like he is healing well and on his way to recovery. So whatever decision you decide to make he is better off then what he was. I have to keep reminding my self that I can't keep them all and I can't help them all.  

Wow, you're terrific for having made such a strong commitment to care for this cat! In time, this cat will bond with you, and while he may never become a lap cat, will love and trust you deeply. You've done so much for this cat that I expect he's "yours" now. I had no intention whatsoever of keeping the last feral cat I trapped, but after spending several hundreds of dollars on her veterinary care and nursing her back to health, there was no way I was letting her go. Ever  

I think it's very unusual for a raccoon to attack a cat and pass rabies onto it. Although it's possible this happened, it's much more likely that your cat got injured by another cat during a fight over a mate or territory issues. This is how the overwhelming majority of feral cat injuries occr. My feral outdoor cat has co-existed with raccoons and other wildlife for years. Cats generally are too smart to pick a fight with a raccoon, and in my experience, when my feral has had encounters with raccoons around the food bowl, they retreat from each other because neither want to get into a conflict. If I were in your position, I would not tell any future vet that your cat may have been attacked by a raccoon because they usually will insist upon removing the cat and euthanizing it, and there's no proof that a raccoon attacked your cat.

If he doesn't need to be captured in the near future to get taken to the vet, it might not be a bad idea to make your bedroom his home base. It will be a lot more comfortable for him, and he will get used to your presence and learn that he's safe with you at night while you're sleeping. I don't think it's a bad thing if he hides underneath your bed--it will help him feel secure. My domesticated cats of 13 and 14 years still like to hide under the bed sometimes. I think you will bond more quickly with him if you're around him more.

Feral cats usually cry their heads off when initially taken inside, and some scale walls and windows during their first days/weeks of confinement. It could be that your feral is only now feeling well enough to voice his concerns! When I took in a feral kitten of 3-4 months last summer, he cried non-stop for a few days, and then it decreased to a few hours each morning, and then stopped altogether after a month. The older feral I took in was sick, like yours, never went through this phase because it was a month before she had recovered, and by that time, she was enjoying having a warm place to live and 24/7 access to food.

I kept a radio on with low volume on a station that played soft pop music on it for my feral kitten during the first 2 weeks he was confined to a room. He got used to not only music, but the sounds of peoples' voices. As long as the music is mellow and not too loud, I do think it helps a confined cat to not feel so lonely and aids the socialization process.

Unfortunately, many vets and vet techs are impatient and rough with ferals because they don't want to deal with the possibility of getting bitten or scratched. Many don't want to treat ferals at all. Again, I applaud you for all you are doing for this cat!

Great progress, but the scratching of his facial wounds is a bit worrying.  Vets often advise an Elizabethan collar to stop cats scratching and biting at wounds after surgery, but it would probably be nearly impossible to get it on and they do look awfully uncomfortable.  Happily if he is still on antibiotics the risk of infection is much reduced, and if the wound is itching that is at least a sign it is healing.  Perhaps giving him some toys to play with might distract him from scratching?   So as not to be worrying, I can say that one of my feral rescues, Little Grey,  chewed her outside stitch right out after she was spayed (unfortunately the spay clinic had left rather a long end on it) and I was worried to death that her surgical incision would open up, but clearly there were deeper stitches below because it stayed closed despite the visible external hole. 

The meowing seems very variable to me.  Little Grey (who is a great hunter and tough as nails) hardly ever miaows and when she does it's just a little squeaky sound.  She was the last of our feral kittens adopted and the most "trained" to be quiet I'm guessing.  A complete contrast to her earlier-adopted sister Picassa who is extremely vocal, she not just miaows but "warbles" and "sings" - her nickname is "Mur-wowsa" after her multi-note voice!

Oh and good news on the tetanus up to date, though the risk there from a cat bite is again very small.

Great job!

Thought I should update as things aren't going so well. He's gone downhill pretty fast health-wise today after doing really well for so long.

I was able to pet Dooder after sitting in with him for a couple hours on Wednesday, and finally got a chance to get a closer look at his wound. I saw that he had managed to pull out one of his sutures. It was pretty late when I noticed this so I called the vet yesterday morning and got him in right away.

The vet took the stitches out and decided to completely close the wound this time with staples and put a drain in (to be removed Monday), along with an E-collar to keep him from doing any damage. She had originally had the top half sutured shut with the bottom left open to drain. She also put him on another two weeks for Clavamox. This is what she told me over the phone when she called to okay him being picked up. When I go to pick him up a tech also let me know that because the skin in the pockets wasn't healing together very well and was granulating they "roughed up" the edges of the skin to get rid of the granulation and promote healing. She also noted that there wasn't much infection that needed to be cleaned out and told me to try to clean the drain area if I could.

I brought him home, left his cage open, and he sat in it for several hours before coming out (he did this the last time he came home from the vet so I wasn't concerned). He went into the cupboard and seemed to be pretty normal, just drowsy from the sedative and swollen faced. I left him alone for the night minus going to the bathroom once, and he seemed fine then as well.

This morning he was still very drowsy and had not drank anything but had managed to eat a small amount. I called the clinic to ask about painkillers since he still seemed pretty miserable and to see what there opinion was about us leaving him alone for the night as my boyfriend and I had had plans to stay with some friends out of town. I was told that he was given pain meds but that I could get more for him if need be and that they felt that as long as he had food and water, he would be okay alone. I managed to clean his drain and wound with only a couple growls on his part. Admittedly, I had to tape a q-tip to a spatula to be able to clean it as he wouldn't let me get my hand that close with me facing towards him. I did get to pet him quite a bit from the side when he couldn't see me, I wasn't sure if he was getting used to being touched or if he just didn't care because he was still being affected by the left over sedative.

