Semi-Feral Mother and Newborn Kittens

Hey all!

To give some background, my neighbor found kittens in his horse trailer a while back. Their very feral mom took off, so they left the kittens there so she could come back to them. She never did come back for them so they took the kittens in and bottle fed them. After they were old enough, they let them go on their property and then those cats had a litter. This was all at the house that my neighbor lives at. The litter from the cats they bottle fed were trapped and brought to the property he keeps his horses at (just down the street form me). 

Anyways, there are now 3 cats from that litter on his property (one was hit by a car and a friendly one found a home at another neighbor's house). My neighbor feeds them daily so they have decided to stick around and they live under a house on the property. They aren't too scared of people (you can get about 10 feet away from them, sometimes closer and sometimes they spook quickly) all probably a bit under a year old. There's a pretty female blue tabby, what I think is a female russian blue (that color at least), and a orange tabby and white tom cat.

I didn't have much interest in them until it came to attention that the pretty little blue tabby was heavily pregnant. So I made it my mission to trap her and let her have her kittens at my house, socialize the kittens, spay mama, let her go back on my neighbor's property, and find homes for the kittens. First, I tried the simple way of trapping, the Havahart trap. I caught every cat but her, including a few random ferals. I think she got trapped but then got out, because I went to check the trap one morning and it had been set off, but the "back door" was open a few inches. I made the mistake of not double latching the back door   I knew that after that, she wouldn't go back into that trap. So I made my own! It was one with a door that I attached a long string to and would pull the door shut when she went in to eat. It didn't have a bottom to it, but I thought it was heavy enough that it would work. Of course, she slipped under it when it got off balance while we tried to get her into a crate. Finally, I tried a smaller version of the "super trap". (http://www.google.com/imgres?hl=en&...w=159&start=0&ndsp=21&ved=1t:429,r:0,s:0,i:70) I successfully got her in their after a few nights of sitting from a distance and waiting. (She is very smart and on top of that, she was wary from being trapped twice already.) We made a wire "shoot" to lead from the trap to the crate and of course she found fault in that and got out once again! She was ready to pop at that time so I knew we didn't have any time to lose. We modified the wire shoot and I sat and waited a few more nights. As late as I stayed, I never even saw her, which I had before every night, even if she didn't walk into the trap. I knew that she must have be having her kittens, much to my dismay.

Surprise, surprise, a day or so later she showed up without her big belly! I searched the property for kittens, but found nothing. I happened to see her today in broad daylight, so I decided to watch from a distance, hoping she would lead me to her kittens. Sure enough, she went straight to a big brush pile and disappeared. As quiet as I could, I followed to see if her kittens were there, too. Through a small opening in the tree branches, I saw a little newborn kitten's face! Of course, mama was hissing, so I quickly left. I don't want to disturb her enough that she feels the need to move her babies. The kittens are probably 2 days old now and the one I saw was, of course, tiny with closed eyes- and what looked to be a blue tabby like mom! Other than that, it was too dark to tell anything else.

WOW! I really wrote a novel there... kudos to whoever took the time to read the whole thing!   Anyways, my question is, what do you guys think I should do? Wait until the kittens are old enough to come out and trap them and mama, or just them? Wait a few weeks and then catch them and mama? Catch mama and then go retrieve the newborn kittens? Do you think she would reject them due to stress or my handling of them? 

Thanks for reading!

Here are the only pictures I have of the mama cat, from today. 









Here she is heading off to her "den"



This is the brush pile





Sorry for the quality of the pictures. They are heavily cropped and edited to see her easily. I didn't have my zoom lens, unfortunately. 

Get her babies and put them in the trap. She will forgo all previous experiences to get to her babies. Can't try for too long because babies need to be fed every 2-3 hours at this age. If you can't catch her, then you might get stuck hand rearing kittens. At that age I only feel comfortable tube feeding, until at least 5 days old when you could start bottle feeding them.

Do you think it would be better to trap her in the "mini" supertrap I built and then getting the kittens? I have their food in their at the moment so the only way she can eat is by going in the trap. I have the door propped open with a bucket so they can all come and go as they please. I'm not in the position to be up every 2-3 hours tube/bottle feeding the kittens. I'd rather leave them for the mama to take care of.

Thanks for your input!

If you are sure where the nest is, you can trap mom first. Prob the easiest.

Dangers to kittens because she may freak out?  Yes, there may be, but in practice it seems to work.

She gets satisfied when rejoined with kittens.

You do of course everything you can to keep her calm.  Lay a towel on the trap as soon you can, so it is dark and cosy.  Move her to her, room, with litter, nest, food, water, scratching post. Let her out form the trap (open the trap simple and leave).  If you have access to a Felway diffuser, have it on.

Under the time you go and fetch the kittens.  After a couple of hours carry them in.

Should work.

There IS some theoretical danger, but folks have done so time and again.

Taking the kittens first can also work, using them as bait. There are even cases when the mom has voluntarily come into the house.

But if it doesnt work, you get stuck.

