You can still give her chicken broth before the vet visit, then the don't have to fill your kitty up with a syringe before taking the sample....that's what I did.
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Reoccuring UTI-treatment question
- Thread starter jen
- Start Date
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- #22
Thanks everyone. I found a vet that we actually went to awhile back and they charge 29.00 for the visit and then whatever the urine tests and meds are gonna cost. The appointment is on sat at 4pm so hopefully all goes well.
Do I need to ask them to do a culture or whatever its called or should they just do that automatically if I say we want her tested for a UTI? I don't want to go in sounding like a know-it-all telling them what to do. But I want to make sure we know exactly for sure what is causing her to pee everywhere. Thanks.
Do I need to ask them to do a culture or whatever its called or should they just do that automatically if I say we want her tested for a UTI? I don't want to go in sounding like a know-it-all telling them what to do. But I want to make sure we know exactly for sure what is causing her to pee everywhere. Thanks.
Don't worry about how you sound...you are hiring them, and they should take your concerns and requests seriously. Tell them the history - symptoms she had last time before she was treated with clavamox, tell them how that urine sample was obtained, and if there were a culture and sensitivity done on that one or not, was there any blood with that previous test, etc. If you have a copy of that urinalysis test results, take a copy of it with you.
If it were me, I'd ask for a cystocentesis to be done, and yes, a culture and sensitivity unless the urine comes out looking totally clean (no bacteria, no white blood cells etc.). Tell them in detail what her diet is and all her symptoms (has she changed the frequency of how often she voids, is she grooming herself there a lot more than before, does she cry or bolt out of the litter box after going...anything you've observed will be of help to them).
Tell them your concerns, ask about crystals, cystitis...as I said, you are hiring them, don't feel like you have to worry about asking questions or asking for certain tests.
Yes, you need to ask because veterinarians are used to clients wanting to save money and don't usually offer a culture to start with. And ask specifically what tests they are going to do on the urine and how they are going to obtain the specimen so you know you are getting what you want the first time. Becky
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- #25
Ok so we just got back from the vet. I took both female cats in since lately we have had doubts as to which one has been peeing. The vet could not get a urine sample because he felt and their bladders were completely empty. So next time they pee I am going to soak it up in a syringe and bring the sample in and have it tested, the urinalysis and culture and all that.
He basically said he doesn't believe she has a UTI since both their bladders were empty and the peeing all over the basement is an ongoing thing. He gave us a Feliway diffuser and plug in and 5 days worth of amoxi just for now incase she does have an infection. He thinks its just stress though, but he will do they urinalysis and culture if we want it.
Do you think I should take in the sample to be tested as soon as I get it just to be safe? Or should I wait and see if the amoxi pills and feliway work?
He basically said he doesn't believe she has a UTI since both their bladders were empty and the peeing all over the basement is an ongoing thing. He gave us a Feliway diffuser and plug in and 5 days worth of amoxi just for now incase she does have an infection. He thinks its just stress though, but he will do they urinalysis and culture if we want it.
Do you think I should take in the sample to be tested as soon as I get it just to be safe? Or should I wait and see if the amoxi pills and feliway work?
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- #26
He also said that wet food is recommended because it has less ash then dry food. (What is ash?) He said the urinary tract health Nutro Max cat food we feed is good but wet would be the best because if not only for UTI's, then to help prevent diabetes later on in life.
He recommended c/d wet food or science diet wet food. I was thinking of just sticking to nutro wet food. Do you guys think that is a good idea?
He recommended c/d wet food or science diet wet food. I was thinking of just sticking to nutro wet food. Do you guys think that is a good idea?
Jen,
Ash is the mineral content of a food. In doing some quick research, on cats that have had flutd or are believed to be prone to it, a lower magnesium, lower ash food is recommended. I saw consistently a figure of Ash should not be more than 6% and Magnesium should be .5 to 1% tops.
Another factor can be making sure the ph of the urine is kept at an optimal level.
I am a bit confused here by your vet sending you home with 5 days of antibiotics. 5 days is not a complete course of tx, did he simply say if there is improvement then it was an infection, and come back to get another 5 days worth?? They now caution to not medicate cats with antibiotics if not really necessary, because antibiotics can become less effective for them with over use.
If it were me, I want a definitive answer...yes a urinary tract infection or no, and to know how the urinary ph is, if any struvite crystals are seen or not etc.
As to the foods recommended,there are times to use prescription foods, but if you have a choice, if your vet would allow you to use a comparable food - ask him what ash/magnesium content he wants you to have, and then go find that in a better quality food. Hills c/d has bha/bht and by-products, and is not my first choice of a food!
I'll ask our vet tech advisor Dr. Doolittle to comment, as I am truly puzzled with the 5 days of antibiotics...
Five days of an antibiotic might treat a very minimal infection, but may not be an adequate course. In people medicine I have read studies that show that seven days is usually adequate if taken perfectly, say every eight hours, but since most people don't take them perfectly and even skip doses, ten days are usually ordered. Just to be on the safe side.
