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anyone here give subQs??

post #1 of 15
Thread Starter 
i have a CRF kitty who is currently getting 200 ccs of LRS per day

usually she complains a little when i put the needle in, but settles down quickly as the fluids do make her feel so much better


well this morning she cried out in pain and got very aggitated, so i withdrew the needle and tried another spot
same reaction

i decided to wait at least an hour and try again
same problem

now she has to get the full 200 ccs tonite (i like to split it up into two treatments, she does not like to sit still long)

i am so nervous that it might hurt again-

anyone have any ideas?

althea and the girls
sara and snoopy in spirit
post #2 of 15
Are you using the needle ore than once?
post #3 of 15
Did you use the same needle both times? It's possible that you had a random dull needle that hurt when you stuck her.

Then again, she also might be feeling out of sorts or even just particularly dramatic today.

Has anything in her life or meds regimen changed recently?

I think not being nervous yourself is a big key. Cats pick up on our emotions and become tense when we are tense. Remember that the real worst case scenario is that she'll have a temporary "ouch" and maybe a little lingering soreness, like a bruise. Obviously I know that you don't want to hurt your kitty, but remembering that you are not going to cause injury to her no matter what should help you to be more matter-of-fact with things tonight.
post #4 of 15
It helps if you warm the fluids first...not by microwave, but I simply fill a large stock pot with fairly warm water, and set the bag in it -keeping the tubing out of the water, and not submerging the drip chamber or any of the insertion area of the tubing into the bag. I let it sit in the warm water for 15 minutes, then flush the line so the colder fluid runs out, then proceed as usual to give my kitty his sub-q fluids. He is much more comfortable when I do this.

Perhaps this would help?
post #5 of 15
Maybe she's actually feeling better? Usually the really sick, or "nice" cats that are staying and getting fluids everyday start pitching a fit when they are feeling a bit better. She's probably tired of being messed with, and since she's being rehydrated she feels alot better. That and the fact she's probably a bit sore from getting her fluids.

You might have someone hold her while you're doing it. Or maybe have a friend [[whome you can show how]] do it all-together so you don't have to be the bad guy if she's going to be unhappy about it.
post #6 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plebayo

You might have someone hold her while you're doing it.
I would be hesitant to try this. Restraint often makes a cat more agitated. It's better to wait till Kitty is naturally sleepy and administer the fluids with as little restraint as possible. If she'll sit in someone's lap or whatever, that's totally fine, but someone holding her down is likely to backfire.
post #7 of 15
Do you draw up the medication from a vial and then use the same needle to inject kitty with? You might want to try and change the needle before you give the medication to kitty cat. I work in an allergy clinic and I give subq's to people and we change the needles because the rubber stopper on the vials is very dulling.

Hope that might help some.
post #8 of 15
Quote:
would be hesitant to try this. Restraint often makes a cat more agitated. It's better to wait till Kitty is naturally sleepy and administer the fluids with as little restraint as possible. If she'll sit in someone's lap or whatever, that's totally fine, but someone holding her down is likely to backfire.
True, however, some cats actually do just fine, especially if she wants to maybe have someone's arm to hide in. I don't know how actually "stressed" the cat is being right now. I would have to see it. But all of the cats we give fluids to at the clinic usually have to be held, not scruffed, but held so they don't run off the table. But my other thought is that maybe she's feeling better, and she knows mom is doing it, and might be less apt to be unhappy if there's someone else there.
post #9 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ali012281
Do you draw up the medication from a vial and then use the same needle to inject kitty with? You might want to try and change the needle before you give the medication to kitty cat. I work in an allergy clinic and I give subq's to people and we change the needles because the rubber stopper on the vials is very dulling.

Hope that might help some.
Not the same kind of subq - good point though, needles dull very quickly imo, after being put through any kind of rubber stopper.

This is subq iv fluid administration, so the needle is on the end of the iv tubing, nothing is done with this needle except to insert it under the skin.
post #10 of 15
[quote=Plebayo]Maybe she's actually feeling better? Usually the really sick, or "nice" cats that are staying and getting fluids everyday start pitching a fit when they are feeling a bit better. She's probably tired of being messed with, and since she's being rehydrated she feels alot better. That and the fact she's probably a bit sore from getting her fluids.

This was true in my case when I had to give Bud (RIP ) his fluids. The better he felt the more he carried on. Lets hope that this is the case!
post #11 of 15
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by emb_78
Are you using the needle ore than once?
rarely.
if i put it in and it comes right back out, i do re insert that needle, but that has only happened once
post #12 of 15
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by semiferal
Did you use the same needle both times? It's possible that you had a random dull needle that hurt when you stuck her.

