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(2001 Thread) Plane just crashed into the world trade center - Page 5

post #121 of 331
I lighted a small oil lamp and placed it in a window, for passersby to see (as I'm presently out of candles). It's burning there still. Neighbors from across the street gathered in a circle with lighted candles. I've no flag just now, but I'll get one on pay day.


post #122 of 331
Unfortunately I couldn't light a candle 'cause in our apartment complex (which is mostly inhabited by Americans) no one lighted a candle or anything They probably didn't hear about it ! So I thought it wouldn't mean anything if I lighted a candle by myself only There was also wind outside; the candle wouldn't stay lit if I left it in the balcony

I heard on TV that the American government wanted every American (kind of a law, but not actually a law) to have American flags in their cars & houses.
post #123 of 331
Just wanted to let you know that we had three minutes of mourning with sirens on yesterday at 11 GMT I think. We are all with you...
post #124 of 331
Dear Dodo, Of course flying the American flag is not a law -- even sort of one! America is not a police state, which is why it is so open to terrorism, by the way -- because Americans don't generally go around informing on each other, or legislating what people do in privacy, unless it is criminal activity or is likely to cause harm to other citizens.

Mourning, national or private, is done with the heart, or should not be done at all. If you are concerned about wind, then make a big picture of a lit candle and paste is on a window pane. But really, many people find it difficult to display grief or mourning, and they prefer to do theirs in privacy.

post #125 of 331
I am still in complete and total shock about what happened on Tuesday. As soon as I heard (6pm Dubai time about 9am NYC time) I got straight onto the phone and tried to call my friend who goes past the towers at the same time that they were hit. I could not get through - I was frantic and fianlly I got a phone call from her at 4am my time - I was soooo pleased she was okay....such a great big relief. I am in the process of looking for another friend who is a fire fighter and a great guy. I have been waiting for 3 days now for his family to call and say hey Vic is fine he was sooooo tired he crawled into a cot at the fire house and fell asleep.

The westeners here and all finding it hard to comprehend what is happening and everyone is rushing to their embassies to register the fact that they are here just in case war breaks out and we have to be evacuated then at least people know how to get in contact with us, I am hoping that that will not happen though.

I just wanted to I dunno say I am thinking of everyone who has someone they love who they have missing at the moment....my prays are with all of you....
post #126 of 331
Peace, Amanda, doesn't look like immediate retaliation. I think your area has joined the US on the issue, Dubai having had terrorist problems in recent past. I'm a hoot and a hollar from where you are -- in Israel -- very tense here, very devastated by events, Palestinians and Jews alike giving blood, putting flowers, signing the Embassy books....

I have lived in the Middle East for almost 16 years, and I could never in my wildest imaginings believed that anyone would have done such a thing. We have a lot of individual terrorism here -- people get angry and band together and perform violent acts (and Palestinians are not the only terrorists). But the scope and strategic development behind this terrible atrocity is something very different. One does, however, have to remember the careful execution of the Nairobi bombings a few years ago. I suppose we should have see something like this as the natural extension.

bin Laden has been trying since the 90s to purchase atomics. That's something to shudder about.

I had a surprising reaction after being ex-pat for over 25 years now. Suddenly yesterday I felt too far away from everything -- as if I needed to see for myself that none of my relatives had been under those towers -- and I started to cry like a lost child. All nonsense, of course, since I have very few relatives in America now, and in any case not in New York. Terrible, inhuman, unforgiveable. McCann said in a moment of pure anger (and I don't even like the man, but I quote him here) -- We are coming after you. God may have mercy, but we won't.

Just for a while, I felt tha anger so powerfully that I wrote down his words. I will get my balance, as you will, but, Lord, this is a hard moment in my 65 years.

May we all be safe and well,
post #127 of 331
Not only do I feel sorry for the families & friedns of the victims, but I feel sorry for the people down working @ Ground Zero..... I can't imagine how they must be feeling, especially some of the grizzly findings they have been talking about all week on the news. It's extremely sad how some of these victims' may never be found! I find it so sad..... There was a link to Newsweek & one of the editors did a story on how not only did these terrorists take away these peoples' lives, they also took away their deaths! Those people died such horrifying & tragic deaths.

