Immediate Help Needed!

Oh Sarah I'm so sorry you're having all this trouble!! And I can sympathize with you on the bites - I'm still on Augmentin for my run-in w/my feral girl on Monday, and I narrowly avoided surgery. (she got my R index finger, on the first joint.)

Sending lots of "You STILL da man" vibes to Tinkles, and calming vibes to YOU. Glad MA and gayef were here to help you, and I hope you got some rest before you read this!

Poor guy! Glad you moved the feral cats stuff away from there. He should feel a little better now.

Hi Sarah,

I just found this thread. You have my complete sympathy with this as I underwent a very similar situation mid January. What you are experiencing is called 'Re-directed aggression".

Tink, who is a dominant cat, was threatened by one of the ferals -probably the feral tom sprayed the screen - and Tink's instincts kicked in. He couldn't get the outside cat, but because he was so instinctually 'hyped' up he ended up attacking the first thing he saw - one of the other cats. He was not able to differentiate between the threatening situation and the friendly cats he lives with. I am sorry to say that it may be a while before you are going to be back to inside harmony.

It is now April 1 and I am still having to be watchful to keep harmony in my house. I have 5 cats and mid-January a neighbour cat jumped at the back door window during the middle of the night. 3 of my cats were there meowing at my closed bedroom door (because they were wanting to play and not sleep) and one of them - the dominant male- got caught in the corner when one of the youngest males' instincts took over.

Like you, I ended up picking up one of the cats to get him away from the attack, and the main attacker then climbed over me to get to the first cat. Get to a doctor and get some antibiotics, especially for the main bite wound on your hand. Bring your rabies certificates for the cats with you to your doctor to prove that rabies is not an issue and he will probably not have to file a 'bite' report.

You will need to plan on setting up a sanctuary area where you can either separate Tink or Cleo. You will probably need to keep Tink or Cleo separated for some of the day or night each and every day for a while so it is best if you have a space other than the bathroom. The 'time outs' are important because they will allow the cats to restore their 'balance'. Their emotions are going to be heightened for a few days no matter what. The whole inside balance has been disrupted and all of the cats are going to be confused about what is what. You and/or Peter need to become the alpha cat now and reassure them that order will prevail.

Some of the things I did that helped. Get the Feliway air diffuser. It will make your cats feel more relaxed - that doesn't necessarily mean more calm, though, because they will have a lot of pent up stress and the difusser initially may make them very playful - they will run and play. Supervise them at this time and be prepared to interrupt any play. You may wish to keep Tink separate from the others and play with him until he 'wears out' a bit, then once he is calm let him out with the others, again supervised. Have small blankets or throws throughout the house so you can pick one up at a momen'ts notice and throw it over him, or over any other cat with whom he gets into a dispute.

Do talk with you vet. If you are not able to restore harmonious relations, you may need medical intervention. I have amitriptylene - a type of mood enhancing anti-depressent - prescribed by my vet. Fortunately, things were beginning to improve so I haven't used it yet, but it may be a necessary component combined with behaviour modification.

I have also used a variety of homeopathic remedies, flower essences and soft music to try and counteract any aggressive tendencies. Time outs have been the most successful thing - it allows the cats to forget the danger and remember the 'good' things. You want to prevent any incipient aggression from happening again - and I am sorry to say that Tink will still be 'wired' and in aggression mode for a while yet - so be prepared. He is not crazy; he is not mean; he isn't even vicious - he is just being a cat reacting to his instincts.

There are three excellent books I suggest you get. They have helped me enormously as they provide insight into how cats perceive the world and why they act and react as they do: by Pam Johnson-Bennet - 2 books, "Cat vs. Cat' and 'Twisted Whiskers". She is a cat behaviourist and experienced in these matters. The third book is "The Cat Whisperer" by Claire Bessant.

Good luck with this, and please don't hesitate to e-mail me privately if you need any support or advice or assistance.

Kathryn

Thanks so much Kathryn for your helpful reply.

I went to Petsmart this morning and bought two of the feliway air diffusers. One is in the bathroom with Tink and the other is in the living room near the front door. I also bought some spray and sprayed it on every corner in the house and door jams where the cats like to rub their faces.

