Winston goes for MOT

e_peery · Oct 18, 2005

New Vet visit is still hours away yet but I have some serious butterflies in my tummy.

huggles · Oct 18, 2005

awwwwwww GOOD LUCK!!!! we are all thinking of you and your little man

rosiemac · Oct 18, 2005

Elaine try not to worry chick!, we may not be able to be with you in person but were all with you in our thoughts

Mega (((((good luck vibes))))) for Winston

e_peery · Oct 18, 2005

Just back from new vet. She did another blood test on Winston, everything is pretty much fine apart from his Urea and Creatinine levels. She is going to give me copies of blood test next week as she was having a little trouble with computer. She has asked for me to take Winston back next week and leave him with her for a few hours so they can try to get an acurate blood pressure reading.
She like so many others is emphasising that he be on a prescription diet. She avoided my questions on sub-q fluids by telling me that Winston is not dehydrated.
She is concerned that he has been on Prednisolone for so long and is worried about taking him off these. She said if we go down that road, we have to do it very slowly indeed.
She was positive in the respect that she didnt think Winstons time was up and that all had been done that can be done but would treat any underlying condition as and when it may arise.
One interesting thing, other vets have always said Winston has an over active thyroid, in my ignorance i assumed that this had been tested for. There is no mention on Winstons files about a over active thyroid. New vet tested for this and indeed he does not have an over active thyroid.
Have alot of mixed feelings.
I keep getting the same answers about the prescription food and his medication etc etc.
What more can or do i do? Short of moving to the USA with Winston and Eva, what more can I do? I cannt keep changing vets every other month.
Sorry was about to get into a rant about financial implecations. Not that i grudge Winston anything and would move heaven and earth for him if I could.
Rant over.
Anyway thats the latest update.
I hope you are all well and in better fettle than me haha.
Take care
Elaine, Winston and Eva

pat · Oct 18, 2005

Originally Posted by e_peery

Just back from new vet. She did another blood test on Winston, everything is pretty much fine apart from his Urea and Creatinine levels. She is going to give me copies of blood test next week as she was having a little trouble with computer. She has asked for me to take Winston back next week and leave him with her for a few hours so they can try to get an acurate blood pressure reading.
She like so many others is emphasising that he be on a prescription diet. She avoided my questions on sub-q fluids by telling me that Winston is not dehydrated.
She is concerned that he has been on Prednisolone for so long and is worried about taking him off these. She said if we go down that road, we have to do it very slowly indeed.
She was positive in the respect that she didnt think Winstons time was up and that all had been done that can be done but would treat any underlying condition as and when it may arise.
One interesting thing, other vets have always said Winston has an over active thyroid, in my ignorance i assumed that this had been tested for. There is no mention on Winstons files about a over active thyroid. New vet tested for this and indeed he does not have an over active thyroid.
Have alot of mixed feelings.
I keep getting the same answers about the prescription food and his medication etc etc.
What more can or do i do? Short of moving to the USA with Winston and Eva, what more can I do? I cannt keep changing vets every other month.
Sorry was about to get into a rant about financial implecations. Not that i grudge Winston anything and would move heaven and earth for him if I could.
Rant over.
Anyway thats the latest update.
I hope you are all well and in better fettle than me haha.
Take care
Elaine, Winston and Eva

Elaine, is this vet at least approachable, willing to work with you? I'd take in (compile this from the katkarma food lists) the foods that have comparable values to what she is prescribing, and say why not, if this is what he'll actually eat? Also re the fluids...what has the crf list said re his bun/creat levels and using sub q - I know that the older members usually can give articles etc. to use as ammo when discussing with the vet why you wish to give sub-q's. I can not imagine if you come up with an article or two (vet written of course) that a reasonable vet would not listen. Bottom line...if it might help, and you are aware of possible drawbacks - the ONLY one I can think of (though I still need my am coffee and didn't sleep well last night, so I am semi-out of it here) is fluid overload and affecting cardiac status...however, if Winston has been just fine, with no known cardiac issues, why in the world would it hurt to do say 75 cc of lactated ringers per day? I wouldn't give up on this one yet...sounds good to find out there is no thyroid problem, sounds good that she will be able to check his bp.

I do love helen's site - the www.felinecrf.org site, can't recall if there might not be article links off this page re the sub-qs.