No one (except maybe the mastermind behind this & his group) deserves to die the way the victim's did!
post #128 of 331
I am an American who lives in the UK, and I can tell you the support here for America is undying. The UK will be there.

Thoughts and prayers go out to the victims of the attacks, and their families and friends. *Be strong*.....we will stick together.

Best Wishes
post #129 of 331
I was on the runway ready for take off from Chicago to Portland, OR when our plane was stopped and we were told all flights in the US were cancelled. We had no idea until people started using their cell phones.

I saw the first images 2 hours later from a hotel television. How horrifying.

I finally got home last night after day after day of cancelations. I watched a lot of TV and heard the horrible news that Chicago has two terrorism schools there. The arabs teach young children how to become suicide bombers and too hate America. There has been nothing America can do about it, because of freedom of speech. Hopefully now they will have something to do about it.

I am sure the leaders of our world will think carefully of every choice they make. I stand behind them 100% and support every choice made in this situation.

Those poor victims and all of there families. For everybody in America we are forever changed.
post #130 of 331
I am also glad they were able to get all the planes down fast enough. I would hate to think how many terrorists might have actually been aboard other flights and how many more acts of terrorism would of happened. What they managed to pull off was horrifying enough
post #131 of 331
post #132 of 331
Found this from one of my my email lists. Written by a 17 year old

The apparently false sense of security possessed by so many Americans has been ripped from their collective hands and shattered like the glass of the World Trade Center, a loss of only slightly less significance than the lives taken by the horrific attacks executed by the ignorant followers of an even more shallow and weak minded evil.

The innocence of so many was raped away by the foolish acts of a few, and the only intentions possessed by those who have survived is to counter these attacks with more violence and destruction. The blind hatred of any medium-brown skinned American that has inundated this country is truly frightening, and the words of the director of domestic terrorism of the FBI only perpetuates this violation of the founding principles of the US.

As horrible as these events have been, I find myself casting condescending looks at those who find it necessary to take out their anger on an entire people as opposed to those truly at fault. I believe it to be incredibly unfortunate that so much of society has opened its doors to a practice so formerly condemned by so many in this country.

The loss of life has been tragic, however, I think that to be obvious, and the other effects of this attack not so much so. The leaders of this country have seemed to completely neglect the possibility of the end of humanity by nuclear and biological warfare, and have failed to address the concerns of those in touch enough with reality to be worried about such a situation. Where the first concern of our nation's leaders should be the safety of its people, revenge has seemed to taken precedence. By ignoring the possible implications of a modern day war we are opening ourselves to more of what has occurred.

It astonishes me to see how much confidence is possessed by our president and military leaders who are sworn to protect all who were murdered. But it is only ignorance and fear masked by confidence, and the expression of utter terror on our newly informed president's face indicated his true uncertainty about the fate of the nation. It would be comforting to think that the goal of such a "civilized" people would be world peace, but it is overly apparent to me that it is not, and the lives of all citizens of the world are bound to change just as much as the skyline of New York City.

Justice must be carried out, but I'm worried about the recklessness of those in charge of seeing that it is. It is a fine line between justice and revenge that we must follow, a line I can only pray we are capable of walking. As of now, the only thing I'm certain of is my true sorrow for all of those killed, and my sympathy to the
loved ones who will no longer be with them. I don't claim to know the right solution to this, for I fear that there is none. I simply wish to express my hope that people will not abandon the beliefs they have held before such a tragedy occurred, and that the idea of world peace remains an untarnished focal point of desire in the hearts and minds all noble enough to hold such a desire.

Copyright © 2001 Preston Duncan
Date published: September 13, 2001
post #133 of 331
That was a very touching piece, and you're right Hissy, I never would have had to write on this topic when I was 17. Life was a lot more simple back then. (Gosh, I sound old!)

