Ringworm and Program (Lufeneron)

aelurophile

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Please bear with me--I provide a long backstory (see below) before getting to my questions about Ringworm and Program. If you do not want to read the backstory, please skip to the last couple of paragraphs.

BACKSTORY: Back in February, my husband and I adopted a young female cat (Hetty Miep) from a local animal shelter. Approx. 3-4 weeks after we adopted her, Miep began itching her ears to the point that she lost quite a bit of hair. We also noticed the hair on her stomach (which had been shaved after she'd been spayed at the end of January--before we adopted her) wasn't growning back, and her overall hair texture was very coarse. At first the vet thought that she might have a food allergy. Then, the itching spread to our other cats (although Hilda was the only one that seemed to experience the same degree of itching), so the vet thought that the cats might have scabies/skin mites and began treating them with injections of Ivermectin. After one month's treatment, the itching had not abated and my vet advised me to take Miep to a specialist. The specialist thought that Miep (and her siblings) either had ringworm or demodex.

The specialist said that the only cure for demodex is lime sulfur treatments. If it was ringworm, there were other options. She started a culture with Miep's hair but warned us that it might take 2-3 weeks before we would know anything (she's had success letting the cultures develop longer than normal).

We were advised to go ahead and give the cats lime sulfur baths. We quickly discovered that it would not be possible to give the cats these ourselves. One of the cats, Elvin, is incredibly sweet at home but a complete nightmare at the vet's office (even after sedation, it is very difficult for our vet and 2 vet techs to control to him). When I called our regular veterinarian about the lime sulfur dip problem, he couldn't believe that the specialist had advised us to do this ourselves. He agreed that he didn't think it would be possible for his clinic to bathe Elvin and admitted that he really doesn't advise people to use lime sulfur baths unless there are no other alternatives (the lime sulfur causes a burning sensation for the cats). The specialist advised waiting a couple of more weeks (for the culture to develop) before making a decision on the baths.

"Luckily", the specialist called us after 3 weeks to let us know that Miep's culture had finally developed ringworm. She prescribed itraconazole (Sporonox). The cats hated it and it was very expensive (the medicine used up our vacation budget, but that's okay--they're worth it!), but we gave them the medicine for two months. After the first month, another culture was started; we continued giving the cats the Sporonox for the next month. That culture never developed ringworm, so we were hopeful that the ringworm was gone. The cats had all quit itching and Mieps hair had grown back on her stomach and was much softer.

ACTUAL QUESTION: In the last week (after being off of Sporonox for 3 weeks) my two girls (Hilda and Miep) have started itching again. My husband and I really can't afford to put the cats back on Sporonox, and we would like to avoid some of the other types of medicine (eg, Griseofulvin) because of possible dangerous short and long term side effects. I've read several reports (some in the forum archives) saying that Program (lufeneron), a medication typically used to treat for fleas, has been successful in treating Ringworm. I've ordered some for the cats. The vet advised giving them 80 mg/kg once a month for two months.

If anyone else has used Program to treat ringworm, please let me know how successful your experience was and also any information (that you might remember) relating to dosage (amounts, frequency of doses, and how long your cat(s) were on it) and methods for administering the medicine.

I read on Novartis' website that the medicine is "flavored". Does anyone know what flavor? I tried calling Novartis but was never able to speak to an actual person. I'm planning on crushing the pills into something "special" (eg, tuna or baby food) and am hoping that the pill flavor/smell won't be detected by the cats.

Any feedback on other's experiences would be much appreciated.

I feel so bad for our poor cats!

Thanks!
Heather
 

hell603

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I used the Program abt. 4 yrs. ago on my Loki - he came home from the breeder with it!

Dosage is based on weight and it's a pink liquid you mix in with the food - don't remember how many times I had to give it to him - could not have been frequent, otherwise I would stick out in my mind.

Worked great on him!!!
 

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When i worked for a vet we had a lady that did persian rescue and she brought home two that had ringworm the vet did everything dips,meds etc.

Then she read on the internet about program pills for dogs, she did it and it worked I don't remember the size pills she bought but i know it was a high dose and she saw fast results.

