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Van Nguyen and a minute's silence... - Page 2

post #31 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by valanhb
So then, should the whole world have held a moment of silence for my mother? For our friend Floyd who was a decorated veteran? I guarantee that these two people did more to HELP people in the world than this drug smuggler did! They don't get honored by a whole flippin' country! And yet this person, who smuggled drugs which probably destroyed a lot of lives...he deserves a minute of silence because of the legal system in another country is going to execute him? Because of the way he dies?

Sorry, I vehemently disagree. If we held minutes of silence for those who DESERVE them, none of us would ever speak again. This criminal doesn't deserve it simply because of the way in which he dies. His death will be relatively painless compared to someone stricken with Cancer or AIDS or countless other diseases that they did nothing to deserve. Again, he KNEW going into it what the possible punishment would be. His greed outweighed everything else, including what might happen to his family if he was caught.
1) I sure didn't mean to upset you or anyone.
2) I would have been honored to have a moment of silence for your mom and your friend Floyd.
3) I do not see this as honoring this criminal. I see it as taking a moment to think. Thinking COULD be asking God to have mercy on him; however, it COULD be thinking about the cold serious result of his actions.
4) I don't know how they do things in Astralia. The way I invision it is that the minute of silence is voluntary. I can't imagine anyone enforcing it.

Heidi, again, I didn't mean to hit a nerve. Its just my opinion.
post #32 of 49
Thread Starter 
Despite my thoughts on a minute's silence, I still, definitely, do not believe in the death penatly.

And Mike, it's interesting to learn that that's what you do - my brother is a Crown Prosecutor - paedophiles, mainly. He's VERY passionate about what he does. I can't imagine him sitting and becoming friends with one of those guys!!!

You would like him - you two seem to both be on the same wavelength. He, too, is very level-headed, fair, and just and has the most amazing sense of right and wrong. He is an inspiration to me - one of those people who became a lawyer for all the right reasons. He is very highly regarded and respected in Western Australia because of his `unusual' attitude for a lawyer!! Lol...
post #33 of 49
Didn't this guy become a mule to pay off his brother's debts?? This is what I read in our papers here. Either way, that was so stupid and I hope his brother is feeling guilty for costing his brother his life, but also at the same time, Ngygen (sp?) should have had the common sense to do something else to raise the money. Tragic.

Your brother sure must have some interesting cases aye Kit?? But its gotta be one of the hardest things to do, working with the victims of paedophilia. I applaud him.
post #34 of 49
Thread Starter 
Oh yeah - he's had to look after babies who have been abused before. He's had to watch `home videos' taken by paedophiles, seen photos, interview children, including some as young as 2. It's very traumatic for him. But he's an amazing person.

It has affected him, though. He and his wife have a nine-month old daughter, and once I posted a picture of her on this site. He asked me to take it down, not because of anyone here, obviously, but because, as he said, `you never know who might be looking'. He did acknowledge that he might be being a bit paranoid but that he's seen too much in his job. He's been `specialising' in paedophiles/child abuse for about 15 years now. I can't tell you proud I am of him. But he's become a different person - still happy etc, but much more serious and grounded now.

And as for Van Nguyen - yes, he was allegedly muling for his brother. It's very sad. I really think they should let him live, but like I said earlier, you know the consequences before you do it. It's amazing what we'll risk for our families.
post #35 of 49
I can understand why he would not want his daughters picture online, there could be a disgruntled convict who might target her. I don't blame him. That has got to be so hard and sickening to watch those home videos, I dont know how people can stomach them
post #36 of 49
Thread Starter 
I heard him on the phone once when I went to visit him at work. He was there late and was talking to the Police Commissioner on the phone about a case where two sisters had been abused - they were 3 and 1 at the time. I was becoming increasing sickened by what I heard and THEN I heard him say, `And was the accused still a policeman at the time of the alleged offences?'. I had to leave. I was horrified. He was so matter-of-fact about it all whilst staying sympathetic. I couldn't believe that was the kind of thing he had to deal with at his work. I mean, I work in a hospital and people die and have horrible illnesses, but that is nature - it's not the evil side of man that I have to deal with.
post #37 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockcat
1) I sure didn't mean to upset you or anyone.
2) I would have been honored to have a moment of silence for your mom and your friend Floyd.
3) I do not see this as honoring this criminal. I see it as taking a moment to think. Thinking COULD be asking God to have mercy on him; however, it COULD be thinking about the cold serious result of his actions.
4) I don't know how they do things in Astralia. The way I invision it is that the minute of silence is voluntary. I can't imagine anyone enforcing it.