I also bought some Cat-eze tablets, that are supposed to have a calming effect. They have chamomile and l-tryptophan in them. I gave tink one when I got home.

Tink was doing this better this morning then things got worse again. I let Tink out for about 10 minutes at 5 am and everything was fine. Then I put Tink back in the bathroom and went back to sleep. I let Tink out again this morning around 8 am and everything was fine for 10 minutes, then Tink cornered Grayson and was yowling and spitting at him and about to pounce. I threw a couch blanket over him and put him back in the bathroom.

While I was at PetSmart peter let Tink out and he said he made a beeline for Grayson. Put him back in the bathroom. Then when I went to put the Feliway in the bathroom Tink ran out and immediately began going after Grayson again.

So Tink is back in the bathroom with the feliway diffuser, and I sprayed the feliway around the door so if tink sniffs another cat under the door that might help???

I also called my vet back in Texas who was the best vet I ever had. She is in surgery but the tech assures me she will call me back when she gets done.

I suppose I will set up my office as a Tinkles space. He likes sitting on the window perch next to the computer anyhow, that is where he usually is during the day. I will move the litter box and food and water and feliway plugin in here too, since it seems that unlike last time, Tink isn't going to get over this quickly.

Part of the problem (although I may be wrong) was that when I let Tink out this morning he was fine until Grayson pinned his ears back and hissed at him. It's like now that the other cats are all freaked out at Tinkles they are on the defensive, which just upsets Tink more.

Sounds like you are doing the right things, Sarah.

Yes, Grayson's absolutely reasonable action to Tink would set Tink off again. He is still wired from teh experience even though he appears calmer. You will find over the next few days that almost anything will set them off as they are going to be 'wired' for a bit. Outside noises, loud music, car doors banging, a hiss in play, someone running past in play, all of these may turn into 'triggers' unfortunately. The next few days are going to be the hardest for you and the most likely for aggression to re-errupt.

It appears that Tink and Grayson are going to be the problem characters in this situation. Over the next few days see if you can identify one or two of your cats who are not interested in being alpha or territorial. You can then have these cats help you to restore calm. These are the cats who don't respond in an aggressive or defensive way if Tink starts his aggressive posturing. I was able to use my two who weren't involved as 'companion keepers' when I had to divide the household up into separate rooms - I had 3 main antagonists - or 2 antagonists and 1 victim who also gets defensive/aggressive.

All of yours are going to be on the defensive for the next few days because they just don't know what to expect. Their normal order has been thrown into chaos. So, it may take a few days before you find out who your 'peace makers' are.

Two things to think about right now: 1) your own stress level is going to be high because you are just as confused as the cats are; you can't predict what is going to happen any more and that will make you prone to being over-reactive too. This is 100% normal! It is important that while you and your cat and human family are re-learning how to live together peacefully that you find ways to reduce your own stress levels. Try and think positive thoughts at the cats - consciously remember them being good friends and try and project those images to them whenever you find your mind beginning to think about them fighting. You are all going to have to re-pattern how you react and it isn't an easy thing to do. 2) you will begin to notice times of days that are more susceptible than others to aggression and you can use that to your advantage as well. For mine it is early morning any time between 4 am to 9 am and then around bedtime. That is when the cats seem most active and energetic, and where they will likely take 'umbrage' if some one does something out of the ordinary or unexpected. Once you identify those high-risk times, those are the times you will want to keep them separated for now. Focus on getting positive interactions to happen when they are quiet or more sleepy and use that to start rebuilding the relationships. Once they are back to interacting without problems during the easy times you can start working on creating positive interactions during the high stress times.

If you do have a incident of active aggression, allow at least a day for the tempers to cool (so to speak) before you let those two together again. This is where your companion cat peace-makers are very useful. You will want to rotate the cats through different rooms together to make sure they all keep that 'family scent' so you may find having Tink in your bedroom for a while, then in the office for a while and in the main living area for a while will take some co-ordination but will help.

