Considering Raw for IBD kitty

Hi

Been reading this post and looking for some help for my cat as well.

London had been on Wellness Chicken brand before he started to poop around the house, flare ups. It was happening daily so we brought in a vet to look at him. He did an examination and blood tests, put him on steroids and antibotics and vet prescribed food Medi cal royal canin hypoallergenic cat food. Needless to say all of that was competely ineffective and did nothing for him, he continued to poop around the house and had loose stools. I was concerned about the actual ingrediants in the food he was on and kept mentioning to my vet about it but he insisted this was the best food for him.

The vet now is suggesting he would have to be on steroids for the rest of his life??? When I asked about the raw diet he frowned against it and did not recommend it at all.

I came across www.ibdkitties.net where I have been in contact with Lisa about London's current progress. I am currently trying him on Nature Variety Instinct Duck Formula, blending uber slowly because he cannot handle new foods well. The first couple days I was seeing results and it has been a toss up between loose, soft stools. He was on a probiotics but i took him off of that because he seemed to make him go more poop during the day. 

London is also a curious little bugger and is stalking us for food when we eat, stealing pieces of bread from the green bin. When meat is being cooked he literally goes mental for the food. On a side note my other cat who has not issues tummy wise is gaining serious weight on the hypoallergenic food and I need to get her off of it ASAP.

It has now been 2 weeks of blending RC brand and NV and other than the stool being dark, thicker at times. I am wondering should I switch from the duck formula to another one? Or should I try the homemade diet or buy premade froozen food?

Welcome sunnybelle76!

Sorry I didn't respond sooner, I was on holiday.

I would love to try to help out with your kitty anyway I can.

sunnybelle76 said:

Hi

Been reading this post and looking for some help for my cat as well.

London had been on Wellness Chicken brand before he started to poop around the house, flare ups. It was happening daily so we brought in a vet to look at him. He did an examination and blood tests, put him on steroids and antibotics and vet prescribed food Medi cal royal canin hypoallergenic cat food. Needless to say all of that was competely ineffective and did nothing for him, he continued to poop around the house and had loose stools. I was concerned about the actual ingrediants in the food he was on and kept mentioning to my vet about it but he insisted this was the best food for him.

With all due respect to the vet, but that food is the worse pet food that money can buy.

I have looked into all the vet prescribed diets and have learned that they are full of low quality fillers and are pushed at the vets because they also make money selling it too you. My cat was also prescribed this diet, and of course it never worked.

My vet could not figure out why the food was not helping, but I already knew why. If you dig a little on the topic of prescription diets, I am sure you will be amazed!

The vet now is suggesting he would have to be on steroids for the rest of his life??? When I asked about the raw diet he frowned against it and did not recommend it at all.

My vet also frowned on the raw diet at first, making sure I understood all the risks involved in the diet. I also informed her that the same risks were involved in feeding the traditional cat food. My cat also was/is on a lifetime supply of steroids which I have tried to take her off of, but I have not had any luck with that yet. But raw food has certainly kept the stools regular and I usually never see loose stool or diarrhea in the litter box.

I came across www.ibdkitties.net where I have been in contact with Lisa about London's current progress. I am currently trying him on Nature Variety Instinct Duck Formula, blending uber slowly because he cannot handle new foods well. The first couple days I was seeing results and it has been a toss up between loose, soft stools. He was on a probiotics but i took him off of that because he seemed to make him go more poop during the day. 

I would keep your kitty on the probiotic personally, mostly if you are dealing with GI issues probiotic can really help with the loose stool and digestion issues. I give my cat a human grade probiotic 10billion CFU capsule once daily. She has no issues at all on it and does have a regular nice firm stool daily. At first the stool was a toss up too when getting started but it eventually became more consistent as the days went on. So if I were you I would keep the probiotic as part of the meal. It will help more than anything.

London is also a curious little bugger and is stalking us for food when we eat, stealing pieces of bread from the green bin. When meat is being cooked he literally goes mental for the food. On a side note my other cat who has not issues tummy wise is gaining serious weight on the hypoallergenic food and I need to get her off of it ASAP.

