Homemade Food - Where do I start?

[Jullesg]

I have to change cat food due to ingredients/lack there of in the food I was using. One of my 12 yr old became very ill. Not sure how he got ill. His buddy then stopped eating. The newest cat has stopped eating wet food but will eat dry. All 3 were eating the same brand of wet food. I want to feed a good cat food whether canned or homemade but not sure how to start. The comments regarding nutritionist etc make me pause on proceeding with the purchase of a meat grinder. The Vet is going to want to put the cat that is recovering on a prescription diet which I don't want to do.

 

[daftcat75]

I am following the conversation because I find myself in a similar situation as ObeseChess. I have to change cat food due to ingredients/lack there of in the food I was using. One of my 12 yr old became very ill. Not sure how he got ill. His buddy then stopped eating. The newest cat has stopped eating wet food but will eat dry. All 3 were eating the same brand of wet food. I want to feed a good cat food whether canned or homemade but not sure how to start. The comments regarding nutritionist etc make me pause on proceeding with the purchase of a meat grinder. The Vet is going to want to put the cat that is recovering on a prescription diet which I don't want to do.
I apologize if I have hijacked the conversation but I would appreciate advise.

Most vets do not have enough nutrition education. If you are going to consult a vet for a homemade diet, make sure you consult with a veterinarian nutritionist e.g. the specialist who does have enough nutrition education. Otherwise you‘ll likely get what one nutrition class teaches general vets: raw is risky, don’t make your own food, feed prescription food if your cat has any health concerns.

I believe as long as you use a premix supplement powder (let someone else do the heavy lifting of the vitamin and mineral needs) and keep at least one canned meal a day in their diet, you should do alright even without a nutritionist consult. People get into trouble when they get too homemade and then they start off-roading and their recipes drift from what was originally a nutritionally balanced and complete recipe to something custom and unknown. The reason I recommend keeping one canned meal in the diet is insurance. If you are making a mistake, it’s being mitigated by a proper food. But also you will encounter supply or production issues (can’t get the powder, made a batch they don’t like, can’t get the meat and organs, or just forgot to make a new batch before the food ran out.) Having a canned backup helps you weather these issues. And if you ever need to leave your cats in another’s care, you’ll sleep easier knowing your cats can get by on a canned food if your caregiver can’t do the homemade for any reason.

 

[Jullesg]

Most vets do not have enough nutrition education. If you are going to consult a vet for a homemade diet, make sure you consult with a veterinarian nutritionist e.g. the specialist who does have enough nutrition education. Otherwise you‘ll likely get what one nutrition class teaches general vets: raw is risky, don’t make your own food, feed prescription food if your cat has any health concerns.

I believe as long as you use a premix supplement powder (let someone else do the heavy lifting of the vitamin and mineral needs) and keep at least one canned meal a day in their diet, you should do alright even without a nutritionist consult. People get into trouble when they get too homemade and then they start off-roading and their recipes drift from what was originally a nutritionally balanced and complete recipe to something custom and unknown. The reason I recommend keeping one canned meal in the diet is insurance. If you are making a mistake, it’s being mitigated by a proper food. But also you will encounter supply or production issues (can’t get the powder, made a batch they don’t like, can’t get the meat and organs, or just forgot to make a new batch before the food ran out.) Having a canned backup helps you weather these issues. And if you ever need to leave your cats in another’s care, you’ll sleep easier knowing your cats can get by on a canned food if your caregiver can’t do the homemade for any reason.

Daftcat, thank you. I had already purchased EZ complete premix before my cat became ill. I need to change the canned cat food as I believe that was the culprit. Reading the comments it seems Tikicat would be a good choice for canned. I am using Solid Gold Lamb and Brown Rice along with Applaws dry. I want to feel comfortable before I invest in a meat grinder. Any suggestions people have is appreciated. As stated at the beginning of the conversation this is overwhelming when you first begin.

