Hm...which one to get...

This is linked to my post in the behavior section (introducing a new kitten to an older cat), I'm looking at the food situation and I'm hesitating...

Sasha's been on Royal Canin Indoor mature for the past couple of years and seems to like it. (he's 18)

Tiggy (the 6 month old kitten I'm adopting this coming week) was fed Hills' Science Diet kibble at the Humane Society, and then a mix of Performatrin wet kitten food and Science Diet kibble (for kitttens) by my inlaw...

Since the Royal Canin agrees with Sasha (and has Glucosamine and Taurine...at his age not a bad thing) I feel it would be best to keep him on that formula.

Since Tiggy has gotten pretty chubby on the kitten food - I'll see what the Vet says tomorrow- I figured I'd switch him over to adult food. Question is, which one?

I thought I'd slowly wean him off the canned food - I got some Performatrin Chicken and Fish Indoor Adult cat food cans; and perhaps feed him Performatrin Hairball control dry food - he's a medium-hair tabby.

The dilemma is that I can't find any kind of reviews of the Hairball formula on the internet, and everyone seems to endorse (or at the very least like a lot) Performatrin Ultra as a quality food...

Should I return the Hairball control food and exchange it for the Performatrin Ultra? Would the Performatrin Ultra provide Sasha with the same glucosamine and taurine a cat his age needs? While it would be more economical to feed them both the same food, I'm concerned about the effects on their respective healths!

Okay...so I dug a bit deeper on a break and found this about the Performatrin Hairball food formula:

Performatrin Hairball Control Dry Cat Food Features and Benefits:
•\tScientifically developed to meet your cat's needs
•\tControls hairballs
•\tSupports the digestive and urinary systems
•\tReal chicken is the #1 ingredient.

Crude Protein (Min.) 32.0 %
Crude Fat (Min.) 18.0 %
Crude Fiber (Max.) 8.0 %
Moisture (Max.) 10.0 %
Ash (Min.) 6.7 %
Calcium (Min.) 0.90 %
Phosphorus (Min.) 0.75 %
Magnesium (Min.) 0.08%
Magnesium (Max.) 0.10%
Taurine (Min.) 0.16%
Vitamin E (Min.)150 Iu/Kg
Vitamin C (Min.) 25 Mg/Kg
Omega-6 Fatty Acids (Min.) 3.32 %
Omega-3 Fatty Acids (Min.) 0.40 %.

As far as finding a cat food suitable for both cats, the Performatrin Ultra (Slim Care Salmon & Olive Oil) would fit the bill, though there are differences:

crude protein 33% as opposed to 27% with Royal Canin
crude fat 10% as opposed to 14%
Crude Fiber 5% as opposed to 6.2%

Moisture content is the same, and Royal Canin doesn't list the rest of the nutrients?

I would not change the food of the 18yr old.
As far as the baby, I am not sure why you want to take him off wet food... Wet food is the best food for a cat health wise, and if you want to keep the weight in check, that is the way to go too - feeding more wet and less dry will make it way easier to cut down calories. Dry food is calorie packed, not wet.

Originally Posted by Carolina

I would not change the food of the 18yr old.
As far as the baby, I am not sure why you want to take him off wet food... Wet food is the best food for a cat health wise, and if you want to keep the weight in check, that is the way to go too - feeding more wet and less dry will make it way easier to cut down calories. Dry food is calorie packed, not wet.

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If you saw the way he wolfs down that wet kitten food and only nibbling on the kibble...(and feeling Tiggy's round belly) I dunno, seems to me that the wet food packs its share of calories!

I'm more concerned with putting him on an adult formula at this stage; and I've fed Sasha almost exclusively kibble (I tried feeding him wet in the past - he'll have a few bites but the food just goes sour on the plate) and he's still going strong at 18...

Again, I'll base my final decison on what the Vet tells me tomorrow. If Sasha tries the Performatrin Ultra from Tiggy's food and I see he reacts well to it, I might consider putting them both on it; we'll see!

DO Not change the older ones food... 27% is fine for a senior cat , 33is a kidney taxer

Carolina is correct about wet food...

wet food 5-6 oz can ave 150-200 calories ...

dry food 1 cup ave 350-400 calories( which in most brand is roughly four oz in the cup)

Originally Posted by sharky

DO Not change the older ones food... 27% is fine for a senior cat , 33is a kidney taxer

Carolina is correct about wet food...

wet food 5-6 oz can ave 150-200 calories ...

dry food 1 cup ave 350-400 calories( which in most brand is roughly four oz in the cup)

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Hmm...keeping their food separate is going to be a challenge...conversly (if I can't keep Tiggy from sampling Sasha's food) would Tiggy eating Sasha's kibble be detrimental to his health? So many questions to ask the Vet tomorrow...

You can feed Tiggy two wet meals, one in the morning, and one at night, most of his calories would come from wet, and he wouldn't be very hungry, only snacking on the dry food...
I will leave the answer about snacking on Sasha's food to Sharky to respond.