Keep trying to find the dose because it is like a miracle cure.
Good luck
 
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aelurophile

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Thank you for your responses!

I did order the dog pills (some of the Ringworm/Program literature has mentioned that the tablet form has been slightly more effective than the suspended form).

My vet specialist recommeded 80 mg/kg, but I've seen higher dosages used in some of the studies, so I was wondering what types of dosages other people had used.
 

stormyskiez

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Forgive me for posting in an old thread. I am currently battling ringworm in a 7 pet family home.

A kitten was bought from a breeder and brought into the home with a 24 hr health guarantee and clear vet check only to find out 3 weeks later he was a carrier of ringworm. All the cats had lost hair and one of my dogs did as well. I have treated with topical meds, fungus baths, itraconazole (4 months) for the last 6 months. Treating the home as well. Finally none of the pets had lesions that I could find. Did some fungus tests. I purchased fungassays 10 pack fungal test for ringworm and had the vet check the kitten 1 time. The test came back negative on the kitten. My home tests came back negative on all the cats. Both dogs tests after 7 days had the white mold growth then on day 10 the gel turned red. Not sure but I think that is negative because it started with an overgrowth of mold. The kitten was nurtured 2 weeks later. On the 10 day back from the vets he had a bloody red sore on his neck that lost all the hair except for a few strands in the middle. I'm treating him for ringworm again. Have isolated him in an extra bedroom. From what I can see he has no other sores or bald spots. I have no idea if this is ringworm but treating for it out of fear. The vet said bring him back in but I do not have the money to do this. I have maxed out credit cards buying ringworm meds and vet bills.

Does program work for ringworm?? Please advise.
 
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aelurophile

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StorymySkiez,

I can definitely share your frustration about ringworm. We maxed out on the expenses involved in ringworm too, which is why we moved to program. Dipping wasn't an option (the cats wouldn't comply and our vet thought it would be cruel). Itraconazole worked best but became too expensive for us and the cats really really started resisting it.

Program does work but you need to keep using it for quite awhile. We used it for ~3 months and then stopped because the problem seemed to go away. When it came back (not as bad as before), we started up again. Our vet advised us to keep it up for a year, but it just hasn't been financially possible. What we've ended up doing is purchasing it when things get bad and using it for 3 months. Two of our cats aren't really effected by it at all, while the other two are (although not as bad as originally).

The thing with the program is that you have to use high doses of it (which is what makes it so expensive). The ratio we were given is to use 80 mg of program for each 1 kg of weight (1 kg = 2.2 pounds). We purchase the larger pills (program for dogs) and then grind it down and mix it with baby food. It needs to be given on an empty stomach and then the pet should be given a good portion of food (more than normal) to eat afterwards because eating (digestion) helps the animal absorb it better. Four doses are given to each cat: the 2nd dose is given two weeks after the first, the 3rd dose one month after the 2nd, and the 4th dose a month after the 3rd dose (if you do it for more months, it would be one month between doses). The 2nd dose is given so close after the 1st dose to provide "heavier coverage" in the beginning. By the way, the dosage frequency and amounts were modeled after a study on this. As you probably know, Program is used "off label" for ringworm, so there aren't any real established guidelines for this.

I had to get a prescription for Program at first, and then I discovered that I can purchase it from the "Drs. Foster & Smith" website without a prescription. I am usually able to google for a "free shipping" coupon or a certain percentage off. I'm probably going to need to put at least one of the cats back on it. I've mostly been letting their immune systems deal with the small re-occurrences of ringworm and, for the most part, this has worked. One of the cats has been overcleaning and has brown spots on her nose, though.

I should mention that our cats never developed the lesions that typically accompany ringworm. The only reason we found out that it was ringworm was because took them to a specialist who let the culture develop longer (~28 days) than is usual.

Hope this helps! Feel free to pm me if you have any questions.
 

stormyskiez

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Thank you very much Aelurophile for your fast reply. Today I have been in a panic concerning ringworm. I did some more research in the mean time. This is what I found:

http://www.vetinfo.com/cringwrm.html
Lufenuron (Program Rx) for treating a cat with ringworm

Question: Dr. Mike- I have heard that I can treat my cat for ringworm using Program. Is this true?