 

[furmonster mom]

Waiting to invest in a grinder is perfectly reasonable. I was several years into my raw food journey before I got one.
Start off easy, chicken is usually the safest and most economical. Start with small batches to allow for transitioning.
Once they seem to be on board with the new diet, then start expanding with other meats (rabbit, beef, pork, lamb, etc.). You want to encourage them to eat a variety, as all meats have different nutritional profiles. An overall balance is the ultimate goal.

 

[Box of Rain]

Dark meat turkey is the most naturally taurine-rich protein that is commonly available, so legs and thighs are great pieces to purchase and debone. Save the bones and make stock (which cats love, just keep it "pure," no salt, onions, or garlic (especially).

Dark meat chicken is not as taurine-rich, but not a bad choice (and more available and more economical).

Chicken breast and turkey breast are quite low in taurine).

If you are doing organs, beef liver, beef kidney, and chicken liver are common and inexpensive.

Unless you have a special need of a grinder (say a cat with no teeth) I'd argue against grinding. Better for a cat to "work" by chewing (and hopefully gnawing on raw-meaty bones) in order to keep teeth, jaw bones and muscles, and gums healthy and strong.

You could start with a "complete" pre-mix and if you start feeling more confident start mixing in meals that rely on taurine-rich meat, organs, and raw edible bones in the Prey Model percentages to form some percentage of meals.

Don't become discouraged by the notion that feeding a cat with typical needs is overly complex or that you will require a nutritionist. Follow the formulas of reputable pre-mixes and/or follow PMR with fresh taurine-rich meat, organs, and ebile bone in the right percentages (while avoiding plants and carbohydrates) and your cats will thrive.

Bill

 

[daftcat75]

EZ complete has green lipped mussels which does not agree with every cat. If you have vomiting or diarrhea even with a slow transition, it may be the green lipped mussels. I recommend Alnutrin with Eggshell calcium. If you don't want to deal with fresh liver, you can use freeze-dried liver at 1/3 the called for amount. If the recipe calls for 45 grams of fresh liver, use 15 grams of freeze-dried and add another 30 grams of water. You can find freeze-dried liver in various proteins from SmallBatch, Raw Rewards, or Wholehearted (Petco brand)--usually in the treats section. As long as liver is the only ingredient, it doesn't matter whether you find it in the dog treats or cat treats section.

Yes it is overwhelming. Plan on making a mistake or two. That's why I recommend keeping canned in the diet. Start slow with homemade. As you get better at it, you can increase the proportion of homemade to canned. But I would plan on always keeping at least one canned food in their diet as insurance and a backup.

 

[lisahe]

I fully agree with all the advice that daftcat75 , furmonster mom , Box of Rain have already given! You haven't said what your cat's medical issue is, J Jullesg , or if you're planning/hoping to make raw or cooked food so I'll just add some general thoughts.

-To add to what daftcat75 said about keeping canned food in your cats' diet, I'll mention that we've been feeding a combination of canned, homemade cooked, and commercial raw food for some years now. It works really well since our cats get bored with their food easily.

-To add to what furmonster mom and Box of Rain says about grinders, I just use a food processor, a regular Cuisinart and don't even want a grinder. Sometimes (when I have time and patience) I even chop cooked meat for cat food by hand! (One cat seems to really prefer that...) I've always (with one small exception) made food with premixed supplements so don't need to grind bone. The exception on premixes is the one batch of food using this recipe that I made almost ten years ago, using bone meal rather than bone.

-I really love what Box of Rain says about simplicity! I really like Alnutrin because it's so basic. I do add some fish oil, egg yolk, and pumpkin but that's about it.

-Tiki is great food but watch out: our cats have always had a love-hate relationship with Tiki! I seem to recall other people mentioning that their cats did, too. (I remember a time, maybe four or five years ago, when they seemed to change the recipe repeatedly...)

