Need help identifying this beautiful lady's pattern

isenhart · Mar 28, 2017

Hey fellas,

Just curious if any of you can help identify the pattern of my precious little girl, JamJams.

DSCF1976.JPG

isenhart
May 30, 2015

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isenhart
May 31, 2015

DSCF1967.JPG

isenhart
May 31, 2015

The third photo is her mamma. Unfortunately, I don't have one of the father but I suspect he's a grey tiger which I saw every once and a while when momma bolted out of the house when in heat several years ago. Fortunately, both are now fixed and are indoor kitties.

The common characteristics which JamJams gets from her mamma are those cute little nose dots, light blue eyes as well as the flame/seal coloring in certain spots but other than that.... she has no recognizable pattern. Her tail is more solid with calico coloring but that's about it. The closest I can think of is a calico harlequin but that's only a guess and I'm not sure if such a pattern even exists.

So, any help would be great. I need something other than confused bandit-cat when I describe her to others.

Much appreciation!

Kieka · Mar 28, 2017

My guess is a calico pointed cat.

Calico would be her pattern if she didn't have the pointed gene. The pointed gene causes the blue eyes and faded looking coloring over her body through a form of albinism. Mom is a flame point so she got the orange gene and pointed gene from Mom. Dad had to carry the pointed gene too for her to show it (although he didn't have to show it).

@1CatOverTheLine what do you think?

1CatOverTheLine · Mar 28, 2017

Kieka said:
My guess is a calico pointed cat.

Calico would be her pattern if she didn't have the pointed gene. The pointed gene causes the blue eyes and faded looking coloring over her body through a form of albinism. Mom is a flame point so she got the orange gene and pointed gene from Mom. Dad had to carry the pointed gene too for her to show it (although he didn't have to show it).

@1CatOverTheLine what do you think?

Yep - the point gene is carried in the same place as is temperature sensitive albinism, and the blue eyes are gene-linked, so there's certainly some ~~evil~~ lovely Siamese in her background, and as Keika has pointed out the O / B colours are gender-linked, and Dad could have passed the recessive c^s on as well.

There seems to be a faint pattern under the mask that gives the impression of a Tortie Point - now recognised as one of the (36 !) Breed Colours of Siamese, Showshoes and Balinese.

She's a beautiful cat with that half-mask and piercing aquamarine eyes (Keika's avatar is her own beautiful boy, Link, with an eye coluration closer to sapphire, and mine - Moo Shu Snowshoe - is down around Lapis blue), and JamJams has enough Siamese heritage to either pass for or actually be a pet quality Snowshoe.

.

PushPurrCatPaws · Mar 28, 2017

Isenhart said:
Hey fellas,

Just curious if any of you can help identify the pattern of my precious little girl, JamJams.

DSCF1976.JPG

isenhart

May 30, 2015

She is so lovely! What a character.

Isenhart said:
The third photo is her mamma. Unfortunately, I don't have one of the father but I suspect he's a grey tiger which I saw every once and a while when momma bolted out of the house when in heat several years ago. Fortunately, both are now fixed and are indoor kitties.
...

Though this doesn't help to figure out JamJams' genetics, I just wanted to add that, don't forget, kittens in a litter can have more than one father.

You can have quite a mix in a litter, depending on how much you were able to be a "gatekeeper" for momma's boyfriends. If momma cat got outside when in heat, she could easily have had several interactions with males. What were the other markings on the other kittens in momma's litter, when JamJams was born?

As an example, my cat Milly is a black and white tuxedo, but one of her brothers was a gray and white tuxedo with the same small build, her sister was a long haired gray and white tuxedo with a larger build, and this was her other brother shown below, and the largest of the bunch:

Littermate-of-Milly.jpg

PushPurrCatPaws
Mar 28, 2017

isenhart · Mar 28, 2017

1CatOverTheLine said:
Yep - the point gene is carried in the same place as is temperature sensitive albinism, and the blue eyes are gene-linked, so there's certainly some ~~evil~~ lovely Siamese in her background, and as Keika has pointed out the O / B colours are gender-linked, and Dad could have passed the recessive c^s on as well.

