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Don't need a diagnosis...Just ideas.....(long)

post #1 of 83
12/18/05 at 11:11pm
Thread Starter 
Ok so I know I can't get a diagnosis for a cat over the internet...But I more so need ideas, common stories, tests to ask for....etc........

Ok heres the senerio.....

John had three cats growing up...Yin...Yang..and Shuto.....Yin an yang were sister and brother from the same litter, and shuto was a show up on the porch stray......Yang ran away quite a few years ago ....But Yinny and shuto are still alive and live w/ Johns mom........

Ok theres the background here the story.......

Yinny a very intelligent indoor-outdoor calico, is 13 years old this year....She was always a heavy kitty...Not exactly obease but fat....Anyways up until 2 years ago she was healthy....(According to the vet at least...but i will rant about them later)

Well anyways 2 years ago Yinny lost 8 lbs in about 2 months...Yeah very bad...However the incompitant vet said that was fine.....never checked for fat on the liver or anything........I urged johns mom to bring Yinny to a different vet....But she had a friend their so she was getting deals on bills....And unfortunatly John and I were hardly able to survive never mind pay for a vet visit.........So life went on....and Yinny seemed to be happy and more active then she had ever been......Not knowing what had happened...But the vet said she was healthy so what were we to do.......

A year passes and nothing seemed to come of the mysterious weight loss......Then last year Trish (johns mom) moved...Yinny seemed to adjust very well to the move...she was acting like a kitten....the only difference was she refused to go outside anymore....But she would run around the house like mad, and play...etc....But a few month after moving in she developed chronic diahrreah....she went all over the house.....and the diarreah was foul smelling...Not that diarrea usually smells good...but this has a more fetid and unusual smell to it......And once in a while she would cry like she was in pain....And she stopped eating....and became obviously dehydrated.....

So trish brought Yinny back to the vet....The vet said that Yinny most likly had stomach cancer and to test her for it would be a waste of time...They put her on Prednizone so she would eat...and had trish feed her baby food to get calories back in her..............

So now another year has passed....And yinny still has chronic diarreah which she leaves all over the house....She is still on prednizone, and on a hills weight gain diet..........

The vets keep claiming she has cancer...and has not put her on flagyl or anything to help the diarreah.......because it would be a waste of time.......

So now John and I are in a better finacial position...So we are bringing Yinny to our vet...a feline only vet.......for a second opinion.......Are thoughts are is that we need to know if she is in pain....and if it really is cancer....because if it is, we feel it would be better to put her to sleep.......

But god help me if shes been suffering for 2 years because the vet didnt want to do anything...and was compltly incompetent.....errrrrrr

So what I would like from you guys are some ideas......

Do you think its cancer?....would she have lived this long if it was cancer??

Do you think her present condition has to do w/ the sudden weight loss???

What tests should I ask to be run???..Though I feel our vet is compitent enough to run the test needed....

And more so I just need someone to calm me down......Yinnys present vet has shown complete disregard, and neglect...and this poor girl who should be living out her later years, has been in pain because of it..... ....Well I am in this situation now And I am going to put this to and end one way or another........

So thank you all for listening...and thanx in advance for any ideas and comments on this situation
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post #2 of 83
12/18/05 at 11:16pm
Bridget, I have found that just because they went to vet school, does not mean they are good vets. Mostly in school (around here) the emphasis is on the large farm animals and not the companion animals, so it is easier to have a vet out to look at my horse then it is to take my cat in to be seen, because of the area of expertise. And even the small animal vet in another town- quite literally sucks. She is the one who "accidently" broke Tazzy's leg while taking an x-ray after Taz got hit by a car.

All you can do is find a feline specialist and let them look at her. And I wouldn't say anything about what is suspected to be wrong with the cat until after the first part of the exam. See what these experienced new set of eyes have to say about the weight loss and diarrhea
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post #3 of 83
12/18/05 at 11:35pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by hissy
Bridget, I have found that just because they went to vet school, does not mean they are good vets.

You can say that again.....

Poor Tazzy......If only animals had more rights...then we could sue for malpractice...and then they would start acting like vets.......