Well if your kitty has food allergies or IBD then I would try my hardest to keep him out of the bread or the green bin, easier said than done but it might be a start to see what might be causing the upset. If he wants some meats, well you could toss him a piece of unseasoned meat you are cooking. And if the meat has been frozen for a while, after you thaw it out you can toss a piece of raw to your cat.  I freeze any meat I intend to feed to my cat for a week before I thaw and feed it to her. So far so good. Never feed any ground meats from the supermarket thought! Feeding your other cat the raw too will help with the weight issues, kibble always tends to make kitties fat, especially if they are allowed to free feed. Maybe you could do scheduled feedings or put down less kibble through the day.

I feed my kitty 2 larger meals at breakfast and dinner and 2 smaller snacks in early evening and before bed. If I am lazy and don't want to or am unable to feed snacks or even a scheduled meal, I put down some freeze dried raw for her instead. NV also makes a freeze dried food in raw.

It has now been 2 weeks of blending RC brand and NV and other than the stool being dark, thicker at times. I am wondering should I switch from the duck formula to another one? Or should I try the homemade diet or buy premade froozen food?

The RC is likely what is causing the dark color. My cat loves the NV duck and when she eats that on a day, her stool is usually light in color. If you can I would suggest you take your cat off that food all together since it has not helped anyway. If he likes the duck, let him have it. And of course add variety. NV sells a few flavors, beef is a hit in my home and so is the lamb, chicken was okay for a while till she lost interest in it.

You can always get some organ meats too, my cat really loves all the smelly organ meats like beef offal, but I suppose that is common with cats. They seems to like the smelly foods.

Don't ditch the duck, maybe try adding another meat like beef, chicken or lamb to the menu. NV sells a beef and chicken in trial size you could try, but feed it gradually to avoid GI upset.

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If I can help you with anything else I would be happy to share all my trials and errors. I must say though that before switching to an all raw diet, my cat never had a good stool, mostly soft or diarrhea all the time. Till I made the switch was when she started to have a normal kitty poop and for the most part usually does unless she is stressed out or something. At least I know its not likely food related though. If you can get your cat to transition gradually to all raw, I am pretty sure you will start to see results, but like with any diet, introduce it slowely because it can cause loose stool. Best of luck to you and your kitty and I hope he gets some relief soon!

Hi

I am getting a fecal exam to rule out any parasites.

I am blending more NV than the RC brand, at first he only pooped 2x a day. Than the last 2 days it was more than that 4X, and yesterday it went back to 2x plus what I call a bonus poop.

I wrote all the ingrediants of the 3 different cat foods to see what is what and compared with a list of allergens to a cat, the Royal Canin Hypoallergenic Food had the most allergens including vegetable oil, which I now know just is like a lubricant for some cats. But I highly suggest people do it because it is good to cross compare the various foods to see what are the triggers

It has been frustrating to figure this out for him, because he is so lovable but also super active and I am just trying to manage the poop issues, meaning I have trained him to meow to me if he has to go poop (somewhat confusing with I am hungry meows but he has a pattern and you get used to it) otherwise he will poop around the house. He is slender and has been for awhile now, where the other cat has gotten fat on the vet food.

The poop is somewhat loose to soft right now, poor guy just can't seem to have a hard stool like the other cat does. I took him off the probiotic powder cuz it seemed to make him go more than normal. 

I have bought Natural Balance limited ingrediants as the next food to try, I also bought 2 forms of raw premade food, Nature variety has a trial size and Pet for life I believe is the other brand both in the freezer at at pet store by my house.

I'd just like to jump in and note that many proteins that are triggers for cats and their allergies in commercial food are not triggers when fed raw. Carolina's Bugsy suffered from IBD for a loooooong time. He had 14 months of diarrhea. His first full day of 100% raw he had his first formed stool. He reacted violently to any canned chicken commercial cat food. He also reacted to plain old supermarket raw chicken. But when it's organic raw chicken, or vegetarian-fed raw chicken, he is fine with it.

I'd consider working towards a 100% raw diet before trying more canned foods. You might be surprised at how well your kitties does without the frustration of figuring out triggers in the commercial foods....

FYI, the probiotics provide beneficial gut bacteria, which really boosts the immune system.