Welcome to TCS site and our Forums!

Good luck!   *vibes*

Ps.  YOU are thinking soundly, spaying, fostering, etc.

But your friend, although having a big heart and wishing well, does everything backwards.  Ie not spaying them - and thus getting new litters of semiferales...  There becoming more of them instead of less.

Please tell him the vet would be happy to do his profession.  If he doesnt  afford nor have time to transport them to the pricey vet in the town, tip him to talk with his horse veterinar.  Many  rural veterinars do also help the local cats while they are there to look after the horses or cows.  Taking just a small fee extra.

ps the danger may be if her freaking out because ot the extreme stress.  This about rejecting because smelling humans is largery a myth.  The myth may be true for wild rabbits and deers, who both do leave their kid alone in the grass some hours - dont touch this kid!

But it doesnt seem to be true for cats.

And definitely not for the cat moms who are somewhat used to the rescuer, where the rescuer was their food source a longer time.  Even if they are still very shy and semiferal.

so taking in them to her room, leave the basket with them at the door, and leave (or possibly get way at side, sit down in a corner, making soft friendly sounds, IF you want to observe and be prepared for everything).  the mom can fetch them herself into the nest when she wants.

If she is too stressed, she prob wont care for time being,  ie not kill them either.

As said, this is taking extra precautions. Most rescuers arent that fussy, and yet it works fine. 

About the kittens, you had some answers in the Pregnant forum.

Your momma is very beautiful, even stunning!   If you manage to foster her, you could surely show her in the Pet class...  She would do OK!

The sorrow part of your story is your friends part.  They DO have a big heart and the best wishes, but they also do it backwards.

Not neutering causes them be new generations of semiferales, isntead of solving the problem in a good way.

Please talk with them.

Good YOU do think not only about fostering, but also about neutering.  

Welcome!

Thanks so much for the help! After helping the mama and kittens, I'll definitely TNR the other cats. My neighbor doesn't care how many cats he has on the property so he has no motivation to spay and neuter them all. The other grey cat who I think is a female looks to be growing a belly on her, too, unfortunately. I don't have a problem helping him out so no worries there.

Sorry about that, didn't mean to post in two sections! I was having problems posting in the pregnant cat forum and didn't think my thread was ever posted! I was confused when I found my thread in the pregnant cat section and never thought to check here to see if it was posted twice.

Anyways, she really is a beautiful cat- much more so in person! The pictures are pretty crummy.. Blue tabbies have always been my favorites. I'll bring my zoom lens with me when I attempt to trap her today, tomorrow, and this weekend

AWWW she is just lovely, so very pretty. I pray you can get her trapped and then you must also get all of those kittens the same time!!! It would be best to trap her right away since you already know where the nest is, you can easily get all of the kittens at the same time. They will all be in the nest since they are only a few days old. The little family needs your help and thank you for caring :heart3: Much luck with that this weekend :cross: Keep us posted

Thanks for the good wishes!   I will keep you all updated 

SilverTortie said:

 My neighbor doesn't care how many cats he has on the property so he has no motivation to spay and neuter them all. The other grey cat who I think is a female looks to be growing a belly on her, too, unfortunately. I don't have a problem helping him out so no worries there.

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Swell he hasnt no problem with cats.  So he can always add some "barn-cats", or take in other semiferal into the colony, if his good will is as big.

Im very, very glad to help YOU will help him with his motivation  etc, so they will be TNR:ed.

In the name of the Cat, I do thank you.

Grey can be spayed at once, if you want.  As long she isnt high preg it isnt very difficult nor ethically too tricky.   Although you and your vet must decide for yourself of course.

Good luck!  *vibes*

I would make plans to trap her again and then once you have her go and get the babies before they are old enough to move on their own.  Of course have her spayed but socializing them will be key if you wish them to be adopted by people.  Also, spaying her of course will prevent more unwanted pregnancies but it is key to find people that are pro-neuter/spay as well to adopt the kittens.  You don't want them to continue the cycle.  Most people out there will not spay/neuter a free kitten even if they have a "contract" with you to do so.  So I would call your vet and see about a special way to cut down on the costs for the kittens.  Many Humane Society's will do a free or very cheap spay/neuter when the time comes & even come to them.  That way, the adoptees will only have to make the call. 

Have any of you ever trapped a feral cat w/ kittens?  She won't put herself in a situation where she could be separated, ie going in a trap. She will starve before she goes in that trap. . But your best bet is to put the kittens in that trap. I am super experienced in this. And I am an animal behaviorist. But only do what you are comfortable doing.. And your cat appears to be blue not silver.

P3 and The King said:

I would make plans to trap her again and then once you have her go and get the babies before they are old enough to move on their own.  Of course have her spayed but socializing them will be key if you wish them to be adopted by people.  Also, spaying her of course will prevent more unwanted pregnancies but it is key to find people that are pro-neuter/spay as well to adopt the kittens.  You don't want them to continue the cycle.  Most people out there will not spay/neuter a free kitten even if they have a "contract" with you to do so.  So I would call your vet and see about a special way to cut down on the costs for the kittens.  Many Humane Society's will do a free or very cheap spay/neuter when the time comes & even come to them.  That way, the adoptees will only have to make the call. 