Originally Posted by sharky

DO Not change the older ones food... 27% is fine for a senior cat , 33is a kidney taxer

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I have three cats: ages 12, 11 and 7 on blue buffalo healthy aging dry, and grain free wet food twice daily. The healthy aging has 32% protein, is that too high? I like blue buffalo, and now I'm wondering if I should switch to a lower protein formula; their weight control has the lowest at 28%.

Originally Posted by Carolina

You can feed Tiggy two wet meals, one in the morning, and one at night, most of his calories would come from wet, and he wouldn't be very hungry, only snacking on the dry food...
I will leave the answer about snacking on Sasha's food to Sharky to respond.

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From what I've also read, keeping my kitty fountain away from the food bowls should improve their drinking? With experience, I've learned what amount of kibble is the "just enough" amount to feed Sasha, he doesn't really care for the wet stuff, so hopefully they'll sort things out between themselves...

Originally Posted by clpeters23

I have three cats: ages 12, 11 and 7 on blue buffalo healthy aging dry, and grain free wet food twice daily. The healthy aging has 32% protein, is that too high? I like blue buffalo, and now I'm wondering if I should switch to a lower protein formula; their weight control has the lowest at 28%.

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I did some label checking, Hill's Senior formula packs 29% Crude Protein while Nutro packs 28%. Iams premium has a whopping 35% crude protein...there was a time they were a quality food?

Originally Posted by Lucky Luke

I did some label checking, Hill's Senior formula packs 29% Crude Protein while Nutro packs 28%. Iams premium has a whopping 35% crude protein...there was a time they were a quality food?

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That could be fine for some.. but read where the protein comes from... Iams used to be a solid food , today IMHO I would suggest cat chow before it...

The younger cat is okay if it samples the less protein food... AFFCO says kitten food only has to have 30% protein... Obviously kitten cannot just eat older cats food but a bite here and there is likely okay...

Originally Posted by sharky

That could be fine for some.. but read where the protein comes from... Iams used to be a solid food , today IMHO I would suggest cat chow before it...

The younger cat is okay if it samples the less protein food... AFFCO says kitten food only has to have 30% protein... Obviously kitten cannot just eat older cats food but a bite here and there is likely okay...

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Found the AAFCO charts

http://www.maxshouse.com/nutrition/a...t_profiles.htm

based on this (again I'm no Vet) it would seem that (based on the chart) 33% crude protein is acceptable in older cats?

Originally Posted by Lucky Luke

Found the AAFCO charts

http://www.maxshouse.com/nutrition/a...t_profiles.htm

based on this (again I'm no Vet) it would seem that (based on the chart) 33% crude protein is acceptable in older cats?

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NOTE I am not a vet either... but I have worked in the pet food industry and learned the AFFCO stuff in and out..
Acceptable yes... advisable no.. Think about a older human , do you feed the same foods to a 90 year old that you would to a 35 year old?

Older cats do not digest the protein in a dry as well as a younger cat... This is why MOST senior drys have less protein and fat .... Now if you are feeding a Quality wet even kitten is okay for MOST seniors as it has the Moisture to aid in proper digestion..Realize "senior" begins for a cat at 7-9 depending on the vet and personal preference... your 18 yr old cat is roughly 90-95( depending how close to 19 )... Your six month old is roughly 6-10 years old...

Originally Posted by sharky

NOTE I am not a vet either... but I have worked in the pet food industry

and learned the AFFCO stuff in and out..
Acceptable yes... advisable no.. Think about a older human , do you feed the same foods to a 90 year old that you would to a 35 year old?

Older cats do not digest the protein in a dry as well as a younger cat... This is why MOST senior drys have less protein and fat .... Now if you are feeding a Quality wet even kitten is okay for MOST seniors as it has the Moisture to aid in proper digestion..Realize "senior" begins for a cat at 7-9 depending on the vet and personal preference... your 18 yr old cat is roughly 90-95( depending how close to 19

)... Your six month old is roughly 6-10 years old...

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Once again, I'll see what the vet says tomorrow about the food issue; Tiggy's gotten a bit too chubby and Sasha's not very keen on wet food.

I was just thinking that if I could find one food suitable for the both of them I could get the larger sized bag of food and adjust portions accordingly. I have a small kitty fountain that Sasha seems to like; and for a cat who hates getting wet, Sasha certainly enjoys sitting in the tub and drink from the dripping faucet!

For all I know, the Vet might ask that I keep Tiggy on a kitten formula for another month or so, I'm only speculating at this point in time.

Originally Posted by Lucky Luke

Once again, I'll see what the vet says tomorrow about the food issue; Tiggy's gotten a bit too chubby and Sasha's not very keen on wet food.

I was just thinking that if I could find one food suitable for the both of them I could get the larger sized bag of food and adjust portions accordingly. I have a small kitty fountain that Sasha seems to like; and for a cat who hates getting wet, Sasha certainly enjoys sitting in the tub and drink from the dripping faucet!