Answer: L- Ringworm (dermatophytosis) can be treated with lufenuron (Program Rx). Dr Ziony's recommendations are as follows: Thank you for quoting my research (JAVMA publication, Nov 15, 2000) in your answers regarding the use of lufenuron for the treatment of fungal infections of dogs and cats. I would like to update you on certain innovations which I had the privilege to present at the Boston AAHA Annual meeting on March 26, 2002. Based on additional clinical experience the recommended dosages of lufenuron are as follows: Cats and dogs: 80-100 mg/kg Cats in catteries: at least 100 mg/kg The treatment should be repeated once every two weeks until at least two consecutive fungal cultures are negative over a period of two weeks. In our JAVMA publication we reported on a mycological treatment study based o 23 cats and 16 dogs (a total of 39 animals). In addition 297 lufenuron-treated animals were included in the clinical study. The new data is based on the mycological examination of 59 cats and 47 dogs (a total of 106 animals). Cats (59). These were 56 cases of M. canis, 2 cases of T.mentagrophytes and one case of M. gypseum. Dogs (47). These included 28 cases of M.canis, 14 cases of M. gypseum and 5 cases of T.mentagrophytes. In JAVMA we reported mean recovery times of 8.3 days for cats and 14.5 for dogs. In the new study the range of recovery times for cats with M. canis and M. Gypseun is from 6 to 37 days with a mean of 13.7 days. For dogs the new values are 6 to 32 days with a mean of 16.7 days for M. canis and M. gypseum. For cases of T. mentagrophytes recovery takes a little longer: 16 days for cats and 18 for dogs. These times are based on the time taken for daily fungal cultures to be negative and remain negative for 6 to 8 weeks. times are based on the time taken for daily fungal cultures to be negative and remain negative for 6 to 8 weeks. Dr. Yair Ben Ziony DVM, (Also in the name of Dr. Boaz Arzi, DVM, and second Author of our JAVMA publication) This is not an approved use for lufenuron in the United States. However, the other commonly used medication is itraconazole and it isn't approved for use in cats, either. At this time it seems apparent that lufenuron does not work in all cases of ringworm in cats even at the higher dosage. However, it does appear to be a relatively safe treatment for the condition and the ease of use is also a benefit. Lufenuron can also be used in dogs at the same dosages. Mike Richards, DVM 3/1/2002
Program is not an option for me. I have to get rid of this ringworm. I can't continue treating for ringworm for years on end. I have grand kids & grown kids & all my pets that I have not been able to be close to to since the start of this. It has put major stress on my marriage. I'm doing all the treatments which has put me on edge. I have reached out to 2 different vets on this. I have emailed sites that offer support. Made many posts concerning this. Contacted the local humane society and animal control. Everything local has come up with nothing. The vets say keep doing what I am doing or bring them in for another check up. Why, when in 6 months this has not been resolved? 1000.00 dollars later. I have used bestpet meds w/ a guarantee to work in 3 day. It did not work at all. It got worse, same with the itraconazole. The baths are a nightmare. 2 of my cats mat so bad the I now have discovered clippers. The hair flies everywhere. My vet did not recommend lime sulphur as my pets are in the late teens and it would be harsh. Whats worse? 6 months of treatment or clearing it up w/ harsh chemicals sooner?

Here is a few other things I have found. The revolution is very expensive, not approved for ringworm. You have to have a heart worm test before using. 400.00 for me to get all the animals on. No can do at this point. Would like to in the future. Another option that is much cheaper is ketoconazole which I have ordered and is on the way. This is not approved for use either in cats or dogs from what I understand.

Check these links if interested:

http://www.i-love-cats.com/forums/ca...ten-54250.html

http://www.showcatsonline.com/x/keto...ringworm.shtml

It is insane that the vets have not come up with a sure way to treat ringworm to get rid of it for good.