Yeah I wont mention the cancer diagnosis till they do.....Thanx for that, I probably would have ran my mouth.....
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post #4 of 83
12/19/05 at 8:01am
OH gosh I am so sorry! The only thing I can do is offer my experience. My beloved Bookie(RB) became extremely ill - first sign was the nastiest smelling diarhea I've ever smelled out of any species of animal.
They sent the stuff out to be cultured, it took a month for results, they were sure it was salmonella or ??? Anyhoo...we never got an answer in that everything came back negative, and we began treating her as if it were severe IBD. This approach cleared her up, but she was quite ill for a while.

So...off to your own vet, please keep us posted?

Ah..one more thing to share (forgive me if I am incoherent, up until 2 am and I don't do "naps" for nighttime sleep well any more), Patrick was in no position for an endoscopy two years ago...we did as much as we could (ultra sound) to determine if he had ibd or lymphoma (his intestines are quite thick, ropey with an area that my vet was sure felt like a tumor or two)...then began treating him as if ibd and loving him up even more as my vet said he only had several months to live (this was a year ago). Treatment initially included flagyl, and since has been prednisolone daily (tried to wean him off, could not do so). If it is lymphoma, he's certainly beat the odds, but I am more for it's being ibd. My vet always shakes her head when she palpates his gut, but my cats never do anything expected <@@>...a good thing in this case
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post #5 of 83
12/19/05 at 6:32pm
Thread Starter 
Thanx for sharing that story w/ me.......


Youre story is giving me ideas w/ dealing with this situation, so I completly appreciate it....

Also you made perfect sense...if you were worried.....
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post #6 of 83
12/19/05 at 6:49pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nebula11
Thanx for sharing that story w/ me.......


Youre story is giving me ideas w/ dealing with this situation, so I completly appreciate it....

Also you made perfect sense...if you were worried.....
I'm glad if sharing my experiences helped, and that I made sense. I'm not doing any posting tonight besides this, and I am much more tired than I was this morning!
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post #7 of 83
12/19/05 at 8:01pm
Hmmmm, I was thinking irritable bowel syndrome, or possibly a food allergy? But usually prednisone helps IBS....depending on the dose I guess. Could it be a parasite? Coccidia, or maybe even salmonella, ecoli, giardia, or cryptosporidium?
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post #8 of 83
12/19/05 at 9:38pm
i have no suggestions - but i'm really irate at the vet who thought that treating her symptoms was a 'waste of time' because she supposedly had something fatal!!! why should she suffer even if she's due at the bridge soon? we don't do that to people - why did this vet think this was appropriate for her! i don't understand why anyone with this attitude towards animals would even become a vet - cats are so clean, & here she's being forced to be so dirty! i'm not blaming you - you did what you could & are doing what you can for her. he's the professional, the expert - we're supposed to be able to rely on their advice! i'll be praying for your baby that she sees someone who can, if nothing else, make her more comfortable - & hopefully cure her!
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post #9 of 83
12/19/05 at 9:41pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by menagerie mama
Hmmmm, I was thinking irritable bowel syndrome, or possibly a food allergy? But usually prednisone helps IBS....depending on the dose I guess. Could it be a parasite? Coccidia, or maybe even salmonella, ecoli, giardia, or cryptosporidium?

Thanx for the suggestion.....IBS..hadnt even thought of that till you and pat mentioned it...Its definitly a thought.....

I thought parasites before.....When Trish gives me the records I will look see if a facal analysis was done.......

Thanx again
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post #10 of 83
12/19/05 at 9:42pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by laureen227
i have no suggestions - but i'm really irate at the vet who thought that treating her symptoms was a 'waste of time' because she supposedly had something fatal!!! why should she suffer even if she's due at the bridge soon? we don't do that to people - why did this vet think this was appropriate for her! i don't understand why anyone with this attitude towards animals would even become a vet - cats are so clean, & here she's being forced to be so dirty! i'm not blaming you - you did what you could & are doing what you can for her. he's the professional, the expert - we're supposed to be able to rely on their advice! i'll be praying for your baby that she sees someone who can, if nothing else, make her more comfortable - & hopefully cure her!