However, I just want to say that I support President Bush and his leadership. I don't think Bush is ignorant or terrified. I believe he's horrified by what has happened and by what he's going to have to do as a consequence of the actions of others. World peace would be a wonderful thing, but we absolutely must root out this evil and destroy it. There's no way to guarantee the safety of our people unless the terrorist activity is stopped. (I realize that our safety will probably be compromised in the meantime, but this is just a fact of our new life since last Tuesday.)

I do agree with the writer about how terrible our new-found prejudice is of people of Arabic descent. It's embarrassing to say the least and anyone exhibiting this behavior is just showing how truely ignorant they are.

I firmly believe that Bush will not be reckless in the defense of our nation. I'm thankful he's a man who knows God and will seek His guidance in these difficult times.
post #134 of 331
that I do not agree with all that this boy wrote, but I can understand his point of view, and I personally think he is terrified but trying not to show it. I have never in my life wanted to support a war, but now it is different.This was unprovoked, and chilling in its execution. It it time for us to stand up and say "ENOUGH" The point in sharing the essay was to show how much the world has changed from when we knew it.......

post #135 of 331
Good point, Hissy. I agree, it's a far cry from our life at 17. I'm sure teenagers, especially those so close to 18, are really scared. I know I am, and I have the benefit of age and maturity to help.

I was very impressed by this boy's writing though. Very thought out and well written.
post #136 of 331
Dear Dawn (and Hissy -- and everyone) -- The essay is a very good one for a 17-year old -- passionate, good sentiments, and humanist. But it ias also very uninformed, and shows the age of the boy. In ten years or so, he will be embarrassed. But A for effort.

The certainty expressed that the Bush government's only response is violence is, surprisingly, shared by a very large number of people, judging by chat lines and write-ins to BBC and CNN.

I would never have voted for Bush. I am on the very liberal fringe of the Democratic Party, and I stood squarely behind Gore as the best alternative. But I think Bush has managed this affair very well. The problem is that terrorists are fanatics -- the True Believers of Eric Hoffer -- and there is no remourse, no second thoughts, no compassion, no limits when they want to achieve a goal. One could say that they were functionally insane and inhuman. If we were a little more technologically advanced, we could set out to capture them and then repair the problems that permit them to be so totally without humanity -- perhaps it is a genetic defect that causes the True Believer. Perhaps it is a chemical imbalance. For sure it is not normal.

But what do you do with people who become both murderously and suicidally insane? You could lock them up in a padded cell, but endless new terrorist groups would create equal disasters in order to demand their release.

If you have a beloved dog that contracts rabies, you must kill him, because there is no cure, and because, as much as he has loved you in the past, he is driven by the disease to try to bite you, your children, your neighbors, totally blind to all human relationships and rational thought. At our present time in technological growth, I am afraid that is the only solution to most terrorists. These are not sad, disadvantaged people who act out of desparation. Many of these people, as it is transpiring, are from wealthy or priviledged families. There is just something wrong with their minds.

The decision to respond to this atrocity by attacking terrorists wherever they are in the world is exactly BECAUSE Bush's government is trying to ensure future security for Americans -- and indeed the world. There is no way to allow smallpox or bubonic plague to exist because we feel sorry for the evolutionary future of the bacteria (which some scientists now think are somehow sentient on some very low level), and terrorism is a plague that is growing in cleverness and volume. Humankind must wipe it out, or end up being slaves to its perpetuators.

Nor is anyone in any government of the United States unaware of chemical, germ, or nuclear dangers. And the quicker we stamp out the terrorists -- who would have no compuction at all about using these tools -- the better. This is an age when most people are far more knowledgeable about what could possibly happen. Both the Soviet Union and the United States and her allies had all of these tools at their disposal for the entire Cold War. They were never used. But they WERE used by Saddam Hussein (another fanatic, co-incidentally from the Arab world), and by a Japanese fanatic religious sect (Saran gas), and not so long ago --- While it is known that bin Laden has been trying to buy a nuclear weapon since the mid-1990s.