Then again, she also might be feeling out of sorts or even just particularly dramatic today.

Has anything in her life or meds regimen changed recently?

I think not being nervous yourself is a big key. Cats pick up on our emotions and become tense when we are tense. Remember that the real worst case scenario is that she'll have a temporary "ouch" and maybe a little lingering soreness, like a bruise. Obviously I know that you don't want to hurt your kitty, but remembering that you are not going to cause injury to her no matter what should help you to be more matter-of-fact with things tonight.

that was one of the very few times i used the same needle twice, the fliuds cool off so quickly i wanted to get going before i had to re heat them and start all over

i did examine the needle as best i could but did not see anything unusual about it
i do not have a magnifying glass though

yeh i know being matter of fact helps a lot, and what happened after she cried out like that, is i lost my nerve a bit, thinking i must be hurting her, and it was hard to calm after that,
but we had success today, more about that later
post #13 of 15
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pat & Alix
It helps if you warm the fluids first...not by microwave, but I simply fill a large stock pot with fairly warm water, and set the bag in it -keeping the tubing out of the water, and not submerging the drip chamber or any of the insertion area of the tubing into the bag. I let it sit in the warm water for 15 minutes, then flush the line so the colder fluid runs out, then proceed as usual to give my kitty his sub-q fluids. He is much more comfortable when I do this.

Perhaps this would help?
i always warm the fluids up and run out anything in the line that is cold, when i get to the warmed fluids, i get her and get going before they have time to cool off

a vet tried to give her cold fluids once and i damn near hit the roof! even if the fluids were say, 75 degrees, her body temp is at least 25 degrees higher than that, can you imagine someone putting fluid that much colder than your body temp under your skin!! never went back to that vet. they think i over reacted but hey, this is my baby!
post #14 of 15
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plebayo
Maybe she's actually feeling better? Usually the really sick, or "nice" cats that are staying and getting fluids everyday start pitching a fit when they are feeling a bit better. She's probably tired of being messed with, and since she's being rehydrated she feels alot better. That and the fact she's probably a bit sore from getting her fluids.

You might have someone hold her while you're doing it. Or maybe have a friend [[whome you can show how]] do it all-together so you don't have to be the bad guy if she's going to be unhappy about it.

hi i did consider that she might be feeling better, but only briefly, she has not been eating much and all day yesterday she had diahrrea, so she got even more dehydrated
in the beginning, her struggling was a good sign that she did not need the fluids that day
but it wasn't this time i am afraid

she is the kind of cat who would go nuts if she was restrained, i keep her in place by skritching her non stop, she loves it so much she won't move
but heaven help me if i stop for a second!! she is gone!!
post #15 of 15
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ali012281
Do you draw up the medication from a vial and then use the same needle to inject kitty with? You might want to try and change the needle before you give the medication to kitty cat. I work in an allergy clinic and I give subq's to people and we change the needles because the rubber stopper on the vials is very dulling.

Hope that might help some.

hi
well as alex said this is sub Q fluid therapy, not subQ meds.
she usually gets 100ccs in the morning and 100ccs at night, that way i can inject her (subQ) pepcid into the fluid bubble, as injecting it just under the skin would sting, i was told

she did not get any fluids yesterday, we both got totally stressed out trying to figure out what was going wrong....so i gave up

this morning, i was able to give her 200ccs (and she will likely need more, as she has had diahrrea for two days)
and i gave her her pepcid injection

she is in end stage renal failure, OR she has a cancer the vet has not found yet, he was not sure. or both! she is losing wt and her hair is coming out in clumps
she is just skin and bones, she has lost most of her muscle already

it will be very hard to know when it is time, because as some of you mentioned, i believe, she has learned that if she freaks out enough, she can get mommy to stop doing something- at least sometimes.
i KNOW she HAS TO have these fluids to survive, without them she would quickly get very sick and die, so that is not usually an issue

i think i may have been trying to hard to find a new place to stick her, she did not accept the fluids til i went back to the same area i usually use


she has one side she prefers, so i guess we will stay with that and hope she does not get thickened skin there

i use 19 guage terumos, i tried the 20 guage but they were too slow and she really did not seem to notice the difference

i am going to have to go back to sleeping during the day and being up all nite, to monitor her eating and things, she is now up all nite, somewhat senile and very needy and gets anxious if she cant wake me up

i may as well stay up, i am not getting any real sleep this way
i had been staying up nights for a long time, but had daytime appts and could not afford to miss them

i will have to switch back, she needs me at night

thanks for all your replies! i hope this does not happen again! i want her last days/weeks/months? to be as pleasant as they can be

althea
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