Aelurophile I admire you for doing what you can to stop the ringworm and not giving up.
 

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OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!! I just got two persian kittens from a breeder who knowingly sold them with ringworm, tapeworms, giardia and earmites. My life has been a living hell and the breeder wiil not take the kittens back. I have 3 small children and two other pets. This has been the worst experience of all my animal loving years
All they say is that I signed a 24 hour health gaurantee. How can breeders do this to people. It is so heartless. My family is in emotional and financial wreck over this!!!!!!!!!!!! And my whole family, pets and home have now been exposed to ringworm.
 

pcatlover

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My kittens came from Kentucky, I will never buy kittens from a website again! I am going to try the program. Although my vet did say these kittens will probably always have a low immune system since they were so emaciated and in ill health when I got them
 

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If you would like further advice regarding individual situations dealing with ringworm, I advise you start a new thread seeking advice, and detailing your situation.


I have a multi-pet (cat & dog), multi-person household - I lived with a ringworm carrier for many years....and did successfully treat/eradicate ringworm from my household.
 

skimble

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When mine were kittens with ringworm I tried all the routine medications and dips prescribed by my vet. I finally saw improvement after reading this personal experience from a breeder. http://www.siamese-kittens.com/Ringw..._treatment.htm I was VERY CAUTIOUS in making sure the kittens were NOT licking any treated areas and I did as suggested and wiped the area clean. I diluted clorox in 30 parts water and used a cotton tipped swab to apply. Do not get around eyes! Then cleaned the area. My kittens cleared up as did my skin. No ill effects to kitten or human.

I also put L-Lysine in there canned food to try and boost their immune system. I had them on a very good grain free canned food only. I cannot suggest you do this, I am only sharing what I did and the results. You may not have the same outcome.

I vacuumed daily and threw away the bag so as not to spread the spores with the next vacuum time. I changed the central return air filter every week. I cleaned all possible surfaces with bleach/water solution. I kept the ringworm kittens confined to one room. Washed their bedding daily with a dilute bleach solution in the wash.

Whew, that's all that I can recall right now. I understand the frustration. Wishing you luck.
 

stormyskiez

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Skimble I used bleach on my lesions after the over the counter stuff was not working fast enough....2 weeks into treatment. I used bleach and smothered some spots on my body after the bleach with clear fingernail polish. Mixed results on me. For the most part it cleared most of the spots fast. I did not do this to the pets as I had not found a site that promoted it on the pets although on yahoo a person said it had worked on her dog. The fluorescing only shows up on 50% of ringworm. That is not reliable.

My meds have not come yet. I'm tempted to stop the miconazole spray and use bleach. I don't see why it would hurt to wipe the animals whole body down with a washcloth soaked in diluted bleach and dry. Bleach is the cheapest chemical that Does Kill the Fungus. Building up the immune system is another good idea. I have been doing the relentless cleaning through all of this.

pcatlover My kitten also was advertised on a cat website. He was the only Siamese, so my husband says advertised in the TN area. I reported the seller to the BBB. Sent her pictures of my other animals that caught the ringworm and asked her NOT TO SELL anymore Kittens! She advised me to use the human ringworm treatment she had used and rip out my carpets! I rent. I can not rip out carpets. This woman deserves to be sued because she knowingly sold the kitten that had ringworm before testing to make sure he was clear. I might when I am done paying for treatments to get rid of this nightmare. I feel the same way you do. My sympathy goes out to you. The breeder would not take back the kitten. She said turn him into a no kill shelter. There are no kill shelters taking animals right now. What's worse was my husband has been in denial through most of this. He thinks the new lesion on the kitten is possibly a flea bite! A flea bite the size of a pea?? and we use advantage on the animals. I don't think so. He buys this kitten we never could afford.