The first 2 to 3 weeks are the worst because anything seems to set them off - we have construction going on here and they chose those weeks to do pile driving the next street over. It did NOT help, hehehe. It will be discouraging at times, but and this is a big BUT - it will improve and it will get better, it will just take some time. I made the mistake of moving too fast and lost ground the first time I allowed the 'victim' to stay out overnight with the others. I had to go back to square one although we made faster progress the second time around. The biggest challenge in multi-cat households is that you have all of the cats involved in one way or another, as well as the main players, and one of them may end up causing a repeat unexpectedly. So, just practise relieving your own stress levels and you will find you will also be able to intercept potential problems before they develop. Your cats will take their cues from you - if you are stressed, they will stress; if you laugh and cuddle and play, then they will 'let it go' more quickly.

One of the best tricks I found was to iinterrupt their stares. You will notice if one starts to stare at the other, he will then start getting 'posture-y' and the initial aggression will start. Interrupt that stare even if it means putting your hand over the cats eyes and making him blink. Get both of them to blink or interrupt that focus. I used the word 'blinky, blinky' at the same time and just keep repeating it while I am interrupting their focus and have noticed now that when I say the word' blinky, blinky' that they will usually look away or interrupt their stares - a welcome result that I hadn't anticipated but helps.

Good luck.

Kathryn

Thanks again Kathryn.

There is one cat Tinkles has never gone after. That is Marge, Cleo's sister. Last night when all the cats were freaking out, Marge got puffed up, but stood still, didn't run around like the rest of them.

Marge also was playing with her toys and in some packing boxes while the others will still upset. So I think Marge will be a good intermediary.

I;ve got my office all cleaned out and almost ready for Tink to move in. I am in my office most of the day, so Tink will have plenty of attention.

Well, I am pretty upset right now. Our doctor's office says they don't have any appointments open today, not until middle of next week in fact. When I explained the situation she told me to go to the health department or the ER. No way! I would rather have my hand cut off than have the health department think about quarantining Tinkles! And my ER copay is $100, which I don't really have right now.

I am keeping my hands clean and everything looks good except the deep bite near my finger joint on my palm. That one is puffy and red circle around the puncture about the size of a nickel. I have a band aid over it with neosporin on it.

If the bite gets worse I will of course go to the ER, but it seems OK for now.

now that sucks!

Ok, for the spot that is also red and inflamed, try putting an ice pack or a ice compress on it as well. I found that helped the last time I got badly injured during an 'incident'. I thought I was going to have to go for another round of antibiotics and didn't look forward to explaining that to the doctor. I put an ice gelpack on the area that felt hot and swollen and by the next day it was down significantly and I didn't need to repeat the antibiotics after all. I also tried to keep the puncture area open and used hydrogen peroxide on it as well, trying to get the peroxide into the puncture.

Good luck
Kathryn

Pictures of the accused Tinkles in my office : (

www.petersimmons.com/ebay/badtink1.jpg
www.petersimmons.com/ebay/badtink2.jpg

Originally Posted by PrissyKitty

Well, I am pretty upset right now. Our doctor's office says they don't have any appointments open today, not until middle of next week in fact. When I explained the situation she told me to go to the health department or the ER. No way! I would rather have my hand cut off than have the health department think about quarantining Tinkles! And my ER copay is $100, which I don't really have right now.

I am keeping my hands clean and everything looks good except the deep bite near my finger joint on my palm. That one is puffy and red circle around the puncture about the size of a nickel. I have a band aid over it with neosporin on it.

If the bite gets worse I will of course go to the ER, but it seems OK for now.

Click to expand...

Sarah, please be very careful about the bite on your palm! A couple of years ago, our then-cat (a feral) bit me in the calf. I cleaned the wound immediately, and got antibiotics, but still ended up with a really horrible infection and could barely walk for six months. Cat bites are dangerous; their teeth are so sharp that they really penetrate. One thing I was told then: All cat owners should have up-to-date tetanus shots!

wow, what an ordeal. Tink looks like a great cat though i'm sure you're doing a good job, and please follow everyone's advice.

good luck!

I am wondering what any of you think about this idea I just had...

