or Connect
TheCatSite.com › Forums › General Forums › The Cat Lounge › Very Disturbing
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Very Disturbing

post #1 of 36
Thread Starter 
Please go to the website, www.geocities.com/ptinnocents/queso.html. After reading the entire page, then go to board 1. Its about two Baylor University students who murdered a cat named Queso. For those of you who live in Texas, you probably heard about this story. Warning, this may not be for the faint at heart. The board you might find very disturbing, about how a student requested a prayer for the cat and see about the response he/she got in return.
post #2 of 36
Thread Starter 
If it dosen't work, then just type in the address. Or go to www.ptinnocents.org
post #3 of 36
Thread Starter 
I forgot to mention that after you go to the website, ptinnocent.org, go to cases, then click Queso. Max the cat and other animals are listed here too.
post #4 of 36
I went to the site you mentioned, and from there I found a link telling the actual story of what happened to poor Queso....I copied that link, here it is...........


I am outraged at what these people (if you can even call them that) did to this poor cat.....what kind of people DO this???? What kind of evil is lurking in their hearts to make them do something like this????????? If a person doesn't like cats....fine, that is their choice (although they don't know what they are missing) but to hurt one, and torture it for the sheer enjoyment of it....
These guys need to be sent to prison in my opinion, and if I was the judge, the death penalty sounds pretty good to me!
Anyone who can do this heartless, horrible act, would not think twice about doing it to another person either.
Hell is created for people like this!
post #5 of 36
Nena, I also just figured out what you meant about going to the comments posted on Board 1, I just now went there, and am outraged at THAT too!!!!! This woman was asking a Christian board to pray for what has happened to that poor cat, and she got comments like, "It concerns me that you are so obessed with an insignificant dead #*@* cat....etc.....here is the link to read these responses to her request for prayer...


Thank you Nena for sharing this with us. We all need to be aware of these things.
post #6 of 36
I'm sorry guys, I can't do it. I can't go read about it. I can't turn on the news without more bad news, and I don't have it in me to go look for it on the internet. I'm sorry, please don't think that I don't care, cause I do, but I'm too tired, and too worn down right now to check it out.
post #7 of 36
Thread Starter 
This website, ptinnocents, talks about cases of other cruelty cases in the United States. I've been reading it, and it makes me sick.
post #8 of 36
Airprincess, I understand.
There is so much bad news out there lately, it is hard to look at more. I almost decided the same thing when I read this thread, but I went ahead and checked it out, and it angered me so badly, I can understand how you feel.
post #9 of 36
I, too, get sick of hearing about animal cruelty. I wish that if someone hears about it, I wish they really wouldn't post about it. I am not saying this to make people upset, and I really hope you can understand that! I see this every single day on other cat boards. I am sure there are more cases every single day, and nothing is ever going to stop this from happening. You put away one person, and another person will hurt or kill an innocent animal. I guess it's my fault for reading about it, but that is how I feel. There is never any good news anymore. This is really one of the reasons why I almost stay away from any animal related site.
post #10 of 36
I went and read the board and was amazed that the administrator insists that animals do not have souls, therefore they will not be in heaven. They appear to believe that only man can attain heaven, and anyone who believes cats are to be cherished, should be locked in a nuthouse. It is an interesting and very sad read to be sure.
post #11 of 36
I just visited Queso's site and am ONCE AGAIN sickened to death with this type of cruelty. AND not to mention the fact that this type of SICK MENTALITY is being defended!!! Somebody please tell me what the hell is wrong with these people!!! If that was my son that did that ... He'd be sitting in a psychiatrists chair or in a mental hospital, that's if I didn't take him out myself before! Of course, the truth of the matter is that no offspring of mine would ever do that. So, does this little :censor::censor::censor::censor::censor::censor::censor: and his buddies get off with a slap on the wrist? Shall we send him out there to maybe rape and beat up a young lady? And if he did will they say ... "boys will be boys?" What the hell is this world coming to?? Maybe we need more animal rights vigilantes to take up the slack where the IGNORANT legal system leaves off!God this has me pissed off... AGAIN.. I haven't calmed down from the work I'm doing ... Well it's back to the printer for me ... More letters to send out! I really hope those little spineless pricks get what's due to them.

