New to forum, have some questions

[craftydoodle]

Hi there! My name is Nicole and I am new to this forum. I am a SAHM to my beautiful dd Taylor, and have quite a few pets... We have a dog, two cats and six kittens. The six kittens were a litter that a feral cat had which neighbors called animal control on (which of course we couldn't let happen). We took them in at ten days old, bottle fed them for weeks, and seven months later still have our loving babies. We have grown so attached and can not give them away now, as originally planned. We do have a few problems though, which I would like to ask your advice with...

1. My one cat (Holly) does not like the kittens at all. Holly was the baby in the past. She hisses at them, attacks them, tried to scratch one of their eyes out along with Cinnamon's nose and throat, it is just non stop. We have had them separated since day one, as the babies have the run of our garage, and we flip flop them out so we can minimize problems. I would really like to integrate them, but don't know where to start, and the safest way to try it. Any advice or books out there that I can consult?

2. Our next problem is a major one. We had the two boys neutered on April 16, so we thought we were okay. Well, one of the kittens is pregnant (I am pretty sure of it). I honestly did not know they could get pregnant at six months of age, as I was told in the past to wait to neuter or spay until they were six months! I feel so irresponsible. Anyway we of course will let her have the litter, and plan on finding homes for them at eight weeks of age when they can be weaned from their momma. Here are my questions

a. Because she is pregnant by her brother, is there a risk for anything that I should be aware of?

b. Are there any good books out there that deal with pregnant/labor for cats?

c. What do I have to do for her, to make her comfortable during delivery and thereafter?

d. She is pretty round right now, and I am assuming that she is at least 40 days. Her nipples are starting to protrude and have a milky substance below them. How far does she have to go, round about?

e. Should I take her to the vet for a checkup, or will he be able to tell me the same things I already know?

f. Is she at risk giving birth so young?

As you can tell, this is really eating at me, because I had no clue and feel awful that this happened to my poor little Piglet. And then it is the explaining to my daughter how she got pregnant by her brother! Oh, that will be a fun coversation!

Thanks in advance for all your help and advice on these issues... I love my pets as if they are my children, and want to make sure all of them are okay. Thanks again!

Nicole "craftydoodle"

 

[valanhb]

Welcome to the site Nicole!

Since the biggest part of your post is about the pregnancy questions, I'm going to move this to Health & Nutrition. I would suggest that you start a new post in Behavior with the first question so that can be addresses separately (but I'm sure people will answer both if they can

).

 

[hfrodoc]

If this kitten is about 40 days. She has another 25 to go. Cat's are pregnant for about 65 days of gastation.

If you have any other cats.....please neuter and spay them all now. My little frodo was nuetured at 8 weeks. (which I believe is the ealiest a vet will do it)

About the risks, yes. There are risks. Expect deformities.
My friend got two kittens from the same litter, a boy and a girl. The kitten got pregnant, had one kit...but it's legs were deformed, and the mother would not nurse it, because she knew it was deformed. The kit died.

I have a cat encyclopedia that explains everything you need to do to help a cat before she delivers. She will most often find a hiding place to deliver her kits, when she does that, make sure to put some towels where ever that is so that you don't have stained carpet or furniture...maybe even put a little box in that place. Right before she is ready to deliver, she may have a loss of appetite, or be more aggressive than usual, watch for these signs. Check on her every now and then in her hiding place, but make sure she doesn't feel vialated, and keep the other cats away from her.

This is all of my advice. Please be careful next time and with this next litter, because you know now that they can all be nuetured at 8 weeks and spayed at 10 weeks. If you don't believe me ask a vet.

Good Luck

 

[craftydoodle]

Thanks! I just posted over there too.

I appreciate your help.

 

[craftydoodle]

Both boys are neutered now, so there aren't any more chances of pregnancy. We are trying to do the girls two at a time, because it is costly with six, so most important to us was getting the boys fixed first to prevent what already happened. Unfortunately we did it too late. I had two vets tell me to wait until six months as it was recommended. Obviously I was misinformed.

It was not my intention at all for this to happen, as I was going on advice from two separate vets, so I really thought we were in the right for it. If it was just a few weeks sooner we would have been safe. That's what I am kicking myself about. I really feel awful about the entire thing.

Thanks for your advice, I appreciate it. Are the encyclopedias like that available at pet stores like petsmart, or should I order from Amazon? Just curious which route you took.

 

[hfrodoc]

You could try at your local petsmart. It might be cheaper there, and you wouldn't have to pay for shipping. Or if you go to http:www.askjeeves.com you might be able to find out all the information you need without any expenses at all. Good luck, and I hope her kits turn out alright.