There seems to be a faint pattern under the mask that gives the impression of a Tortie Point - now recognised as one of the (36 !) Breed Colours of Siamese, Showshoes and Balinese.

She's a beautiful cat with that half-mask and piercing aquamarine eyes (Keika's avatar is her own beautiful boy, Link, with an eye coluration closer to sapphire, and mine - Moo Shu Snowshoe - is down around Lapis blue), and JamJams has enough Siamese heritage to either pass for or actually be a pet quality Snowshoe.

.

Kieka said:
My guess is a calico pointed cat.

Calico would be her pattern if she didn't have the pointed gene. The pointed gene causes the blue eyes and faded looking coloring over her body through a form of albinism. Mom is a flame point so she got the orange gene and pointed gene from Mom. Dad had to carry the pointed gene too for her to show it (although he didn't have to show it).

@1CatOverTheLine what do you think?

Thanks for all the in-depth information you two!

I never even knew there was such a thing as a Snowshoe but definitely something I will be doing my homework on since I am always interested in learning more about my girls as well as our pets in general.

So would it be fair for me to say she's a Snowshoe in spite of her broken-up pattern or would it be more like a specific Tortie Point?

Thanks, again!

isenhart · Mar 28, 2017

PushPurrCatPaws said:
DSCF1689.JPG

isenhart

May 31, 2015

10649658_10154617699085195_529855893451575880_n.jp

isenhart

Mar 28, 2017

The top is her sister, middle is her brother, and bottom is more or less a comparison from when she was a kitten to now. Her sister has an actual solid pattern whereas her brother had the same strange markings but without the full mask or pointed features. All kept their blue eyes but, unfortunately, these were the last photos taken of the two since they found new forever homes not long after.

Kieka · Mar 28, 2017

The brother is a lynx point which is a tabby point essentially (and likely points strongly at the tabby as a father). The other sister is harder to tell because the pattern isn't expressed enough to know for sure but I would guess that with the mom being flame point she also is a calico or tortie point (orange is dominant but for a female to be solid orange, which technically mom is under the point, they need double orange. A single orange will result in tortie or calico everytime. Which would also indicate that Mom is one of the 25% of solid orange females which is less common than a male flame point). But that all three kittens have obvious pointis confuse the father part. I suppose the tabby you thought could be the father of all if genes mixed in such a way for all pointed kittens but typically when you have a pointed and a non-pointed carrier you would expect to see half the litter pointed and half non-pointed. A kitten has to get the pointed gene from both parents so for a dormant point cat to result in 3 pointed kittens out of 3 is highly unlikely; but can occur. I would be surprised at a second father who was also pointed or that tabby and the mom got super lucky to mix the right way three times for the point to express itself.

Basically this litter is a great example of kitty genetics at work.

Your girl would classify as a snowshoe. Snowshoe is essentially a bicolor pointed which is mostly white with another color under the point. My two are both that as 1CatOverTheLine pointed out. All pointed cats do get darker with age as the pointed gene makes them color reactive and darker with cold and age.

Here is a better photo of my boy so you don't have to squint at my avatar... and I like to show off pictures

IMG_20170325_170351.jpg

Kieka
Mar 25, 2017

isenhart · Mar 28, 2017

I found another picture of her face to show greater detail:

15515561_10154137550383443_261238065_o.jpg

isenhart
Mar 28, 2017

It's nice to have it all explained to me though. I know that all features and characteristics boil down to genetics but sometimes it's hard to keep up!

PushPurrCatPaws · Mar 28, 2017

Kieka said:
The brother is a lynx point which is a tabby point essentially (and likely points strongly at the tabby as a father).

(The top photo is the sister... she looks to be the lynx point.)