I am amazed that your vet said he would do a culture on urine you collect at home. The urine you collect, even is you can get the cat to pee in a clean empty litter box, will be contaminated. You don't need to know what bacteria are in your litter box or on your hands or on kitty's feet, you want to know what is in her urine as it exists in her bladder. A cystocentesis is the only way to accomplish that. If your cat's bladder is empty the vet could keep her in a cage with no litter box for a few hours until she makes some urine. He could even give her a little sub q fluids, although that would make the urine more dilute and may not show if she has crystals, which you also want to know.
Ash is called that because of you heat a substance really hot and incinerate it, what is left is the non carbon based stuff, ashes, namely minerals. The amount of ash isn't as important as what minerals it is, for most cats having too much magnesium in the urine allows struvite crystals to form. Your vet probably has not studied nutrition since vet school since that is an old theory.
What I would do if for some reason I had to stick to this vet is bring the cat back and ask him to keep her until he can obtain an uncontaminated urine specimen and ask him to look at it under the microscope. If he sees white cells or bacteria he needs to do a culture.
I would feed a good quality canned food, including the Nutro pouches if that is what you like and your cat likes, and if the symptoms go away, then you are fine. If not then pursue the urine specimen. The urine will be more dilute within just a few hours to days of giving canned food, especially if you add a little water to each feed. Symptons should decrease within a few days if it is crystals caused by too concentrated urine.
I am amazed that your vet said he would do a culture on urine you collect at home. The urine you collect, even is you can get the cat to pee in a clean empty litter box, will be contaminated. You don't need to know what bacteria are in your litter box or on your hands or on kitty's feet, you want to know what is in her urine as it exists in her bladder. A cystocentesis is the only way to accomplish that. If your cat's bladder is empty the vet could keep her in a cage with no litter box for a few hours until she makes some urine. He could even give her a little sub q fluids, although that would make the urine more dilute and may not show if she has crystals, which you also want to know.
Ash is called that because of you heat a substance really hot and incinerate it, what is left is the non carbon based stuff, ashes, namely minerals. The amount of ash isn't as important as what minerals it is, for most cats having too much magnesium in the urine allows struvite crystals to form. Your vet probably has not studied nutrition since vet school since that is an old theory.
What I would do if for some reason I had to stick to this vet is bring the cat back and ask him to keep her until he can obtain an uncontaminated urine specimen and ask him to look at it under the microscope. If he sees white cells or bacteria he needs to do a culture.
I would feed a good quality canned food, including the Nutro pouches if that is what you like and your cat likes, and if the symptoms go away, then you are fine. If not then pursue the urine specimen. The urine will be more dilute within just a few hours to days of giving canned food, especially if you add a little water to each feed. Symptons should decrease within a few days if it is crystals caused by too concentrated urine.
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- #29
I think he offered the antibiotics just to make me happy. He realy doubted that she a has a UTI. That is probably why he didn't give a full dose. I will call on monday and ask about getting the urine another way because of contamination.
He explained about wanting a food with like 5% ash and low carbs, so he kinda knew what he was talking about there, but he was a very old man so he probably did go to vet school a long time ago. He suggested permanently switching to wet food too, which I was going to do anyway. It is going to take awhile for them to switch over because last time I tried just for fun, neither cat would touch it.
Oh and I just checked on the food that they eat. It is Nutro Max cat for urinary tract health. It says that the ash is 6% and the magnesium is .085.
This is what the bag says about U.T. Health--the most important factor for maintaining urinary tract health is cinsistant diet promoting slightly acidic urine pH. We use high levels of quality protein-many which are natural urine acidifiers that reduce urine pH and contribute to overall urinary tract health. Also provides a low dietary magnesium, to keep pH at safest range possible. Oh and this food doesn't contain BHA, BHT or ethoxyquin.
This all sounds good so should I still switch over to wet food? Are there a lot of carbs in this food? I am just a little unsure and I want to do the right thing, but every reason I have been given about switching to wet, this food I already feed them seems to contradict.
The first ingredients are chicken meal, corn gluten meal, wheat flour, ground rice, poultry fat (preserved with vitamin E, ground whole wheat and natural flavors. That seems like too many non-meat products. Is that ok if the other things are all good? Where do the carbs come in to the picture?
He explained about wanting a food with like 5% ash and low carbs, so he kinda knew what he was talking about there, but he was a very old man so he probably did go to vet school a long time ago. He suggested permanently switching to wet food too, which I was going to do anyway. It is going to take awhile for them to switch over because last time I tried just for fun, neither cat would touch it.
Oh and I just checked on the food that they eat. It is Nutro Max cat for urinary tract health. It says that the ash is 6% and the magnesium is .085.