And if you're worried about bacterial risks, the Nature's Variety is actually a sterile raw food - it's pasteurized, so no bacterial risk in using it.

Yes I have been reading up on it alot.

London goes mental when meat is being cooked, could be his way of saying to me "thats what I want".

The Hypoallergenic diet didn't do much for him & I have slowly tried to get it out of his life for good. He seems more satisfied on Nature Variety, wheras before he would always be awake and restless and begging for food all the time. He still begs for food but he also now has more down time (finally he takes naps thru the day otherwise he is constantly meowing for food)

And my other cat pretty much has picked up the weight for herself and him and I need her to lose the weight.

I am not sure why vets pump the vet prescribed diet? cuz there really is no such thing as a hypoallergenic diet. If London has some sort of allergen to something in that food

Poor little guy tends to go 3 times a day, not very close together usually around 11am, than 6pm and around 12am sometimes it is very small amount.

I am pretty good at figuring out when he has to go poop and I pay attention and he comes to meow at me. If I ignore him at all he will go in a place he shouldn't otherwise for some reason

when I take him to the litter room he will go into the box on his own. Not sure if this is more a behaviour issue but it has been working and less poop surprises around the house.

I see soft stool from time to time but at this point I am trying to get the vet prescribed food out of his system. I would like to try the Nature variety Raw medallions, even just one or two to see what happens blended in with his food a little.

Well, the poor little fella probably associates the litter box with his bowel movement discomfort.

If you try the raw medallions and they start helping, you may want to consider buying a new litter box or two, and putting them in new places. He might use those, not associating them with pain and/or discomfort....

LDG said:

I'd just like to jump in and note that many proteins that are triggers for cats and their allergies in commercial food are not triggers when fed raw. Carolina's Bugsy suffered from IBD for a loooooong time. He had 14 months of diarrhea. His first full day of 100% raw he had his first formed stool. He reacted violently to any canned chicken commercial cat food. He also reacted to plain old supermarket raw chicken. But when it's organic raw chicken, or vegetarian-fed raw chicken, he is fine with it.
I'd consider working towards a 100% raw diet before trying more canned foods. You might be surprised at how well your kitties does without the frustration of figuring out triggers in the commercial foods....
FYI, the probiotics provide beneficial gut bacteria, which really boosts the immune system.
And if you're worried about bacterial risks, the Nature's Variety is actually a sterile raw food - it's pasteurized, so no bacterial risk in using it.

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my Bugsy always did poorly.... Today I found my notebook from back in 2008, and page after page is of diarrhea and things we tried Diets, supplements, meds.... Vet trips.... In 2010 he had an uti and I should known better, but the E-vet gave him 74 days of clavamox. From that day on he started on a 14 month daily diarrhea. He was so bad, his bottom would be bleeding sore it was constant vet trips, treatments, diets... Until that all the drugs started taking a toll on his liver. Our only option would be open him up for an exploratory surgery....
After months fighting against raw, I decided to give it a try, out of pure desperation.
I introduced him very slowly.... The first thing was to remove him from the kibbles- coincidently, the same you feed, Royal Canon Hypoallergenic (by the way, this food has NO meat!). Then I started mixing 1 tsp of raw into this canned food, in each meal.
Next day I mixed 2. Third day, I mixed 3 and removed one of wet. This day he had a 1/2 solid stool. I kept adding tsp by tsp until all he was eating was raw. Took 8 days. On that 8th day, which was the firs day eating all raw, he had hi first solid stool of his life!
We never looked back. From that time on, we discontinued all supplements, leaving only probiotics and omega3.
Bugsy never he's diarrhea, and for a cat that was my "lemon kitty" which if anything could go wrong it would, he is today the happiest and healthiest of the bunch! He never cared too much for canned, but he LOVES raw! His vet is amazed with his progress!
He also has stomatitis. A few months into raw we discontinued the treatment, and it seems that even his stomatitis is subsiding. We are close to going to the vet the check his teeth; I think we will be able to skip dental this year!
Raw pretty much save Bugsy. The difference is night and day. It all goes back to inflammation, and raw is the least inflammatory diet for a cat... Not sure if you have access to rad cat, but where commercial goes, imho it is the best, the most easily digestible, and kitties in general love it!
Hope this helps! (sorry for all Tue typos, typing from my phone)

He had a bad night, a flare up, he pooped outside my door & 8am he pooped on my floor in my room. He than threw up clear liquid a couple of times, not sure what triggered the flare up usually something he finds sniffing around the house or the food he is on.