-EZ is a great premix, though one of our cats can't eat it; I'm nearly fully certain it's the mussels (which Daftcat75 mentioned) that bother her. We use Alnutrin with egg shell calcium (which our cats prefer anyway) and I make it with freeze-dried liver. If you're going to make a lot of food and need lots of freeze-dried liver, I'd recommend Stewart brand, which comes in large tubs. (I bought a tub of FD chicken liver from Chewy during the peak of the pandemic!)

-I definitely understand your preference to avoid prescription food! Edwina (our cat who can't eat mussels and several other odd ingredients) had surgery on Monday and had part of her stomach removed... our regular vet, whom we love, said to feed her prescription food before the operation and also said Edwina would probably be eating prescription food forever. I didn't say anything (out loud!) about that "forever" but was relieved when the clinic where Edwina had an operation said to feed her very plain, regular food and even recommended against Hill's A/D, which is high-fat. Credit where it's due: I was very, very grateful to have A/D for Edwina pre-op, when she wasn't eating much (I think the giblets and liver probably appealed to her!) but I wouldn't want to feed that (or the Purina or Royal Canin foods the vet also gave us) to her for more than a very short time, particularly since Hill's specifically says it's not for long-term feeding. I'm glad to have a can on hand, though, since she did initially like it. The same goes for a similar Purina food, which I wouldn't feed for long because it has carrageenan. (She may have IBD.) The Alnutrin food, which is pretty plain, will be perfect for her in a few days, as she continues to recover from surgery. I hope it will continue to work for her.

 

[LTS3]

You can also buy pre-ground and chunked meat from a raw pet food supplier so you don't have to invest in a grinder. Hare-Today.com is one popular place to buy raw meat for pet food use.

The vet will likely discourage raw and home cooked diets but it's perfectly ok to disagree with the vet.


Not all cats will eat a raw or home cooked diet even with a slow transition and toppers. They're so used to canned and dry food that they don't recognize raw or home cooked as food to eat. One of the highest quality canned foods available is Rawz. It's expensive, though, and sold only at specialty pet stores and a few authorized online sites (Amazon is not one. Any Rawz product you find there is sold by a third party seller who basically goes to the local store to buy the food and then ship it to you)

 

[Jullesg]

I fully agree with all the advice that daftcat75 , furmonster mom , Box of Rain have already given! You haven't said what your cat's medical issue is, J Jullesg , or if you're planning/hoping to make raw or cooked food so I'll just add some general thoughts.

-To add to what daftcat75 said about keeping canned food in your cats' diet, I'll mention that we've been feeding a combination of canned, homemade cooked, and commercial raw food for some years now. It works really well since our cats get bored with their food easily.

-To add to what furmonster mom and Box of Rain says about grinders, I just use a food processor, a regular Cuisinart and don't even want a grinder. Sometimes (when I have time and patience) I even chop cooked meat for cat food by hand! (One cat seems to really prefer that...) I've always (with one small exception) made food with premixed supplements so don't need to grind bone. The exception on premixes is the one batch of food using this recipe that I made almost ten years ago, using bone meal rather than bone.

-I really love what Box of Rain says about simplicity! I really like Alnutrin because it's so basic. I do add some fish oil, egg yolk, and pumpkin but that's about it.

-Tiki is great food but watch out: our cats have always had a love-hate relationship with Tiki! I seem to recall other people mentioning that their cats did, too. (I remember a time, maybe four or five years ago, when they seemed to change the recipe repeatedly...)

-EZ is a great premix, though one of our cats can't eat it; I'm nearly fully certain it's the mussels (which Daftcat75 mentioned) that bother her. We use Alnutrin with egg shell calcium (which our cats prefer anyway) and I make it with freeze-dried liver. If you're going to make a lot of food and need lots of freeze-dried liver, I'd recommend Stewart brand, which comes in large tubs. (I bought a tub of FD chicken liver from Chewy during the peak of the pandemic!)