I do not believe in giving carte blanche to governments, and I am constantly suspicious of the individual motives of government officials in any country. I am a constant criticizer of anything that violates personal freedom. But it is only the inexperienced who would think that Bush has shown either fear or poor logic in this situation. As I say, I don't like the man. I don't like his politics, and I don't like his policies while he was governor of Texas. But he has shown good steady nerves in this ghastly situation, and I think, with his father and his very capable advisors, that he will do very well in such a sensitive enterprise. He consulted the UN and NATO on the first day, consulted with America's two friends in the Middle East -- Jordan and Egypt -- and with all of America's principle European allies. He did not go half cocked and bomb anyone, and Rumsfeld pulled everyone up short about leaking sensitive information, so that Bush can negotiate quietly with a lot of nervous countries. Most of the Arab countries back his initiative, and many are already cooperating on sharing information about bin Laden's network Al Quida. Where do you think America is getting all that massive foreign cooperation to arrest suspects and initiate investigations within their own countries, trace the movements throughout the Middle East of the principle suspects and of the hijackers? There is global unanimity, with a small number of exceptions, that terrorism must be stamped out. Bush is not rushing into the first pyrotechnic demonstration of power. He is moving slowly, because he knows -- and I admit I didn't think he was that smart -- that this "war" he has declared is something that will span many years, many countries, and require unconventional tools and planning that belong more to intelligence ventures with special forces in tow rather than frontal attacks. Frontal attacks grind civilians to death between opposing forces. He is not proposing that. He is proposing more of a surgical war, with specific targets and small, well-trained forces and quick strikes.

This has all been shaping up for a long time. To save ourselves, we must all -- worldwide -- adopt a new way of looking at risks and responses. Not all terrorists will be caught, and there will be casualties like what happened in New York scattered in our futures. But if we do not act now, we will have no future security of any sort for generations. We have no choice if we mean to survive as a species.

I doubt very much if all this talk about "using everything in our arsenal" translates into using atomics. But the proof of all this will be in how we see it all by this time next year. If you are the praying kind, I suggest we do a lot of that in months to come.

FINALLY, I am appalled by the viciousness of the growing wave of persecution of tan to brown suspected "Arabs" in the US. In Israel, I live under the constant knife of suicide bombers, drive-by shooters, and other terrorist threats. But I would never make the mistake of assuming all Palestinians or citizens of other Arab areas to be terrorists -- even though they might be with better cause. I cannot imagine why hatred has turned so swiftly to Arab and Muslim Americans. bin Laden's terrorist group represents a certain view of fundamentalist Islam, but most Arabs in the world do not agree with his interpretation of their religion, nor with the Taleband, who are a blight on all of humanity. Where are the neighbors of these Arab Americans, and why are they not banding together to make sure such violent actions can't take place in their neighborhoods? Why aren't they joining to prevent crazy people from throwing firebombs at perfectly law-abiding American citizens or beating up old men or running their cars through the doors of mosques? Not all Arabs are even Muslim -- many in Israel are Christians -- and many, many Muslims are not Arabs -- think of Indonesian, the many Muslims on the Indian subcontinent, and all the Asian countries that are Muslim, or of the African Muslim nations... And what is an "Arab" supposed to look like anyway? People in the US are beating up Sikhs, for God's sake (who are not Muslims or Arabs), and any other brown or tan-skinned people that they see on the street. Shameful. And shameful that communities do not form themselves into watch groups to see that such things do not happen during this time of national crisis.

If all Arabs or Muslims were terrorists, believe me, all the white-skins and non-Muslims in the world would be dead by now. Spread the word. And protect your neighbors. Let them know you care about their safety -- that they do not have to stand alone in this disgusting display of hatefulness. This is way the persecution of the Jews started under the Nazi terrorists.

Think love and peace,
post #137 of 331
Many of you are probably aware of these web sites already, but just in case you're not. . . .