I've got a cat harness that will fit Tink. What do you guys think about me letting him out with the other cats with the harness on and me holding the leash? That way if he looks like he is going to start to attack someone I've got him at the end of the leash and he can't hurt anyone.

I was thinking about doing this tomorrow, for only a short period of time, hopefully before he gets agressive, and putting him right back in my office.

Something very interested has happened in the dynamics between our other 6 cats that are in the rest of the house.

Grayson has become much more friendly with Peter and I, meowing a lot more than usual and following us both around. He has also become more agressive with the other cats, but not bad, just taking a swipe at them when they walk by him within his arms reach.

Before Tinkles exploded last night, Grayson was Tinkles' best friend. Grayson followed Tink everywhere and would lay down right on top of him to get him to clean him. Tink was usually good and would clean Grayson's face, then he would move and Grayson would get Tink's spot.

Whenever Tink and Gray would play, Grayson would always be the one laying on his back with his belly up, and Tink would be the one standing.

Is it possible Grayson is now trying to take over Tink's role as alpha cat? Grayson is also sitting outside the door to my office and sniffing and meowing a lot because he knows Tink is in here. When I open the door to let them sniff each other Tink just stares at him and he hissed at him once so I shut the door. When I let Bender sniff through a crack in the door Tink just gave Bender a glance then looked up at me; not the cold stare and hiss he gave Grayson.

Any ideas?

Hi Sarah,

First, the harness idea is certainly worth exploring so give it a try and see what happens.

Second, yes, the dynamics in the household probably are changing. Lion and Bear have the same relationship with each other that Tink and Grayson had - it seems to have been restored between them, but the relationship they both had with my older cat Tristan changed. Tristan used to be the alpha cat and it had never been challenged until the night when the stray 'attacked' at them through the window. Lion took on the role of alpha, although Bear did some jockey-ing for it as well. Tristan was confused and had no idea what was going on and basically as long as there are no problems they can co-exist comfortably, but if there is a problem Lion moves into alpha mode. Aggression happens if one of the other two challenges it. I suspect that Grayson is deciding that he can do the alpha role as well and you will have Grayson and Tink jockeying for that alpha position. They will have to rework their own dynamics and a lot will depend on how strongly each insists that he be alpha. Since they had such a good relationship before - like the one between Bear and Lion in many ways - there is a lot of positive interaction there from previous so once they begin to 'chill out' again, there is a good chance to you will be able to restore some of that. Do remmeber that even though it has been a few days they are all still hyper and on edge and it doesn't take much to have one of them tumble over so be really alert to body language and act quickly to intercept any aggression before it actually becomes aggression. Have a blanket available to toss over Tink even when he is in the harness because you don't want him turning on you if he does get aggressive. Try and keep him in the company of one of the safe cats as well and gradually increase the time he spends with them outside of Gray's company.

Good luck

Kathryn

PS - one other useful bit of advice I received - if you need to pick up a cat to prevent a violent outbreak, pick up the alpha cat not the one he is attacking. If he hasn't become aggressive and is just doing the glaring and beginning to posture a bit you can prevent an outbreak that way. If he is already into aggressive mode - fur raised, tail puffed, stuff like that, touching him will set off the aggression so that is when you use the blanket instead.

Just an update:

Last night Marge wanted in my office with Tinkles, so we let her in and the two both pretty much ignored each other.

This morning I let Cleo in and after about 2 minutes, Tinkles hissed and spit at her and chased her under the bed. (Yes I have a bed in my office!) So I broke Tink's stare first (very good advice) then he was OK for me to pick him up and put him in the large cat carrier (dog crate) I have in the room while poor Cleo worked up the courage to come out. Once Cleo came out from under the bed I tossed her outside and Bender came in. Thinks seemed fine between him and Tink in the crate so I let Tink out. Tink went stright to the bed to stare under there and see if Cleo was still there. Bender and Tink totally ignored each other like what happened between Tink and Marge last night.

So I guess we know who the "neutral cats" are now. Looks like Marge and Bender.

Very interesting.

I spent the night in here with Tink last night, he did throw up once, but it was a big messy hairball, and he usually throws up a big messy hairball about once a week. And yes I give him Laxatone.