One pissed off Guardian!
post #12 of 36
I cannot believe what I have just read . . . something is mentally wrong with all of the people who do not have anything negative to say about this. They all need help. I haven't got much to say about it (well, not exactly - I'm just speechless), but I know I'd definitly have something to say about it if the people who commited that crime and those who think what they did was "okay" or did not indicate they thought it was wrong were here! I'd be breaking out the bible verses and law books and then I'd call PETA (OMG - they can be HARSH!!! -- do they know about this?!?! I may have to contact them later. . .)

even though it does say in the bible that animals do not have souls, I think it is ignorant that an "administrator" say such things in a time like this . . . as if he is arguing for the SOBs that commited that horrible crime against the innocent cat. He has to learn there is a time and a place for everything. I was looking for his email to write him, but I couldn't find it and I have to go to school; however, I am going to look again (does anyone know what it is?)
post #13 of 36
Christina, I looked for his e-mail address also, and couldn't find one, I even tried joining the boards, just so I could tell him exactly what I thought of his comments, but after about a half hour of trying to join the boards, I finally gave up...every username I put in was supposedly taken...I even put in some ridiculous ones like debbyloveskats421987 and they still said it was taken!! What's up with THAT? Anyway, I really wish I had a way to tell this guy,I beleive his name was Mike George, if memory serves me right, exactly what I think of his "christian" comments.

Yes, The bible states that animals have no soul, per say, like we do, meaning they do not have to know right from wrong, or chose to beleive or not beleive, but as far as them not being in heaven, I feel that is ridiculous, because God is our father, and what father would deny his children their long lost pets, when they get to heaven. He wants us to be happy after all. And in the bible it says that God sees even the sparrow fall, and he cares, so how much more does he care for us, his children. So if he is seeing the sparrow fall, he obviously is seeing the cat who is tortured and murdered. And it angers him.
Now, I will admit, I eat meat, and I don't beleive the bible is against that, they even made sacrafices to God (at his request)of fatted calves, but I also beleive that God intended for the animals to only be killed for food and clothing, or to raise the funds for food and clothing...such as selling furs, etc.....but he also intended for the killing to be done in a very humane way, no suffering, and he also created certain animals, such as cats and dogs and horses, etc, to be compainions to us, and not for food or clothing, or killing in any way.
This is just my beleif, and I am not saying it is right, but it is just what I myself beleive.
I beleive it angers God terribly to see ANY animal tortured or mistreated and they will get their just dues someday.
post #14 of 36
Thread Starter 
Debby, I have to agree wholeheartedly with you. I read a part were they were comparing the skinning of the cat to that of a deer. I got mad. I mean. There is a big difference. The deer, cattle, pigs, and poultry were made for us to eat and clothe. Nobody(sane people) would even harm a dog or cat to eat it or wear his furs. I've also read in the bible that we are only to eat hoofed animals. Not furry or paws. I will look it up tonight. I also like ot eat meat, but when it comes from hoofed mammals, poultry or fish. Putting these men or any animal abuser to death would be too easy. They need to be tortured so they can feel what the animals feel. If animals have no souls and can't feel pain, why do they cry. What does it mean when a dog wags his tail at the sight of his master? If dogs and cats have no souls, then why do they use them in hospitals and nursing homes? Did you read the part about the school expelling students who have premarital sex or for lying? But will not expel for murdering an innocent creature(that is not walking on two feet)?
post #15 of 36
I agree Nena, these animals CAN feel pain, and whether they have souls or not, they can still love, hurt, feel lonely, scared, happy, etc...and it is not right to mistreat them in any way, even the pigs and cattle, if we are going to use them for food, fine, but we need to do it with as little pain and fear to them as possible.
post #16 of 36
Thread Starter 
The people on this board believe that if we were to pray for the cat, then we are not christians. That we worship the cat as if he were another god. I wish I could tell these people that most sane people believe that cats, dogs, and other companion animals have become a member of the family. They are family members. And they need our prayers as much as humans.
post #17 of 36
Thread Starter 
Here is the quote from the guy who says we are worshipping cats:

The Bible states only humans have souls. We have dominion over ALL other creatures and forms of life. Your idol-like view of cats and nonhuman animal life is HERESY and not Christian at all. Do you worship a golden cat? Would you if you could? It sounds like it. As a dedicated Christian, your misguided animal worship is an affront to me and all other real Christians. Quit hiding under the name of Christ and reveal yourself for whatever Eastern religion you actually represent.
post #18 of 36
The person who said that is really sad. he obviously has a very hard heart, and Christ would not feel the same way. I guess this person will be accountable for his feelings someday, by God, so there isn't much we can do, but I have a hard time believing that such a hard hearted person would ever enter the gates of heaven, and call himself a Christian.
post #19 of 36
Don't know if I want to get into this one... But I guess since I'm not moderating anymore, I might as well.

As a Christian, I don't believe animals have souls, and I don't really think they'll go to heaven. I think we'll be so busy praising God that we won't even miss them. However, that's up to God so I'm not going to worry about it too much.

But I do have to agree with some of the posters on that other board that you don't need to pray for a dead cat. Now, don't get me wrong, these people did a horrible, horrible thing and they need to be held accountable to the fullest extent of the law. And I also don't see how they can be Christian and do this terrible things. But back to the praying, the cat is already dead. Praying for the cat won't do any good. I think we need to pray for the family (if there was one) that owned the cat, or the people who were feeding it, for the people that were affected negatively due to the terrible actions of these boys. We also need to pray for the boys that did this, they obviously need a lot of help, and who better to help them but God.

