Raw For Ibd And Possible Kidney Issue

[LTS3]

Leroy's health issues are adding up His last blood work showed a slightly elevated BUN level. The vet took more blood today to recheck just in case Leroy has early kidney disease. If it turns out that Leroy has kidney issues or just borderline, what kind of raw would be suitable for that and IBD? I know Darwin's has a veterinary formula for kidney issues but it only comes in chicken

Edit: Abyssinians are the main breed affected by a rare condition called renal amyloidosis. I have to ask the vet about that. The Cornell web site says there isn't a cure for renal amyloidodis but it can be treated like regular kidney disease.

 

[lisahe]

I'm very sorry to hear this, LTS3 . I guess renal amyloidosis would be where the proteins gather in the kidneys? (I'd never heard of amyloidosis at all until last week when someone I knew died of its complications...)

Before anyone suggests anything, what, exactly, are Leroy's food limitations, so we can avoid those suggestions? Chicken is one of them, right? And does that include all forms of chicken, including liver? And what are the foods that he doesn't like? (I ask this in part because my first suggestions would be Rad Cat, but I seem to recall that he doesn't like that. And EZ Complete is a great supplement but it's got chicken liver...)

 

[LTS3]

No chicken Eggs are ok, though. Better In The Raw contains egg yolk and Leroy has no issue with that. I tried a sample of EZComplete and Leroy had no issue with that so chicken liver is probably ok.

Duck and other poultry seem to be ok.

No Rad Cat. Leroy won't touch it He seems ok with Primal again but I haven't fed that since the one nugget last week. No Stella and Chewy's. I have not tried frozen Vital Essentials only because the pet store seems to carry only the freeze dried. I can ask about the frozen.

Leroy will eat any protein: elk, venison, goat, bison, etc.

Something Emma can eat as well would be a plus so I don't have to feed two separate raw diets but it's not that important.

Renal amyloidosis is when fibrous protein stuff collects in the kidneys for an unknown reason. No idea why it mainly affects Abyssinians.

 

[1 bruce 1]

Is Leroy raw fed now, and has been for awhile?
I'm curious that if so, what the slight elevation was in readings compared to those WNL's. Our raw fed dogs and cats both usually show a slightly higher BUN reading, but it depends on his diet and his normal "baseline" for such readings.
A raw fed pet will usually show a higher than normal BUN based on a kibble fed pet!
Would ordering from somewhere like Hare Today be an option? They have both boneless AND bone in meats (chunks and grinds) that might be a winner with both cats.

 

[1 bruce 1]

This is mostly dog stuff but you seem like an owner that's had some experience but I'll toss this in here just in case...or for anyone else that might be interested..

 

[1 bruce 1]

^Holy crap. I tried to link this and it won't fix.
Sorry about the lengthy text =/

 

[LTS3]

Leroy's BUN was within normal limits in January. In March they were slightly elevated.

Leroy has been eating raw since he was weaned, so nearly 8 years.

I've been getting HT through the pet store but won't be able to until after the summer. The pet store owner put in a massive order recently to avoid needing to buy extra ice packs for summer shipping. That order is for her own dogs. Had I known that she was putting in a huge order I would have asked her to include a few boneless chubs for me. I really don't have freezer space for my own HT order. I can usually find boneless Oma's Pride and Bravo at another pet store.

Found these:

Do Raw Diets Affect Blood Test Results? - Feline Nutrition Foundation
Feline raw diet and the kidney blood work values... - Feline Instincts
Looking for the links with info about elevated BUN/crea in raw fed cats

So BUN is slightly elevated on a raw diet. Not sure how Leroy's levels went from normal to slightly elevated in 2 months on the same diet of NV rabbit and first HT rabbit with Alnutrin and then Oma's Pride vension with EZComplete. mixed in.

 

[1 bruce 1]

Do you think she would be willing to split/share (cost), provided she got any boneless chubs?
Has Leroy ever had tripe? Some cats find it really un-feline and some really like it.
Also ask any butchers in your area about pet food. Lots of them are really happy to help pet owners out and will save/grind scraps (bone in or boneless) to cut costs when it comes to not buying bulk.
One of our butchers finds raw feeding really awesome and will call anyone he knows that raw feeds if they have a surplus.

 

[LTS3]

She buys meat with bone and organs for her dogs.