I hear your frustration, but it does sound a bit more positive with this vet.

e_peery · Oct 18, 2005

Thanx for that. I am frustrated and feeling pretty flat.
Tonight I think Winston, Eva and myself will curl up on the sofa and chill watching a movie or something.
Hopefully tomorrow I will have my energy back to fight the good fight once again.

rosiemac · Oct 18, 2005

I can imagine your feeling flat Elaine, but i'm agreeing with Pat with regards to this new vet.

Their wanting to do further tests on Winston which is good and you've found that he doesn't have an over active thyroid!.

Like Pat said work with this vet, and voice any concerns you have so the vet can answer them and hopefully Winston will get sorted.

Now, " nae getting upset lassie! "

ktlynn · Oct 20, 2005

Elaine, I strongly agree with what Pat & Alix last posted about the use of subQ fluids. What is it with those vets?!?! Hydration is SO beneficial, I cannot for the life of me understand the reluctance to recommend it. The whole point is NOT to wait until Winston's dehydrated, but to help his kidneys function and *prevent* dehydration NOW.

I'm wondering what his creatinine and BUN levels were. If you don't mind, please post them when you know. Also, why is Winston on prednisolone?

I certainly understand you being "ticked" at all this, including the fact that Winston was misdiagnosed with an overactive thyroid by the previous vets.

Curious too, why the vet didn't just do the blood pressure test while you were there with Winston. Why make you come back a second time just for that? It only takes a few minutes to put the cuff on the back leg (BTW, they should always take the bp reading on the same limb) and get the readings. I recently had this test done for my 17 year old kitty - they simply brought the blood pressure apparatus into the exam room and did it right then and there. Didn't even take 10 minutes.

Hang in there, Elaine. You clearly have an uphill battle to get your boy the care he needs, but just keep being persistent. Please keep us updated - hugs to Winston!

booktigger · Oct 20, 2005

My cat has to go for his blood pressure to be checked in a couple of weeks, and the vet said they prefer to keep them in for a couple of hours to make sure they are calm when they do the reading, and they do 2.

pat · Oct 20, 2005

I think it varies re checking BP..on the cat and the practice

I've had them do it both ways...take Patrick in the back (where he misbehaves) or bringing the doppler in to the exam room to check Tyler, who lays like a placid baby in my arms throughout...versus doing a king kong impression

e_peery · Oct 20, 2005

Thats what the vet told me too Desley. Although I feel a little reluctant about it. Winston is and has always been pretty laid back and friendly but has never been without me at a vets for any length of time.
Am going to take some articles along to vets with me for her to read, hopefully, and also some nutritional facts showing very little differences in the foods i am already feeding him and the prescription foods they want me to feed him, which he wont eat anyway.
It seems that vets in Brittain have this thing about "clinical dehydration". From what i can understand from the blood values that Winston is showing, he would be, to some degree, dehydrated and would benefit from sub-q's. BUN being 21.9UK, 61.34 USA and Creatinine 391 UK, 4.42 USA. But to Brittish vets he is not "clinically dehydrated".
On the morning Winston was going to the vets for blood tests, he had fallen off the bed and lost the use of his hind legs. Thats why the vets have had him on Prednisolone all this time. I will never forget the look of fear and pleading on his little face that morning.
Having said that, the other night we hear him crying in the next room. We went to see if he just wanted some cuddles and found him standing on top of the rather high book case. Graham had to get him down coz i couldnt reach him. Have no idea how he got up there and that frightens me. If he were to fall from that height god knows what damage he will do to himself.
At this rate though Winston is gonna out live me I think. Bless his old white whiskers.

e_peery · Oct 22, 2005

I am just wandering, do you think that maybe vets here in Scotland are less likely to give Winston certain treatments due to him being an OLD cat?
Cannt help thinking there might be a little agism going on here too. Hmm.

wellingtoncats · Oct 22, 2005

I'm not too sure but that is a possibility. I know that can't perform an operation on my dog because she is so old and obese!

pat · Oct 22, 2005

Originally Posted by e_peery

I am just wandering, do you think that maybe vets here in Scotland are less likely to give Winston certain treatments due to him being an OLD cat?
Cannt help thinking there might be a little agism going on here too. Hmm.