-I definitely understand your preference to avoid prescription food! Edwina (our cat who can't eat mussels and several other odd ingredients) had surgery on Monday and had part of her stomach removed... our regular vet, whom we love, said to feed her prescription food before the operation and also said Edwina would probably be eating prescription food forever. I didn't say anything (out loud!) about that "forever" but was relieved when the clinic where Edwina had an operation said to feed her very plain, regular food and even recommended against Hill's A/D, which is high-fat. Credit where it's due: I was very, very grateful to have A/D for Edwina pre-op, when she wasn't eating much (I think the giblets and liver probably appealed to her!) but I wouldn't want to feed that (or the Purina or Royal Canin foods the vet also gave us) to her for more than a very short time, particularly since Hill's specifically says it's not for long-term feeding. I'm glad to have a can on hand, though, since she did initially like it. The same goes for a similar Purina food, which I wouldn't feed for long because it has carrageenan. (She may have IBD.) The Alnutrin food, which is pretty plain, will be perfect for her in a few days, as she continues to recover from surgery. I hope it will continue to work for her.

Lisahe,

Thank you for your response. My cat is recovering from Pancreatitis. His health has always been fragile and the adoption center had him as a high risk cat. I do not know how he got this illness. I believe it is from bad batch of food. I was also feeding him a brand of food which had carrageenan which made the Pancreatitis worse.

I have a total of 5 cats. The two seniors are special needs cats. The other three are young (3-6) however they are not adventuresome to try new foods. Unfortunately now they have to. I need to change the food and it is daunting to wade through all the information.

 

[Jullesg]

Dark meat turkey is the most naturally taurine-rich protein that is commonly available, so legs and thighs are great pieces to purchase and debone. Save the bones and make stock (which cats love, just keep it "pure," no salt, onions, or garlic (especially).

Dark meat chicken is not as taurine-rich, but not a bad choice (and more available and more economical).

Chicken breast and turkey breast are quite low in taurine).

If you are doing organs, beef liver, beef kidney, and chicken liver are common and inexpensive.

Unless you have a special need of a grinder (say a cat with no teeth) I'd argue against grinding. Better for a cat to "work" by chewing (and hopefully gnawing on raw-meaty bones) in order to keep teeth, jaw bones and muscles, and gums healthy and strong.

You could start with a "complete" pre-mix and if you start feeling more confident start mixing in meals that rely on taurine-rich meat, organs, and raw edible bones in the Prey Model percentages to form some percentage of meals.

Don't become discouraged by the notion that feeding a cat with typical needs is overly complex or that you will require a nutritionist. Follow the formulas of reputable pre-mixes and/or follow PMR with fresh taurine-rich meat, organs, and ebile bone in the right percentages (while avoiding plants and carbohydrates) and your cats will thrive.

Bill

Bill, thank you. One of the seniors has a couple of teeth. The other has no teeth at all. I am determined the 3 younger ones will never have dental work. As for bones I have read it wasnt good to have it in their food as they might choke.

 

[Box of Rain]

My Desmond is the least picky cat imaginable, and took to raw food from day one.

In fact, on the day we rescued him 9 months ago I made a platter of food that had 5 options for him to choose between. Some hand-minced (raw) dark-meat chicken, hand-minced (raw) dark-meat pork, cooked shredded dark-meat chicken, cooked shredded pork, and some of the canned Royal Canin food he'd been eating at his foster home.

He the raw chicken, raw pork, cooked chicken, cooked pork, and canned food in that order.

From that moment forward we've fed him a highly varied PMR style raw diet. He has literally devoured everything I've thrown at him.

I have helped people who are just getting started with raw feeding to get their dogs and cats started, and one of the things that has helped many if to put a very light sear on whole chicken pieces (before serving or mincing). Not really "cooking," just bringing out enough natural automatics in the meat to turn the animals minds on to the idea that this is food (if they need it).

Most people find that one their pets "get it," that they can wean off the "sear" and the link between the raw food and "good eating" remains.

Bill

 

[LTS3]

. As for bones I have read it wasnt good to have it in their food as they might choke.