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Thanks for the advice!! 

Reekajane said:

Have any of you ever trapped a feral cat w/ kittens?  She won't put herself in a situation where she could be separated, ie going in a trap. She will starve before she goes in that trap. . But your best bet is to put the kittens in that trap. I am super experienced in this. And I am an animal behaviorist. But only do what you are comfortable doing.. And your cat appears to be blue not silver.

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I have absolutely no experience with this but I'm learning through researching and, unfortunately, a lot of trial and error! She went into the trap today, I pulled the door, and she was in! Of course, she found more flaws. She escaped out the top!!   I have plastic netting screwed down but she found a loose spot. I'm going to screw some real wire fencing around it so hopefully it will be completely unescapable!

If it I need to, do you recommend putting the kittens in the end of a havahart type trap? If it doesn't work do you think I could put them back in their den and she would take care of them as usual? The problem is, it's not going to be easy getting to her babies. I'll have to be super careful to move the branches to get them without possibly smashing them   It's very hard to tell how big their nest in the branches is and I have no idea how many kittens there are. 

I'm not sure if I accidentally called her a silver tabby one time but I have been calling her a blue tabby   My username didn't have anything to do with her.

Reekajane said:

Have any of you ever trapped a feral cat w/ kittens?  She won't put herself in a situation where she could be separated, ie going in a trap. She will starve before she goes in that trap. . But your best bet is to put the kittens in that trap. I am super experienced in this. And I am an animal behaviorist. But only do what you are comfortable doing.. And your cat appears to be blue not silver.

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Of course some of us have trapped a mama cat and her kittens before!!!!! That is not true, that she will starve before going into a trap and leaving her kittens.

I do not agree with you on using the kttens as bait. Would not ever recommend doing that. That is very dangerous and could potentially kill a kitten when the mother goes in to rescue her babies who will be wiggling and squirming about. A kitten could get killed when the trap door slams shut on a Havahart trap. That is a bad idea IMO!!!

SilverTortie said:

I have absolutely no experience with this but I'm learning through researching and, unfortunately, a lot of trial and error! She went into the trap today, I pulled the door, and she was in! Of course, she found more flaws. She escaped out the top!!   I have plastic netting screwed down but she found a loose spot. I'm going to screw some real wire fencing around it so hopefully it will be completely unescapable!
If it I need to, do you recommend putting the kittens in the end of a havahart type trap? If it doesn't work do you think I could put them back in their den and she would take care of them as usual? The problem is, it's not going to be easy getting to her babies. I'll have to be super careful to move the branches to get them without possibly smashing them :cross:  It's very hard to tell how big their nest in the branches is and I have no idea how many kittens there are. 
I'm not sure if I accidentally called her a silver tabby one time but I have been calling her a blue tabby   My username didn't have anything to do with her.

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It is alright, hun. DO NOT put the kittens in the trap. They could be killed by squirming and moving about and be killed when the trap door is triggered shut. Just keep trying to trap that momma cat again. There is also a crate method other's have used but that is only IF the mother cat will eat in your presence. I don't know if you are that far along in the trust process with this cat. :dk: It is best to just keep trying to trap this momma cat. AND don't be surprised if she moves the kittens. Mother cat's will move the nest if they feel there is danger. Hopefully, she will not do this after her trapping episode. BUT she will go in again, hunger will take over and she will need to eat for her nursing kittens. :nod: BEFORE you trap her again though, make sure you know that she has not moved the kittens. This is very tricky, but can be done, and many of us here have had to trap a feral mom and her kittens before. Just make sure that trap is secure and she cannot escape like that. OH and I have a "silver" cat too..... you don't have to use the "professionals" coat color terms. :lol3:

Yep, she went in the trap pretty quickly yesterday after not having food that day yet. She's been unsuccessfully trapped in it before, but still wasn't too sacred of it obviously. If I end up using her kittens as bait into a trap, it will be my last resort. I would probably use a trap where you pull the door shut once she goes in and not a havahart trap.. that does seem pretty sketchy/dangerous. 

OK, now this might sound a little crazy... But, she does know you somewhat.  This is what I have done in the past with mommas I couldn't trap.... Go get the kittens put them in a box, a regular box.  Make sure momma can see you and talk soothingly to her.  Walk slowly so she can see you and she knows where you are taking them. Usually, she will follow.  Just put them inside the door of your place.  She should follow shortly.  And then just shut the door once she is inside.  Of course if this doesn't work, it could be a problem.  But, most of the time cat mothers are very good mothers and will not abandon their young... Especially if they are familiar with you.  However you may still have to trap her but she will be more willing to stay if she know you have her babies.  That may be the problem, she is worried about her babies.  And this trap seems faulty in some way... I would try to get another one.  Good luck!!