I hope they base any decisions on his attitude, overall health..on "the cat" and not the numbers (as they say on the crf list

)
Really, isn't it between you and Winston as to how much you do to give him another 1-4 or more years? I think it is.

e_peery · Oct 25, 2005

Just back from the vets again. Winstons blood pressure is fine. Didnt get a chance to talk to the vet today but will make an appointment with her very soon. She did say that Winston is doing very well and that I should continue doing what I have been doing. Here are his blood results, there are some things on it which I didnt understand and so couldnt convert them to USA figures, sorry about that.
ALB UK 38g/l USA 3.8g/dl
ALP UK 44u/l
ALT UK 44u/l USA 44.00u/l
AMY UK 1092u/l USA 1092u/l
TBIL UK 2mmo/l USA 0.11mg/dl
BUN UK 221mmo/l USA 58.82mg/dl
CA UK 2.76mmo/l USA 11.4mg/dl
PHOS UK 1.83mmo/l USA 5.66mg/dl
CRE UK 373mmo/l USA 4.21mg/dl
GLU UK 6.9mmo/l USA 125.45mg/dl
NA+ UK 151mmo/l
K+ UK 4.3mmo/l
TP UK 75g/l
GLOB UK 37g/l USA 3.7mg/dl
T4 UK 37mmo/l USA 2.84mg/dl
CHOL UK 7.2mmo/l USA 276.92mg/dl

The vet has also given me a print out Headed Heamatology and EO Histogram. I am not sure what it all means so dont know if it will be usefull or not.

pat · Oct 25, 2005

Originally Posted by e_peery

Just back from the vets again. Winstons blood pressure is fine. Didnt get a chance to talk to the vet today but will make an appointment with her very soon. She did say that Winston is doing very well and that I should continue doing what I have been doing. Here are his blood results, there are some things on it which I didnt understand and so couldnt convert them to USA figures, sorry about that.
ALB UK 38g/l USA 3.8g/dl
ALP UK 44u/l
ALT UK 44u/l USA 44.00u/l
AMY UK 1092u/l USA 1092u/l
TBIL UK 2mmo/l USA 0.11mg/dl
BUN UK 221mmo/l USA 58.82mg/dl
CA UK 2.76mmo/l USA 11.4mg/dl
PHOS UK 1.83mmo/l USA 5.66mg/dl
CRE UK 373mmo/l USA 4.21mg/dl
GLU UK 6.9mmo/l USA 125.45mg/dl
NA+ UK 151mmo/l
K+ UK 4.3mmo/l
TP UK 75g/l
GLOB UK 37g/l USA 3.7mg/dl
T4 UK 37mmo/l USA 2.84mg/dl
CHOL UK 7.2mmo/l USA 276.92mg/dl

The vet has also given me a print out Headed Heamatology and EO Histogram. I am not sure what it all means so dont know if it will be usefull or not.

The Hematology will let you know if Winston is anemic or not, there should be a result for hemaglobin (Hgb) and hematocrit (hct), and I'm guessing the EO Histogram is re the white blood cell results - delineated as the neutrophils, eosinophils and more that I'd need my morning cup of coffee to remember

Good news re the Blood Pressure. Just off my sleepy head, the Calcium looks high, and the potassium is I think low.

e_peery · Oct 31, 2005

Have gone over everything with my nurse friend and also the vet. Good news is, his blood pressure is fine, he is not anemic and his pottassium and calcium are with in range.
Still no go on the sub=q thing. Trying to re-gain trust with new vet as last one was awful. She is very willing to discuss things with me, which is a good sign. Have an appointment made with her, without Winston, in a few weeks time so i can discuss things better. If Winston is not there then I am less likely to get all emotional.

e_peery · Dec 4, 2005

Just wanted to let you all know that Winston is still doing well. He has had a bad case of cystitis but is now recovering from this. Poor old boy had to be hospitalised and have his bladder expressed. I thought he was a gonner that week, but nope he is still here and still loving all his cuddles and kisses.
New vet is very good and very easy to talk to. She is angry that Winston has been left on prednisolone for as long as he has. She can see no reason why he should have been on it for this long but ofcourse it may be more detrimental to take him off this now. She thinks he super for his age and every one there loves him. Very happy I changed vets.

pat · Dec 4, 2005

Good to hear a report, especially that you now have the kind of vet you wanted. Skritches to Winston!

jcat · Dec 4, 2005

I'm glad to hear he's doing well.

Winston goes for MOT

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