I am dropping off the stool sample off today at the vet.

I blended in the raw frozen bits into his current food, he seemed interested enough but left the food and she ate it. He still came to sit with me, as he does every morning in  my lap while I am working away on my laptop.

I am starting to give up on Nature Variety Duck Formula as I am not sure if the canned version is agreeing with him.

I may try the rabbit if I can find not many stores carry Rabbit for some reason.

I thought I would try the raw before switching to another can, does anyone else have the above problems with their kitty?

I totally feel your pain! I went through all these flare ups with my kitty too and sometimes she will still get them although not as severe as before.

sunnybelle76 said:

He had a bad night, a flare up, he pooped outside my door & 8am he pooped on my floor in my room. He than threw up clear liquid a couple of times, not sure what triggered the flare up usually something he finds sniffing around the house or the food he is on.

I am dropping off the stool sample off today at the vet.

Good Idea, better safe than sorry!

I blended in the raw frozen bits into his current food, he seemed interested enough but left the food and she ate it. He still came to sit with me, as he does every morning in  my lap while I am working away on my laptop.

It's a good sign that he seemed interested in it, and real great that the other cat ate it. It may take some time to get him adjusted to the new food but keep trying, they have to get familiar to the new food before they take to it sometimes. Some cats go for it right away, while others take months before they are all on raw. Just be patient and go at your cats pace.

I am starting to give up on Nature Variety Duck Formula as I am not sure if the canned version is agreeing with him.

I may try the rabbit if I can find not many stores carry Rabbit for some reason.

If you can, try the duck in raw formula. My cat loves it, and like LGD said what might cause upset in canned or kibble formulas, may not cause the same result on the raw. You could give that a try. Nature's variety has the raw boost bites duck in trial size too. It is like a raw kibble so you could give  a few to start.

I thought I would try the raw before switching to another can, does anyone else have the above problems with their kitty?

I personally would. I also tried can after can of different diets with my cat and it never really helped. That and all the switching just made her more sick. Raw was the only thing that ever helped her in the end. It sounds like your kitty would be a good candidate for a raw diet too!

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I know how frustrating seeing your cat not feeling well is. I went through it for most of a better part of a year before I made the big switch. My cat was also in the litter box at least 4x a day or more with watery bowel movements, and she ended up wearing it too, which was not at all pleasant for her or I. (she is long haired) For me, the switch was easy since she took to it right away. I started her on the chicken NV raw then we went to the NV lamb. I can get her to eat just about all the NV varieties and she does very well on it.


She still gets the odd flare up from time to time, but mostly from stress or if I accidentally forgot her pill (which is rare but has happened) But instead of diarrhea she gets a mucus issue instead. Still these flare ups only last a day or two and she has never been better on any other diet. I highly recommend you get your cat on a probiotic because it will help a lot! The raw will also be a huge help if you can transition him to it. Don't loose hope, it might take a while but it will happen eventually. Just don't give up! He is likely still sensitive to the ingredients of the canned foods. A raw diet will likely fix that issue. Best of luck, keep us posted on his progress.

Had another bad day yesterday with kitty, I tried to introduce a new canned food. Natural Balance Duck and Pea (thought cuz it was one protein source) boy did that not work very well.

Loads of poops and throw up as well, he did not respond well even if it was just a smidge added. But it was scary how bad he reacted to it, which makes me think that whatever is that particular formula. And after all the poops and throw ups he still wanted to eat like he didn't miss a beat.

So for now I am going to wean him off the vet food with Nature Variety, what I wanted to do is is have him on one food than introduce the raw bites. I have two raw formulas Nature variety and Paw for life....

I realize I have been ying yanging with the food but this is such a science to seeing what works and what doesn't. The other cat is going along for the ride, lol. 

I was so upset that I ended up crying in his litter box room at 3am, cuz I didn't know how to help him.

sunnybelle76 said:

Had another bad day yesterday with kitty, I tried to introduce a new canned food. Natural Balance Duck and Pea (thought cuz it was one protein source) boy did that not work very well.