District of Columbia Homepage

Federal Bureau of Investigation


New York Center for Animal Care and Control

NYC.gov Always Open

Welcome to the White House

After the Triangle Waist Company fire at New York in 1911, the following cartoon appeared. The question needs an answer, once again.

post #138 of 331
The following article was written and posted by a New Yorker who is a message-board member of Car Parts, Bottles and Cutlery, a web site for fans of Björk Guðmundsdóttir.

Today was the first sort of semi-regular weekday since. But there wasn't anything regular about it.

I mean, the Stock Market took the biggest single day fall in history, and nobody really even mentioned it. I remember back in 1989 when they pre-empted the Geraldo show I was appearing on to give word that the Dow Jones fell over 400 points. Never did get to see that episode of Geraldo.

As I walked around the city, doing my "usual" weekday jobs and errands, there was a different sense. The people who knew each other seemed closer. And those that didn't, might have seemed a bit more distant.

There's a distinct sense that we don't want to disturb each other. Truck drivers don't honk their horns. Cabbies are keeping an extremely low profile.

But most of all, it's quiet. You don't hear the chatter of tourists' voices on the street. There are fewer cars and buses on the avenues. You don't hear the discussions on subways. People don't make eye contact now, not so much because they're afraid of you, but more because they're afraid they'll start crying.

Even seasoned newsman Dan Rather burst into tears twice on the Letterman show. This ache is deep. Some hack dentist pulled out our wisdom teeth with an unsterilized wrench and no novocain. We're still reeling. In fact, it's so painful we don't even know how painful it is.

Of course, the American flag is everywhere. Store windows, street signs, the clothing we wear. And too, are the pictures of the missing, everywhere. People who worked in the WTC lived all over town.

Another sad state of affairs: many of those workers lived alone. Their dogs and cats are now orphans, as people scramble to find new homes for these pets, preventing them from following their masters.

Baseball, just back today, was being played under sleepwalking conditions. The Mets paid tribute to the valiant rescue workers by coming on the field wearing NYFD, NYPD and NYEMT baseball caps, before switching to their official uniform caps to play. The Mets expressed a desire to actually wear these caps during their first home game, to be played in a few days; a small tribute to the colossal effort these professionals have given to our city.

We're taking baby steps now, as we continue with the business of the living. The quiet is the quiet of a library or a religious house. Muted and hushed, no one is ready to speak at full volume, especially when some five thousand voices have been silenced.

When I hear the phrase, "Time heals all wounds," well, I look around and see a city, a country, a world that's desperately seeking a little more time.

We will get through this.

We will.

post #139 of 331
Re: hate crimes against tan-skinned "Arab terrorists"

It is happening everywhere, even here in Ottawa, Canada where I thought we were, as a city, quite accepting of our wonderful diversity of cultures. In my suburban neighbourhood, I, as a Caucasian, am a minority. Even so, since last Tuesday, a so-called "tan-skinned" teen was swarmed by a group of other teens and beaten to unconciousness, houses graffiti-ed, verbal attacks on the street and on the telephone... it makes me sick.

If it was not so distasteful, it would be laughable. These people are *so ignorant* they can't even do their hate crimes against the "correct" group of people, the group that these attacks have made them feel the they have the right to be prejudiced against.

What is even worse is that the reaction to this is making people suspicious right back at me. Several houses of worship of various non-Christian denominations that had received threats closed their doors to non-members. If I had wanted to join a friend at a worship or peace service, or even a fellowship meeting, in one of these, I could not, simply because I was not of that religion. While I understand their security concerns, it still hurts, and it makes me very, very sad.

post #140 of 331
Dear JulieB -- Don't bemoan the situation. Try to reach out to your neighbors, even if it doesn't get immediate response. You can do this in a number of ways:

Write letters to local newspapers about how you feel.

Write letters to the religious community centers and houses of worship directly, saying how you feel and that you would be happy to take part in any activity that they may need help with ( for example ---- neighborhood watches, visits to local government officials, a delegation to discuss the situation with the police, picking up children at their schools so they don't have to ride home on a public bus or walk some distance unsupervised --).