The vet called shortly after I got done doing that to tell me that she had talked to a surgeon and thought that it would be a good idea to have Dooder put on another new antibiotic on top of the Clavamox. My boyfriend went to pick it up and asked if it was okay that Dooder was still very drowsy and just laying around. The tech working told him that he would probably be pretty out of it for the next few days since they had given him multiple pain killers. I had not been told that he had been given any painkillers and none were listed on his invoice and aftercare information.

Fast forward another hour or so. My boyfriend and I are planning on leaving, so I go in and make sure everything is ready for him and that he is doing okay. At this point he is entirely layed out, unable to keep his eyes open and will allow me to pet him all over. I felt like at this point there really is a difference between being tired from pain killers and something being wrong. I also noticed that he was very warm, had my boyfriend check and he agreed, so I called the clinic one more time just to make sure everything was okay.  The second I told the tech that he is running a fever she tells me that he needs to come in right away for fluids at the very least and the vet will see what needs to be done. He was so lethargic by now that I was able to pick him up and put him in a carrier.

We got to the vet and they checked his temp right away and it was at 104F. They put him on fluids and a medication to try to bring down the fever. I didn't think to ask what it was. That was almost two hours ago now. They told us they would give a call if anything happened, so I'm waiting at home hoping he's okay. They close in an hour, so hopefully he's doing okay if I haven't heard anything yet.

I just really don't know what to think. When I cleaned his wound earlier he was acting normal enough and didn't feel hot. Also, even though his wound wasn't healing wonderfully, he was doing fine otherwise, as far as health goes, before he went in yesterday. Now he's possibly close to death. I'm trying to decipher what could have happened to cause this but there are so many things. I'm hoping that he was too tired from the pain killers and sedatives and couldn't get enough fluids and simply needs them replenished.

Please send good vibes his and my way. I'm definitely worrying myself sick. I'm glad we didn't leave without checking on him or he likely wouldn't have made it. I'll update when I know how he's doing : \

I am so hoping the best for Dooder.  You are both in my thoughts. 

Hi Catb8

Are you still with Dooder or do you have a carer who can check ...  if the vet give him a hydration shot under the skin (you should be able to see and feel that because there will be a squissy lump on his back and his fur will be wet there).  Likely so, but if not, can you try to get him to drink water (through a dropper if need be) and/or some shaved ice?    I am not a vet so disclaimer here, but some experience with infections and fevers, suggesting he needs to be hydrated.  Can you check his eyes (moist vs. dry looking ) or his skin (pinched seems loose and goes back quickly vs. dry, stays up and seems rough) to see if he is dehydrated?

Dooder may have a latent infection from the wound (hence the extra antibiotics) or a reaction to the meds.  Either way, try if you can to monitor him.  He may well come out of it on his own, especially after his vet visit, but he may need help, like getting  extra fluids into him,and I know this sounds counter-intuitive, if he has a fever he also needs a blanket or snuggle bed or something he can crawl into or under to be warm. 

Does your vet have an emergency after hours number in case of something drastic like trouble breathing? 

Try not to panic, ferals are tough ... he will probably recover on his own, but do try to watch him for dehydration and labored breathing. 

Many vibes indeed.  likely you will wake up in the morning to a cranky and hungry cat!

Thanks for the good vibes. He's stable for the time being : )

They managed to get his fever down to 101 when I brought him home several hours ago. He's still a little warm, but no where near what he was when I took him in. He was definitely given fluids although I'm not sure how much; they didn't include the mL on the care sheet. They also gave him a steroid to break the fever and an injection of antibiotic. They really didn't give me an answer as to what they think is causing this to happen.

I'm keeping small fan on him and put a cool compress on his back while he was still in the carrier. He didn't like it much and moved back into the cupboard. I moved the fan back on him and he doesn't mind that though.

He hasn't eaten or drank yet, but he definitely is more alert. I attempted to give him some antibiotics by syringe, and he growled, hissed, and batted me away. So he's definitely not out of the woods yet, but he is better than earlier today. At least he's moving around and acting slightly like his normal feral self.

My vet doesn't have emergency hours, but there are two very good 24/7 emergency critical care clinics nearby. I will definitely be checking on him throughout the night so I can catch anything that might require an ER trip.

Trying to remind myself to keep calm. It's been a reeeeeally long day. I've put so much work into him, I really don't want him to go downhill when he's come this far. Ferals definitely are tough if he's already lived through everything that's happened so far. I'm optimistic he'll be able to get through this too. Here's to hoping he feels up to drinking some fluids by tomorrow.

Just saw this and am writing to tell you that you and Dooder are in my prayers.

Thank you Ondine : )

He's doing a bit better this morning. He still has not eaten or drank anything, but he is becoming more and more alert and less lethargic every time I check on him. He's gotten up at least twice to use the litterbox, urine only so far. His temperature has also stayed down.

Does anyone have an opinion as to how long I should wait to let him eat and drink on his own before considering taking him back into the vet? He has not drank anything since Wednesday morning, although he did have fluids given yesterday. The last time he ate was Wednesday night, but it wasn't very much. He does have an appointment Monday morning to remove his drain, so I'm hoping he'll be okay in my care until then.