Loads of poops and throw up as well, he did not respond well even if it was just a smidge added. But it was scary how bad he reacted to it, which makes me think that whatever is that particular formula. And after all the poops and throw ups he still wanted to eat like he didn't miss a beat.

So for now I am going to wean him off the vet food with Nature Variety, what I wanted to do is is have him on one food than introduce the raw bites. I have two raw formulas Nature variety and Paw for life....

I realize I have been ying yanging with the food but this is such a science to seeing what works and what doesn't. The other cat is going along for the ride, lol. 

I was so upset that I ended up crying in his litter box room at 3am, cuz I didn't know how to help him.

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The Pea fiber may have been to much for his little tummy. Angel used to be able to eat that, but after he had tummy trouble (different reason), it changed. It seemed to give him loose stool, or diahreea. I don't know if Duck is just to oily for him, or if it was the pea fiber. -Just thouht I'd mention that.

My cats had trouble with NB duck and pea too. It's too much pea, in my opinion. Second and third ingredient, and when you remove the moisture, probably first. However, it also has carrageenan, and this ingredient causes a lot of intestinal problems in cats. If we're talking about the canned.

The dry LID, the first and fourth ingredients are pea, again, too much pea.

(it was about 2 years ago I tried it)

I am trying to find a food that agrees with him, I am seeing mixed results with his Nature Variety Duck Formula. I had stayed with Duck because the vet food was also duck.

The vet food since day 1 really never made a difference in his stools.

The common ingredients of guar gum and carrageenan, were in his original cat food of Wellness Chicken, the vet food also has the same ingredients, the Nature Variety doesn't have either. Natural Balance that I tried the other day coupled with pea flour, pea protein.

Does anyone know any other cat foods that doesnt contain the above mentioned ingredients?

Sunnybelle, maybe you should start a new thread in the Cat Nutrition forum: http://www.thecatsite.com/f/64/cat-nutrition

Maybe you don't realize you're posting the raw feeding forum? People here may have some ideas for what canned foods to try, but most people here with kitties with IBD or GI issues tried the prescription foods, tried the limited ingredient foods, tried alternate proteins, tried to identify the triggers and problems, and after months or years of frustration and failure, switched to raw food. I think the best advice you'll get from us here is - try raw food.

This thread in the nutrition forum identified foods without carageenan, but most of them contained guar gum, if I remember correctly. Some without both might have been identified: http://www.thecatsite.com/t/240335/canned-food-without-carrageenan-or-guar-gum

I do not believe we have Rad Cat in Canada does anyone know any canadian raw food companies and thoughts?

I have access to Nature Variety Raw and Paws for life brands.

I didnt know that the vet food had no meat, no wonder he was always hungry.

Yes, post #7 of this thread has a link to a list of raw foods in Canada: http://www.thecatsite.com/t/249931/new-to-raw-feeding-and-have-questions#post_3262259

Oakshimmer, also in Canada (the original poster of this thread) feeds Nature's Variety and Carnivora, I believe.

I think I am just scared, you get your hopes up and nothing seems to work.

He is a lovable cat and always has been a rascal and vocal, so no doubt he was getting into things that he shouldn't be.

did anyone else feel like this?

Hey sunnybelle76,

sunnybelle76 said:

I think I am just scared, you get your hopes up and nothing seems to work.

He is a lovable cat and always has been a rascal and vocal, so no doubt he was getting into things that he shouldn't be.

did anyone else feel like this?

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When I first switched to raw I was a skeptic, and yes I also felt as if nothing was going to work. But in the end raw feeding was my only hope, and I am so thankful that I gave into trying it out. Give things some time, and just wait it out. Take things day by day with your kitty. If he really loves the raw, let him have it! And of course if you have any questions or concernes (even the smallest of ones) just ask! I think I asked lots of questions when I first started out, and I really needed all the support. The folks on this forum have really helped me to understand raw feeding, and have also provided me with some very helpful tips and suggestions that have also helped my cats current conditions.

Keep up the good work with your kitty, just stick with it and you will see that he will get better one day at a time.