The straw that broke the camels back was the vet I used for the ringworm test when all animals appeared to be clear, her assistant took no precautions with the kitten when she was told he was a ringworm carrier. She held the kitten up against her smock. I was dumbfounded. This was the only vet I knew of that had the cheapest fungus tests and would neuter even if he was a carrier. The vet assured me that it was a hospital environment. I did not say anything about the assistant as I felt paranoid. Also the fungus test she did she threw away after 10 days! Originally she had said it took up to 14 days. Why throw it out after 10?? Then later I read online that some tests are left for 20 something days?? Who am I to question the vet?? The kitten has a lesion 10 days to the day he was last seen in that clinic. It make me wonder what the heck. I called the vet up when I found the lesion. I ask do you take precautions to not spread ringworm and told them what the assistant did. They said yes they do take precautions but had no answer for me to whether or not the assistant changed smocks after holding a potential ringworm infected animal.

white cat lover I will start a new thread when I have time. I would like to hear how you resolved your ringworm problem in the home.
 
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aelurophile

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Ringworm is definitely a frustrating thing to deal with! I also find it hard to believe that something more reliable and affordable hasn't been found to treat it, but I guess ringworm isn't a high priority considering other disorders.

I also agree that the immune system does seem to effect ringworm somehow. As mentioned previously, two of my cats seem more effected by ringworm than the other too. Also, my husband occasionally will develop a ringworm spot and I haven't had one yet (even though I have more physical contact with the cats). My husband is also more prone to getting sick than I am. I think this, and the differences in ringworm symptoms in animals, is what makes it hard to prescribe a blanket treatment for every animal.

I agree that what works for one animal will not work for all animals. I'm very lucky that my cats never developed lesions, but that may also be why Program works for me but not other cats (who may have a more severe case).

My thoughts are with those of you still struggling to find a cure for your animals!
 

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Originally Posted by Skimble

When mine were kittens with ringworm I tried all the routine medications and dips prescribed by my vet. I finally saw improvement after reading this personal experience from a breeder. http://www.siamese-kittens.com/Ringw..._treatment.htm I was VERY CAUTIOUS in making sure the kittens were NOT licking any treated areas and I did as suggested and wiped the area clean. I diluted clorox in 30 parts water and used a cotton tipped swab to apply. Do not get around eyes! Then cleaned the area. My kittens cleared up as did my skin. No ill effects to kitten or human.
This treatment was use successfully by a collie breeder whose entire kennel was infected.

Best,

Elizabeth, Whimsey, Magic, Merlin, & Fancy
 

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Be aware that bleach is toxic to cats. Please do not use any treatment without speaking to your vet first - as you do not know what the side-affects may be.
 

stormyskiez

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Originally Posted by Skimble

When mine were kittens with ringworm I tried all the routine medications and dips prescribed by my vet. I finally saw improvement after reading this personal experience from a breeder. http://www.siamese-kittens.com/Ringw..._treatment.htm I was VERY CAUTIOUS in making sure the kittens were NOT licking any treated areas and I did as suggested and wiped the area clean. I diluted clorox in 30 parts water and used a cotton tipped swab to apply. Do not get around eyes! Then cleaned the area. My kittens cleared up as did my skin. No ill effects to kitten or human.

I also put L-Lysine in there canned food to try and boost their immune system. I had them on a very good grain free canned food only. I cannot suggest you do this, I am only sharing what I did and the results. You may not have the same outcome.

I vacuumed daily and threw away the bag so as not to spread the spores with the next vacuum time. I changed the central return air filter every week. I cleaned all possible surfaces with bleach/water solution. I kept the ringworm kittens confined to one room. Washed their bedding daily with a dilute bleach solution in the wash.

Whew, that's all that I can recall right now. I understand the frustration. Wishing you luck.
Skimble how long did it take for the ringworm to go away completely? Were you treating all bald spots until the hair grew back daily? Did the kittens have multiple spots?

My first outbreak the carrier had no lesions and 5 of the other pets had very large to small multiple bald spots & lesions at its worse. I mean more then 10 spots on the cats. In the early stages It's impossible to see everything that may be on the animals skin with the hair.