Mobilize the "white" people in your neighborhood to offer collective help and to write letters.

Be vocal wherever you go.

Speak out within your own religious community.

Encourage your own religious leadership to reach out directly to the embattled communities in your neighborhood -- minister to minister, as it were.

I spent most of my life, from my 12th year working in black-white groups in the American south from the 1950 on, and bridges are hard, but rarely impossible, to build. They must be built, or else minority or persecuted groups build walls around themselves and become paranoid. And then the bad guys win.

Your heart is in the right place. But I expect that God gives brownie points to those who get their hands dirty in His work.

Pray for peace, love, and compassion. And above all, pray for understanding.
post #141 of 331
You're absolutely right... I have been vocal, but now is the time to put my money where my mouth is.

post #142 of 331
Mr. Cat, Thank you for posting that letter. It is sadening to read and so true of my thoughts. I don't think people can even prepare to comprehend the pain that this has left on our hearts and souls. Living here on the West coast makes me feel desensitized to it all. Having to see those horrible images, and smelling that smell everyone talks about. I don't know how New Yorkers do it. They truly are amazing individuals!

You here about the hate crimes almost everyday now. How embarrassing for Americans. For anybody. We can't tollerate and we most definitely can't learn from our mistakes. Some of these Arab Americans being attacked and bullied have never even been to the Middle East. There are a lot of ignorant people in the world.

Catspride: Thank you for your words. I have always enjoyed reading your thoughts on many different subjects, and this is no different.
post #143 of 331
Written by Graham Nash of Cosby, Stills, Nash & Young and written for the victims of the Oklahoma bombing, but the words are so appropriate for what has happened on 9-11






post #144 of 331
Hi guys...

I just wanted to say I have not said anything here because I cannot read this thread. It is too painful for me.

I do want you all to know that I wish everyone going through the pain healing and love. Just wanted you all to know that just becuase I am not reading this thread, does not mean I don't care. I am just not ready.

post #145 of 331
This has been such a painful two weeks. I know someday, New York will be as beautiful as it was before. Instead of thinking of sad songs, why not put Frank Sinatra's New York? I love New York City and I will miss the Twin Towers. But we still have the Empire State Building and The Statue of Liberty. And we still have our freedom. The damn terrorists can't take that away from us! I hope they burn forever in the fires of hell. I am a catholic and belive in forgiveness, but this is too much!!!!! I was a born mexican but I loe America and all that it stands for!!!! I AM HAPPY TO BE AN AMERICAN!!!
post #146 of 331
I am having a meltdown.... ...

I keep hearing about biochemical attacks...... I can't keep it together...

sorry to vent
post #147 of 331
Oh, Val, I'm so sorry you're having such a hard time. I can't even imagine what it must be like to be living in NY right now. The only thing that keeps me going is my faith. Be strong!
post #148 of 331
Hang in there! Remember, there will all manner of innuendo, gossip and rumors during this time. Such scare tactics are most often the work of the journalistic media, who know that fear sells their product. Do not be taken in by such stories! The dissemination of frightful "what if" scenarios by the media amounts to giving aid and comfort to the enemy, in this case global terrorism. You will be safe, now more than ever! The officials of government have set aside political differences and are making a maximum effort to safeguard every one of us. Yes, we're in the midst of a national emergency; but we must all believe in the inevitability of a positive outcome.

post #149 of 331
Mr. Cat:

I far from believe that we are safe now. Do you think that a group who would mastermind the events of 9/11 doesn't have other ideas in the works, ready to catch us off guard in another area?

Today on National Public Radio, I listened to just how unprepared we are in the area of vaccines to prepare for a biological assault. If anthrax spores were released over a city, more than a million would die. There is also talk of infecting more "suicide" terrorists with smallpox and letting them roam crowded urban areas just as they are the most contagious.

I believe that this country has a long and hard challenge ahead of it.
post #150 of 331
Mr. Cat, & Dawn, thanks.

Deb, yes, this is what I am afraid of.
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