Heidi, again, I didn't mean to hit a nerve. Its just my opinion.
I'm sorry. I re-read my post and it obviously did hit a nerve that I didn't even realize when I hit Post. You are fully entitled to your opinion, and I can respect your opinion. I do apologize for coming off so...I don't know...harsh.
post #38 of 49
I am also against the death penalty but you have to pretty dumb to smuggle drugs into Asia with all the movies, books, and the publicity generated. Singapore does not want drugs in the country its a sovereign nation. You have to respect the laws of the country you live in, being given a visa does not entitle you to break laws. It is well known that in Saudi Arabia you cannot drink or you will be lashed, to then get drunk and have your neighbors call the police is extremely disrespectful to the country. Why would you do that? If you have to drink don't go there if you want to do drugs don't visit countries that will execute you for possession.
post #39 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by valanhb
I'm sorry. I re-read my post and it obviously did hit a nerve that I didn't even realize when I hit Post. You are fully entitled to your opinion, and I can respect your opinion. I do apologize for coming off so...I don't know...harsh.
And you are entitled to your opinion too.
post #40 of 49
Thread Starter 
Well, Van Nguyen, apparently completely composed and resigned to his fate, met it this morning at dawn. I did feel very sorry that this has happened, and imagined his mother as she hugged him goodbye.

The death penalty is a sad, IMO barbaric penalty, that should not be upheld anywhere in the modern world. But drug trafficking brings with it it's own horrors, so it is up to us all to decide whether we feel justice has been served.

RIP Van Nguyen.
post #41 of 49
Well death by hanging isn't exactly a human way to do it but I don't agree with a moment of slience either.
post #42 of 49
I don't mind the moment of silence to pray silently for this man's soul, and to regret the waste of a human life - think of all the good he could have done to help make the world a better place for the most vulnerable among us.
BTW, if he was "working off" his brother's debt to the drug dealers, was his brother under some sort of threat? Or was he actually drug-running for the money?
post #43 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mom2SalemIsis
I can identify with this totally.. my brother who i practically raised killed 2 people one of who happened to be a guy i was secretly dating.. they were both good friends of mine. and I love my brother to death (no pun intended) i attended everyday of the trial and the memorial services of both guys. i totally felt conflicted. it was hard because here is my brother my flesh and blood who i love and would do anything for but then again he is a mean spirited egotistical man who killed 2 innocent guys over money. then theres these 2 guys one who i was involved with and the other his best friend. i had close relationships with both of them and they also happened to be friends with my brother. it was crazy so when they sentenced my brother (age 20) to 2 life sentences equaling to a total of 80 years without a chance of parole i felt he deserved it but then again the fact that I was going to have to see my baby brother behind glass and in a orange jumpsuit for the rest of his life killed me. the only reason they did not give him the death penalty is because he asked for the death penalty. they said he wanted them to kill him so he wouldn't have to live behind bars for the rest of his life. so they denied him that. (we live in tx)
What a horrible experience. I am very sorry that this happened to you, your family, and your friends. I will now observe a moment of silence for your brother, and will pray that his heart will change, and there will be healing within your family. Also for the families of his victims, and you, that you have found or will find peace about this horrible crime.
post #44 of 49
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by catsknowme
I don't mind the moment of silence to pray silently for this man's soul, and to regret the waste of a human life - think of all the good he could have done to help make the world a better place for the most vulnerable among us.
That is a lovely sentiment. It makes me feel somewhat differently about this...although I think as a whole `Australia' still is taking the wrong stance on the situation...
post #45 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beckiboo
What a horrible experience. I am very sorry that this happened to you, your family, and your friends. I will now observe a moment of silence for your brother, and will pray that his heart will change, and there will be healing within your family. Also for the families of his victims, and you, that you have found or will find peace about this horrible crime.
thank you. because of this situation and because of the fact that our family is well known in our town i have been pretty much labeled "guilty by association(sp)" i can't get a job because they see the last name and automatically know who i am and that is the main is the reason im selling my house. and moving away from not ony this town but from texas. its hard but i will get past this because i believe that just because my brother committed a horrible act does not mean that i am a bad person. i am a good person who had some hard times. and now im moving on and putting this as far behind me as i can.
post #46 of 49
[quote=catsknowme]I don't mind the moment of silence to pray silently for this man's soul, and to regret the waste of a human life - think of all the good he could have done to help make the world a better place for the most vulnerable among us. QUOTE]