The ketoconazole arrived yesterday. I'm treating the one kitten with that to start because I had already started to use the Malaseb Shampoo fungus baths and topical spray. Don't want to mix the fungus meds with bleach. His raw blood red lesion has hair growing back already (it's been a week on malaseb and 2 days on oral ketoconazole) but the lesion still looks raw in some spots. He is scratching the spot raw around the lesion. You would think the malaseb spray would stop the itching! He is shedding a lot. I found a loose plug of hair on his tail yesterday with what looked like a scab, not good. I'm out of the Malaseb Shampoo and was considering using nizoral shampoo if I can find it or give him a normal bath to clean off the anti fungal and use bleach. I don't know what to do. Will I have a bad interaction?

If other animals get lesions I will probably use bleach on them to see if it works first because it does not do the damage to the liver that the ketoconazole and other oral meds can do and it is affordable and it works faster then anything else???

I have researched bleach. The animal would have to drink a lot of it to do harm or inhale very strong fumes to do damage to the lungs. I believe diluted bleach if fine to use.

Please advise, Thank you.
 

skimble

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Originally Posted by StormySkiez

Skimble how long did it take for the ringworm to go away completely? Were you treating all bald spots until the hair grew back daily? Did the kittens have multiple spots?

It's impossible to see everything that may be on the animals skin with the hair.

Don't want to mix the fungus meds with bleach.

If other animals get lesions I will probably use bleach on them to see if it works first because it does not do the damage to the liver that the ketoconazole and other oral meds can do and it is affordable and it works faster then anything else???

I have researched bleach. The animal would have to drink a lot of it to do harm or inhale very strong fumes to do damage to the lungs. I believe diluted bleach if fine to use.
I don't recall how long it took to clear up. I treated every day until hair grew back and a vet check with ringworm tested neg.

I was prescribed a Malaseb dip from the vet to be used 2 times a week.

I never mixed treatments on the same day.

I used diluted bleach/water on the days the dip was not used. I got a black light to use so you can see the lesions well and see lesions that are about to erupt and applied with a q-tip. Very supervised time of a few minutes so no licking, then I used a warm wet wash cloth to rub all over to remove any residue. I did NOT use anything on a spot that was raw or irritated.

I cannot advise this method and would always suggest a talk with your vet. I talked to my vet re dilute bleach and he was against it. When I asked what harm could be caused when using the care I described....he could not give a reason not to use it. No solution is left on the fur. It is all washed off so as not to get licked.

This is just what I did and I am only relaying my experience with this situation. Please everyone, research your individual situation and make informed treatment after a discussion with your vet as I did.

I wish you the best.
 

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I wanted to post my experience with Lufenuron since this was one of the first fora I found when researching the treatment. I'm 8 days post giving the medication to my 2 year old male. He's been struggling with his skin gradually getting worse for about 10 months. It started with executive grooming which led to bald spots on his chin, head and neck. For a few moths, it's been so bad that he is damaging his chin, paws and ears by scratching. I had originally treated him and his brother, who shows no sign of any problem, for fleas with Program and his temperament improved a great deal, but he got a little better and then a lot worse after the fleas had been completely eradicated which led me to suspect ringworm was the cause. I've ruled out food allergies because they were both on raw diets with no additives or grains when the problem started. They now eat primarily wet food.

What I've used is generic Lufenuron from Amazon. The pills came in 205mg dosages and I gave one and a half pills each to him and his brother with their wet food. I plan to give them this dosage again after another week and to keep up monthly if the treatment is successful. The reason I'm treating him orally is because he's an indoor/outdoor cat and he tends to disappear when I try to bathe or put anything on him, making topical treatment very difficult. He takes water worse than any cat I've ever had.

So now, 8 days in, the results are coming in: his front paws and chin are completely healed. He still has bald spots on his head, but no more wounds anywhere besides the toes on his hind legs. I've noticed a powder-like substance appearing on the hair around the balding on his head. His temperament improved a bit again. He's sleeping closer to his brother and allowing himself to be licked by him. He's sleeping in the living room with the family instead of by himself in the laundry room. I'm cautiously optimistic that he is being healed.

Now this could all be premature, so I'll be back to post whether or not the bald spots have healed and any relevant follow up information. I hope this helps anyone looking for information and inspires some more experience stories.
 
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