Cooked bone is not safe to give to any pet because the bone is brittle and will break into sharp fragments when chomped on. Those fragments can cause internal injury to the mouth or further down in the throat or stomach or digestive tract. Raw bone is safe to give. Raw bone can be ground finely enough so that it doesn't cause any issues. Some cats enjoy gnawing on a raw chicken neck bone or wing for dental health purposes. If you worry about bone, buy bonless meat and follow a recipe or use a pre-mix that includes a calcium supplement.

 

[Box of Rain]

Bill, thank you. One of the seniors has a couple of teeth. The other has no teeth at all. I am determined the 3 younger ones will never have dental work. As for bones I have read it wasnt good to have it in their food as they might choke.

Raw bones (never cooked) need to be chosen appropriately to the cat's experience. But I'm convinced that teeth and bones that are not put to use will atrophy over time.

And cats with weakened teeth and jaw muscles and bones notoriously lose teeth as a result.

Promoting good dental health is one of the prime imperatives of my raw feeding goals. And promoting gnawing on bones and tearing at meat is fundamental to that end in my estimation.

As with anything there are risks, and ways to mitigate risks.

With starter bones, such as chicken necks, one can first off split them in two (serving only a half at a time) and then either taking a mallet or a meat cleaver to the RMB (raw meaty bone) and smashing it as much as necessary to eliminate the choking hazard.

As you gain confidence in your young cat's abilities, you can do less (or no) work for them. They will become stronger and more able to crack bones. Amazingly so.

Chicken feet are another good starter RMB, which you can also split and pre-chop a little for an initiate.

Another bone strategy (vs pre-chopping) is to provide bones with plenty of meat on them that are too just large for a cat to eat. A rib bone with meat or a chicken thigh or leg is something a newbie cat can't demolish (at least to start).

While one doesn't want to dismiss such things as choking hazards, and observing cats (and dogs) especially when starting is important, please don't let fears about choking on bones loom overly large in your mind. It is something to be mindful of, but mitigate the risks rather than stopping you from allowing your cats to eat in a way that is natural to them and necessary to their well-being.

Gnawing on appropriate bones and tearing at meat will make the entire muscular-skeletal-dental structure strong (very strong) over time.

I'm convinced this is critically important, both for promoting good dental health, but I also believe it is good for cat's minds. Watch how they behave when they take on meals that include appropriate bone. They act like proud little lions consuming their prey. And then konk out.

I wrote in another thread that we just saw the vet with my Vizsla (dog) who has been raw fed from the time he was 8 weeks. Chester is now 8.5 years-old. Not only is he strong, lean, and in vibrant health but his teeth and gums are clean and in perfect health. I got huge kudos from the vet, who is excellent (but very traditional).

Sady, the vast majority of dogs have periodontal disease by the age of 3 and I believe the situation with cats is similar.

There are other reasons I'm not a fan of "grinds" (unless they are necessary), including the leaching of highly-soluble taurine, but the dental health aspect is one that seems under discussed among sites dedicated to feline nutrition.

Bill

 

[Jullesg]

You can also buy pre-ground and chunked meat from a raw pet food supplier so you don't have to invest in a grinder. Hare-Today.com is one popular place to buy raw meat for pet food use.

The vet will likely discourage raw and home cooked diets but it's perfectly ok to disagree with the vet.


Not all cats will eat a raw or home cooked diet even with a slow transition and toppers. They're so used to canned and dry food that they don't recognize raw or home cooked as food to eat. One of the highest quality canned foods available is Rawz. It's expensive, though, and sold only at specialty pet stores and a few authorized online sites (Amazon is not one. Any Rawz product you find there is sold by a third party seller who basically goes to the local store to buy the food and then ship it to you)

LTS3,

Thank you. There is a location which sells Raws in the city I live in. I believe you are right about some cats not eating raw or home cooked food. I have placed broth in a couple of the dishes. The Senior cats eat it the younger ones just look at it. I can switch the kibble and change to a better canned food.