I am right their w/ you.......I am revolted by the care at this vet clinic...... ....thank you for your prayers.....and for being as angry as me......I do appreciate it
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post #11 of 83
12/19/05 at 10:01pm
I vote for IBS as well. Sounds like what my girl went through before I switched her diet. She had it so bad for so long (before i got her) that she taught herself to literally balance on the edge of the litterbox to keep the poop off of her fur. She could not gain weight either unitll it was cleared up. It's so sad that she suffered for so long. But im really happy that I was able to figure out what was wrong and clear it up.
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post #12 of 83
12/19/05 at 10:07pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bengalbabe
I vote for IBS as well. Sounds like what my girl went through before I switched her diet. She had it so bad for so long (before i got her) that she taught herself to literally balance on the edge of the litterbox to keep the poop off of her fur. She could not gain weight either unitll it was cleared up. It's so sad that she suffered for so long. But im really happy that I was able to figure out what was wrong and clear it up.

Geeze she must be a wicked smart cat...I am glad you figured it out....and that she is feeling better...

I feel the same way about Yinny, I am completly a mess, because I wasnt able to do more earlier...But I didnt know anybetter...ya know...Now that I am in school, and no what "adequet care" is I am fumming.....

Question....is it possible to change a 13 year old over to raw, have you ever delt w/ that in an older cat???........I definitly want to look into it for her once we know what is going on
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post #13 of 83
12/20/05 at 12:18pm
I just read an article today about FIP cats having chronic diarrhea....not to scare you though, but maybe look into this as well?
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post #14 of 83
12/20/05 at 12:43pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by menagerie mama
I just read an article today about FIP cats having chronic diarrhea....not to scare you though, but maybe look into this as well?

Thanx......

Yeah FIP would be a scary diagnosis....No scarrier than cancer I suppose
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post #15 of 83
12/20/05 at 2:05pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nebula11
Geeze she must be a wicked smart cat...I am glad you figured it out....and that she is feeling better...

I feel the same way about Yinny, I am completly a mess, because I wasnt able to do more earlier...But I didnt know anybetter...ya know...Now that I am in school, and no what "adequet care" is I am fumming.....

Question....is it possible to change a 13 year old over to raw, have you ever delt w/ that in an older cat???........I definitly want to look into it for her once we know what is going on
Yes she is! She is soooo smart she knows how to open cabnits and such. The funny thin is she teaches all of her kittens to stand on the litterbox too even though none of them have runny poos and she dosent either now but I guess so long of her having it made it a permanant habit now.
It would be hard to switch over a cat that old because cats become fixated on one type of food thinking that's whats acceptable. I would try it VERY slowly. I mean just a little bit mixed in with her wet food and slowly add a little more and a little more unitll it's completely switched. It helps for the older cats to see a young cat enjoying the food too. You know how curious cats are.
Im hoping it's only IBS and not FIP but if it's been going on for awhile now I think FIP would have killed the cat by now so here's wishing you the lesser of two evils!
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post #16 of 83
12/20/05 at 3:36pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bengalbabe
Yes she is! She is soooo smart she knows how to open cabnits and such. The funny thin is she teaches all of her kittens to stand on the litterbox too even though none of them have runny poos and she dosent either now but I guess so long of her having it made it a permanant habit now.
It would be hard to switch over a cat that old because cats become fixated on one type of food thinking that's whats acceptable. I would try it VERY slowly. I mean just a little bit mixed in with her wet food and slowly add a little more and a little more unitll it's completely switched. It helps for the older cats to see a young cat enjoying the food too. You know how curious cats are.
Im hoping it's only IBS and not FIP but if it's been going on for awhile now I think FIP would have killed the cat by now so here's wishing you the lesser of two evils!

Yeah lets hope that it isnt FIP...though I am leaning towards your theory that this has been too long of an issue for it to be FIP........

Thanx for the info on the raw......
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post #17 of 83
12/20/05 at 3:46pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nebula11
Yeah lets hope that it isnt FIP...though I am leaning towards your theory that this has been too long of an issue for it to be FIP........

