Diagnosis of Stage 2 CKD in 3 Year Old Cat

[hillyy13]

I'll try to find research about it, although some of what I'm seeing says it's "controversial", and there's a tipping point in the illness where too much protein can have a negative effect.

That said, you might want to take a look at Weruva, they have a couple varieties such as their steak frites that are lower in phos, and a new line coming soon called Weruva WX which is nutritionally complete except for even lower phos (so they have to state it's not nutritionally complete in order to be able to sell it).

I wish we could get Weruva here in the UK, but after having a look I don’t think we can

I was actually thinking - his allergy food is hydrolysed (so I imagine this means low protein, as the protein is broken down?) and also low phosphorous - maybe this could be a good shout?!

I have news on his ultrasound. I will post below…

 

[hillyy13]

Ultrasound update for anyone interested:

The vet said his kidneys look (I quote) “not particularly small, maybe slightly” - which I am taking as a positive! There was no sign of PKD or tumours.

I asked about the staging and he said from the ultrasound and his numbers he would suggest him to be at early stage 2.

However - he also said that his urine culture hasn’t yet come back which sometimes indicates that something was picked up on it. He said it could be a UTI, which could also lead his numbers to be slightly higher. With Cecil being on/off steroids for his allergies (which can cause a UTI as a side effect) it could be a possibility. So we’ll wait to see how they come back to rule that out.

Overall I am relieved that the ultrasound didn’t pick up anything worse. Of course, I would like him to have no kidney issues at all but I am now just grateful for any good news!

 

[fionasmom]

It is good news that the US did not show anything abnormal. I am not saying, by any means, that your vet is not a good one. But most are not trained in nutrition, at least in the USA. My cat vet, who is an excellent medical doctor, did not know what EZ Complete or Alnutrin were when I asked about trying to do something to help Jamie and his preference for all fish.

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

I'm wondering what your Vet is basing his diagnoses on in the first place since he doesn't even have the results of the urinalysis nor did he have the ultrasound results when the diagnosis was made. BUT, I'm so glad Cecil doesn't have PKD. That's wonderful news!!!!

I don't believe there is any concrete evidence either way about feeding high protein vs low protein in early stages. It's just that so many cats with kidney disease have muscle wasting, and it makes sense that without protein those muscles would waste away. My Vet said she had been to some conferences where they had been discussing it and there they had come to the conclusion that there wasn't a need to reduce protein until the later stages, so she was fine with me continuing feed a raw diet to my last kidney cat as long as I didn't feed bone since it was too high in phosphorus.

I just tried to find out info about hydrolyzed protein to see how it worked and can't really figure it all out, however, I do see that Royal Canin has a version that is kidney friendly as well as food sensitive friendly, combined into one food. Since your Vet is so adament that you go the kidney diet route, you might try that food and see what happens. Or wait for the urine results and see if all this is a result of a UTI. I told you above that one of my boys had increased numbers all due to a UTI and they decreased once it was gone. Could be the same for Cecil

 

[hillyy13]

I'm wondering what your Vet is basing his diagnoses on in the first place since he doesn't even have the results of the urinalysis nor did he have the ultrasound results when the diagnosis was made. BUT, I'm so glad Cecil doesn't have PKD. That's wonderful news!!!!

I don't believe there is any concrete evidence either way about feeding high protein vs low protein in early stages. It's just that so many cats with kidney disease have muscle wasting, and it makes sense that without protein those muscles would waste away. My Vet said she had been to some conferences where they had been discussing it and there they had come to the conclusion that there wasn't a need to reduce protein until the later stages, so she was fine with me continuing feed a raw diet to my last kidney cat as long as I didn't feed bone since it was too high in phosphorus.

I just tried to find out info about hydrolyzed protein to see how it worked and can't really figure it all out, however, I do see that Royal Canin has a version that is kidney friendly as well as food sensitive friendly, combined into one food. Since your Vet is so adament that you go the kidney diet route, you might try that food and see what happens. Or wait for the urine results and see if all this is a result of a UTI. I told you above that one of my boys had increased numbers all due to a UTI and they decreased once it was gone. Could be the same for Cecil

Sorry, I may have forgot to mention he did give me the urine analysis results (well, he told me over the phone that the urine was diluted and that there was protein in the urine. He didn’t give me the numbers though). I’m assuming this points to CKD?

What he doesn’t have is the urine culture results which will determine whether he has a UTI. I’ll keep you all posted as to when I find these out.