I have not tried tripe. I know I can get that at ethnic markets around here.

 

[1 bruce 1]

She buys meat with bone and organs for her dogs.

I have not tried tripe. I know I can get that at ethnic markets around here.

If the markets are somewhere you are happy with (quality wise) I would try it, even just 1/4 pound bought at first to test.
Our IBD cat really seems to go for it (as a "topper" to help enzymatic production). We were encouraged to use this food for our raw fed dog showing a slight increase in BUN. It did seem to help, but keep in mind this was a dog, not a cat.

 

[lisahe]

No chicken Eggs are ok, though. Better In The Raw contains egg yolk and Leroy has no issue with that. I tried a sample of EZComplete and Leroy had no issue with that so chicken liver is probably ok.

Duck and other poultry seem to be ok.

No Rad Cat. Leroy won't touch it He seems ok with Primal again but I haven't fed that since the one nugget last week. No Stella and Chewy's. I have not tried frozen Vital Essentials only because the pet store seems to carry only the freeze dried. I can ask about the frozen.

Leroy will eat any protein: elk, venison, goat, bison, etc.

Something Emma can eat as well would be a plus so I don't have to feed two separate raw diets but it's not that important.

Renal amyloidosis is when fibrous protein stuff collects in the kidneys for an unknown reason. No idea why it mainly affects Abyssinians.

Well, it sounds like Leroy likes the EZComplete, right, so I might try to keep going with that since it has egg shell instead of bone, which I'd keep away from. Or at least try to not to feed a lot of. Some Primal, for example, has around 10% bone, though some proteins (like pork, I believe) is lower.

It's too bad Leroy doesn't like Rad Cat because that one doesn't have bone, either! (When we had a cat with mild kidney disease and advanced IBD/likely lymphoma, Rad Cat was one of the few foods she'd eat, with fairly low phosphorus.)

Anyway, good luck! I think you're off to a good start if Leroy likes EZ.

 

[orange&white]

She buys meat with bone and organs for her dogs.

I have not tried tripe. I know I can get that at ethnic markets around here.

You want green tripe for pets. The only tripe sold for human consumption has been thoroughly cleaned and bleached. Not much nutrition-value there. Green tripe is "green" because it includes the partially-digested grass in the cow's stomach. It's essentially like a prebiotic/probiotic (in theory). It stinks, but pets seem to love it.

 

[lisahe]

It stinks, but pets seem to love it.

If it stinks, that's probably exactly why pets seem to love it!

 

[1 bruce 1]

You want green tripe for pets. The only tripe sold for human consumption has been thoroughly cleaned and bleached. Not much nutrition-value there. Green tripe is "green" because it includes the partially-digested grass in the cow's stomach. It's essentially like a prebiotic/probiotic (in theory). It stinks, but pets seem to love it.

Yes, the bleached/white/honeycomb stuff is not worthwhile!

 

[1 bruce 1]

If it stinks, that's probably exactly why pets seem to love it!

Even our pickiest/sickest will pick at this stuff. It's SO gross!!!

 

[Azazel]

Have you tried a little fortiflora on the Rad Cat? What about different proteins, does he hate all of them?

 

[LTS3]

BUN came back within normal range this time. Creatine is fine. Vet will want to keep a close eye on kidney values just in case.

I think I tried the chicken Rad Cat and one other, turkey maybe? it was a teeny half ounce sample. FortiFlora oddly doesn't work on Leroy

 

[1 bruce 1]

BUN came back within normal range this time. Creatine is fine. Vet will want to keep a close eye on kidney values just in case.

I think I tried the chicken Rad Cat and one other, turkey maybe? it was a teeny half ounce sample. FortiFlora oddly doesn't work on Leroy

Do the vets think it's a blip in blood work? We've had that happen before. It's scary but sometimes numbers do silly things.
Glad things are looking better!!! I agree...keep a watch but hopefully the scary stuff is done.

 

[Azazel]

BUN came back within normal range this time. Creatine is fine. Vet will want to keep a close eye on kidney values just in case.

I think I tried the chicken Rad Cat and one other, turkey maybe? it was a teeny half ounce sample. FortiFlora oddly doesn't work on Leroy

It might not hurt to try and get some samples of some of the other flavors and see if he likes them. Nice thing about Rad Cat is their free samples.