Thanx for the info on the raw......
I re-read your original post and since the problem strated 2 years ago I very much doubt it's FIP.
Your welcome on the info...anytime you need more you can PM me!
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post #18 of 83
12/21/05 at 12:07pm
My cat also has a mysterious illness. I can't help thinking that the cup of organic plant fertilizer I dropped down the stairs which I did not clean up for some time found it's way into his system through grooming my other cat after perhaps rolling around in it. My other cat does not groom him in return, and in fact has little reason to groom herself because he does it for her. So, I cannot rule out my own negligence in my cat's health.

Maybe their new digs had something they rolled in and then passed on through the grooming.

Good luck, Marty
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post #19 of 83
12/21/05 at 1:14pm
Nebula, any news yet?
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post #20 of 83
12/21/05 at 1:38pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by menagerie mama
Nebula, any news yet?

No no news yet....The vet is extreamly busy this week, but she is going to try to fit us in...I will let you all know when we have a definite appointment for Yinny.....Thanx for asking....
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post #21 of 83
12/21/05 at 1:49pm
I guess I'm just irritated with "It could be cancer so why bother?" There are so many types of cancer and while some are aggressive and quickly fatal, there are others where the removal of the tumor can enhance and extend the cat's life.

Much had a tumor between her shoulder blades. Didn't feel that big and she wasn't showing any discomfort, but the tumor was removed (it ended up being the size of a small fist) and she had been doing wonderfully ever since. I'm just glad I ended up with a vet who keeps up with all of the latest research because feline medicine has made a lot of strides in the last 15-20 years. I'm not sure that some of the teaching facilities and practicing vets have kept up with it.
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post #22 of 83
12/21/05 at 2:41pm
Thread Starter 
This whole situtation is getting sketchier and sketchier.......

One of them is lying..........

Its either the vet clinic....or Johns mom............

She is really slacking on getting Yinnys records...I wanted them like yesterday...But all shes done is complain about money......"Well I have her on special food...which costs like 16$ a bag..Hello...Not that I mind Paying it"....

:censor::censor::censor:.....

Ok well John and I are going to pay for anything that needs to be done...The more I have read about IBS the more it seems to mirror Yinnys symptoms....and If this is the case this poor girl has been suffering needlessly for 2 freekin years.....

I cant get her records myself...They wont relase them to me because she is not my cat......And Trish (Johns mom)...is dragging her heels........WHY????

So I have a few questions....One thing was that the vet "supposidly" told Trish that Yinny most definitly had cancer...However they werent going to check because 1. because it was a waste of time......but like Jana said what if it was just a easily operable tumor..... 2. They said they would rather not do it because the proceedure to test for cancer will cost $4k.........

Ummmm now something doesnt make sence here.....The head vet at this office is Trishes friend, and she gets great deals from her on Vet visits....But why wouldnt the Vet office try to collect on a possible $4k proceedure????

And what freekin type of test costs freekin $4k any ways..............

I have been reading about IBS....thanx to Bengalbabe and an artical that Hissy posted in another thread......And it seems that one fo the only ways to diagnose IBS is through a Biopsy....which even though I didnt get a definite figure, I was lead to believe the proceedure was simple, safe and cost effective.......

So...Let me ask you.......Why would a cancer biopsy cost $4k and a IBS biopsy cost soooo much less.......

Someone is lying to me....and god help them when I find out which one....If its the clinic....then errrrr I will make sure they never practice animal medicine again......

And if Trish is lying.....welll I can't really do anything to her.....But I will rehome those cats right quick.........

In other words if this poor kitty has been suffereing over money........

Well now I wanted to know if anyone had any info on either cancer biopsys or IBS biopsys and thier cost.......One reason I would like to know this is so I can get to the bottom of this grotsque mess.......and also so I know how much money I need to get up for either possibility.....

Thanx again for all your support....you guys are great....
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post #23 of 83
12/21/05 at 2:49pm
I can't share what the cost of a biopsy would be as Patrick wasn't a good candidate but we went to probably ibs by his response to medication, and what an ultrasound showed (under $300 to do an U/S).