Thank you for the food recommendation, I will check it out

 

[Furballsmom]

This is from felinecrf .org

Protein

• The need for reduced protein for CKD cats is much debated, and may not be necessary for cats in the early stages of CKD. See Nutritional Requirements for more information.
• However, since BUN levels are influenced by diet, it does often help the cat feel better if you restrict protein intake, particularly as the CKD progresses and BUN rises.
• Most therapeutic kidney diets have protein levels of between 28 and 35%.
• When choosing a commercial food from the lists, I would not only look at the phosphorus level but also consider the protein level. That is to say, if for example I have two foods with the same phosphorus level to choose from and my cat will eat both of them, and one food has 32% protein while the other has 50% protein, I would normally choose the lower protein food.
• Ohio State University College of Veterinary Medicine has stated that protein should never be reduced to less than 20% of calories. According to Small Animal Clinical Nutrition — 6th Edition, Chapter 37, Chronic Kidney Disease (2019) Davenport D & Kirpensteijn J (Eds.) Mark Morris Institute, this is around 24% on a dry matter analysis basis.
• Personally I would try to feed a food with a protein level of 35% on a dry matter analysis basis, or as close to this as you can get.

This is the Nutritional Requirements link above
Tanya's Comprehensive Guide to Feline Chronic Kidney Disease - Nutritional Requirements

 

[moxiewild]

Hi all, just wanted to update that our beautiful boy has been diagnosed with stage 2 kidney disease. He has only just turned 3. We are heartbroken but going to do all we can to make sure he lives the best life he can. I’m going to make a new thread to ask about advice for CKD as I’m completely overwhelmed and don’t even know where to begin

I haven’t read every here, so I apologize if it’s been mentioned, but I highly recommend checking out Tanya’s CKD site (the “CKD Bible”) and I especially recommend joining the CKD Facebook group.

Tanya’s site - Tanya's Comprehensive Guide to Feline Chronic Kidney Disease - Everything You Need to Know to Help Your Cat

Feline Chronic Kidney Disease Facebook group - https://m.facebook.com/groups/703846239667023/

I’m so sorry about your poor kitty, but you’ve caught this relatively early and that is a really good thing!

 

[hillyy13]

Hi all,

The vet rang this morning with Cecil’s urine culture results. They found bacteria in his urine but they don’t think it’s a UTI. They are going to prescribe an antibiotic just in case. Does anyone know if this is safe for CKD cats?

I had a tough night with him last night. He runny pooped outside his tray twice and then had a weird episode where he was purring with his mouth open as if it was hard for him to breathe.

I just wish I knew what was causing all this. The vet still hasn’t given me any advice about hislow RBC count. The only positive to update is his potassium and phosphorous levels were in range

 

[Furballsmom]

Well, antibiotics can be rough on the stomach as they can kill off the good bacteria.

If you're not confident in your vet, maybe something here might help you to find one;
Find a Veterinarian and Practice | The Cat Community

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

According to Tanya's website, if bacteria is present in urine, that means there is an infection. And, with CKD, UTI's are quite common. Antibiotics are the "cure", but the type of antibiotic depends on what type of bacteria it is. Unfortunately, they typically do cause tummy upsets, so your boy may either feel nauseated or get the runs from them. We usually give probiotics when they are on antibiotics, but give them at least 2 hours apart.

As to his current runny poops and the breathing issues, I would notify the Vet about this. the poop issues could be the new medication he is on (Semintra), but I can't find anything about breathing issues with it. BUT that is alarming and your Vet needs to know about it. Open mouth breathing in cats is not normal unless they are playing hard and then it should only last for a few seconds. Please let your Vet know if you have started giving him any supplements, etc along with the Semintra. Also, ASK about the low RBC and is there is anything you can do about it. My hubby has this and was advised to take slow release iron. Don't do that though without discussing with your Vet.

 

[Rogie Rose]

My special boy Roger just passed away after 22 years and had CKD since he was about 16. Different stage of live but what we did which appeared to help was 1) minimise phosphorus in diet. we added a bit of iPakitine into his food. iPakitine reduces phosphorus being absorbed into the body. Not expensive can get it at ebay 2) Pet Wellbeing Kidney Support Gold which you are doing 3) start encouraging renal food, but don't go fully on it. At that age, they still need protein. It about balance. Some cats hates it, my Roger did, so it was about finding certain foods that whilst not renal, do have lower phosphorus content. As he got older and Kidney started to deteriorate, we also did sub cut fluids for his last two years.

 

[terestrife]

I don't have useful advice. But just wanted to offer my support and a virtual hug. My 11-year-old cat has started having early kidney issues too. I immediately searched google and had a panic attack in my vets office.

I am praying you find a solution that helps your fur baby. sending you positive energy.