That's exactly how I feel. Also, if one's country has a policy that says that the death penalty is wrong, it makes sense to call for a moment of silence when one of your own is to be put to death, no matter what it is that he's done. I grieve for anyone who dies while in the midst of darkness. For me, a moment of silence is indeed a time of prayer. Prayer is never a waste.

Cheers to you out in God's country, catsknowme (I rather wonder if a bit of Narnia didn't get put into the Eastern Sierra). I'll be there soon, home for Christmas; here's praying for some snow Christmas morning along with my prayers for peace!
post #47 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by sharky
Mike is right ... I was a kid when I read this , but for thirty days after an execution in Texas .... The murder rate goes up by 200%... I dont like that at all and it showed it aint a deterrent ... I am Christian , on the death penalty I say what did God do to the first murderer ??? If we are in Gods likeness should we be going against what God did ??
Quite apart from the issue of whether people are Christians there is a conflict as to whether such an opinion is reflective of Christians. Briefly, the phrase "Thou shall not kill" is a King James Translation but a more accurate translation vis-a-vis the original language is the NIV which says "Thou shall not murder" which suggest that some killings are allowed. Then the following phrase can also be interpreted to suggest that killing of another person as punishment for him crime is allowed. "Whoever sheds the blood of man, by man shall his blood be shed; for in the image of God has God made man." Therefore while it is entirely right to give your own interpretation to the religion, it has to be remembered that not everyone would share such an interpretation.
post #48 of 49
I didn't believe that Australia should hold a minute's silence for Van Nguen, but I did personally intend to have one. To me it was about thinking about Van Nguyen & his poor family. To pay my respects for a young life lost due to an absolutely stupid choice he made.

He's no hero, but he was a human being who made a mistake. I absolutely didn't think he deserved to die for his crime.

My plans were to have that minute's silence for him...and to thank my lucky stars for my family. No mother deserves to go through what Kim has endured. As it is, I sat on the sofa at 9.00am with my two young children watching Sunrise & absolutely howled. Even typing this brings back tears & memories of that sombre moment knowing one of our citizens was being put to his death.

So it wasn't about making him out to be a hero, it was thinking of him & his family at that awful moment & taking some time to appreciate everything we have.

RIP Van Nguyen.
post #49 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by bumpy
Quite apart from the issue of whether people are Christians there is a conflict as to whether such an opinion is reflective of Christians. Briefly, the phrase "Thou shall not kill" is a King James Translation but a more accurate translation vis-a-vis the original language is the NIV which says "Thou shall not murder" which suggest that some killings are allowed. Then the following phrase can also be interpreted to suggest that killing of another person as punishment for him crime is allowed. "Whoever sheds the blood of man, by man shall his blood be shed; for in the image of God has God made man." Therefore while it is entirely right to give your own interpretation to the religion, it has to be remembered that not everyone would share such an interpretation.
I do take that into account but it seems many havent read the book of genisus which the first murder takes place, I just wonder at times why since two and possibley three prominant religions use it ... NIV is a far later version If memory serves it is about 300 years ..We wont know until the end what version is the truth ... I actually have read and studied both and the meanings do seem to change//thou this is way off ..
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