I'll say a pray for em!

 

[cilla]

Craftydoodle, it all depends where you live as to how old the kitten is before the vet will spay/neuter.My vet here in the UK refused to spay/neuter my cats until they were six months old, and this general practice in UK. Don't know where you live though.

 

[hfrodoc]

I'm sorry. I didn't mean to sound rude about the spaying and nuetering thing. If you live in a small town like I do, they may not have what it takes to spay and nueter before six months. But I got my kitten from phoenix, and they were able to do it at eight weeks, and they said they could do females at ten weeks. I suppose it depends on the location like Cilla said. Sorry if I came across as rude...I'm just and advit of keeping the streets cat free.

 

[craftydoodle]

Thank you so much! I will try petsmart Monday. They are always great and knowledgable in there.

 

[craftydoodle]

I am near Orlando Florida USA.

Thanks for the info and support! I really feel so bad about the whole thing. My poor little baby is having a baby and that isn't fair to her.

 

[craftydoodle]

Amazingly enough, I am right outside Orlando. So, you think they would know more since we are in a bigger area. And you didn't come across as rude, I understand being an advocate for pets. They can't voice their concerns, so we have to for them. No hard feelings at all.

We have been involved with getting some of the ferals spayed around here, because we don't want to be in the same situation again. I am a sucker for these poor babies, and will help them out however I can. But unfortunately I did wrong by my one baby.

 

[kumbulu]

The fact that she is so very, very young and the kittens are a product of siblings mating, means that the mom-cat could be in serious trouble when she gives birth. As has been said in the posts above, many of the kittens may have serious birth defects and if they are born that way, it is your responsibility to take them to the vet and have them humanely euthanised. Nicole, as sad and as shocking as this sounds, would you consider spaying this pregnant kitten, even though she is pregnant? I am very worried for her and her kittens.

 

[craftydoodle]

I thought the same thing, and don't want to lose her. I really need to take her to the vet and figure out the best option. I really am scared that something is going to happen to her, or that she will have a real tough time with the kitties. Thanks for your advice, I appreciate it.

 

[hfrodoc]

Can you do that with a pregnant cat? Isn't just like getting a historectomy in humans?

 

[vettechstudent]

Originally Posted by HFrodoC

Can you do that with a pregnant cat? Isn't just like getting a historectomy in humans?

Yes,she can have the cat spayed if she chooses to.They will abort the kittens,but sometimes this is what is best all around.

They take out the uterus and ovaries.

 

[vettechstudent]

sorry..double post

 

[hfrodoc]

Yes, it may be best in this case, since they are most likely deformed.

 

[weatherlight]

If you're going to abort the kittens, the sooner the better the way I see it. Abortion is hard, but it's even harder when you know they have a developed nervous system and are really kittens with feelings. It will also be easier if it's not done in the later stages.

This is about dog breeding, but a lot applies to cats... http://www.pbrc.net/breeding2.html They have a nice scary list

 

[pat]

First, welcome to TCS, I think you will find this is a very supportive group of folks, who all adore cats

I would most definitely have a vet see her, depending on what your decision is whether or not to let this pregnancy progress, sooner is better than later.

I will share just my past experience in two instances of oops brother-sister mating. Many years ago (the '80's!) this happened with two of my cats...both were young adults, the kittens were normal, healthy and went on to have long healthy lives.

The second experience, a litter born at a friends, after she too thought neutering the male sibling at 6 months would be enough until she could get all the girls spayed. It was too late...one girl developed pyometra and spontaneously aborted, the second went to term and had 8 kittens, all visibly normal, two that died, one of a pneumonia, and one due to her inexperience and nervousness as a first time mom (note: it was her only time, she was fixed afterwards as had always been planned). The surviving 6 are now 3'ish I believe,(and all were altered) and healthy so far as I know (no longer in touch with this person).

So...yes, deformities are possible, so are normal, healthy kittens...but also possible is that this immature girl may have trouble giving birth..and that needs to be discussed with your vet - whether or not her pelvis is likely to be adequate, if she might be more predisposed to a problem such as poor quality contractions (uterine inertia). Both of these problems would be very serious and you'd likely be looking at a c/section (based on my experience with uterine inertia in cats, rarely does the vet giving pitocin(aka oxytocin) work well enough to avoid a surgical delivery.

Hard decision, and I can absolutely understand how this happened (there really are still vets who do not do early spay and neuter)...I know this community will support you as you consider the options.

 

[craftydoodle]

Thanks. I appreciate your help and input on this.

Unfortunately I think she is pretty far along at this point, but am taking her to the vet this week to get her checked out.