And for the record, I have nothing against praying for an animal's health while it's alive. I've prayed for my own pets in the past, and I would now too. But God can't do much for the cat now that he's dead.

Just my two cents.
post #20 of 36
Dawn, I agree with you in the fact that praying for the cat after it is dead won't do any good, and we should pray instead for justice for this evil crime,and for the people who loved this cat, but I do disagree on animals not being in heaven to a certain extent....yes, we will be very busy praising God, and worshipping him, but I also beleive that my father will be sitting down to his huge bowl of ice-cream that he loves so much, and my mother will be painting her pictures that she loved to do so much, so in my opinion, it is no different to say that when I get there, I will have some time to sit down and pet my lost animals that I have loved so much. But like you said, that is God's decision, not ours, and I certainly respect your opinion.
post #21 of 36
Would someone please place here the EXACT PLACE in the Bible that says animals have no place in Heaven? Not Book,not Act..EXACT verse. Now please no ambiguous passages that can mean something different to anyone who reads them.

As for whether or not God can do anything for a dead cat...well I for one would not presume to limit God's abilities. I'll pray for my friends;feline or other,alive or dead.

I'm not questioning anybody's faith here. Nor am I suggesting your particular church or pastor is right or wrong. No religious wars please. I AM a Christian..I believe WHOLEHEARTEDLY in God..my Master,my Father,my Brother and my Friend. But I think that to say that all God's beautiful creations have no place in Heaven is ludicrous to say the least.

Flame away if it pleases you.
post #22 of 36
Debby - (referring to your post right after mine) I agree with you 100%. There is just so much that can be said about it that I don't even know where to begin. And if I was face to face with "Mr. Christian" himself (Mike) I don't think I'd know where to end. I know all of you probably feel the same way. Most of what I was thinking was already said in the later posts, so I will not repeat it, but I think what these people need is a taste of their own medicine - sorry, that's just how I think (I know it's not Christian, but I'm angry!!!!!
post #23 of 36
Most troubling for me is this:

Regardless of anyone's position on the existence of animal souls, the lack of compassion for a living creature by the Baylor posters is abhorrent. To sarcastically and casually criticize someone for seeking prayer for the victim of any injustice, whether human or not, seems to be the height of hypocrisy for someone purporting themself to be a Christian. To criticize another for an inappropiate prayer is ludicrous -- in many ways the purpose of prayer is for God to provide the one offering it with greater understanding and strength. And surely God understands that a prayer offered for the soul of any animal is also a prayer for our own humanity.

I once was told by an Episcopalian Minister that the love that cats & dogs exhibit toward man is important because it is the closest example of unconditional love that we can tangibly experience. As a volunteer at a shelter, I can definitely attest to this in extreme circumstances. I saw badly beaten dogs that, although terrified of you, wouldn't leave your side. I often thought that it was quite fortunate for us that God and the animals are supposed to exhibit unconditional love, because if it was up to us -- they might both be in trouble.

Practically speaking, what raises the hair on the back of my neck is the coach and web-poster reactions of "it was just a cat". There is so much statistic evidence that people who commit heinous crimes on people start with animals that -- animal cruelty issues aside -- this is a very serious issue. It makes you wonder if someone said the same thing when Jeffrey Dahmer dissected cats at his parents house, or when the Mississipi school shooter burned his family pug alive if there were those who said "it was just an animal".

How we treat animals says far more about our souls than theirs.
post #24 of 36
Why is it every time an animal abuse case is brought up, religion has to be discussed? I mean come one..... this is a cat site, not a religious site! I am sorry if I am offending anyone, but this is how I feel :baloon:
post #25 of 36
It's good that you care enough about cats to bring this matter before us. There's nothing I can write which would add to what others here have already written — in regard to the torture of cats.

However, I'd like to state my opinion that religion is a private matter. Having said that, I believe we can thank Descartes — whose ideas are worshipped by conservative Christians — for the notion that non-human animals haven't "souls" and therefore cannot be in "heaven." Descartes asserted non-human animals are not sentient beings but rather clever machines which generate programmed behavior in response to external stimuli only.

If there are no animals in "heaven," I don't want to go there!

post #26 of 36
Tigger, I'm not into the religious debate myself (Judaism has a simple solution - there is no heaven and hell, so no need to worry who goes there or not ).