Something does sound puzzling about all this, that is for sure!
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post #24 of 83
12/21/05 at 2:59pm
Those costs sound out of line with what I experienced. Much's surgery was not more than $1k here in Denver. That included the removal of the tumor and all of the biopsy tests. The vet really should be able explain why the difference.

I wish you lots of luck and good vibes that you are able to get to the bottom of this and help this little one.
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post #25 of 83
12/21/05 at 3:05pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pat & Alix
I can't share what the cost of a biopsy would be as Patrick wasn't a good candidate but we went to probably ibs by his response to medication, and what an ultrasound showed (under $300 to do an U/S).

Something does sound puzzling about all this, that is for sure!

Geeze an ultrasound.....why didnt anyone do an ultrasound......We get ultrasounds done all the time on emmet to check his bladder...they are lik nothing like $50 where I go....

I'll have to check her records when I finally get them to see id they did one...I would think cancer or IBS they should have done one.......

The plot thickens
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post #26 of 83
12/21/05 at 3:07pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by katachtig
Those costs sound out of line with what I experienced. Much's surgery was not more than $1k here in Denver. That included the removal of the tumor and all of the biopsy tests. The vet really should be able explain why the difference.

I wish you lots of luck and good vibes that you are able to get to the bottom of this and help this little one.

Seee thats what I am saying 4K is rediculous...My sisters knee surgery didnt cost 4K

Thanx for the vibes sweetie....I will let you know how it goes....
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post #27 of 83
12/21/05 at 3:09pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nebula11
Geeze an ultrasound.....why didnt anyone do an ultrasound......We get ultrasounds done all the time on emmet to check his bladder...they are lik nothing like $50 where I go....

I'll have to check her records when I finally get them to see id they did one...I would think cancer or IBS they should have done one.......

The plot thickens
And you will have to keep us updated. You know we are all pulling for you and Yinny.
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post #28 of 83
12/21/05 at 4:13pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nebula11
Geeze an ultrasound.....why didnt anyone do an ultrasound......We get ultrasounds done all the time on emmet to check his bladder...they are lik nothing like $50 where I go....

I'll have to check her records when I finally get them to see id they did one...I would think cancer or IBS they should have done one.......

The plot thickens
Wow, an ultrasound here in Sacramento costs about $450.00! A c-section costs $1500.00. I would LOVE to only pay $50.00 to have an ultrasound done, i'd have it done with every cat pregnancy.
I wonder why it's so much more expensive here in Sacramento? Maybe im just not calling/going to the right vets. It cost me over $400.00 just to have a vet give my cat oxytocin and an xray when she was in labor
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post #29 of 83
12/21/05 at 4:49pm
I'll bet her vet is doing what mine does. He doesn't say a test costs $4000, but will advise you if the test shows cancer, the total cost will likely be $4000. He offers what tests can be run, but also what the cost to treat what he suspects is wrong.

Maybe your mil misunderstood, or is just telling you what the total would be. Just leave the mil issues to John, because trust me it will just cause trouble between you otherwise.

Are you going to be keeping Yin, or is she staying with your mil? Poor kitty to have diarrhea for so long!
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post #30 of 83
12/21/05 at 5:48pm
I would vote with everyone else on IBD - and NO the vets
don't know that much! I mean, look at what Diablo went
through - he was sick as a dog because of him being wormed
at a higher strength than he probably needed. Did he vet
mention that "hey, this might be really tough on his stomach??"
NOOOO.... so he was sick and vomiting and in pain all night long.



And yes, if it is cancer the cat could go on for years, or
just drop dead. But to my money, if she managed to
stay at the same weight she is now... then it ain't cancer.

Also, have you thought about thyroid or pancreatitis?
Either can cause rapid weight loss... pancreatitis is
hard to pin down, but one way it can show up
is on some enzyme level test (blood I think).

diablo and shebs were both tested for, when they
went through their bout of bad dirreah and vomiting
(bad chicken - it resolved on its own, after an agonizing
week!)

Food allergies ought to be considered too. And yes, raw
diet might help if it is/was IBD...(or so my friends with
cats on raw food tell me..)

Good luck and please let us know what you find out!
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