This is what the bag says about U.T. Health--the most important factor for maintaining urinary tract health is cinsistant diet promoting slightly acidic urine pH. We use high levels of quality protein-many which are natural urine acidifiers that reduce urine pH and contribute to overall urinary tract health. Also provides a low dietary magnesium, to keep pH at safest range possible. Oh and this food doesn't contain BHA, BHT or ethoxyquin.
This all sounds good so should I still switch over to wet food? Are there a lot of carbs in this food? I am just a little unsure and I want to do the right thing, but every reason I have been given about switching to wet, this food I already feed them seems to contradict.
The first ingredients are chicken meal, corn gluten meal, wheat flour, ground rice, poultry fat (preserved with vitamin E, ground whole wheat and natural flavors. That seems like too many non-meat products. Is that ok if the other things are all good? Where do the carbs come in to the picture?
Excellent point, it makes it pointless to do a u/a c& s this week. You'd have to wait 2-3 weeks. I think that's the time frame after stopping meds before repeating a u/a.
You do what you can...but yes, I still think switching to a wet food diet would be better for the long run...though I do like Nutro's dry and do use their natural choice complete care weight management currently, as I slim down my guys (except my cats I have on a special diet). Those ingredients are awful, but I do like nutro's natural choice line better. If you go to the nutro site, you can find all the stats for each dry food, including the guaranteed analysis with ash and magnesium content.
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- #33
I havent started the antibiotics yet so I will hold off til i can call on monday and see what the vet says about the whole thing with the urine being contaminated if I get it at home. Do you think they take that into consideration already? maybe they have a way to figure out what is the bacteria from the litterbox and stuff. Just a thought.
I think canned nutro would be best because it has AWESOME ingredients and all the good things I mentioned that the dry food has.
I think canned nutro would be best because it has AWESOME ingredients and all the good things I mentioned that the dry food has.
Does the urination behaviour change while your cats are on antibiotics? I thought that is what I read in a previous post? If there are no accidents while they are being treated then isn't this likely an infection???
I am not sure about your luck with vets?! It seems to me that if symptoms disappear while on antibiotics then infection is likely. I can't understand your vets reluctance to culture the urine.
As others have said, a culture while on antibiotics may have no bacterial growth so you want to collect a sample before treatment. It is also very easy for a clinic to keep a cat in a kennel for a day with no litter pan! Usually after 4-5 hours the kitty will have a full bladder and a cysto can be performed.
As far as diet I agree with most of what has been said. For perscription diets I like Medi-cal. They use natural preservatives and I don't recall any by-products listed in the preventive ingredients. Check out the website for info:
www.medi-cal.ca
I am not sure about your luck with vets?! It seems to me that if symptoms disappear while on antibiotics then infection is likely. I can't understand your vets reluctance to culture the urine.
As far as diet I agree with most of what has been said. For perscription diets I like Medi-cal. They use natural preservatives and I don't recall any by-products listed in the preventive ingredients. Check out the website for info:
www.medi-cal.ca
Sorry, just checked out the ingredients list myself,
and the canned preventive does contain by-products. As many of you well know, I don't believe in the "all by-products are evil" school of thought, so I still think this is an excellent diet and I know it works!
Jen:
I posted something like this to the Dry vs. Canned thread. Try this it works for my tortie that has constant crystal problems:
Put your cat on canned food. Add some water to it also. Do not free feed your cat. Urine ph goes up when cats eat. I give mine three meals a day. If they don't eat it all right away, pick it up. I use baited water too when my cat gets crystals to dilute her urine. I just put a couple of smidgens of canned in a small saucer of water and wait until she laps it up before I give her any more food. It should be mostly water with just enough food floating in it to give it a good smell. This regimen always gets my cat over a bout of urinary ph.
I was tempted to try a meal or two of dry food every other day or so after my cat did so well on the regimen described above, and she came down with a bout of urinary crystals in about 2 weeks.
Try the method above and see if it stops your cat's problem. Usually crystals are self limiting using this method, but in case of a male cat, I would take him to the vet because they have a narrower urethra and can get a serious blockage.
KAte
I posted something like this to the Dry vs. Canned thread. Try this it works for my tortie that has constant crystal problems:
Put your cat on canned food. Add some water to it also. Do not free feed your cat. Urine ph goes up when cats eat. I give mine three meals a day. If they don't eat it all right away, pick it up. I use baited water too when my cat gets crystals to dilute her urine. I just put a couple of smidgens of canned in a small saucer of water and wait until she laps it up before I give her any more food. It should be mostly water with just enough food floating in it to give it a good smell. This regimen always gets my cat over a bout of urinary ph.
I was tempted to try a meal or two of dry food every other day or so after my cat did so well on the regimen described above, and she came down with a bout of urinary crystals in about 2 weeks.
Try the method above and see if it stops your cat's problem. Usually crystals are self limiting using this method, but in case of a male cat, I would take him to the vet because they have a narrower urethra and can get a serious blockage.
KAte