However, if people wish to discuss that here I think it's perfectly alright. People were upset by what they've read and if what it brings about is a cat related theological discussion I think that's fine. I know you don't want to offend anyone, but having been here for a while, I can tell you religion is one thing people tend to be sensitive about... So, if you don't care for the discussion - there are plenty of other threads to visit. Please don't take my words the wrong way - you're one of my favorite members I'm just trying to extinguish any flaming that may come out of it before it bursts.
post #27 of 36
Tigger - I don't think that every animal abuse case thread is overtly religious. However, this one is different simply because it started on a religious message board. Baylor is a Christian college here in Texas. That's what made this case particularly appauling, in my opinion. Being a Chrisitian, it shocks me to see other Christians behaving in a way that so goes against Christian teachings. I'm sorry if I offended you with my post. But if you knew me in person, you'd know that my relationship with God is very, very important to me. It seeps into just about every aspect of my life. One thing I'd hate is for people to not tell that I'm a Christian after they've known me.

Kittyfoot - You and I obviously have different beliefs about this. I'm sorry that I can't quote you a verse that states this in the Bible. However, my belief (and those of others like me) is that because God created humans in His image and since he is eternal, we have that blessing too. He created animals too, but not in his image so they don't have the eternal aspect. I will try to find some verses that discuss this, but I'd also like to see some verses that show that animals do have souls and will be in heaven. BUT, it doesn't really make a difference what we believe about this. We'll all find out in the end. With or without animals, heaven will surely be a great place to be. (And truthfully, I love animals so much it would be a great joy to have them there!)

Anne - Thank you for being so lenient in the topics that we can discuss on this board. I will try not to offend anyone with my posts.
post #28 of 36

I really was going to stay out of this, but since I firmly believe that animals do have souls and they are in heaven, I am jumping in. There are many references in the Bible of man and beast and where the beast is obedient to God. There are also references in Revelation about the coming of the Lord and with the Lord comes a creature that is not man. Every living thing has a soul, and you don't need to go out and save an animal's soul, because unlike our soul, their soul is only corrupted by man. If you would like Bible verses check out these: Numbers 22-24 read those verses and then ask yourself why the donkey saw the angel of the Lord first before the man did? Because the donkey knew no sin and was able to see the angel with the eyes of the innocent. In verses 28-30 the Lord gives this dumb animal the gift of speech so she can address Balaam on her back and ask him questions. later in the new testament, 2 Peter 2:16 the prophet reminds his audience of this occurence and tells his audience that to accept this as the Word of God is to accept the faith that the Bible does not contradict itself.

Consider in Genesis chapter 8 when they speak of Noah and the animals that God wants saved from the floods. He talks in verse 5 about how He created the heavens and gave breath to the the people on it and spirit to those who walk in it. In genesis 7:21-23 He talks about how every living thing on the earth in "whose nostrils was the breath of spirit of life, died.

There are other examples consider Jonah and the whale, and how the Lord finally commanded the whale to regurgitate Jonah and on the Lord's command the whale did. But out of respect to Tigger and others who might tire of a theological discussion on this board, I will stop.

I will end by saying this. I think that the reason these type of animal abuse cases end up becoming theological in nature is simply because it is evil-vs- good. When faced with the appalling amount of animal mutilation and abuse, the natural thing is to try and remind myself that there is good in the world as well. Prayer is good, no matter what religion is offering it. Hope is good, love is good and to have faith that there is good in people is what I cling to.

I for one, once I cross that Bridge and go to heaven, if I do not find my Smudge, Tag. Hissy, Gulliver, or Bravo there in Heaven, well, that will diminish heaven in my estimation. I wouldn't want to be there if my animals were not there to greet me. And if any of this post appears to be abstract, please forgive me. I am not feeling well these days.
post #29 of 36
Thread Starter 
Here is something I thought about last night. See, there is always walks and fund raises for causes and awareness. March of Dimes walk is for prevention of babies being born with defects. Then there is the walk for breast cancer. O a special activity for the homeless. Or for any other human cause.
I thing in Utah they have a thing in April called Be Kind to Animals Week. I will try and see if they have sort of a walk, march or any kind of awareness to how animal abuse is really a serious manner. I think we should also write to our state lawmakers or make a petition of some kind to punish those that do harm to animals for fun rather than for a special purpose such as for meat. We should tell our state officials. I think in Utah they do have some kind of felony. I will see. I like the idea for a walk to raise money and awareness for the animals. I think in Utah there are many pet owners who love their animals.
post #30 of 36
I don't have time to look for the verses in the bible about it, but I'm sure someone will find them anyway - but it does say that animals do not have souls and that "souls" are the ones who go to heaven if they are saved. Spirits are different than souls, too. I don't want to make anyone angry - just pointing that out. I'm not going to be participating in this discussion any longer because it's true, the one thing that can not be discussed very well without getting "angry or bitter" is religion and politics. And that seems like what this has turned into - a religious discussion, not by anyone's fault, just the "nature" of the thread.

I just hope that those boys get what they deserve. And that's one thing I'm sure everyone hopes for.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: The Cat Lounge
TheCatSite.com › Forums › General Forums › The Cat Lounge › Very Disturbing