Kieka said:
... I suppose the tabby you thought could be the father of all if genes mixed in such a way for all pointed kittens but typically when you have a pointed and a non-pointed carrier you would expect to see half the litter pointed and half non-pointed. A kitten has to get the pointed gene from both parents so for a dormant point cat to result in 3 pointed kittens out of 3 is highly unlikely; but can occur. I would be surprised at a second father who was also pointed or that tabby and the mom got super lucky to mix the right way three times for the point to express itself.

Basically this litter is a great example of kitty genetics at work.

Yeah, I'm kind of wondering if that "grey tiger" male was just a forlorn, secret admirer/onlooker of the momma cat and not a boyfriend.

Kieka · Mar 28, 2017

PushPurrCatPaws said:
(The top photo is the sister... she looks to be the lynx point.)
Yeah, I'm kind of wondering if that "grey tiger" male was just a forlorn, secret admirer/onlooker of the momma cat and not a boyfriend.

Gah! I am special. My brain is mush today, way too busy of a day to keep things straight. Then the sister is a lynx point and the brother is likely another snowshoe since boys can't be calico or tortie.

Right? I just don't see a non-pointed male mating resulting in 3 clearly pointed kittens. The chances of them getting the fathers point gene in all three kittens? Go buy a lottery ticket too.

isenhart · Mar 28, 2017

That's the only one I saw but we have a rock wall behind the field which neighboring cats will often use as some kind of cat freeway so it really could be a case of admiring from afar while the mom went out shopping.

Would JamJams Snowshoe pattern be considered common or can I give her an extra special treat for being uncommon or even a degree rarity?

PushPurrCatPaws · Mar 28, 2017

Kieka said:
Gah! I am special. My brain is mush today, way too busy of a day to keep things straight. Then the sister is a lynx point and the brother is likely another snowshoe since boys can't be calico or tortie.

...

That's ok, no worries -- I'm a little mushy, too, as I wasn't trying to suggest (above) that being a tuxedo cat was a breed. It's a coat color pattern that can occur in a variety of breeds. I just know that there were at least two dads that produced Milly & her siblings.

Kieka · Mar 28, 2017

PushPurrCatPaws said:
That's ok, no worries -- I'm a little mushy, too, as I wasn't trying to suggest (above) that being a tuxedo cat was a breed. It's a coat color pattern that can occur in a variety of breeds. I just know that there were at least two dads that produced Milly & her siblings.

Ahhh true. A tuxedo or bicolor father and a tabby father. The one sister with the tabby father and the brother sharing a father with JamJams.

JamJams is more unique in being a bicolor calico pointed cat. It's a very hard mix to create on purpose within even controlled breeding.

isenhart · Mar 28, 2017

So a bi-color calico pointed Snowshoe mix. That's a mouth full.

Thanks a lot folks! Thankfully my other cat is just a white DSH.

1CatOverTheLine · Mar 28, 2017

Isenhart said:
Thanks a lot folks! Thankfully my other cat is just a white DSH.

Oh, no. Your other cat is a DSH Tabby without the White Masking Gene (W / w) occurring as an homozygous recessive (ww).

.

1CatOverTheLine · Mar 28, 2017

1CatOverTheLine said:
Oh, no. Your other cat is a DSH Tabby without the White Masking Gene (W / w) occurring as an homozygous recessive (ww).

.

About six people in the world will find this absolutely hilarious.

.

Kieka · Mar 28, 2017

1CatOverTheLine said:
About six people in the world will find this absolutely hilarious.

.

*raise hand*

1CatOverTheLine · Mar 28, 2017

Kieka said:
*raise hand*

Yeah, I know. You and Abyeb and Stefanz, and Fat Charlie at U.C. Davis Veterinary, and some 13 year old kid in Korea who's saving up for a gene gun.

.

abyeb · Mar 28, 2017

1CatOverTheLine said:
Yeah, I know. You and Abyeb and Stefanz, and Fat Charlie at U.C. Davis Veterinary, and some 13 year old kid in Korea who's saving up for a gene gun.

:lol3:
.

Lol, that is funny

Need help identifying this beautiful lady's pattern

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