For all I know, the Vet might ask that I keep Tiggy on a kitten formula for another month or so, I'm only speculating at this point in time.

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Many are not to keen on wet .. I have settled for 25% with my current crew ... There are all stage foods ( good for kittens thru adult) Most are in the 30-34% range ( grain frees are higher)..

Water drinking for a non wet eater is AWESOME

Wet is definitely best! My girls only get dry food occasionally, or as a treat. When it was a larger part of their diet, they all gained weight--a little known side-effect of giving a carnivor so many carbohydrates. Have you heard of Dr. Martin Goldstein? He wrote a book called, "The Nature of Animal Healing." I highly recommend it. http://www.drmarty.com/drmartybook.htm If you read this book, you would never consider feeding your cat Science Diet. It's crap.

What the Vet said

Tiggy: keep him on the kitten formula afor another 4 to 6 months. He's 6 months old... putting on weight but not quite full grown yet. The pet nutritionist should let us know the appropriate portions to feed him so he doesn't become grossly overweight.

Sasha: his current food is fine, but a higher protein food wouldn't be detrimental unless he already has a kidney condition. In that case, yes it would make sense to keep protein levels manageable and even put him on a "kidney diet".

There's a test (I forget if it's a blood test or a urine sample test) that can be done to determine whether or not his kidneys are in bad shape and would benifit from lower protein levels...

But honestly, for now, as the saying goes "if it ain't broken don't fix it". When Tiggy's fully grown, I'll worry about feeding him an adult food.

Originally Posted by Lucky Luke

What the Vet said

Tiggy: keep him on the kitten formula afor another 4 to 6 months. He's 6 months old... putting on weight but not quite full grown yet. The pet nutritionist should let us know the appropriate portions to feed him so he doesn't become grossly overweight.

Sasha: his current food is fine, but a higher protein food wouldn't be detrimental unless he already has a kidney condition. In that case, yes it would make sense to keep protein levels manageable and even put him on a "kidney diet".

There's a test (I forget if it's a blood test or a urine sample test) that can be done to determine whether or not his kidneys are in bad shape and would benifit from lower protein levels...

But honestly, for now, as the saying goes "if it ain't broken don't fix it". When Tiggy's fully grown, I'll worry about feeding him an adult food.

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It is Blood work to determine kidneys ( urine helps but only shows one part of the picture)... I dealt with kidney issues for 4.5 yrs with one kitty ... After dealing with it and researching I will NEVER feed a senior cat over 30-32% protein in a dry form.... Oh and FYI 90% of cats over 16 have some kidney disease ...

Why would you have to have a nutritionist call you on how much to feed? It is Definitely something the vet should be able to cover as it is a very elementary item... Kittens at his age need roughly 1/3 to 1/2 more calories than the same size adult

I'm not a vet, but I am a vet tech assistant and work very closely with the vets and techs at the clinic I'm employed at. But, reading what you've written has raised some major red flags -- not only because I work at a pet hospital, but also because I'm a cat owner.

There should be no reason that a vet refers you to a pet nutritionist unless there is a major issue present. And, from what you've already shared, that does not seem to be the case. Any vet or tech can point you in the right direction as far as quantities to feed a 6 month kitten and an adult cat. To start, while the packaging on cat food is not always accurate in regard to feeding instructions, it does offer valuable information. And, while some of that information can be confusing to the "typical" pet owner, a vet or tech could glean a lot of information based on the labeling alone. And, to be honest, no cat or kitten is the same -- there is a lot of trial and error where pet nutrition is concerned. But, that being said, there is no reason to spend money on a pet nutritionist given your current situation (unless there is more to the story). Your vet should be able to get you started on a healthy diet and regimen for your cats and then go from there during follow-ups and the like.

Secondly, I'd be concerned that your vet did not strongly suggest having a senior blood panel done on your older cat. Before making any changes to that cat's diet, it would be wise to find out where he is at from a medical standpoint. Adding additional protein could be hazardous under some circumstances just as taking away vital nutritients can be detrimental. A cat that age should have a full exam, blood testing (CBC, electrolytes, organ function), and a urinalysis done. And, that's the minimum.

Frankly, I'd be concerned that my cats weren't being seen by a vet confident in his or her abilities as well as someone who does not make preventative care a priority. And, add to that the fact that your vet is quick to make a referral for a professional whose services, at this stage in the game, are not needed...I'd be looking for a second opinion. And, from one cat owner to another, that is my advice.

Originally Posted by Lucky Luke

"if it ain't broken don't fix it"

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I think this goes specially for Sasha... Any changes on his diet can be trouble at his age... If he is doing well at his diet, with no problems, I would definitely not fix it, aside from perhaps adding a little wet to protect his kidneys... But that's the extent of it...
For the kitten... you have plenty of time... And I agree with Sharky, you should not need a nutritionist for this... really...